Second Danish zoo plans to publicly dissect giraffe and feed to lions

[jsr]

Source: The Telegraph

Denmark’s Jyllands Park Zoo may euthanise and publicly dissect a giraffe named Marius only days after another zoo in Copenhagen slaughtered a giraffe that coincidentally shared the same name, sparking outrage from animal lovers across the world.

Marius, one of two male giraffes at the zoo, may be killed according to rules laid down by a European breeding programme to which Jyllands is signed on to. A female giraffe will be sent to breed with the other male at the zoo which means that Marius must go to prevent the two males fighting over her.

The zoo’s chief zoologist Jesper Mohring said that if the animal is slaughtered he will dissect it because he is duty-bound to educate the public about animal anatomy “in both life and death”.

“If you have such a marvellous animal as a giraffe, if you can use it for education, then I think you should,” he said. “I’ve done dissections in front of children down to three years old -- with camels and tigers and lions and so on. They are not disgusted, they are fascinated, and curious, and learn a lot.”

Read more: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/denmark/10636741/Second-Danish-zoo-plans-to-publicly-dissect-giraffe-and-feed-to-lions.html

[valerief]

1. No matter how far the little guy sticks his neck out, the lions will eventually get him. nt

Last edited Thu Feb 13, 2014, 02:27 PM - Edit history (1)

[ForgoTheConsequence]

2. Sounds like the Danes have a better grip on life than us.

Maybe the outrage machine would prefer we put the lions on a diet of Boca burgers and quinoa?

[Lithos]

16. That has nothing to do with the issue

The Zoo is wanting to get a female to replace the male. The issue why they can't keep the mail is they only have room for "two". What do they think they want to do with the offspring?

The first Zoo made it clear they have other priorities. My guess it was mostly to be sensationalistic and gain attention. If you don't give us money, we'll kill more animals. They are looking at it as a business and the animals are nothing more than resources. Hell, if they are gonna go that route, let's bring in one of our chicken companies to manage their zoo. I'm sure there is a market for Giraffe burger at whatever passes for Whole Foods in the EU.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

20. I'd try a giraffe burger.

Giraffes are vegetarians so their meat is probably pretty tasty.


I love love watching Americans get outraged about what happens in foreign countries when far worse animal husbandry conditions exist here. What hypocrites we are.

[brett_jv]

35. We'd be even more outraged if it were happening in the USA and we knew about it ...

And the protests about the killing of the other Marius last week came from all quarters of the world, not just us 'hypocritical' Americans.

This really has very little to do with the 'country' in which this is happening, and I don't hear anyone saying it could/would never happen here in the US.

Straw-man is a straw-man.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

38. Some would, some wouldn't.

Much easier to be outraged when it involves a certain amount of xenophobia.

[AtheistCrusader]

27. The offspring is probably genetically desirable.

Being that zoos are largely closed systems, breeding programs must combat inbreeding, if you are to keep them as healthy as possible.

The offspring will likely be sent to another zoo.

Sure there are practical reasons, like zoo attendance to bolster with a cute baby animal, but it doesn't seem to be a widespread strategy to boost attendance.

You lost me at nationalism...

[swilton]

52. If they are so undesirable

in the gene pool - why were the parents bred in the first place????

This smacks of Western society's disposable culture.....The first Maurius could have had a home in a British zoo....

I'm sorry my belief in zoos is changing - non-human species deserve more than to be put on in some exhibition for a dissection class.

[AtheistCrusader]

78. I view it as maximum utility out of an animal, that in the past, or even in the US,

might just be chopped up for lion food.

Using it as a cadaver for anatomy, useful. There's actually a lot about giraffe physiology we are just recently tripping to. Some things that speak to the origins of all mammals, us included.

Look, I understand it seems crass or mean, but it's really not meant so. They probably considered releasing it to a preserve or something. There may be medical reasons for this animal that they cannot do that. Some zoos certainly do.

