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Eugene

(61,874 posts)
Fri Jun 3, 2016, 11:19 AM Jun 2016

More Than 100 Bodies Found After Migrant Boat Capsizes Off Libya

Source: ABC News

The bodies of more than 100 migrants have been pulled from the waters after a boat capsized off Libya’s shores, a Libyan navy spokesman told The Associated Press today.

At least 104 bodies were retrieved near the western port city of Zuwarah after the Libyan Coast Guard discovered the empty vessel Thursday that may have capsized a day earlier, Col. Ayoub Gassim told the AP.

The death toll is expected to rise in the coming hours, as these boats are typically packed with up to 125 people.

It’s the latest tragedy in the migrant and refugee crisis that has claimed more than 1,000 lives in recent weeks, as people fleeing war and poverty in their home countries flood to Europe’s shores.

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Read more: http://abcnews.go.com/International/100-bodies-found-migrant-boat-capsizes-off-libya/story?id=39582259



By MORGAN WINSOR and BRIAN MCBRIDE Jun 3, 2016, 9:06 AM ET
31 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
More Than 100 Bodies Found After Migrant Boat Capsizes Off Libya (Original Post) Eugene Jun 2016 OP
We came. We saw. They died. Wilms Jun 2016 #1
Libyan civilians have been dying prior to US involvement. LanternWaste Jun 2016 #5
+1000 Blue_Tires Jun 2016 #7
What do you see as the start date of US involvement? n/t Wilms Jun 2016 #10
They aren't all Libyan. ronnie624 Jun 2016 #14
Noam Chomsky: How Imperial Violence Backfires – Lessons from the Middle East ronnie624 Jun 2016 #15
The migrants coming from Libya are generally from other parts of africa Marrah_G Jun 2016 #16
Tragic Equinox Moon Jun 2016 #2
"migrant" reddread Jun 2016 #3
Why? They are mostly migrants from Eritrea and Somalia Marrah_G Jun 2016 #21
on the scale of sadness reddread Jun 2016 #25
I don't understand your posts. Marrah_G Jun 2016 #26
The destruction of Libya and its people nyabingi Jun 2016 #4
that^ 840high Jun 2016 #13
The migrants aren't Libyans. Marrah_G Jun 2016 #22
It's Zuwara, Libya & current google map (and 3D/lg. monitor) can see the deadlands Libya is today. Sunlei Jun 2016 #6
You realize Libya and Syria are two different countries, right? OnlinePoker Jun 2016 #8
Yes, thank you, Best Friends for Life. Sunlei Jun 2016 #11
It's not Libyans, it is migrants coming from other african countries. Marrah_G Jun 2016 #17
was mostly woman & children dead, so sad. I found it odd that town seems empty, Sunlei Jun 2016 #19
This has been happening over and over for a long time now, women and children are at huge risk Marrah_G Jun 2016 #20
I know. This group not a life jacket among them. Maybe their boat sank. Sunlei Jun 2016 #23
The Libyan disaster should never have happened riderinthestorm Jun 2016 #9
her solution is to set up a regime We Can Deal WithTM pump more arms and money in MisterP Jun 2016 #12
Folks- You need to learn a bit about what is happening before commenting Marrah_G Jun 2016 #18
As a republican would say, "Never let the facts/history get in the way of a good political blast." pampango Jun 2016 #24
I think your partially right about the refugees origins. Onlaketime Jun 2016 #28
I believe most Libyans refugees went to Tunisia Marrah_G Jun 2016 #29
I found this video quite intresting on what the NATO powers have done in Libya Onlaketime Jun 2016 #30
I find the fact that we are now supporting Al Queda in Syria revolting Marrah_G Jun 2016 #31
Damn. ZombieHorde Jun 2016 #27
 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
5. Libyan civilians have been dying prior to US involvement.
Fri Jun 3, 2016, 11:58 AM
Jun 2016

Libyan civilians have been dying prior to US involvement. As per Human Rights Watch, the death count is much smaller now than under his regime. Let's not fall into logical fallacy (post hoc ergo prompter hoc) territory simply to validate a bias.

ronnie624

(5,764 posts)
14. They aren't all Libyan.
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 01:50 AM
Jun 2016

Last edited Sat Jun 4, 2016, 02:42 AM - Edit history (1)

It’s the latest tragedy in the migrant and refugee crisis that has claimed more than 1,000 lives in recent weeks, as people fleeing war and poverty in their home countries flood to Europe’s shores.


