Mitt says he pays close to 15 percent rate

[kpete]

Mitt says he pays close to 15 percent rate

Mitt Romney, who has a high net worth, pulled the curtain back a bit on his income when asked about the effective tax rate he's been paying during a Q and A with reporters in Florence, S.C.:

"What’s the effective rate I’ve been paying? It’s probably closer to the 15 percent rate than anything. Because my last 10 years, I’ve—my income comes overwhelmingly from some investments made in the past, whether ordinary income or earned annually. I got a little bit of income from my book, but I gave that all away. And then I get speakers fees from time to time, but not very much.”

Romney made more than $360,000 in speaker's fees between Feb. 2010 and Feb. 2011, according to his most recent personal financial disclosure statement.

More:
http://www.politico.com/blogs/burns-haberman/2012/01/romney-says-hell-release-tax-returns-111123.html

[jpak]

1. So he pays less than the Average Joe - percentage-wise

now I understand why he won't release his tax forms.

yup

[kpete]

3. yep

Mitt Romney has good reason to keep his tax records out of view. Call it the 'WTF' factor

family of four making an
upper-middle-class income of
$100,000 would save $5,500 on income
taxes if it were taxed at the Romney Rate.
(Democratic National Committee)
as Matt Viser and Beth Healy reported, he pays a far lower tax rate—15 percent—from what typical middle-class families or even upper-middle class families pays on their earnings.
http://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2011/12/23/romney-will-not-reveal-tax-data-least-for-now/UJLtCoei1ligNaw4kP9MvM/story.html
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/12/27/1049218/-Mitt-Romney-has-good-reason-to-keep-his-tax-records-out-of-view-Call-it-the-WTF-factor?via=search

[Kellerfeller]

42. I'm not sure I believe that

I make decent (above average) money and with the dependent deductions, child credit, and mortgage interest deduction, I don't even pay 10%.

On edit: The average is 16% or below.

http://www.incometaxlist.com/

[Atman]

2. And therein lies the problem...he considers $360,000 "Not very much."

And yet, he wants everyone else to PAY. He is so fucking out of touch it is a type of insanity. Keep in mind, that $360,000 isn't even his real income...he's just throwing that off as an aside, "You know, I make some speeches, but I didn't make much off them." Just $360,000. And he pretends he knows what is good for the rest of America.

FUCK YOU, Mittens.

.

[Johnny2X2X]

11. Yup

That's the part that struck me most too. $360k is not that much. This guy is so out of touch with regular people and there is nothing he can do to hide it.

[kpete]

15. "below that of middle-class workers, which would also include military servicemembers."

On Tuesday, the Republican presidential candidate finally admitted that the effective tax rate he has been paying for the last several years is likely below that of middle-class workers, which would also include military servicemembers.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/17/mitt-romney-not-much-definition-speaking-fees_n_1210522.html

[Atman]

17. It's a bizarre contruct..."Since I didn't really EARN the money, it shouldn't be taxed as much."

If you WORK for the money, then the rich fuckers consider it "earned income," and it should be taxed heavily. If you just sit on your lazy fat fucking ass and count the interest which accumulates, then it's not really "income," and they don't think you have to pay taxes on it.

I'm for totally reversing the system. If you WORK for your money, then you should pay a minimal tax rate. If you play golf while your accountants phone you to tell you how much you made in interest income while you were putting, then you pay 90%. Or more.

This is why our system SUCKS right now. If you are wealthy, you are rewarded for doing NOTHING...which is the claim the Repubs try to use on real people who are struggling. A mom who can't feed her children even though she works three jobs at Dollar Store, the gas station and WalMart, is considered a leech. But Mitt Romney who DOES NOTHING, who just sits on his ass and watches his wealth accumulate, he's a "hard worker" and shouldn't have to pay taxes.

What the fuck is wrong with this picture?

[klook]

20. +1 (n/t)

[CrispyQ]

25. It is absolutely back asswards.

"Time is the essence of our lives."

If you work for a living, you trade your time, your life, for wages. If you invest for a living, others trade their time, their life, for your 'wages.'

[Fool Count]

34. It is even more skewed than that. 15% is the tax rate on dividends and capital gains.

The pathetic 1% interest your saving account earns you is taxed at the same rate as all your
other income. So just having money is not enough to get that sweet deal on taxes. One must
actually own means of production to qualify. In other words - only capitalists get taxed at the
lower rate. That's "fairness" the American way.

