Gang-raped Indonesian woman may be caned publicly

[hue]

Source: The Washington Post


By Associated Press, Updated: Wednesday, May 7, 9:20 AM

BANDA ACEH, Indonesia — An Indonesian woman who was gang-raped by men accusing her of having extramarital sex may be caned publicly for violating Islamic law, an official said Wednesday.

The 25-year-old widow said she was raped by eight men who allegedly found her with a married man in her house. The men reportedly beat the man, doused the two with sewage, and then turned them over to Islamic police in conservative Aceh province.

The alleged attack occurred early Thursday in Lhokbani, a village in East Aceh district.

The head of Islamic Shariah law in the district, Ibrahim Latief, said his office has recommended the widow and the married man be caned nine times for violating religious law, pending an investigation. Its preliminary finding was that the two were about to have sex at that time, but Latief contended they violated Shariah law by being in the same room together. He said they also admitted they had sex earlier.

Indonesia, the world’s most populous Muslim nation of 240 million people, has a policy of secularism but allows Aceh, a predominantly Muslim province on the northern tip of Sumatra, to implement a version of Sharia Islamic law.

Police have arrested three of the eight men and are hunting for the others.

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/gang-raped-indonesian-woman-faces-public-caning/2014/05/07/87c02dce-d5ce-11e3-8f7d-7786660fff7c_story.html

---

Sharia Law should be a formal psych diagnosis.

[JustAnotherGen]

1. All sense of 'tolerance'

For religion goes out the window when I read things like this.

And I agree - Sharia Law should be a formal psych diagnosis.

And it should also serve as lesson of what could happen in America if the far religious right in this country gets their way.

[The Green Manalishi]

2. Agreed.

It's always a small step from believing absurdities to committing atrocities.

[cosmicone]

3. +1,000,000

There should be no tolerance of such acts if your religion is fucked up enough to condone it.

[Cartoonist]

4. I lost my tolerance long ago.

As horrific as this instance is, it can't even begin to compare to all the religious led genocide in our planet's history. All the free soup in the world can't even begin to atone for religion's atrocities. I have nothing but contempt for all religion, but if I speak it here, I get my posts banned.

[JustAnotherGen]

8. I'm a UU

In a strange twist of irony - Catholic High School and University made me question my Baptist upbringing. I almost went the way of my Maternal Grandfather - he was raised Jewish.


But what I found was the UU 'faith' allows me to question not just the 'big three' but ALL of it. Have serious discussion. My feeling is that those who follow earth religions and Hindus should be just as questioned as those that follow the big three. They don't get a 'special pass'.

And if they don't speak up when horrific things happen - all 'religions' lose their moral high ground.

[delta17]

36. Blanket tolerance is idiotic.

Some things are just wrong. This is a good example.

[happyslug]

39. What is wrong? That the Religious leader is demanding a worse punishment for the rapists?

Remember that is what the Religious leader is DEMANDING. While he believes the woman should be caned nine times for admitting to having sex with a man not her husband, the Religious Leaders also condemns the rapists and saying none caning is NOT sufficient for them.

You may disagree with the sentence to the woman for her crime, but it has been a crime in that part of the world even in pre-Islamic times. Nine caning is harsh, but it is rarely fatal.

Please note, under Sharia Law, her family (including herself) can arrange a lesser punishment if the victim agrees (in this case the wife of the person she was with). Thus this victim may get out of the canning, depending on what the local leaders (and that includes this judge) can convince the two families to agree to.

[happyslug]

38. Or you believe rape is a lesser crime then fornication?

Read the Article, it clearly states that the Woman was to be canned for having ADMITTED to having sex with a married man. That is fornication.

The same religious leader was DEMANDING that the rapists be punished and that nine caning was NOT sufficient. Thus if you oppose what this religious leader is DEMANDING, you are saying rape is a lesser crime then fornication. You may think rape is the worse of the two "Crimes", but that is NOT what you are saying when you attack this religious leader.

[JustAnotherGen]

41. According to what

Man made law? Some man who talks to something that is not there and gets his "laws" from a cute book of allegories shouldn't be weighing in on the laws of humanity.

Just one woman's opinion. You don't have to like it or accept it - but I do not accept religion as the basis for anything to do with crime and punishment.

You lost this chick at "Religious Leader".

[happyslug]

44. Mankind is a SOCIAL ANIMAL and as such we develop law to decides disputes within society.

Different societies have adopted different rules. Many societies tries to justify their rules with religion. i.e. tries to get everyone to accept those rules.

In Islamic Societies, the leaders of the society are the religious leaders. Even Islam tries to retain traditional rules of any society that turns Islamic, thus in Islamic Societies it is the Religious leaders that are the Judges of that Society.

We in the West have a long history of Religion and Secular society being separate and apart. This concept goes back to the Roman Empire, but did not extend much beyond that Empire till the Christian Churches took that concept to the rest of Europe and into North America.

