USC students linked to admissions scandal can't enroll in classes, get transcripts, university says

[nitpicker]

Source: NBC News


March 19, 2019, 1:44 AM EDT

By Minyvonne Burke

The University of Southern California on Monday said that it had taken action that prevents students who may be associated with an alleged admissions scheme from registering for classes or acquiring transcripts.

In a statement posted on Twitter, the school said the students have been notified that their status is under review.

“Following the review, we will take the proper action related to their status, up to revoking admission or expulsion,” the school said on Twitter.

The university did not disclose the number of students affected.
(snip)


Read more: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/usc-students-linked-admissions-scandal-can-t-enroll-classes-get-n983656

[beachbum bob]

1. immediate expullsion...if awarded diplomas, revoke the diplomas

cheaters should never be rewarded

[CreekDog]

89. did they do that to all the athletes that graduated on the sanctioned sports programs?

oh so this should be different?

[vlyons]

2. good move

I took out loans and worked my way thru college years ago. Not once did I ever cheat on a test, or plagerize content. A lesson must be taught, even if unaware what their parents had done.

[bernie59]

3. Closing the barn door after the horse has bolted.

USC let themselves be used.

[Botany]

4. If the students did the work and got their grades legitimately then I think ....

... they should be allowed to TRANSFER the credit hours that they earned.

I have a hard in believing that some members in the USC administration
did not know what was going on.


******

Update I just watched part of an "Olivia Jade Lifestyle" vlog on youtube
(do not do that ever!) and now I think that her spoiled ass needs to go to
Devil's Island or at least to some third world country to work with the needy.

[LovingA2andMI]

33. Nope....

As it NOPE if they did not fairly earn the right to attend the University in the first place, they surely did NOT earn rights to any grade achieved while cheating the system to enter the system.

[obamanut2012]

5. If they did the work, they deserve the credits and the transcripts

Let them finish out the semester since it it will be over soon, and that's it.

[rpannier]

7. If they got in fraudulently they should get nothing

Especially if a crime was committed to get them in

[jberryhill]

10. Even the ones who didn't know?

So they should be punished regardless of moral culpability, simply because of what their parents did?

Does that principle apply across the board, or just to this situation?

[getagrip_already]

24. Yes, it's fruit from the poisoned tree....

It will set an example to other parents. Their parents will only end up with fines and spend no time in jail. Just a little more expensive then they planned if their kids get to stay in school.

Sorry kids, your parents are assholes that screwed up your life. Join the clubs, they are out there.

[rpannier]

26. Yes they should

If their parents get them something illegally then they cannot keep it
The parents got them in under false pretenses, by bribing and engaging in fraud. So, they shouldn't get to keep their grades or get transcripts because they should not have been there in the first place.
As to across the board, under most cases yes.
If I steal a watch and give it to my child, if the authorities find out the child loses it. It doesn't matter if they knew it was gained illegally or not

[jberryhill]

45. So the Dreamers should be deported?

[sdfernando]

49. Straw man argument

This has absolutely nothing to do with Dreamers.

[Blue_Adept]

51. Every argument being made is the same as conservatives do toward the DACA kids

[rpannier]

53. I replied to your point in your other reply

[treestar]

64. I thought of that

the only difference I can think of is the dreamer parents are poor and just trying to get a better life as opposed to people whose lives are already more than financially sound, and they needed yet more, a degree from an elite institution, that they financially don't need, so it's just vanity.

Also there is not much aspect of fraud to entering a country illegally, at least as to those who sneak in (as opposed to those using fraudulent documents).

It is far easier to empathize with those desperate enough to sneak into a country to do the hard, low paying jobs than it is for people who are always going to be comfortably off no matter whether they have a degree or where it is from.

[Blue_Adept]

65. The majority of those that are here "illegally" are overstayed visas and the like

So, there's fraud in that regard.

[treestar]

66. But are they congruent with Dreamers?

It is tough to get a visa to bring your whole family over. Dreamers are more likely to have come over the southern border.