It can be argued with ease, that the turmoil throughout N Africa and the ME, results directly from decades of Western interventionism.

ronnie624

(5,764 posts)
15. Noam Chomsky: How Imperial Violence Backfires – Lessons from the Middle East
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 11:16 AM
Jun 2016
There are countries that generate refugees through massive violence, like the United States, secondarily Britain and France. Then there are countries that admit huge numbers of refugees, including those fleeing from Western violence, like Lebanon (easily the champion, per capita), Jordan, and Syria before it imploded, among others in the region. And partially overlapping, there are countries that both generate refugees and refuse to take them in, not only from the Middle East but also from the U.S. “backyard” south of the border. A strange picture, painful to contemplate.

An honest picture would trace the generation of refugees much further back into history. Veteran Middle East correspondent Robert Fisk reports that one of the first videos produced by ISIS “showed a bulldozer pushing down a rampart of sand that had marked the border between Iraq and Syria. As the machine destroyed the dirt revetment, the camera panned down to a handwritten poster lying in the sand. ‘End of Sykes-Picot,’ it said.”

For the people of the region, the Sykes-Picot agreement is the very symbol of the cynicism and brutality of Western imperialism. Conspiring in secret during World War I, Britain’s Mark Sykes and France’s François Georges-Picot carved up the region into artificial states to satisfy their own imperial goals, with utter disdain for the interests of the people living there and in violation of the wartime promises issued to induce Arabs to join the Allied war effort. The agreement mirrored the practices of the European states that devastated Africa in a similar manner. It “transformed what had been relatively quiet provinces of the Ottoman Empire into some of the least stable and most internationally explosive states in the world.”

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2016/05/noam-chomsky-how-imperial-violence-backfires-lessons-from-the-middle-east.html

HOW THE WEST IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ALL THE PROBLEMS IN THE MIDDLE EAST

This is part of the “blowback” that Stephen Kinzer sketched and predicted in a 2012 article in the Boston Globe. He noted that the West was responsible for spreading Jihadists throughout Mali and the rest of North Africa, through to Somalia. “It is the direct result of an episode that may at first seem unrelated: the US-led intervention in Libya last year. Rarely in recent times has there been a more vivid example of how such interventions can produce devastating unexpected results.” He sees it as part of the larger pattern; “building a jihadist army in Afghanistan, the United States helped create a transnational terrorist force that has plunged an entire region into war. The invasion and occupation of Iraq set off a shattering civil conflict. Now Mali can be added to the list of countries that have been pushed into instability by American-led military action.” As the Telegraph concludes about the recent havoc in Libya, it was “created by the West” because the West “abandoned” Libya. Ironically the same West that toppled Qadaffi also collaborated with him and caused the current mess.

https://sethfrantzman.com/2014/09/05/how-the-west-is-responsible-for-all-the-problems-in-the-middle-east/

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
16. The migrants coming from Libya are generally from other parts of africa
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 11:22 AM
Jun 2016

They cross from Libya on massively over crowded boats after paying huge money to criminals (like coyotes). Vice.com has a series just on the migrant crisis that goes really in depth to the risks these people take to make it to europe.

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
21. Why? They are mostly migrants from Eritrea and Somalia
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:08 PM
Jun 2016

They live in such abject poverty that they are willing to risk their lives for a better life. Much like people from South America coming here.

nyabingi

(1,145 posts)
4. The destruction of Libya and its people
Fri Jun 3, 2016, 11:50 AM
Jun 2016

was one of Hillary's proudest accomplishments as SoS. Hell, she even thought it was funny.

