Two Guys With Guns Have Showdown On First Day Of Georgia's New 'Guns Everywhere' Law

[DonViejo]

Source: TPM

ERIC LACH – JULY 2, 2014, 10:01 AM EDT

A "misunderstanding" between two armed men in a Georgia convenience store led to an arrest on the very day that the state's new expansive gun rights law went into effect, according to The Valdosta Daily Times.

Valdosta Police Chief Brian Childress summed the incident up for the newspaper.

“Essentially, it involved one customer with a gun on his hip when a second customer entered with a gun on his hip," Childress said.

According to the Daily Times, the first man, Ronald Williams, approached the second man in the store and demanded to see his identification and firearms license. Williams also pulled his gun from his holster, without pointing it at the second man. The second man responded by saying that he was not obligated to show any permits or identification -- then he paid for his purchase, left the store, and called the police.

Read more: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/georgia-showdown-guns-everywhere

[rustydog]

1. God, I get sick of the Goober

But for the firearms (sorry, NRA Viagra) present, I bet there would not have been any conversation between the two..."I got my gunz! I gets to question everyones I wants to bekuz itz in the constitution!

2nd Amendment! Freedumb of the people!

rant over.

[roguevalley]

116. it just feels like they are wearing their penis on their hips.

[Hekate]

2. When they passed that law I'm sure they all said "What could possibly go wrong? All is well!"

[miyazaki]

3. People fight for Darwin Awards now? n/t

[BumRushDaShow]

28. Darwin Award candidates was the first thing that popped in my mind. nt

[bvf]

75. Same here.

But it's getting so that, to be eligible, you'll just have to be stupid enough to show up in places where this crap is allowed to happen. By that I mean the entire state of Georgia.

On edit: No offense meant to activists there who are working to turn back this idiocy.

[TrollBuster9090]

86. New York, too, I believe. I think there was a study put out by the NYPD that showed something like

40% of the guns taken off criminals in New York were purchased, over the counter, in Georgia. (From two or three specific gun stores, in fact. I don't know why the ATF doesn't just stake-out those three Georgian gun stores, and follow the next guy who walks in and buys 30 hand guns.)

[gordianot]

4. Eventually law enforcement and the courts will become tired of this nonsense.

Maybe after several deaths something will be done but will not count on it.

[Hekate]

18. You mean unlike the mass slaughters and daily murders we now have?

There's a streak of madness in this nation, and I don't know who it serves to keep it going, but keep going it does.

[lark]

25. Bet you do know what's responsible.

Gun makers, for profit prisons, NRA, & right wing poliiticians who pander to the first 3.

[samsingh]

95. agreed

[maxrandb]

53. Law enforcement, maybe

but the courts won't care unless it starts negatively impacting the 1%.

Bastards have no problem with the poor and the middle class butchering each other.

Makes me wonder how long it would take to get this law overturned if a bunch of open carry folks, preferably minorities, went for a nice stroll through the Tuxedo Park or Sugarloaf Country Club areas of Atlanta.

Want to see a "Constitutional Protection" get taken away real quick? Just let the "wrong" type of American try exercising it.

[heaven05]

80. the thundering silence

on this post response is ............to be expected. That's part of america's dirty laundry and good americans don't want their dirty laundry pointed out. applicable post.

[maxrandb]

110. It makes me sick that I may be right

but do you think there would be "Stand Your Ground" laws if it were young white kids getting "stood" on?

Would drug possession land you in jail for a lifetime if young white kids were getting locked up for life?

Do you think there would be "Open Carry" laws if it were minorities, Muslims, or "others" walking en-masse with AR15s and Bushmasters.

Holy crap, could you imagine what would happen if 15 African Americans walked into Walmart with M1 rifles slung over their shoulders?

[heaven05]

125. per your last

an firefight of epic proportions that may make the MSM. Probably not since it may embolden some 'others' to fight back. You know something like those militia people in bundyland during the standoff. No minorities and others not of bundyland stock, would NOT be allowed to open carry like that. Per your other three postulations: No. You're speaking truth to power, be careful.....

[LongTomH]

128. +1000

We won't get action until the gun humpers invade the country clubs.

It might be a good idea to suggest that on various 'gun rights' forums. I'm sure a good 'Constitutional argument' can be devised!

[lexx21]

89. I seriously doubt that the courts will.....

This is revenue generation for them. Each case that comes through.... cha-ching!

[TeamPooka]

5. I think they're going to solve the population explosion in Georgia real soon.

[kairos12]

6. Gunfight at the Not Ok Corral.

[ewagner]

14. K&R!!!

NOT OK Corral!!!

[bvf]

39. LOL! And who was there?

Why, a derp. Two derps in this case.

[TrollBuster9090]

87. Wyatt Derp, and the gunfight at the Hoakey Corral in Bone-Dumb Arizona?

I guess it would be alright, if not for the fact that so many innocent bystanders keep getting killed.