Overstaying a visa is also not particularly fraudulent. It doesn't require making a misrepresentation to the government. Just staying.

[LanternWaste]

70. "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds..."

"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. He may as well concern himself with his shadow on the wall."

Hope that helps!

[jberryhill]

72. Ah, speaking of hobgoblins

Gimme a kiss, you lovable hunk o' human....

[fleur-de-lisa]

74. That is a ridiculous comparison.

[Javaman]

13. +1000 nt

[Blue_Adept]

27. What're your views on DACA?

[Igel]

76. What about the kids from Louisiana who got into Ivy League schools.

Fraudulently.

Revoke their credits and degrees? If they've done the work?

Or is there some obvious difference I'm overlooking?

[Maxheader]

15. Absolutely..

Looks to be a tough situation..

The ones skipping classes and partying every night..They'd just scream
prejudice if the schools kicked them out ...rich mommy and daddy
would raise hell...

[Honeycombe8]

17. They need to be booted out before end of semester.

They have to start a new school next semester. Maybe they should be able to transfer whatever grades they have, including the "Incomplete" grades from this semester.

If they faked their entrance qualifications, they have no right to gain anything from the school. That's like letting Manafort keep his properties he bought with his ill gotten gains.

[getagrip_already]

25. no, no credit for grades earned...

Let them start from scratch.

[Honeycombe8]

29. I agree. Ill gotten gains obtained through fraud. nt

[CreekDog]

87. tuition refunded then?

[tulipsandroses]

35. How can we trust that they did the work?

Does anyone believe Donald Trump truly earned his Wharton Degree?

[ProfessorPlum]

62. we really should stop saying he went to "Wharton"

he went to U Penn. the college that gave him his degree is named Wharton. And it has nothing to do with Wharton business school.

it lends him an imprimatur even beyond that which he hasn't earned.

[tulipsandroses]

78. Point taken

But I'll make the same point for U Penn.

Does anyone really believe that he really earned his degree from U Penn? I certainly don't.

[ProfessorPlum]

82. neither do I

there is an interview with a Penn professor of his saying he was the dumbest student he's ever taught. And that was years ago, before his madness and ignorance were on full display.

[CreekDog]

90. yeah if they passed the classes without cheating then they get the credit

they can expel them after.

University of Southern California has not been immune to scandal.

does ANYBODY (besides us) here pay attention to college sports???

people are posting here as if this is the FIRST scandal in USC history and is the first ding against their unblemished record.



oh please.

[Sgent]

6. If the kids actually did the work

then let them finish / graduate unless it comes out they were aware of the fraud.

Their parents are going to prison and their family is going to be paying millions of dollars due to to this. I don't see any reason other than vindictiveness to punish the kids.

[rpannier]

8. Disagree

They got in fraudulently. Whether they knew or not, they still should not have gotten in
Bad precedent to say, "Well they didn't know..."
1. Because it opens the door for future abuse with the parents claiming their kids didn't know
2. They wouldn't have gotten in originally. So, they are not entitled to anything

[jberryhill]

11. "Whether they knew or not, they still should not have gotten in"

Just as an aside, what is your position on minor children brought into the US and raised here without knowing they entered illegally as infants with their parents?

And explain the difference.

[Lucky Luciano]

12. Well done

[Honeycombe8]

18. They are 17 and over. Not 10.

They knew. No way their entrance qualifications were falsified, and they didn't know. All that is part of their record. Plus, their parents would have told them, in case they are asked about any of the false information.

These weren't all just payoffs, accompanied by real information. There was outright falsified records in some cases, complete with fake pictures of some of the kids playing sports they never played (head shots placed on the bodies of other kids, who were the ones playing the sports). Grades were falsified.

Of course these kids knew.

[SomewhereInTheMiddle]

34. How could the students not know?

Both of my children went through the college admissions process in the last three years. The role of the parent in that process was pretty limited.

The young adults took the standardized exams, gathered the evidence, wrote the essays, solicited the letters of recommendation, filled out the applications, attended the interviews, and signed confirmation of the veracity of the claims in the application. As parents we pushed, cajoled, supported, and offered advice. We also paid for it all.