I'm sure she feels deeply saddened about the deaths of these people fleeing the mess she made of their country.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
6. It's Zuwara, Libya & current google map (and 3D/lg. monitor) can see the deadlands Libya is today.
Fri Jun 3, 2016, 12:08 PM
Jun 2016

no more "streetview" for Zuwara anymore eh Asaad? 80,000 people used to 'live' there.

Are they sure these are migrants bodies? or are Putin & Assad body dumping at sea these days?

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
17. It's not Libyans, it is migrants coming from other african countries.
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 11:24 AM
Jun 2016

They just cross from Libya.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
19. was mostly woman & children dead, so sad. I found it odd that town seems empty,
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:01 PM
Jun 2016

beach is empty for miles, 2 cars at the airport, it's empty, fishing boats tight cluster in the harbor, no activity.
Typical long line of beach dwellings and not a boat outside of any of them. It's like the whole area is empty/closed.

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
20. This has been happening over and over for a long time now, women and children are at huge risk
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:06 PM
Jun 2016

Most cannot swim and trying to swim while saving your children is near impossible. European countries have been trying to save people but often reach them too late.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
23. I know. This group not a life jacket among them. Maybe their boat sank.
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:28 PM
Jun 2016

I just found it odd the drowned group were all on the coastline of a town that seems empty of the 80,000 people.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
9. The Libyan disaster should never have happened
Fri Jun 3, 2016, 12:40 PM
Jun 2016

War hawks have to profit though so fuck the Libyan people - hahaha, right?


MisterP

(23,730 posts)
12. her solution is to set up a regime We Can Deal WithTM pump more arms and money in
Fri Jun 3, 2016, 03:25 PM
Jun 2016

to keep the people from the shore or something

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
18. Folks- You need to learn a bit about what is happening before commenting
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 11:31 AM
Jun 2016

The migrants crossing from Libya are mostly Eritrean and Somalian. They pay big money to have criminals pile them into massively over crowded boats in a desperate attempt to reach Europe.

It's not about Assad, Putin or Clinton. It is about extreme poverty and the search for a better life.

There is a TON of information and documentaries on the internet free of charge.

pampango

(24,692 posts)
24. As a republican would say, "Never let the facts/history get in the way of a good political blast."
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 04:08 PM
Jun 2016

Thanks for injecting some facts into the discussion.

 

Onlaketime

(65 posts)
28. I think your partially right about the refugees origins.
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 10:05 PM
Jun 2016

Half are from other impoverished countries in Africa and the other half are from wartorn Libya itself which was overrun with jihadists and warlords after NATO bombed and destabilized it. The country is in dire straits these days with the US and NATO backing members of al Qaeda that operate there now from what I've read. Ghaddafi kept the immigrants from central and East Africa from using Libya as a crossing route to Europe. That barrier was removed when Britain and France bombed Libya into chaos and brought the warlords to power. That is the real story. And yes, Hillary Clinton was instrumental in causing all that chaos and harm at the end of the day, which is why I think we need Bernie Sanders as the next President of the United States more than ever.

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
29. I believe most Libyans refugees went to Tunisia
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 10:31 PM
Jun 2016

I am not in any way downplaying what happened in Libya. I am just correcting the belief that the people dying on these boats are Libyans. Very few, if any are. They are mostly African migrants from more southern parts of the continent. It's incredibly sad and there are so many of these people camped in the hills, stuck because they can't afford the trip on these over crowded leaky boats or are in migrant jails in Libya.

Here is some good reporting on the issue: https://news.vice.com/show/europe-or-die

I am not a Hillary supporter in any way, I just hate seeing stories incorrectly used to push an agenda.

 

Onlaketime

(65 posts)
30. I found this video quite intresting on what the NATO powers have done in Libya
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 10:55 PM
Jun 2016
Can't say that I disagree with Vices video on the refugees. Looks legit although some of their other reporting has shown bias towards covering up for NATO's wars. Doesn't look like Libya will get better anytime soon as ISIS and other terrorists are now flooding in.

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
31. I find the fact that we are now supporting Al Queda in Syria revolting
Sun Jun 5, 2016, 12:04 AM
Jun 2016

We need to GTFO and leave it to the middle eastern countries to resolve their own issues. Everytime we step in we make it worse.

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