[Deny and Shred]

88. Wyatt Derp !!!

Love it !

Many, many people walking around in public with guns on their hips, wondering, "are those other guys with guns on their hips bad guys with guns?" This is a logical result of so much unfortunate legislation.

Let them start doing something about it and either call the cops on each other, or head mano a mano to the Not OK Corral - just keep the innocent bystanders far from the gunfire.

[Judi Lynn]

109. Sublime! n/t

[Kaleva]

60. Duzy!

[Hassin Bin Sober]

115. Or The Circle K Corral.

[kairos12]

130. That is Arizona funny.

[HuskyOffset]

7. Question . . .

. . . what happens if both people have the attitude of the first guy? I can picture it now, both men with guns drawn screaming for the other man to show him his papers. It would be funny if not for the inevitable bystanders getting shot.

[LW1977]

8. No one saw this coming..

Stupid people and their phallic-shaped weapons to make up for the very little that's"downstairs".

[groundloop]

9. And this crap isn't all that's going to be coming out of that stupid law

It's no longer a crime to have firearms in the public areas of airports in Georgia. If someone 'accidentally' tries going through a security checkpoint with a weapon they won't be arrested but merely turned back and sent on their way. Talk about an invitation to terrorists.

C'mon Georgia - let's GET OUT THE VOTE IN NOVEMBER !!

[onehandle]

10. Don't miss Georgia, whatsoever.

Miss my friends and the few family I have there. Miss Mellow Mushroom Pizza, Ru San's Sushi, and The Varsity.

That's about it.

[Raine1967]

41. I hear that.

I would add Taco Mac and basically all of Virginia/Highlands. (L5P too!)

[cordelia]

67. We don't miss you that much either.

[YOHABLO]

111. You know those are all great places to eat and have fun in A T L A N T A !! However

Go outside the perimeter and it's a whole different ball game. We're talking evangelical christian country, and red neck to the bone. This happened down in Valdosta GA .. way down south and very prejudice white folks down there. They love their guns and their bibles.

[Tom Ripley]

114. I spent a year in Valdosta one week

awful place

[Zambero]

11. Open Carry + Stand Your Ground =

Let's Have a Duel

[LynneSin]

19. To me those laws mean Terrorism and Human Hunting

Think about it - there are states out there that you can legally kill a human as long as you word it right after the guy dies.

[lark]

26. Only certain people get to kill with impunity -

white males and the ultra rich. Other people go to jail, even in FL.

[ManiacJoe]

90. Don't let the facts get in the way of your story.

In Florida, the blacks are the ones with the most successful SYG defense record.

[americannightmare]

93. Except for Trayvon and Marissa Alexander...

As long as there are exceptions, it shouldn't matter how "successful" other blacks have been with SYG. It's an insane law no matter how you slice it.

[ManiacJoe]

96. It's insane only if you don't understand it.

Confusion over the law is reasonable given the poor reporting it gets in the media.

[hack89]

102. Marissa Alexander was not SYG

she left the house, got her gun, went back into the house, and took a shot at her ex-husband's head (with her kids standing right next to him.) Mutter "I have something for you ass" as she went to get her gun certainly did not help her case. Neither did violating parole conditions by returning to the house to assault her ex (gave him a black eye).

[freshwest]

100. +1

[Electric Monk]

101. + credible threat + warning shot =

[Renew Deal]

12. lol

People are dumb

[Orrex]

13. Early one morning in the middle of the night...

[tblue37]

15. From the article:

Among other things, the law also prohibits police from demanding to see the weapons permit of someone seen carrying a gun. Childress mentioned that last point when talking to the Daily Times about Tuesday's incident.

“This is an example of my concern with the new gun law that people will take the law into their own hands which we will not tolerate,” Childress said <emphasis added>.

That first guy, Williams, felt that he had the right to demand the second guys permit, when the Georgia cops don't even have that right now. There are going to be a lot of di*k-swinging p*ssing contests in Georgia now. I don't live there, but if I did, and if I my kids were not adults, I would probably want to avoid most public places altogether.

[Javaman]

17. basically that means felons can openly carry, no questions asked. nt

[hack89]

40. Cops have ways to get around it if they wanted.

they could run a license plate, for example.

As a practical matter, wouldn't you rather felons open carry so you can avoid them? Or does them carrying concealed somehow make you safer?

[Javaman]

121. I perfer no one carry period.

but that is an argument for another day.

[hack89]

123. No law will stop criminals from carrying guns

we could, however, do a lot more to deter them by significantly raising the penalties for being found with illegal guns.

[Javaman]

124. And as I said, that's an argument for another day. nt

[cosmicone]

71. Darwin is going to be proven right again. n/t

[Locrian]

73. some of them like it ...