How was the experience different for the alleged beneficiaries of these instances of bribery and fraud? Even if the parents/phony charity did all of the above. The student still had to sign off on the truth of the applications. That may well be their first act as adults, but it is legally binding.

I do not see how these students could not have been aware that their process was so different from the norm and not been aware of at least some of the inaccuracies in their applications. This does not take into account obvious things like posing for fake sports pictures or actual cheating on the SATs.

But if they signed their applications without doing the work of filling them out, they don’t belong in college. If they signed them knowing they were inaccurate then they are part of the fraud.

Or at least that’s my opinion.

[Honeycombe8]

44. I agree.

I'm "mature," so it was decades ago that I entered college. (I didn't finish.) I didn't have parents involved, and I don't recall the admissions process very well. But I had to order my transcript sent to the college, fill out forms, sign things. I was assigned a counselor who had my records and forms, who asked me questions about my goals, referred to the information on my records, and such.

If my parents had falsified any of that, I would have known because I saw the information that I sent in. And the counselor might have referred to my "excellent high school background, including your participating in swimming" (when I didn't swim), or my "excellent top tier grades" (when I knew my grades hadn't been top tier.

So the kids knew, definitely. I suspect this sort of thing is so common among the wealthy that the kids all know and accept that they got in fraudulently, and it's okay. It's simply their parents "helping" them.

The parents would have thought that what they were doing was a good thing for their kids, and would have been proud to tell the kids, on the one hand, and would have warned them to be prepared for references to a fake record, on the other. Of course they knew.

[Pachamama]

83. Depends on the situation

There were different forms of cheating done. Some were flat out cheating on exam/test scores and the children knew and knowingly participated in the cheating. Administrators of test taking who were compromised arranged and coordinated with the parent and student to show up on the test day at a compromised test center and would "check in" and have their identity verified but then after the fact would actually leave and the administrator changed the test results OR another person took the test for the student. Even down to how high they wanted the test scores to be were coordinated (in some examples high enough but not too high as not to draw attention).
In these cases, the students knew and knew they were cheating.

Another form of cheating was falsification of athletic skills in order to get in to a school in a "Student Athlete Recruit Slot". This was accomplished in multiple ways - some with the students knowledge - in some cases it wasn't with their knowledge. In the case of Lori Loughlin the actress, neither daughter had ever even sat in a crew boat, yet they posed in pictures on rowing machines "training" and claiming to coxswain's. These girls knew what their mother did and they knowingly participated. They just dropped out of USC because they know they were going to be expelled and they wanted to avoid that. In other cases, the student applied legitimately to the University, submitted their legitimate high school transcripts and test scores and submitted the application with the essays etc. But what these students didn't know was that their parent(s) had contracted with Singer to submit an Athlete Recruitment form to a person at the University Athletic Dept who was being bribed and then there would be falsification of their qualifications. These students didn't know that had been done or submitted on their behalf. Those students didn't knowingly participate in a fraud and when they signed their applications were not committing fraud. Their parents did and they didn't know.

Each case is different and the Universities should look and investigate each case on a case by case basis to determine if the student knowingly committed fraud. The ones who did know should be expelled, but I don't believe the kids who didn't know should be punished because of what their parents did without their knowledge.

[SomewhereInTheMiddle]

84. Interesting.

In other cases, the student applied legitimately to the University, submitted their legitimate high school transcripts and test scores and submitted the application with the essays etc. But what these students didn't know was that their parent(s) had contracted with Singer to submit an Athlete Recruitment form to a person at the University Athletic Dept who was being bribed and then there would be falsification of their qualifications. These students didn't know that had been done or submitted on their behalf. Those students didn't knowingly participate in a fraud and when they signed their applications were not committing fraud. Their parents did and they didn't know.

Interesting. I had not thought of that.

But I still wonder if a student was offered an Athletic scholarship or place on a team as part of their admissions, would they not have to agree to accepts or participate. Again would this not require their signature rather than their parents or someone else’s? If they had not been part of the fraudulent application, they still would have to accept knowing that they had not applied for the team/activity/scholarship. Would that acceptance not be a fraudulent act in and of itself?