[CTyankee]

36. As a retiree, I get income from investing in annuities. Isn't that "earned"?

[wordpix]

44. +1 and the answer is "Everything is wrong with this picture"

[Fool Count]

33. Yet, it is probably the only part of his income that incurred 35% income tax.

So, it is definitely "not much" of the total, since it failed to raise his effective rate even a little
from the 15% rate paid on capital gains and dividends.

[Bozita]

4. Maybe poor folks could lift themselves out of poverty by giving speeches?

Thanks for the tip, you assclown!

[BeyondGeography]

5. It's hilarious that he's their most electable candidate

After all we've been through the past five years, the run-up of wealth concentration that preceded it and continues to this day.

Or maybe it's just where we are as a country. Land of the Lost.

[Beavker]

14. +1

and brainwashed.

[brooklynite]

6. What's wrong with this picture...

Pretty rolicking "rally" (e.g. no questions from the crowd) in Florence this morning.

[XemaSab]

7. Here's another theory about the tax returns:

He's been a faithful Mormon, and he's given 10% of his income to the Mormon church.

Being a good churchgoing Christian is one thing, but giving millions to a church that many evangelicals think is a cult might not go over so well.

[MGKrebs]

8. I think that it is not helpful to just be critical of his wealth.

I mean, Teddy Kennedy was wealthy. John Kerry is wealthy. Even Howard Dean is wealthy. Wealth does not automatically exclude one from being progressive or thoughtful or aware of others. And it's not even his problem that he pays so little in taxes. If we want to change the tax code we should talk about that, but he would be an idiot to pay more than he had to. I agree with Atman, the problem is that he apparently thinks that $360,000 isn't much.

[BeyondGeography]

9. I don't see anyone saying that

He is tooth-and-nail opposed to any changes in the tax code that would increase his burden.

He wants to undo "entitlements" when his SS bill is virtually non-existent and most people pay 7.65%.

He is the embodiment of a tax system that values wealth over work and wants to perpetuate it.

[onehandle]

12. It is when it has been suggested that he is trying to hide something.

Which he is.

[The Genealogist]

24. The amount he has, alone, is not of great concern

It is how he makes it, how he pays taxes on it, and his attitude toward it. How does he make much of it? By destroying jobs and gutting companies to profit off it. He makes his money off the misery of others. Other money he makes by phone calls to his staff, who move it around and invest it here or there. How much does he pay in taxes? Chump change, for someone in his bracket of wealth. What is his attitude about it? He bitches about how much he and people like him has to pay in taxes. I'll call the wahhhhmublance. Then he acts like the elitist asshole. Oh, $360,000? Pocket change! He is the poster child for what is wrong in this country, the walking embodiment of greed and income inequality.

[MGKrebs]

29. Exactly my point.

[tridim]

10. Wonder if he disclosed all of his $10,000 bets?

[hughee99]

13. I wonder if he's won any of them. n/t

[Southerner]

16. I think what he meant was the $360K is not much compared to his investment income...

...which proabably is many millions per year. Regardless, a heartless comment considering the state of our economy today.

He probably has some legal deductions here and there he is using. So, he's paying what the law requires. Quit picking on him and go after the politicians on both sides of the aisle who voted to extend the Bush tax cuts which allow for a really low capital gains tax.

[DocMac]

18. And his job plan is to reduce taxes

on the Job Creators and to end Capital Gains Tax.

That's no job plan. That's a Mitten plan.

[CanonRay]

19. $360K a year = "Not very much"

OK, yeah, he's one of us all right.

[DFW]

21. He gave away the income from his book?

How much was that? $75.36?

And did he pay 35% on his "not very much" $360,000 speaking income? I paid 35% on my W-2 wages (and for working, not for speaking), and they weren't anything like $360,000 either.

What world do these people live in? Swissworld?

[MADem]

22. That jerk pays a lower rate than I do--and no one asks ME to speak!

What's up with that?

I am surrounded by four other people right now. I've added up their salaries, and included mine, and we still can't reach Rmoney's "pin money speaker's fee" amount.

Talk about out of touch!

[yellowcanine]

23. "And then I get speakers fees from time to time, but not very much.” ($300,000/yr)

Romney made more than $360,000 in speaker's fees between Feb. 2010 and Feb. 2011

The ads just write themselves, don't they?

