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Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 02:50 PM Dec 2013

Egypt's Military-Backed Rulers Declare Muslim Brotherhood "Terrorist" and Extend Crackdown

Source: Time

<snip>

The blast was the second in Egypt in three days. Fifteen people were killed in a much larger explosion, a suicide car bombing, according to the Interior Ministry, at a police headquarters in the Nile Delta town of Mansoura early on Tuesday. In response to the Mansoura bombing, the military-backed government officially branded the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist organization, a measure that deepens the military-backed government’s clampdown on the Islamist group following the military’s removal of Brotherhood-affiliated President Mohamed Morsi from power in July. The new designation criminalizes membership in the organization and its activities and finances.

No evidence has surfaced linking the Muslim Brotherhood to either attack. The Brotherhood’s official media organs condemned the Mansoura bombing, and a separate group, Sinai-based Ansar Beit al-Maqdis, claimed responsibility for it. Nevertheless the government appears determined to use the violence as an opportunity to pursue its crackdown on the organization. “From [the security establishment's] perspective, they see this as an opportunity to eradicate, once and for all, an organization that they hate. That takes precedence over everything else,” says Shadi Hamid, director of research at the Brookings Doha Center.

Morsi was removed by the military in July following vast protests against his rule. In the months following the coup, more than a thousand people died in a security crackdown on protests against Morsi’s removal. The new terrorist designation could shutter hundreds of Brotherhood-affiliated charities and could also drive members of the organization further underground, but it is unlikely to completely eliminate the Brotherhood as a social movement. On Wednesday night, one Cairo-area member of the Brotherhood, who asked not to be named over concern for his safety, said he met with other members of the group following the declaration. “What will the government do after this decision? Arrest? They already arrest us. Kill? They already kill us,” he said.

Despite the current clampdown, Brookings’ Hamid argues, the Brotherhood is steeped in an “organizational ethos of not resorting to violence” owing in part to its experience of brutal repression for years under the regime of late Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser. “But in a situation in which the leadership is decapitated and people aren’t getting clear orders,” he says, “you might have individuals who are going their own way because you lose the superstructure of the Brotherhood as an organization.”

<snip>

Read more: http://world.time.com/2013/12/26/egypts-military-backed-rulers-brand-muslim-brotherhood-terrorist-and-extend-crackdown/



The military's Orwellian campaign against dissent continue.

It's not just aimed at the Muslim Brotherhood. Now, those young democracy activists are being marched off to prison, too.

I know the Brotherhood is not popular in these precincts, but they were democratically elected and represent a significant portion of the population. It is as if we declares the Republican Party "terrorists." (I know that's a kind of popular notion, but I hope that is said only jokingly.)

The Arab Spring in Egypt has resulted in the military deepening its grip on power. The Obama administration is to be lauded for the steps it has taken against the coupsters, but chided for not doing more.
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Egypt's Military-Backed Rulers Declare Muslim Brotherhood "Terrorist" and Extend Crackdown (Original Post) Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 OP
More from the Time article: Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 #1
"Clashes Across Egypt Leave 3 Dead, Scores Injured" Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 #2
I love the last paragraph you pasted: happyslug Dec 2013 #3
Violence seems to be the only path the military is leaving open. Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 #6
Quit talking you Marxist..... happyslug Dec 2013 #8
What can the Obama administration really do? davidthegnome Dec 2013 #4
It can follow the law--the 1961 Foreign Assistance Act--and cut off aid to the generals. Comrade Grumpy Dec 2013 #5
I'm not terribly familiar with the foreign assistance act. davidthegnome Dec 2013 #7
Cut off aid, lose whatever influence you have left to preserve your interests TwilightGardener Dec 2013 #9
The cycle of violence never ends. jessie04 Dec 2013 #10
 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
1. More from the Time article:
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 02:51 PM
Dec 2013

<snip>

In recent weeks the military-led government has also extended the clampdown to include non-Islamist opposition groups who carry the torch of the January 2011 uprising that toppled dictator Hosni Mubarak. On Sunday a court sentenced three prominent activists who helped spearhead the 2011 revolt to three years in prison for violating a new law that criminalizes all street protests that take place without explicit government permission. The three, Ahmed Maher, Ahmed Douma and Mohammed Adel, founders of the April 6 youth movement, declared a hunger strike on Wednesday in protest of the conditions of their detention. Their winter clothes, they said through an intermediary, had been taken away, with no replacement, by guards who said the garments were the wrong color.

Everywhere in Egypt, the raucous, unpredictable space for political expression opened by the 2011 revolution appears to be shrinking. The government asserts that the clampdown on the Brotherhood and restrictions on protest are needed in order to restore the security needed to proceed with a “road map” for political transition. The next step on the road map is a referendum, scheduled for mid-January, on a new constitution drafted in the wake of the coup. Fatigued after nearly three years of periodic unrest and distrusting of the Brotherhood after Morsi’s presidency, a vocal portion of the public backs the government, though some of last summer’s militaristic fervor has faded. In a sign of persisting sectarianism, the Brotherhood released a statement on its official website that in part faulted the Coptic Church, which backed Morsi’s removal, for the government crackdown.

Thursday’s roadside bombing proved for some that the insurgent activity common in the Sinai is taking root in mainland Egypt — a sign that the country as a whole is sliding deeper into a spiral of repression and violence. Some experts suggest that a violent showdown suits the designs of hard-liners within Egypt’s security state. “It is obvious that there is a faction within this government that is pushing everything toward escalation and violence in order to force their opponents to resort to violence,” says Emad Shahin, a political scientist at the American University in Cairo. He argues that the government’s real aim with the terrorist designation is to stamp out the “culture of protest” that flourished in 2011. “This regime is trying to tame a revolution,” he says.