One of the things about my sons’ college experience that is difficult for me as a parent is that the boys are making commitments as adults. Commitments which we as parents have little or nothing to do with, and in many cases no knowledge of. FERPA protects their information privacy, even from parents.

Each case is different and the Universities should look and investigate each case on a case by case basis to determine if the student knowingly committed fraud. The ones who did know should be expelled, but I don't believe the kids who didn't know should be punished because of what their parents did without their knowledge.

I agree it is not right to punish one generation for the crimes of the preceding ones. These young adults who benefited from the bribes/fraud, at some point must have agreed in some way as the schools would require their signatures. If they can find students that did not sign off on something fraudulent then perhaps they are ignorant, maybe even innocent.

Or so it seems to me.

[gopiscrap]

86. welcome to DU

[SomewhereInTheMiddle]

95. Thanks

Long time reader. Not sure why this prompted me to finally post.

[Farmer-Rick]

21. Well, that is a different situation. Apples and starvation

Being kicked out of a college because their parents are over rich cheats ain't gonna hurt those kids. They won't be separated from their families. They won't be moved to an unknown country they don't even speak the language of. They won't suffer deprivation and lose all they own.

Those trust fund babies are going to be just fine. And if those illegally entering parents were uber rich, or like the first nude lady's kid, were gold diggers and managed to illegally con an Einstein visa from the US, then they too would be just fine.

Your comparison is very forced at best and ridiculous at least.

[LovingA2andMI]

38. The difference is....

Infants are infants and the illegal entry (If YOU are calling it that) could have been a situation to save the life of the INFANT and PARENT for all we know.

Cheating the system to obtain entry into a elite college, is just CHEATING PERIOD. Does not matter who started the system of cheating or who did not know they were apart of the CHEATING scheme. The grades were not earned in the proper matter as CHEATING is how one got into the system (i.e. School) in the first place. They need to start completely over and EARN IT ON THEIR OWN.

That's the difference and to make that any type of a quasi faux comparison says plenty about you.

[jberryhill]

46. Oh, a personal dig, how nice

Thank you for reminding me that people on DU cannot resist making personal digs like that.

We do not, in general, punish persons who are not morally culpable for wrongdoing. Elsewhere someone compared it to "not punishing a bank robber for funding an orphanage", presumably since in that situation the poster would punish the orphans for having lived off of those proceeds.

[LovingA2andMI]

54. Except.....

There's a law for that ......

"The Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA) (20 U.S.C. § 1232g; 34 CFR Part 99) is a Federal law that protects the privacy of student education records. The law applies to all schools that receive funds under an applicable program of the U.S. Department of Education.

FERPA gives parents certain rights with respect to their children's education records. These rights transfer to the student when he or she reaches the age of 18 or attends a school beyond the high school level. Students to whom the rights have transferred are "eligible students."

https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.html

I.E. -- Once the Child becomes a College Student and earns College Academic Credit Hours grades, the parent cannot obtain the grades UNLESS the Student shares them with the parent.

However, it was the actions of the parent in YOUR scenario, that allowed for the Child now -- College Student, to obtain the grades in the first place. Noting such, if the FIRST action was wrong, so was the SECOND. As if the parent CHEATED the system to have their Child now College Student to enter the elite school, the grades obtained by the College Student was only obtained by Cheating the system. One action does not outweigh the other.

In most Universities they teach an Ethics class and with such, before there is any "lobbying" for the College Student who Parents Cheated the System to allow them to enter the school -- maybe, just maybe a discussion should be had with each and every Collegiate Ethics Instructor or Professor to see how they feel about that.

Got a feeling, they would say the Child That Entered The Collegiate System by the actions of a CHEATING Parent, has to suffer the impact of that parent actions, which means that the grades earned are null and voided.

[rpannier]

52. It's a fair question

I will concede that a strong argument can be made in support of your position.