[TwilightGardener]

3. These people are fucking psychopaths. Who knew the Danish were this fucking mental?

Why should they be allowed to have zoos, at this point? Zoos are for protection and appreciation of animals, not for pointless slaughter to "educate children" and provide meat.

[TM99]

6. Did you actually read the article

or do you just have knee-jerk outrage?

The giraffe is put down due to regulations on breeding which helps to protect the animals in zoos. The choice to do a public dissection is to educate after the death has occurred. Why waste the opportunity to educate when death is already inevitable? Some of these children and young teens will go on into medicine, zoology, etc. themselves inspired by what they learn.

They are not 'psychopaths'.

[TwilightGardener]

10. I stand by my statements. Purposely breeding and then killing healthy animals

to maintain their desired breeding plan is fucking sick.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

14. What should they feed the lions?

Or are some animals more equal (or cute) than others?

[TwilightGardener]

26. That's a side issue. I'm appalled at their treatment of these animals as

mere breeding commodities to be discarded, instead of living beings to cherished and protected--even if it means moving them elsewhere, or no longer breeding more giraffes only to end up with excess for slaughter. Humans control this process--why are they doing it like this?

[ForgoTheConsequence]

28. It's not a side issue.

It's blatant hypocrisy.


Do you eat meat?

[TwilightGardener]

30. You're hung up on how they use a carcass. This isn't a meat/vegetarian thread.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

33. No I'm not.

All carcasses begin as a living breathing animal. Some just happen to be more cute than others.....


I remember dissecting cats in high school biology, I'm a better person because of it.

[MicaelS]

40. No it's about how people anthropomorphize animals.

"Ohh, the giraffe is so pretty with that long neck, and big pretty eyes, with those long eyelashes. It's toooo pretty to die."

If this was an ugly-ass water buffalo people probably wouldn't say shit.

[TwilightGardener]

43. I don't anthropomorphize, and yes, I would feel just as outraged if they were

deliberately breeding water buffalo, or hippos, or whatever and then simply killing off the unwanted when the animals no longer help them meet their breeding plan.

[TM99]

74. That is simply ridiculous hyperbole.

Those who deal with animal husbandry and breeding especially with endangered species are NOT psychopaths just because their choices rub you the wrong way.

[brett_jv]

25. Yes, but ... why is death 'inevitable'?

Is there absolutely no way to transport the unwelcome Marius to a different facility that DOES want him? They're moving the female in from elsewhere, correct? Well, why can't Marius move to wherever SHE ... is coming FROM?

If that doesn't work, is there no way this female could breed with a DIFFERENT giraffe, as opposed to one who's located somewhere that such breeding will result in the slaughter of a different adult male? Is it really worth it to sacrifice the life of Marius in order to breed this female with his pen-mate?

The only way that this whole thing is remotely acceptable in my mind is if the zoo has done absolutely everything in it's power to find him a different home, and a different male to breed with, and come up empty ... and even then it's questionable as to value of the act of 'breeding' being more important than an adult giraffe's life.

I can't believe some of you people here acting like there's anything ridiculous about protesting something like this. Even once you read the whole story and understand 'both sides' it's not at all difficult to feel like this is of 'questionable morality'.

It's not the dissection, or the feeding to the lions that's the issue. It's the KILLING of an apparently perfectly healthy, beautiful animal, just because it's not 'good breeding stock'.

[NickB79]

46. One purpose of zoos is to preserve wild species threatened with extinction

You may poo-poo the idea of killing an animal because it's not good breeding stock, but maintaining good breeding stock is CRITICALLY important to this purpose.

If the animal is too closely related to others of it's species within the relatively small breeding pool of European zoos, it is taking up valuable resources that could be used to raise and care for an animal with more diverse genetics. Even if they simply neutered the animals that aren't suitable for the breeding program, they'd still be taking up space that zoos simply do not have. That was the problem with the last giraffe they killed last week; another zoo had the space for him, but his brother lived at the same zoo. Having two giraffes so closely related, at the same facility, would have meant only one could have been used for breeding.