 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
2. "Clashes Across Egypt Leave 3 Dead, Scores Injured"
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 04:30 PM
Dec 2013
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/12/27/us-egypt-brotherhood-idUSBRE9BQ06M20131227

(Reuters) - Muslim Brotherhood supporters and police clashed across Egypt on Friday, leaving at least three dead in protests after the army-backed government declared the group a terrorist organisation. The violence broke out after Friday prayers and the health ministry said 87 people were injured nationwide in the clashes, which flared in Cairo and at least four other cities.

An 18-year-old Brotherhood supporter was shot dead during clashes in the Nile Delta city of Damietta. A second man was killed in Minya, a bastion of Islamist support south of Cairo, and a third person was killed in the capital, the interior ministry said, without providing further details. Security forces detained at least 265 Brotherhood supporters nationwide, including at least 28 women, the ministry also said.

The widening crackdown has increased tensions in a country suffering the worst internal strife of its modern history since the army deposed Islamist President Mohamed Mursi in July. Security forces have killed hundreds of his supporters and lethal attacks on soldiers and police have become commonplace.

The Brotherhood was declared a terrorist organisation after 16 people were killed in a suicide attack on a police station on Tuesday, although the group condemned the attack and it was claimed by a radical faction based in the Sinai Peninsula.

<snip>
 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
3. I love the last paragraph you pasted:
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 05:04 PM
Dec 2013
Despite the current clampdown, Brookings’ Hamid argues, the Brotherhood is steeped in an “organizational ethos of not resorting to violence” owing in part to its experience of brutal repression for years under the regime of late Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser. “But in a situation in which the leadership is decapitated and people aren’t getting clear orders,” he says, “you might have individuals who are going their own way because you lose the superstructure of the Brotherhood as an organization.”

i.e. Because all of the leaders are in Jail, leaders who would STOP any move to Violence, lower ranking people MAY resort to violence.

The Logic is weird. i.e. We locked up the leadership for their oppose the Government, because we locked them up, the lower ranks will use violence. Does that mean release the leadership to prevent such violence? NO. It means violence will occur and the Military will do NOTHING about it.
 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
6. Violence seems to be the only path the military is leaving open.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 07:12 PM
Dec 2013

They overthrew the democratically-elected Muslim Brotherhood government.

They gunned down hundreds, if not thousands, of Muslim Brotherhood protesters.

They jailed the leadership.

They banned the organization.

They have now declared it a "terrorist" organization.

They arrest and imprison you for demonstrating.

What's left?

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
8. Quit talking you Marxist.....
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 08:13 PM
Dec 2013

The right HATE Karl Marx, for when it came to revolutions HOW they occur, WHEN they occur, and WHY their occur was his strong point. He pointed out as things go down hill economically, you will NOT have a revolution, it is when things had bottomed out and started to recover you have a revolution (i.e, people have to feel confident before they turn radical, when they don't know where they next piece of bread is coming from, they will NOT revolt, when they finally have their stomach full, that is when they revolt).

Marx also pointed out that ruling elites keep up the image of ruling for all fairly, till they can NOT stay in power by acting fairly. At that point they will resort to military muscle (For example what happen in Poland in the 1970s with Solidarity, after Solidarity threaten to take over Poland, the Polish Military intervened to suppress Solidarity, a classic response to revolution that Karl Marx predicted).

Side note: Yes Poland in the 1970s was Communistic, but Marx's strong point was NOT economics, but economics and its affect on history and how it leads to revolutions. Thus his predictions that when the pressure for a revolution is building, the ruling elite will resort to violence to put down the revolution while before the Revolution turns violent. i.e. it is NOT the revolutionaries that turn to violence first, but the ruling elite. For example it was the Louis XVI decision to leave Paris and lead an army against the Revolution that started the Reign of Terror. Everyone knew what Louis XVI was doing when he left to be with his troops. Louis XVI was going to use those troops to suppress Paris. Louis XVI was the first to use violence NOT the revolutionaries.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
4. What can the Obama administration really do?
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 07:03 PM
Dec 2013

When the President does something wrong or stupid, I'll usually express my opinions about it. In this though... I'm not really sure what the options are. To alter what the military is doing here, it is entirely likely we would have to involve ourselves militarily. Should our military, then, instead of theirs, be the one that tries to run the Country? Or do you feel that we should support the Muslim Brotherhood? We've been installing puppet dictators and governments for years, we could do the same here, but aside from that...

Democracy is fine in theory - and when the candidates for power and representation are good, then all is good. However... when an organization like the Muslim Brotherhood is one of your most appealing options... well, there you have it, an excellent argument against democracy.

What separates us is that our Country isn't (yet) quite crazy enough to declare one of it's major political parties a terrorist group. There are many though, even right here, who wish it were otherwise.

The Brotherhood's fanatical zeal is just as scary as a military dictatorship, in some ways, even more scary. When there are no good options, it's hard to figure out what to do and how to help.

Not sure what the heck Obama can do about this one.

 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
5. It can follow the law--the 1961 Foreign Assistance Act--and cut off aid to the generals.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 07:09 PM
Dec 2013

As the act requires.

The Obama administration has taken some half-steps in that direction, delaying some aid. I don't think it has gone far enough.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
7. I'm not terribly familiar with the foreign assistance act.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 07:17 PM
Dec 2013

Something for me to look up when I get back home tonight...

Would cutting off aid be enough to make them stop what they're doing? Or would they just get the funding from somewhere else?

TwilightGardener

(46,416 posts)
9. Cut off aid, lose whatever influence you have left to preserve your interests
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 08:44 PM
Dec 2013

in the region. That's why we've been so hesitant.

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