I would argue it is what they are receiving for the actions of their parents that make part of the difference and the burden of the punishment is different makes up another part.

The actions of the parents (University scandal) were criminal and were designed to leapfrog others from getting into the University. By doing so, they kept others out of USC, Yale, etc who would have gotten in. So their actions prevented others from receiving admittance to which they would have gotten had no fraud occurred. The DACA situation is different in that respect, in that the intent was not made to get something while knowingly depriving others from admittance. No one was denied entry into the U.S. because they got in.

Being able to remain in the US, especially when they have no ties to their previous country, creates a level of hardship that is not equitable with what the children of these parents will lose. A lost two years of University with no grades, is not equivalent. I would also point out that they are being removed and as such, that will likely be included on their transcripts anyway. If I am right, I don't think anyone would want those grades. But even if they did, (or if the transcripts did not include that they were removed for cause) it's not analogous to someone who has been here for ten, fifteen, twenty years and is being sent to some place totally alien to them. The loss is not equitable.

I think what they did is also covered under 'Fraudulent Admissions', which according to the Universities I attended (Washington State and San Francisco State) result in your being expelled from the university, no money being returned and (at least with WSU) you get no credit for having been there. That is in something the parent and student signed when sending in all that paperwork. That is something that no parent or child signed when they entered here illegally.

As I mentioned in one post, if you let them keep the grades, what happens the next time some parent commits this kind of fraud and gets caught later? Is there a cut-off

I do acknowledge that my previous post does come off as leaving little room for nuance.
As I said, your question is a fair one

[Blue_Adept]

28. That sounds much like a conservative view of DACA...

[jberryhill]

48. It's the same logic - they can't admit it

Once the Two Minutes Hate is over, maybe.

DU is primarily "internet anger" driven these days, so probably not.

[Blue_Adept]

50. Pretty much.

Every argument that can be made about the scandal kids is the same that conservatives make against DACA kids. Top to bottom.

It's been an amusing read this morning.

[Javaman]

57. I find it interesting that you equate rich privilege with people trying to save their own lives. nt

[Blue_Adept]

58. Hey, according to folks in this thread, they broke the law. So throw the book at them.

Why should it matter? Context? Nuance? None of that for any of these kids.

[Javaman]

59. because everything is a nail, right? nt

[Blue_Adept]

60. That seems to be the case here

750+ families involved in what Singer did for them.

So expel them all is what's being said here.

[Javaman]

63. wow, just wow.

we're done.

tootles.

and you may have the last word. you seem to be itching for it.

[jberryhill]

61. No one is "equating" those two things

I find it interesting that you cannot recognize a logical similarity.

You either hold persons responsible for crimes committed on their behalf of which they are themselves ignorant, or you don't.

The distinction you would make is "people with lots of money = bad" and "people without lots of money = good".

That's fine, and it feels good.

[treestar]

67. I don't think it is that stark a difference

people who have plenty and still need more for their vanity vs. people who have nothing and are just trying to live. Liberals will naturally be more sympathetic to the latter.

[TexasBushwhacker]

9. Because if they don't punish the kids

other parents will take their chances and pay more to the right people. It sucks for the kids, but I imagine many of them knew something was up when they got into elite schools with mediocre grades and test scores.

[Honeycombe8]

20. I wouldn't call it punishment. It's rectifying a wrong.

They falsified records to get in, or bribed people. So they have no business there and need to be removed. It's like ordering a person return the money they stole.

[jberryhill]

56. Or like deporting a Dreamer

[Honeycombe8]

79. Dreamers were young children. Not bordering on adulthood who didn't know they weren't born here.

And Dreamers didn't participate in defrauding a college, or keeping a deserving student out of that college.

[Javaman]

14. that's like letting a bank robber go because he used the money to build an orphanage. nt

[Sgent]

30. Lets pretend

the bank robber used the money to build a school, should we strip the children of their degrees?

