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SecularMotion

(7,981 posts)
Wed May 14, 2014, 12:33 PM May 2014

11-Year-Old Shoots Grandmother After Getting Into Trouble at School

Source: The Root

An 11-year-old Oklahoma boy came home to his grandmother's Tulsa apartment with a bad progress report from his school. He gave his grandmother the report and while she sat reading, authorities say he went to her room, grabbed a .22-caliber gun, before returning and shooting her in the back of the head.

"All I saw was a big bang of a flash and heard it, and I knew I was shot in the back of my head," the grandmother, Annie Mougell-Walker told local station KOTV, after being treated at a local hospital.

While Mougell-Walker, 42, was able to return home the same day of the shooting Monday wearing a neck brace, the bullet remained logged in her head, the New York Daily News reports.

Her grandchild was arrested and charged with shooting with intent to kill, police told the Daily News.


Read more: http://www.theroot.com/articles/culture/2014/05/_11_year_old_shoots_grandmother_after_getting_in_trouble_in_school.html

31 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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11-Year-Old Shoots Grandmother After Getting Into Trouble at School (Original Post) SecularMotion May 2014 OP
if there had been no gun barbtries May 2014 #1
If only grandma had her own gun ChairmanAgnostic May 2014 #6
Far too many people do not properly secure their guns. ManiacJoe May 2014 #29
Same thing happened when I was in middle school. callous taoboy May 2014 #2
Gun safety fails again. Thanks NRA! TeamPooka May 2014 #3
Oh come on people he was just standing his ground...... bowens43 May 2014 #4
NRA says... Omaha Steve May 2014 #5
Well yes, she should have had a trigger lock on that gun NickB79 May 2014 #13
NRA opposes trigger locks, calls them inherently unsafe. happyslug May 2014 #16
NRA is stupid NickB79 May 2014 #17
Exactly! armed_and_liberal May 2014 #24
I always remove the bolts happyslug May 2014 #27
For Safety reasons, all weapons are presumbed to be loaded.. happyslug May 2014 #28
The NRA is correct. Trigger locks are unsafe. ManiacJoe May 2014 #30
The answer to the question.... AnneD May 2014 #7
There was no alternative that wouldn't deny basement dwellers their object of fetish. nt onehandle May 2014 #8
42 year old grandmother of an 11 year old? UpInArms May 2014 #9
GOP math. You figure it out. ChairmanAgnostic May 2014 #11
Soon to be a great-grand mother. progressoid May 2014 #12
Her and her daughter Mosby May 2014 #14
I did not feel old, when I ran across a couple of 30 year old grandmothers when I was in my 30s happyslug May 2014 #15
well, yeah - it's possible UpInArms May 2014 #18
Yep. Tragic. But the preacherman says... Ghost Dog May 2014 #23
hey back at you! UpInArms May 2014 #31
He'll be the keynote speaker at the next NRA convention mwrguy May 2014 #10
So, Ms. Grandma Responsible Gun Owner, Le Taz Hot May 2014 #19
Keeping Safe From Rampant Crime In Oklahoma SoCalMusicLover May 2014 #20
No Warning Signs? One_Life_To_Give May 2014 #21
Oklahoma. nt valerief May 2014 #22
That's gonna make for some uncomfortable holiday dinners going forward. Hassin Bin Sober May 2014 #25
yeah, you think your Thanksgivings are bad! Marthe48 May 2014 #26

ChairmanAgnostic

(28,017 posts)
6. If only grandma had her own gun
Wed May 14, 2014, 12:53 PM
May 2014

that would shoot that kid's bullet out of the air.

WHERE THE HELL DOES A 11 YEAR OLD GET A GUN? Don't they have gun safes in that state? Or did the NRA outlaw those as being against the 2nd amendment?

What a sick country this is becoming.

callous taoboy

(4,584 posts)
2. Same thing happened when I was in middle school.
Wed May 14, 2014, 12:37 PM
May 2014

A kid in my class shot and killed his mom with a .22 after he got in trouble for his report card.

NickB79

(19,233 posts)
13. Well yes, she should have had a trigger lock on that gun
Wed May 14, 2014, 03:17 PM
May 2014

And while the article doesn't say, I'd wager the gun was already loaded when the boy grabbed it. It WAS irresponsible of her to leave a gun and it's ammunition within easy access of a child. But that doesn't absolve the boy of responsibility for attempting to murder his own grandmother.

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
16. NRA opposes trigger locks, calls them inherently unsafe.
Wed May 14, 2014, 03:58 PM
May 2014

Gun locks only work when the weapon is UNLOADED, if the weapon is loaded the pressure locking or unlocking the trigger lock can set them off. The better solution is to remove the bolt and keep the bolt in another location, away from the rest of the firearm AND any ammunition.

NickB79

(19,233 posts)
17. NRA is stupid
Wed May 14, 2014, 04:15 PM
May 2014

I keep my guns unloaded, with trigger locks in place. The ammo is stored in locked ammo boxes. I even store my air rifles the same way.

Who in their right mind would put a trigger lock on a LOADED gun?

armed_and_liberal

(246 posts)
24. Exactly!
Wed May 14, 2014, 09:37 PM
May 2014

When my kids were young that is what I did. We still do with just my wife and I. Just plain common sense that I learned from my Dad and he from his.



 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
27. I always remove the bolts
Thu May 15, 2014, 12:51 AM
May 2014

On some guns, the absence of bolts affects the trigger, i.e. you can NOT lock it down. Bolts are kept is a separate location. That is HOW I was taught to store weapons, it is also the way the Military store weapons. Trigger locks are a waste of money if you store weapons properly (i.e. NO BOLTS in the weapons).