Islam has ALWAYS rejected the concept that religion and the rest of society are two different things. Thus an Islamic Judge is also a Secular Judge. Such a Judge decides both issues or religion and any other part of society. In this case, under the law applicable to this victim she was subject to a canning. That is INDEPENDENT of the crime of Rape. You may disagree with it, but it was and is the LAW in that part of the world and the Victim knew it.

The Judge's statements as to the Rape, also reflects the law in that part of the World. i.e. each of the rapist MUST be punished, and such a punishment must be worse then the canning the victim was sentences to.

Now, please note, Sharia law also permits settlements of Criminal sentences by Civil Payments. This also was the rule as late as the 1700s in England. People accused of crimes in England, could agree to pay back what they stole from the proceeds of the indenture servitude they agreed to serve in the New World. It was when to many people were opting for such an alternative that actual punishment was imposed on criminals.

This is still the norm within most Islamic and other Traditional cultures. The Religious leaders generally work out a compromise between the Defendant and the Plaintiff, using the threat of the sentence to work out a deal. The Sentence is part of the process, not the end result of the process.

That is how most traditional societies work, compromise as work through the religious leaders. I suspect that is going on in this case, and why the Judge made the comment that the Rapists should be punished more. Sounds like an inter-family dispute, probably involving not only her family, but her husband's family, whoever was the man she admitted to have sex with, Family AND his wife's family. Given outside of "Western Society", China, Korea and Japan (and the later three only marginally) most people marry their cousins. Thus some inner-extended family "Politics" is also at work. We may never learned the details, but compromises between the families and branches of families help keep such traditional societies untied.

Will the Woman be canned? Maybe, but I suspect she will NOT be, for her rapists are on notice what they did was worse then was she did. A compromise will be agreed to and settle the accusation of extra marital sex but also the rape. The exact terms we may never hear of, but the Judge's comment indicates he is mad at the rapists and will punish them as far as the law allows.

[Ilsa]

5. Why can't they give up the violence in their old

Religious texts? Christians and Jews no longer bash their enemies' babies against rocks per Psalm 137.

[snooper2]

11. because they actually follow their holy books, other religions give lip service

It's not like each holy book is the word of god..


Oh wait,

[Ilsa]

21. Whew! You had me going for a minute! LoL. nt

[SamKnause]

6. Some people

sure are hung up on sex and what consenting adults do with their bodies.

They don't seem to be concerned at all they they support young children, young adolescent girls, being forced into marriage.

They don't seem to have as much animosity toward men who stray as they do women who stray.

Whether it comes from a cultural or religious belief, it seems the women always get the short end of the stick.(No pun intended)

When your beliefs affect which gender can attend school, drive, ride a bicycle, work, or the inability to leave one's home without a chaperon, this injustice of inequality will continue.

The majority of religions give women second class status.

When young girls are taught they have to obey men and fear a male "God" no good will come of it.

[Cartoonist]

10. It's all Eve's fault

All the world's holy books were written by men.
Just as I can't understand why some people of color, gays, women, or poor, vote republican, I can't understand why women accept this religious BS.

[FrodosPet]

23. From my experience, more women then men are faithful followers

Whether traditional or alternative, the churches and mosques are filled with women as followers. It seems finding women who are pure atheists is fairly rare. Men who are involved with religion do it as a path of empowerment - they write the books and preach the sermons.

YMMV

[Iggo]

7. Morons.

[hue]

9. The young Indonesian lady was a widow at age 25!! Then raped by 8 men who walked into Her house!

They through sewage at them! Then the two are to be publicly caned PENDING/BEFORE investigation! WTH! This is total insanity!!

[freshwest]

34. If they are so concerned with extramarital sex, why rape her? Isn't that extramarital sex? No, just

plain hatred of women with bonus points for empowering men to get their jollies gang raping the woman because they could gang up on her!

What is the difference between this and any other gang rape, like the one in Delhi, that makes this okay to people?

Very dangerous to be female!


.

[happyslug]

40. And the Religious leader who sentence her, wants to make a worse punishment for her rapists.,

That is what is reported at the END of that news report. Under Sharia law, the family of the Victim has a say in the punishment of the victim. This includes working out a deal so that the victim is made "whole". In this case the victim is the man's wife AND HER FAMILY. I suspect they were also the ones to rape this victim. Sounds like the Judge wants to work out a compromise, the victim gets no canning, and the rapists pay her for the harm they caused her.

Please note, the Islamic Judge noted she had been in the same PRIVATE room as a man. Under the Laws in most traditional societies that is a big no no. The Islamic Judge also said that while the victim said she had no sex with the man she was with, she was planning on it and had had sex with him in the past. That enough to convict her of fornication (being a widow she can NOT be convicted of Adultery, she has no husband to "Betray&quot . Thus they have been an investigation and a confession, but only of fornication as oppose to anything else.

The Judge makes the point that such a crime is NOT to be punished by raping the victim, thus the Judge's demand for harsher punishments for the rapists.