[Javaman]

55. the orphanage should be sold or given over to the state and the robber goes to jail.

in this case, the student loses out on going to the school and has to reapply based on their pre-academic college record. if they don't cut the mustard, tough shit.

if it were found out that the student had knowledge of the bribery, they get kicked out and have to answer to the court of law.

no more free rides. All college credit earned up to that point is completely forfeit.

allowing them to continue, when they got in under illegal means, teaches nothing to anyone involved, especially the students.

hard lessons all around for the very wealthy. time to learn what the rest of us, non-wealthy people, have to put up with daily.

[jberryhill]

47. And what, exactly, would you do to the orphans?

No one has suggested that those culpable should not be punished.

[Honeycombe8]

16. They need to be booted out. Period. nt

[LovingA2andMI]

39. Yes....

Indeed!

[madville]

19. Sounds like an interesting potential lawsuit

Another question, should they get their tuition money back if not receiving their earned credits?

I think if they knew they should be punished. If they didn't know, I'm more sympathetic.

[Honeycombe8]

22. Anyone who is 17 and older, knew.

No way he/she didn't know. Grades and records were falsified. Bribes, fake pictures, pretending to have participated in sports. Of course they knew. No way their parents would let them attend school without being prepared for questions about their high school grades and sports and such.

If bribes had to be paid to get them in, the kids would have known their high school records weren't up to snuff.

Of course Donald Jr. knew his father had "gotten him in" to his university. Like Bush Jr. knew his father had gotten him into Yale, his father's alma mater. They may not know exact amounts, but their parents would have warned them, if records were falsified. "Why would you think I'm a great swimmer?" or "Yeah, I wish I had graduated in the top 10% of my grad class" might be their responses when someone references their high school record.

These aren't 12 year old kids. They're 17, 18, 19.

[Honeycombe8]

32. No, their tuition should not be returned.

Because had that kid not entered fraudulently, the school would have received tuition from a legitimate student. The school should not suffer financially because of their fraud.

[CreekDog]

93. and you're drawing on your experience in contract law?

your experience in academia and enforcement of academic policies and sanctions for not following them?

you've stated an authoritative punishment for the deed, now what gives that credibility, WHAT CREDIBILITY DO YOU HAVE?

or are you just sitting at a computer thinking of things off the top of your head?

if it's the latter YOUR IDEA IS 1000 levels below anything that will be considered.

[Honeycombe8]

96. I'm drawing on my experience in common sense. Their tuition, based on fraud, will not be returned.

They stole their place from a deserving student, who would have paid tuition. Furthermore, for those who are already admitted, the students have used the university resources to some extent. Clerks have entered their forms and data, administrators have spent time reviewing same, for those who are already students - professors have spent time teaching them and grading papers.

Thanks for your snarky response, though. It's much appreciated for a serious discussion of a serious issue, CreekDog.

[SHRED]

23. If they were 18 and signed fraudulent documents knowingly

Treat them as adults.

[LovingA2andMI]

43. Actually....

They could have signed the documents at 17 or 16 years old. Once a Child enters college, unless they are a dual enrollment student (i.e. - high school student taking college classes) the Students grades are private from the parents unless the Student wishes to share the grades with the parents.

[getagrip_already]

31. This is the same principal as not using nazi "medical" reasearch from holocaust camps.....

The nazi's did a lot of horrible things medically to people that potentially could have been valuable to science after the fact because there was no other way to do that type of experiment.

One side of the argument to use that data was "at least some good should come of all that suffering".

The world chose a different answer. They chose to destroy it and not use any of it for anything beyond the evidence it was of inhuman acts. It was fruit of the poisoned tree.

No good can come from bad acts lest they be repeated.

It doesn't matter that lives could have been saved. It doesn't matter that the kids may not have known (hard to believe that the best and brightest kids in the country couldn't figure out they weren't athletes, or didn't need un-timed individual testing accomodations, or someone helping them with answers).

Let them start over from scratch, complete with new sat tests.

[Honeycombe8]

41. I think a better analogy is a bank robber having his car confiscated by police.

A robber, who is the passenger, lets the driver use his car to rob a bank. He uses part of the money to fix up his car, bring the registration and inspection up to date, etc. The two guys are caught for their crime. They let the passenger off...he's so young and may not have known the driver of the car had planned to rob the bank. Even tho the passenger actively participated in taking some actions in the bank that enabled the driver to rob it.