It's not as simple as you seem to think to move animals around in the zoo system. These things are often planned out YEARS in advance, using complex genetic charts and DNA sequencing, with HUNDREDS of zoos participating in animal exchanges. You don't simply call up another zoo and say "hey man, want another giraffe? I can drop him off next week." It can also be dangerous to move animals frequently, between the stress of the move itself and the danger that the other animals in the new zoo may reject them. It is not something the zoos do casually.

You think this is a moral issue; I agree. I think that preventing an entire species from going extinct is more moral than saving any one animal of said species, no matter how cute it may be.

[brett_jv]

62. Fair enough ... this argument, however, is not being well-articulated ...

Either by the folks at the zoo, by the reportage in general, or by various people on this thread who make like this is all good, seeing as how lion's eat giraffe's in the wild so, "what the heck, they gotta eat something, right"?

[TM99]

73. The other poster covered it quite well.

My father grew up on a farm with a wide diversity of animals. As a boy I experienced that 'cycle of life' where yes, sadly, culling of herds, selective breeding, and inevitable deaths do occur.

I breed rats and have done so for almost 10 years now. It is not always easy having to make life and death choices. One litter had to be put down completely because a fellow breeder lied to me about the lineage of her male. Look up the health and temperament problems of Blue rats and you will understand.

I am not insensitive to those who may feel bad about the death of such a beautiful creature, however, to call the zookeepers psychopaths is just ridiculous hyperbole. Animal husbandry is as old as humanity.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

8. Pointless?

You just gave two reasons that it isn't pointless. Do you eat meat? Or do you only care when it's a cute animal? Guess what lions eat in the wild? Geoffrey the Giraffe!

Why shouldn't this lion held in captivity enjoy something familiar to its palate? Nature is a cruel beast, these kids are going to have a much better grasp on how things works than the Americans who are outraged about nature.

[Lithos]

19. It's a matter they screwed up

Their mistake in over-breeding. And now the new Zoo is going to repeat that model for the same reason.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

23. And I don't see a problem with it.

Why are giraffes more precious than what ever other meat the lions would get?

[Lithos]

34. Rather simplistic view

Let me talk to your point then. The cost per pound for Giraffe is going to be an awful lot higher than beef or horse as it is much harder and more expensive to raise a Giraffe in any bulk.

The reality is the zoo screwed up, over-breed and rather than admit it are hiding behind some "bigger good" thing which is full of crap given the minimal value it provides. As for the kids, the lesson it is giving is not one of anatomy, but that it's ok to not take responsibility and dispose of later. It is a lot like taking a race horse and once it is retired, selling it to the Knackers. The animal shelters are always full of animals which are disposed of after they grow up and are no longer kittens or puppies and thus not cute.

L-

[ForgoTheConsequence]

36. The cost of beef is an interesting point.

It exposes a large part of your hypocrisy. Why is it ok to commoditize some animals and not others? Even if the zoo did make a mistake, so what? Why not make the most out of it?


People are only outraged because it's cute. Meanwhile they're chowing down own McDonalds and Burger King while they let their outrage spill out over the internet. Hypocrisy.

[Lithos]

47. The most of it...

Would have been to sell it to another zoo; I understand there were several willing to buy it.

People have absolutely no clue where their meat comes from nor about the process within which the supply pipeline happens. If they did, they would be outraged. Even so, there is a distinct difference between animals raised for food and animals not raised for food.

[snooper2]

4. If they want to go hardcore, why don't they just

Let the giraffe walk into the lion enclosure?

[Aldo Leopold]

13. My guess is...

this will be the next step, eventually. Close the zoo for a day, sell tickets to raise money for zoo operations, and let the ticket-buyers witness "nature in action".

Of course, it's doubtful the lions in either of these two zoos have ever hunted a giraffe or have ever even seen a giraffe.