[aquart]

26. This man is insufficiently taxed.

[anAustralianobserver]

39. Not to put too fine a point on it

[secondvariety]

27. Who in their right mind

would pay to hear Mittens speak?

[Judi Lynn]

28. Mitt Romney admits: I pay 15% tax on $200m personal fortune

Mitt Romney admits: I pay 15% tax on $200m personal fortune
Criticism grows as GOP frontrunner discloses information about his finances and says he will wait until April to publish tax returns
Ewen MacAskill in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina guardian.co.uk, Tuesday 17 January 2012 15.02 EST

Republican frontrunner Mitt Romney highlighted the gap between himself and average Americans on Tuesday when he maintained he did not make "very much" from speaking fees, even though the $370,000 earned in a single year would be considered a fortune by many middle-class Americans.

His comments came at a press conference while out campaigning in South Carolina ahead of its potentially decisive primary on Saturday. Romney is the favourite to win in South Carolina, enjoying a double-digit poll lead over his nearest rival, former speaker Newt Gingrich.

At the press conference in Florence, he disclosed that he pays a tax rate of only 15% in spite of having an estimated wealth of $200m.

Romney has so far resisted offering details about his financial dealings but, during the presidential debate in Myrtle Beach on Monday night, he finally bowed to pressure and said he would "probably" release his tax returns in April.

More:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jan/17/mitt-romney-speaking-fees-tax

[Bozita]

30. I'm betting it's UNDER 15%, certainly not over.

[Scairp]

49. I'm betting you're right

In fact I would bet he doesn't pay more than 13%, when it all finally comes out.

[Ruby the Liberal]

31. And what % of his net worth is income

Unearned income = shit as far as I am concerned.

Go out and earn a damn check and pay ordinary income tax as opposed to sheltering falsified capital gains behind carried interest, you supreme asshole.

[louis-t]

32. "close to 15%"?

The average that these guys pay on investments is 11%. Or so I've heard.

[CTyankee]

35. BUT, how many of your buddies are going to say, "I WANT TO PAY THAT RATE TOO!'

There are plenty of people out there who think they could make millions and pay a lower tax rate, even tho the recent evidence shows that's not likely!

THEY are the republicans who don't want any tax increases on the wealthy because THEY are going to be wealthy ANY DAY NOW! Right?

[Octafish]

37. Shitt offshores the loot, too.

So that makes him a patriotic tax dodger.

[anAustralianobserver]

38. He genuinely seems to believe that people with less wealth than himself mustn't be

as morally worthy of the wealth and opportunities he has...

and that if everyone would bask in his wealthy charisma and wisdom and soothing voice tones, and vote for his regressive tax utopia - his virtue would somehow rub off on them!

[Marnie]

41. Like Duhbya he is too dumb and selfish to know how heartless he is.

[Marnie]

40. In the late 1960s working part time minimum wage

I paid 18%.

Of course I did not have four houses to deduct or a pack of draft dodger children, or an unemployed spouse. And the unearned income interest on my checking account was so low (both the interest and the checking account) it was 0.

[wordpix]

43. and how much do your tax haven investors pay, Mittens?

Answer me that.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

45. Has he got money tucked away in tax havens too?

[wordpix]

46. "Island tax havens factor into Romney's business success" LA Times, 2007

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-na-mittoffshore17dec17,0,2757442,full.story

By Bob Drogin
Los Angeles Times Staff Writer
December 17, 2007
BOSTON— Second of two parts

-- While in private business, Mitt Romney utilized shell companies in two offshore tax havens to help eligible investors avoid paying U.S. taxes, federal and state records show.

Romney gained no personal tax benefit from the legal operations in Bermuda and the Cayman Islands. But aides to the Republican presidential hopeful and former colleagues acknowledged that the tax-friendly jurisdictions helped attract billions of additional investment dollars to Romney's former company, Bain Capital, and thus boosted profits for Romney and his partners....mroe

[TheFarseer]

47. He has proposed getting rid of

the tax on cap gains and dividends to help stimulate the economy. Or is to to stimulate your rich ass not paying any taxes???? The incredible balls republicans have.

[Johnny2X2X]

48. OWS

Thank you OWS, without the movement no one would even be asking these types of questions and no one would care what Mitt Romeny paid in taxes or what the specifics of his job at Bain were.