Do they require the two to return the stolen money? Yes. That is not a punishment. That's returning what they stole.
Do they return the car used in the robbery, since the guy worked hard to fix it up? No. It was used in the commission of a crime. Even if he didn't necessarily know the plans of the driver. The improvements are the result of ill gotten gains and don't form a basis for its return. The passenger is lucky to get to walk away without criminal charges.

You don't walk away, as good as before the crime, except for the loss of the time it took to commit the crime. You lose your ill gotten gains.

In the case of these students, the ill gotten gains are the grades they obtained because of the fraud. They should not benefit from taking away the spot that some deserving student was denied.

They're young. They can start a new school next semester. A lot of students have to delay their education for health, family matters, monetary issues.

[NCjack]

36. Big cheaters always win. There will be no punishment for the super rich. nt

[Lars39]

37. The university has got to be wondering how deep this goes.

If test scores were altered to get a person accepted, what test scores have been altered to keep that person enrolled? Any alternate test takers involved?

[tulipsandroses]

42. I posted my reply before seeing yours. You and I are thinking the same thing

I think more investigation needs to be done. Who knows what these parents were willing to pay for.

[tulipsandroses]

40. I think more investigation needs to be done

If these parents were willing to pay to get their kids in. Were they also willing to pay to keep them in? Were any professors ever paid to change a grade? Who knows?

[RobinA]

68. I Can't Believe

I’m reading this hate on a supposedly liberal board. This kind of judgement of people based on demographics is no different than any other bigotry. Some of which I guess is OK on this site while some other is not.

[Apple Fritter]

69. Hate for which demographic here? on rich people or white people? The kids or...?

I am just curious because not to many people defend wealthy people. There is pretty damning evidence and it doesn't really surpise anyone so I can understand the outrage.

[Blue_Tires]

71. Good...

[mackdaddy]

73. What happened to "Due Process" for these students.

There needs to be some sort of an investigation into each student's situation. Yes, they may have unknowingly benefited from some one else's (parents) improper/illegal acts, but does that nullify their own positive work?
I have not problem in making them go through the admission process again before any further improper benefit from wealthy privilege, but each student situation should be judged on their own merits for their own actual school work.

How about a trial before the execution...

[jberryhill]

75. No longer a liberal value

[Miigwech]

77. Question: how many years back are they going to review?

... it's the whole fucking legacy situation that needs to be investigated

[MichMan]

80. Investigated for what ?

While people might oppose the legacy system, unlike this recent scandal, it is not illegal.

[bernie59]

81. USC was part a participant in this as well.

Perhaps a cut in federal grants, fellowships, etc. for five or so years would be appropriate.

[CreekDog]

91. I look at all the posts in the thread trying to figure out how hard they can punish the students

a bunch of posters casting about at different ways to punish these kids, or young adults, whatever you choose to call them.

the punishment, though, it better be consistent, according to the law and according to the university's own policies (and not just the ones on paper, remember this is USC ) --the ones they actually typically enforce.

or else they'll get sued, they'll lose and the kids will be in the bargaining seat.

the problem with some of you is that you think that you can just be clever and your cleverness can replace law, policies, contracts and practices.

you all just think you're clever and can just make up whatever punishment you want because you have a relationship with Jesus or the universe that tells you your ideas are special.

they aren't.

[Hekate]

92. You have a point

[obamanut2012]

94. A lot of meanness in these threads, too

The Fed has stated most of the kids didn't know, and regardless: if they did the work, they should get the credits to be transferred, or keep the degree. If universities start pulling degrees of kids who did the work and earned the degree, they WILL be sued, and WILL lose. The same for holding transcripts and credits.

It is fine to tell any current students they can finish the semester, but then are booted.

Like you say, Creeky, it isn't even rational, and will cause lawsuits they WILL lose.

DU is very "Sins of the fathers and the mothers."