US Justice Department: Don't treat trans athletes as girls
Source: AP
HARTFORD, Conn. (AP) The U.S. Justice Department is getting involved in a federal civil rights lawsuit that seeks to block transgender athletes in Connecticut from competing as girls in interscholastic sports.
Attorney General William Barr signed what is known as a statement of interest Tuesday, arguing against the policy of the Connecticut Interscholastic Athletic Conference, the board that oversees the states high school athletic competitions.
The conference allows athletes to compete as the gender with which they identify, arguing it is following a state law that requires high school students be treated according to their gender identity. It also argues the policy is in accordance with Title IX, the federal law that allows girls equal educational opportunities, including in athletics.
[...]
Under CIACs interpretation of Title IX, however, schools may not account for the real physiological differences between men and women. Instead, schools must have certain biological males namely, those who publicly identify as female compete against biological females, Barr and the other department officials write. In so doing, CIAC deprives those women of the single-sex athletic competitions that are one of the marquee accomplishments of Title IX.
Read more: https://apnews.com/96ae2ed8ef4cfb2b450ef3b4fac8a954
More from the Hartford Courant about one of the plaintiffs, Selina Soule:
This February 2020 story notes that Chelsea Mitchell, one of the other plaintiffs, took first place by just 0.02 second over a transgender runner.
pnwmom
(108,955 posts)unlike Olympic athletes, can compete as girls without undergoing physical transitioning -- that is, without hormone treatment. So not only do they have a male bone structure, but they have high testosterone and more muscles than cis-females. How is this fair to cis-female athletes?
From the second link:
moriah
(8,311 posts)Just gonna be honest here:
How many people would be as upset as they are about this if it did not impact scholarship opportunities? Then it'd just be about the game/sport -- competing and having fun.
That's not what high school sports are about now, and that's what's wrong with the system, at least in my mind.
Not letting trans girls play on girls teams/participate in girls events.
janterry
(4,429 posts)Mostly, all of the teams were for boys.
I don't know what the answer is, for trans athletes. But competing against biological girls, and disadvantaging girls athletics, is not a solution I endorse. And, fwiw, (for me) I don't care one bit about scholarships.
comradebillyboy
(10,128 posts)pnwmom
(108,955 posts)And that's what Title 9 is about, too -- making sure girls and women have equal access to these opportunities.
elias7
(3,991 posts)For most, high school is as far as they get in sports. So winning or placing in a regional or state tourney is the pinnacle for many excellent athletes. It is its own reward, not the scholarship or the college acceptance. Its not so much about having fun, very kumbaya, but about fair play and healthy competition.
Then for those who are good enough for college sports, it is unfair to be bumped down out of the running by those competing with an advantage.
It is a tricky issue, and there have been several heated threads on DU about this topic.
3catwoman3
(23,944 posts)...college athletes who get no sports scholarship money, so it is not solely about sports scholarships.
Blackjackdavey
(178 posts)Parents are very caught up in who is the captain and who wins end of season awards long before they are competing for scholarships. They are very passionate.
OldBaldy1701E
(5,088 posts)that and the complete favoritism shown to athletics around the country. I used to work at a private school, and let me tell you, if you were a male and not interested in any athletics, you had pretty much nothing to do outside of class. The females had more to do other than athletics, they even had more choices when it came to doing something athletic. The end result is that you have basically two choices: try to be an athlete, or be a second class student. Anyone who has been in the halls of a school knows that the students, and even the faculty, are preferential to the jocks. I mean, they bring 'glory' to their school, they 'represent' the 'best of our student body' (what a crock! When I was in school, the jocks were the most evil children I had ever seen. They got away with 'murder' as well thanks to their preferential status). The fact that there are hundreds of scholarships for sciences, and thousands of scholarships for sports... well you figure it out. Trans kids have enough trouble in life without being forced to maintain such a status quo thanks to this jocular attitude. Now, once we stop really really really praising brawn over brains, all of this might be addressed with more reason, but until than happens... well, we end up with Trump, we end up with McConnell, we end up a bunch of BGFJs (Big Dumb Frat Jocks) running the show (regardless of their gender identity). Hell, we end up with Corvid, thanks to a bunch of preening, d**k waving 'tough guys' who think they can personally fight it, and then act like only the 'weak' will get it anyway.
Blackjackdavey
(178 posts)I imagine your experience is increasingly common as private schools increasingly become "prep" schools for wealthy athletes.
Arthur_Frain
(1,837 posts)Deferential, I think you meant. I agree with you, for the record.
LizBeth
(9,952 posts)oldsoftie
(12,488 posts)After years of trying to open opportunities to female athletes, this is yet another roadblock. If all you've done is identify as a female and nothing else, i'm sorry, but no, you shouldnt be allowed to compete with the other girls
eggplant
(3,907 posts)Sorry, but that is obnoxiously trivializing the incredibly difficult process of publicly identifying oneself as transgender.
Tumbulu
(6,268 posts)I don't know why, either. Care to explain your reasoning here?
oldsoftie
(12,488 posts)But if your physical makeup hasnt changed, then it is simply not fair. You'd still have the advantages of the male body. It wouldnt be fair in basketball, wrestling, soccer. etc. Sorry, its just not right for all the other girls.
qwlauren35
(6,145 posts)Only people who have experienced it can really know what it's like to "come out".
But when it comes to sports, physiology and hormones are a major factor. And from a hormonal point of view, someone who is secreting significant amounts of testosterone, in my opinion, should not be competing with those who primarily secrete estrogen.
I_UndergroundPanther
(12,462 posts)The disadvantages to trans Men that lose to cis men? Nobody brings that issue up.
catsudon
(839 posts)being beat up....
but yeah a cis girl getting pounded to a bloody pulp in boxing/wrestling contact sports does not look good
eggplant
(3,907 posts)What about cis girls with no athletic ability? Who will speak up for their interests?
This whole thing is just transphobia, plain and simple.
pnwmom
(108,955 posts)to trans females who still have hormonally male bodies.
This doesn't happen in the Olympics because of the hormonal transition requirements.
Fairness would dictate following the IOC rules in this area.
ck4829
(35,038 posts)I_UndergroundPanther
(12,462 posts)Our human rights are being undermined still.
OverBurn
(942 posts)Everyone should have equal rights. But, I DO NOT support transgender males (born male) competing against cis females (born female) athletically. It's just not fair, it's not equal rights, it's a born advantage.
ck4829
(35,038 posts)The idea that gender exists as a male/female dichotomy is not something in nature, it's something we socially fabricated.
Nature is filled with morphs, eusociality, sex changing, and other things that certainly do not reflect a gender binary.
If the media and athletics just swallowed this pill and allowed this, they'd also get a lot of money. I think there would actually be a lot of support for something like this.
And this way, we don't exclude transgender athletes and they're not made invisible, trans-female and trans-male athletes as well as non-binary athletes would get a chance to shine, it would be a boon to medicine that involved non-binary/transgender medical needs and sports medicine, and it would reflect how human gender and sexuality actually are.
eggplant
(3,907 posts)If you made this same suggestion using race instead of gender (an equally fluid concept) you would be thrown out of here in a second. What makes gender different?
janterry
(4,429 posts)Mens vs. womens sports
ck4829
(35,038 posts)That would be true equality.
The system is archaic, but I'm just working from within it like Fabianism. I think it's what we'd eventually reach.
Honestly, with today's technology, a sort of 'weight class' or 'skill system' regardless of gender would serve everyone far better.
LizBeth
(9,952 posts)female bodied, then why have a division at all? It makes no sense and there should be no sex classification in sport.