When I was in the National Guard, every time we wanted to use our M16s and M60s, we had to drive about five miles to the nearest Police Station, for that is where the bolts were stored when the armory was unmanned. The Rifles were kept in a Steel reinforced concrete room with a solid steel door, but the bolts, except when someone was in the Armory and was about to issue firearms, were kept elsewhere.

Now, my old First Sargent talked about his old armory. The Feds had fits with it, it did not meet modern requirements for storage of weapons, it had 12-16 feet of solid oak walls as opposed to the Steel Reinforced Concrete walls required by the Feds today. The Federal inspectors would object, my First Sargent would appeal and on review it was determined the solid oak walls were harder to break down then would be a Steel Reinforced concrete wall. i.e. the solid oak walls were better then a what the Federal Government required.

Back to trigger locks. The better option is to remove the bolts, which is NOT hard on most firearms. The major exception would be revolvers and single shot weapons (Which includes double barrel shotguns) these weapons do NOT have bolts and thus best stored broken down (On most shotguns I have owned, single shots and double barreled, it was easy to break down the weapon into two parts). I have no knowledge on revolvers, the only pistol I have ever used was a M1911 automatic which had a bolt, thus in the case of Revolvers it may be harder to break them down, but removing the cylinder would be more effective then installing a trigger lock.

Sorry, I just can NOT see the advantages of a Trigger lock, given that all of them work depending on some metal near or in direct contact with the trigger. I was always taught to treat all weapons as if loaded, and thus a trigger lock can NEVER be installed, for all weapons are to be treated as loaded and if a weapon is loaded trigger locks are unsafe.

When I was a Child, I could find my father's guns, but never the bolts and never the ammunition. Bolts and Ammunition can be hidden and stored in places where a child can not search. Rifles and Shotguns are much larger and thus harder to hide from Children. I also knew that if my parents found me with the rifles and shotguns I would be punished (Slowed me down a little bit, but not much). The fact that I (as a child) could NOT find the bolts and the ammunition was the key to safely storing weapons.

Trigger locks encourage unsafe storage of weapons. i.e. weapons stored with bolts or in one piece. That is my biggest problem with Trigger locks along with the fact that ALL weapons are to be treated as loaded and Trigger Locks are NEVER To go on a LOADED weapon. Trigger locks thus permit people to think of weapons as unloaded, a concept I reject as unsafe.

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
28. For Safety reasons, all weapons are presumbed to be loaded..
Thu May 15, 2014, 12:57 AM
May 2014

That is how I was taught, i.e. to treat any weapon if it was loaded, thus installing a trigger lock requires it to be installed on a weapon I am presuming to be LOADED. That is the problem with Trigger locks, they require someone to violate the number one safety rule when it comes to firearms, that is to treat ALL WEAPONS AS IF THEY WERE LOADED. Thus you install a trigger lock on a weapon, you must find that the weapon is unloaded, and thus you are already violating the first rule of safe firearms (i.e. you are NOT treating the weapon as if it was loaded).

In simple terms, the presumption behind trigger locks is that you can make sure a weapon is unloaded when you install a trigger lock, but that presumption is a violation of the first rule of gun safety, that is to treat all weapons as if they were loaded.

ManiacJoe

(10,136 posts)
30. The NRA is correct. Trigger locks are unsafe.
Thu May 15, 2014, 02:16 AM
May 2014
NRA opposes trigger locks, calls them inherently unsafe.

Cable locks are far superior to trigger locks. Of course, a safe is better yet.

Mosby

(16,299 posts)
14. Her and her daughter
Wed May 14, 2014, 03:30 PM
May 2014

would have to have been 15 and a half when they gave birth.

Or one was older and the other younger.

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
15. I did not feel old, when I ran across a couple of 30 year old grandmothers when I was in my 30s
Wed May 14, 2014, 03:56 PM
May 2014

I started to feel old, when I turn 35 and a client of mine came into my office and told me he was a 35 year old GRANDFATHER. It is possible.

UpInArms

(51,282 posts)
18. well, yeah - it's possible
Wed May 14, 2014, 04:19 PM
May 2014

but the grandson is 11 - so she was a grandmother at 31



mighty young to be parenting and grandparenting - just sayin'

 

SoCalMusicLover

(3,194 posts)
20. Keeping Safe From Rampant Crime In Oklahoma
Wed May 14, 2014, 06:12 PM
May 2014

You will NEVER EVER EVER get gun freaks to understand that their own gun is FAAAAAAR more likely to cause harm to them or someone they know, rather than a criminal.

I get a twinkle whenever I read a story like this, thinking that maybe this time might change someone's mind about the usefulness of having guns, but clearly it won't. I bet this grandma will still want her weapon and she feels safer in her home with it.

I'm sure she forgives her grandson also. Next time perhaps he will be older, more skilled, and have a better shot. She's still alive, so obviously he wasn't doing something right. Get with the times kid, the goal is to shoot and kill, not to shoot and injure.

Edit To Add: Upon reading the article, I see that the problem was with the bullets used in the gun. So it is she that needs to be a better gun owner. What good is a loaded weapon, if there are merely small caliber bullets inside? Get some hollow points, like Oscar Pistorius used. Nobody lives through those.

It's ironic, but she's actually responsible for her own survival. A more proficient gun owner would have better bullets, and would be 6 feet under by now.

One_Life_To_Give

(6,036 posts)
21. No Warning Signs?
Wed May 14, 2014, 06:42 PM
May 2014

Would think there is alot more history to this. Millions get bad progress reports but don't feel the need to murder their Grandmothers over it.

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