[AtheistCrusader]

32. I assume that was sarcasm but, an aside...

When I took my son to the zoo last month, the mountain lions were being lazy and generally ignoring the human visitors. Then a zoo worker paraded a lama on a harness/leash around the zoo grounds for exercise. The moment that sucker was visible AT ALL, the mountain lions were front and center at attention. They had lived their entire lives in an enclosure, yet, they understood possible prey, and *also* ignore humans as possible prey.

Just an interesting observation.

I bet they'd have no trouble figuring out what to do if a lama fell into their enclosure somehow.

[malthaussen]

24. Wouldn't work.

The lions would probably just look at the giraffe, shrug their shoulders, and go check out their food bowls. Lazy buggers.

-- Mal

[bklyncowgirl]

56. That might not work out too well for the lion.

Giraffes are big powerful animals with a nasty kick.

[KamaAina]

5. Couldn't they just send the giraffe to another zoo?

[hamsterjill]

7. Exactly!!! I think that is everyone's question, isn't it?

I mean, good grief!

[MicaelS]

17. Lions eat meat.

What animal do you want sacrificed in place of the giraffe?

[hamsterjill]

21. I am well aware of how nature works.

This is not nature.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

31. True.

But either way an animal is going to die for this lion to eat. You're just outraged because this animal happens to be cute.

[hamsterjill]

49. No, I'm outraged because this animal was bred and raised by this zoo, and was taught to trust humans

Now humans will execute him.

The issues with this zoo NOT having handled their breeding patterns properly in the PAST is already addressed on this thread, so I'll not rehash that.

In my mind, there is a big difference in killing livestock for food than in killing an animal that has been raised, essentially as a "pet".

[anasv]

9. Yes.

A number of zoos tried to adopt (and pay for) the first giraffe, but were turned down.

I'm horrified that I'm Danish-American. I will never set foot in that country again.

[proudretiredvet]

15. This is about genetics and the health of the total population.

This bloodline has reached it's limit within the genetic pool of zoo owned giraffes in that area. Genetic diversity is necessary for the continuing health of the herd.
What they are doing is right but how they are doing it is crude.

[KamaAina]

18. I meant just for exhibition, not breeding.

And it could be anywhere in Europe.

[X_Digger]

58. Another zoo would be in need of a male giraffe that is sufficiently genetically dissimilar..

.. from the giraffes already housed at the zoo. If the genetics are too close, inbreeding could occur.

Also, sexually mature male giraffes will fight, injuring one or both of them, perhaps fatally.

Giraffes aren't like a pack of dogs where once neutered, they can live willy-nilly with each other.

[KamaAina]

60. How about a small zoo that doesn't have a giraffe?

Not for mating, just exhibition.

[X_Digger]

61. The zoos there only exchange animals among the same group (EAZA).

It's one of the tenets of the breeding program- to not sell or give animals in the program to a facility not in the program. Otherwise, they could be accused of breeding giraffes for profit.

If another zoo in the same group were starting up a breeding program, or had a lack of diversity that this giraffe represented, then I'd think they could.

The fact that they didn't do so tells me that either the giraffe was too genetically close to those in other locations considered, and/or no other EAZA facility had a breeding slot open for a male giraffe.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

11. Don't they have Costco in Denmark?

They should have purchased the lion a couple hundred tofurkeys.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

12. Great,...I just pictured the MGM lion farting.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

39. I think I saw a lion at Whole Foods.

Picking up some vegan cheese. She was driving a Volvo wagon with a Nader sticker on the back.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

50. Naw,...that was a cougar.

[jmowreader]

55. Tofurky doesn't have taurine, and cats need that

[Spitfire of ATJ]

22. Two lions looking at the slab of meat in a tray...

"Neck AGAIN?"