[stevenleser]

42. I'm not sure you are making this any better, FYI.

I see you have posted multiple times under this OP. I am not sure anyone who comes into this disagreeing with what is happening to this woman (which includes me and pretty much everyone except you) will feel in any way mollified by the things you are posting.

[Fearless]

12. This is the 21st Century. Some of us are proving how little we've grown as a species.

[tabasco]

28. That's exactly right.

Idiotic superstitions to lessen our fear of death proves that humans are nothing but stupid, cowardly apes. Very cruel, as well, because we needlessly kill and hurt others because of these superstitions.

[Scalded Nun]

13. Pull the plug

The only real thing our 'friends' understand is the dollar.

Any and all aid should be pulled if a country is going to sanction this within their legal system.

The sad thing is that when it comes to punishing the victim, the US is not much better.

[Feral Child]

14. Religious sects always seek to gain control.

Once they do, atrocities follow.

This is the future of our country. Balkanization, then small theocratic states terrorizing their populace. Woe to the non-Elected.

[heaven05]

15. religion gives people

obscene control over others. And what gets me is interpretation of words from so called holy books by sociopaths is all it takes.

[DirkGently]

16. Horrific. n/t

[Swede Atlanta]

17. Wasn't Aceh province one of those hardest hit by the 26 December tsunami?

And didn't we use all available resource to help those people?

In future I hate to say it but I think we let them rot. If they cannot have any empathy or tolerance in their society then I'm sorry but I don't want to spend any of my tax dollars to save or help them. Let them help themselves with their gang raping and canes the next time the ocean sweeps them away.

I am really tired of it. We try to save the world and they just run away with our help and money and then invoke Sharia law. Next time I say we don't answer the telephone when they call for help.

[starroute]

19. My understanding is that the tsunami was what brought on the fundamentalism

Disasters mess people up, and an entire province suffering from PTSD is likely to do some wacky things. That doesn't make it okay -- but this "let them rot" response is offbase.

[Swede Atlanta]

30. It was of course a figurative expression......

My point is this whole Sharia law thing goes way back in Islam. It destroys any notion of human dignity or human rights.

So if these people are going to believe in Sharia law where black is black and white is white (not intended or to be interpreted as a racial comment) then they need to learn to live with the consequences.

They believe that Allah is driving this boat and so the underwater earthquake and resulting tsunami must have been Allah's will. If that is the case all of those that were killed were killed because Allah wanted it. Also it was Allah's will that they should go without clean drinking water, food, clothing and housing.

So we should respect Allah and not assist them next time around.

When they rid themselves of these stupid religious-based laws and join the 21st century I will reconsider but for now I do not want any of my tax dollars or any U.S. resource to help them the next time around.

[Helen Borg]

18. I assume the married man also.

Will be caned in public. Right???

[sakabatou]

20. I highly doubt it

[catbyte]

22. Talibubbas are probably green with envy. There's not a lick of difference between batshit crazy

fundamentalist Christians & fundamentalist Muslims.

[olddad56]

24. how many of the 8 men were married?

just curious?

[hue]

25. Hard to know/guesstimate this since Islam allows up to 4 wives.

To divorce they just have to say, "I divorce You" 3 times.

[blkmusclmachine]

26. The GOP wants this here in the US. They'd call it "Biblical law."

[Dawson Leery]

27. Rick Santorum dreams of this for America.

[Beacool]

29. Sometimes I hate the world.

[JI7]

31. so some fucked up perverted guys can do what they want and claim it's because

of god .

[seveneyes]

32. Where are the religious leaders and members in condemning this abuse?

It seems like all these atrocities in the name of some perverted religion happen and the leaders of the religion appear to just let it slide into the memory hole. It's time to stop allowing these abuses to proliferate.

[Liberal_in_LA]

33. ugly

[Marrah_G]

35. These fundemental views keep spreading

I keep thinking at some point rational people will rise up against it, but it just seems to keep growing.

[happyslug]

37. Did anybody read the ENTIRE Article, the Islamic Judge want WORSE punishment for the rapists.

Latief said the eight could be caned for raping the woman, but “it will be too lenient if they just received the same punishment of nine strokes.”

Sorry, this is like someone who just robbed a bank, but in turn was raped, beaten and the money stolen by someone else. Such a person is still GUILTY of robbery and subject to the sentence of robbery. That is ALL this Islamic legal expert did. In the west, extra marital sex is not illegal, but in Indonesia it is still illegal, if one of the sexual partner has a spouse. The man had a spouse, thus the sex with that man that the woman allegedly Admitted to is enough to convict her of having such sex. Since she is a widow it is NOT adultery, thus the nine caning.

As I said, she broke the LAW in her country. We may disagree with that law, but her punishment is the norm for her crime. On the other hand, the rape was considered a worse crime by the Islamic Law Judge and he was demanding an even harsher sentence for each rapists.

[stevenleser]

43. See my #42 above. nt