[Aldo Leopold]

29. In 1994, an okapi died at the Copenhagen Zoo due to stress from a nearby opera production

From the AP on August 10, 1994:

"ASSOCIATED PRESS

COPENHAGEN Opera may be sweet to some people’s ears. But to at least one animal, the strains of Wagner were fatal.

The Copenhagen Zoo said Tues-day an okapi a rare African mammal related to the giraffe died from stress apparently triggered by opera singers rehearsing in a park 300 yards away.

The 6-year-old okapi, Katanda, collapsed Friday after Royal Theater performers began singing se-lections from Tannhauser, said zoo spokesman Peter Haase.

She started hyperventilating, went into shock and collapsed, he said. We did all we could, but she died Saturday.

Okapis can be severely affected by unusual sounds, he said. An autopsy determined the animal suffered a severe stress attack.

Katanga was brought to the zoo last year from the San Diego Zoo. Eight months ago, she gave birth to a calf in Copenhagen.

Neither the calf nor a male okapi apeared to react severely to the singing, Haase said.

The Royal Theater deeply re-grets the animalís death, said a spokesman, Jon Stephensen. He said the concert likely will be moved away from the zoo."

I happened to be at a party at the Zoological Museum at the University of Copenhagen around the time this happened, and there was discussion of the fact that the okapi had subsequently been butchered and served for dinner at an event.

[bitchkitty]

37. Sick. Disgusting.

Not only the fact that they will publicly dissect this animal. The fact that the fucking zoo exists in the first place.

Sometimes I truly hate people.

[MicaelS]

42. "Sometimes I truly hate people."?????

Really??? Well sometimes I really don't like people who "feel" animals are more important than people.

[bitchkitty]

45. Well, I'm just broken hearted.

To think that you don't approve of my respect and love for my fellow creatures. I'm going to run out and eat a fucking giraffe steak.

[anasv]

82. animals are people both have lives

Animals live theirs better. You don't see giraffes sending the planet into a death spiral, or going around killing other beings because they enjoy wanton slaughter and have the power to do it.

[alp227]

41. Sigh. The comments EVEN IN FRIGGIN DU show why America needs better science education.

The Copenhagen Zoo FAQ about their giraffe is the one English page written on the Zoo website. Whoever wrote that must've thought, "stupid ass Americans". I am just so frustrated with all the comments all over the web from people who think emotionally and not scientifically. It's bad enough with creationism and GMO-phobia and global warming denialism that's poisoned the people of the nation I grew up in.

And if the giraffes were allowed to inbreed, people would then be complaining.

[MicaelS]

44. It's about how some people are fucking batshit..

When it comes to animals. When I see people on DU who claim they like their animals more than they like people, or that animals are equal to people it just proves that the "reality-based community" isn't all that reality based.

[liberal_at_heart]

67. We are not robots. We do have emotions. Just because we use science to observe nature does not

mean we stop using our emotions. You can think all high and mighty about yourself if it makes you feel better about yourself but I will never give up my natural compassion that I have for all sentient beings.

[alp227]

68. Emotional appeal fallacy.

Not everything can be decided emotionally. That's the cold hard truth whether you like it or not.

[liberal_at_heart]

69. Not everything can be decided devoid of emotion. Again I say, do as you please. I will continue

to live my life with love and compassion.

[alp227]

70. So you're just gonna evade the issue the zoo is addressing about genetic diversity?

Gosh this just confirms my frustration about the widespread scientific illiteracy in America...sadly I can't confine my criticisms to right wingers who spew creationist/global warming denialism/anti-gay POVs they heard on Fox News or talk radio.

[liberal_at_heart]

71. every heard of birth control? Someone just posted that Woodland Park Zoo uses

birth control on animals they do not wish to breed. Also, ever heard of not being so condescending and demeaning to others who simply have a different opinion than yourself? I hope you have a nice evening. I am done bickering. I have more pleasant things to do with my time.

[alp227]

72. Not my responsibility to respect all opinions.

And the zoo had addressed birth control:

”Why are the giraffes not given contraceptives?” “In Copenhagen Zoo we let the animals breed naturally. With naturally we mean that they will get young within the same intervals as they would in the wild. That means that the animals get to carry out their natural behaviours. Parental care is a big part of an animal’s behaviour. It is a 24 hour job in longer periods of their lives and we believe that they should still be able to carry out this type of behaviour also in captivity. Contraceptives have a number of unwanted side effects on the internal organs and we would therefore apply a poorer animal welfare if we did not euthanize.”

[Inkfreak]

75. Some1 actually said they're HORRIFIED to be Danish-American...(nt)

[avebury]

77. I imagine that they could have made arrangements to

swap the giraffe with one from another continent (like a zoo in the US) and 2 zoos would expand the genetic pool in their respective zoos.

I am not convinced that either zoo had really exhausted their efforts to save their giraffes.

Maybe the zoo should not be breeding so many giraffe babies if all they are going to do is kill them. It kind of defeats the purpose of what they are supposed to be accomplishing. Maybe creating test tube embryos would allow them to breed only the giraffes they actually need instead of leaving things up to chance and executing the mistakes.

[jmondine]

48. I am a zoo volunteer. I have a lot of thoughts on this whole process.

1. This is not news, in that it's nothing new. This is standard operating procedure for zoos in the EAZA. It's not limited to Copenhagen. Zoos all throughout Europe practice this policy.

2. The North American equivalent, the AZA, does not practice this. Specifically, the AZA, which includes Woodland Park Zoo where I volunteer, uses birth control rather than euthanasia to control breeding of captive populations. The only time euthanasia is used here is when the animal's quality of life has deteriorated due to age or disease.

3. The reason given by the EAZA for allowing non-sustainable breeding followed by euthanasia of juveniles once they reach maturity is that it allows the parent animals the enriching experience of raising young. I emphatically disagree with this policy, and I hope that all of this recent bad press causes the EAZA to reconsider.

4. The phrasing of these articles has been intentionally sensationalistic. By saying the giraffes were shot, or shot by a "bolt gun", makes it sound as if bullets or explosive rounds were used, which is not the case. Also, by saying things like, "killed and fed to the lions", the reporters intentionally call up images of Roman coliseum gore fests.

5. Lions in the wild rarely eat giraffe meat. Occasionally, lions may kill a baby giraffe if they can separate it from its mother, but that is a big "if". A full grown giraffe can defend itself quite well with a powerful kick which could easily kill an attacking lion. That said, giving the lions a unique form of meat is not something I object to. Lions are carnivores by nature, and those in captivity deserve a great variety of food and enrichment.

6. I think that the idea of doing a necropsy on a large animal in front of visitors, including children, is absurd. Now, I haven't seen the program first hand, so maybe they have a way of presenting it that isn't morbid or potentially disturbing, but it's hard for me to imagine.

One last thing: To those who have posted bad jokes on this thread, give it a rest. I've heard every morbid comment designed to shock and rattle animal lovers you can think of. Yeah, yeah. You want to kill the animals, or eat them, or pit them against each other in an arena battle, blah, blah, blah...

[hamsterjill]

51. +1

Very well said.

[NCarolinawoman]

53. Thank you for your very intelligent, thoughtful, and reasonable input.

Very much appreciated.

[Crepuscular]

54. Why

is the idea of a necropsy in front of an audience such an appalling thought? It happens every day at colleges and universities, as well as millions of times a year in garages and back yards when large game animals are butchered. For the most part it does not bother kids at all and can in fact be very educational. Farmers have been butchering animals in front of kids for about as long as animal husbandry has existed, it not a whole lot different then doing dissections in biology class, except on a larger scale.

Having butchered hundreds of game animals in my life, often with one of my kids holding a leg or passing me a knife or saw, I fail to understand why it would be viewed as disturbing or morbid. Unless you are so detached from the real world as to think that the hamburger in the little foam tray in the supermarket comes from a plant and is grown that way.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

57. Because Americans WANT to be ignorant.

They love their beef and chicken nuggets but do not want to know where they came from. They'll chow down on a factory farm raised hamburger while posting angrily online about a zoo 5000 miles away. And science? Forget it.


Like I said earlier, the Danish children who had an opportunity to witness this are going to be more well adjusted than the 45 year old cubical dwellers in America who are having a cry over the death of Geoffrey the giraffe.

[Art_from_Ark]

65. I think that if I had seen something like that in elementary school,

it would have given me nightmares, although some of the other boys would have no doubt gotten into it, especially the country kids who talked about cleaning deer carcasses.

[gwheezie]

76. I've read the entire thread

You seem to be stuck on the vegetarian thing.
I have no problem with feeding lions any kind of animal carcass. I have/had horses,goats and beef, some of the acceptable ways of disposing of an animal is a bullet and donation to a zoo, or in the case of fox hunters, a bullet and fed to the hounds. In some states, you can dispose of a carcass by leaving it out to be eaten by carnivores. You can't do this if the animal is put down using chemicals.
It seems to me that American zoos have a different way of dealing with breeding animals then Denmark does, since we have a comment from someone who actually works in an American zoo, I figure that person knows what they're talking about.
I am a vegetarian, I used to eat meat, I ate meat of the livestock/fowl I raised. I think factory farming is inhumane, I preferred to have my animals live in a fairly normal as nature intended environment. I believe hunting is more humane than factory farms, the animal lives as intended until it is killed. Having said all that, this is apples and oranges when talking about a zoo breeding animals and then killing them because they can't think of a better way to deal with the offspring. I don't even care if they want to use the carcass as an educational tool, I assume they are giving people the choice if they want to watch it. I would prefer zoos figure out another way to deal with a healthy animal they produced than kill it. It sounds like American zoos have figured this out.
And this rural vs city thing is getting old, I have lived in both settings, one is not better than another.

[X_Digger]

59. This is probably a rural v urban issue.

It's nothing new to a farm kid. Even that pig you raised for 4-H eventually gets slaughtered.

[liberal_at_heart]

64. You think that farm kid who raises that pig doesn't cry the first time it happens?

They are conditioned and desensitized to it after being exposed to it time and time again. I read a thread on DU yesterday about how a passerby stayed with a dying orca until it passed. We have a natural connection and compassion for all sentient beings.

[jmondine]

79. Thank you, Crepuscular

Like I said, I hadn't viewed the necropsy program myself. This is very illuminating. And it's true that dealing directly with the animal carcass is part of the process of either disposing of an animal or processing it for meat. I am just so used to being shielded from this part of the process. City kids like myself have been so separated from the whole process of life in the natural world. Perhaps it would be good for me to observe or even participate in such a process.

BTW, being an animal educator, I'm probably one of the only folks here who knows what your DU name means.

[liberal_at_heart]

63. I'm extremely jealous. I would love to volunteer at the Woodland Park Zoo. I've heard the

waiting list to volunteer is really, really, long. Is it also true that you have to have a biology degree to volunteer?

[jmondine]

80. It's easier than you think

In fact, the program for this year is still open. Just go to zoo.org (we are the only zoo to get one of the big URL's for our very own) and find out when the next orientation is. I think there's one coming up in March. Show up, fill in an app, and if your interview goes well, you get to be an ambassador for a year, after which you can follow several different volunteer paths.

Some of the animal unit paths do have waiting lists. Primates and raptors are the longest. Reptiles and bugs have no waiting at all.

As far as needing a degree, I have an AA in electronic engineering. Totally not an issue, thank goodness.

[Tom Ripley]

66. Note to self: Do not come back as giraffe named Marius in Denmark

[Beacool]

81. I have no problem with the dissection part if the animal died due to natural causes

or had to be euthanized due to illness, but there's something very wrong about killing a healthy animal for not much of a valid reason. How about offering Marius to another zoo?