Some of them only like it when THEY are the ones swinging the dick - I mean gun - as a show of power. Interesting to see what happens when someone else wants to play.

[Javaman]

16. everyone is now barny fife.

I think they should also sprinkle the vernacular with various old west idioms.

morons with guns

[louis-t]

20. "That ain't a vernacular, it's my doiby".

Curly Howard

[QED]

22. Ammosexuals

[Helen Borg]

77. LOL

[mnhtnbb]

82. That's a good one.

[freshwest]

103. Well described in the latest ~NSFW~ Mike Malloy Uncensored Hate Mail Edition:

Reason they are called Ammosexuals, is it's all about the genitalia, always.

[bvf]

43. Barney was only allowed one bullet, and had to keep it in his pocket.

I'm thinking more like Uncle Fester ("I'll shoot 'em in the back!&quot .

[liberal N proud]

21. The Good, the Bad and the Ugly

?t=11s

[Rhinodawg]

23. ITS only a matter of time before the shooting starts.

welcome to " jaw-ja"

[billh58]

24. More guns, more guns...!

Georgia deserves all of the gun nuts it can hold. Here's hoping that as gun laws become more sane across this nation, the Second Amendment absolutists and NRA apologists will move to Georgia and take their guns with them.

[BrotherIvan]

33. What are you talking about fella?

MY guns are totally safe and absolutely benign in every way. Because I am so safe and responsible, there should be guns and bullets and military-style weapons for sale EVERYWHERE just in case I want one. Sure, these guys are irresponsible as were all the other people in articles of accidental shooting, Bourbon Street shootouts, killing a new father on the day his baby comes home, a five year-old with his new gun, etc. sure THEY are irresponsible, but that should not restrict my access to guns whenever I feel the slightest urge to expand my arsenal.

No! Most of those people are dark gang members, but we won't ask where those "criminals" got the guns. I mean, criminals are bad, and that's why I'm always packing heat, because you never know when a bad criminal is going to jump you: church, school, the store, the court house. Gotta be prepared to have a shoot out in crowded public areas because I'm a crack shot like Hawkeye. But there's no way in hell we're gonna close down guns shows or private sales or selling your gun on the damn street corner. No way, because guns are my hobby and I made a wise investment in them, so we have to have guns everywhere to make sure I get my money back.

And don't talk about school shootings or kids dying. It makes my guns too emotional. My guns feel bad when you say they're killing machines. That is discrimination because my guns shoot flowers and rainbows. It's just everybody else's guns that shoot people. But they actually don't really shoot people because most shootings don't count, and knives, and mental illness, and suicide, and they're over a year old which is the expiration date for when you can even talk about murder. Or right when it happened, or a few months later.

It's never guns fault, because guns are more special than any dead kid. Because 2A USA baby! And I can interpret the law however I want that makes my guns feel happy. I'm done talking with all you control freaks, I've gotta go work on my bunker because the government's comin' and I'm gonna fight them off like a Revolutionary soldier!

[billh58]

56. LOL!

I swear that I've seen those same sentiments on DU...

[BrotherIvan]

58. You can't make this shit up

[enough]

59. Thanks BrotherIvan. (nt)

[BrotherIvan]

99. You sound threatening

Glad I've got my guns! Because they're never threatening. Not even when they're loaded and really big and I take them shopping with my toddler or grab a bite to eat.

[valerief]

79. I'll bet your gun collection is a corporation with religious beliefs, too.

[BrotherIvan]

97. MY guns are Jesus approved!

My guns have civil rights, enshrined in the Constitution. Your right to life is just in that stupid declaration of something. So don't offend my guns! You're oppressing them!

[Dawgs]

49. Thanks, but some of us DUers live in Georgia.

Maybe we can send all of the idiots that support a stupid law in your state to move there.

[groundloop]

57. Ditto.... Even most GOPers I know think that law is stupid as hell

[RebelOne]

68. I am a Georgia resident.

And this law is beyond stupid. It is an idiotic law passed by our idiot governor.

[Historic NY]

27. Bravo......

dumbasses.

[DeadLetterOffice]

29. Well good gracious, whoever could've imagined such a thing would happen??

I cannot decide if I want to swear a blue streak or laugh myself sick.
We are going to hell in a hand basket, and the way is being paved by the Koch brothers & their ilk.

[bpj62]

30. Shoot first ask questions later

I will give the second individual kudos for keeping his calm and calling the police. Mr. Williams drew his pistol from his holster and although he did not point it at the second man he was clearly looking for the advantage. this insanity is not going to stop until these guys get into a real shooting match with each other and all the people wounded or killed were actually good guys. we aren't that far from that sort of thing happening, particularly with people like Mr. Williams wandering the streets armed and clearly looking for a confrontation.

[BumRushDaShow]

31. What a show!

[hibbing]

32. Dumb and Dumber III

[calimary]

34. DAMMIT! WHY is this referred to, so damn frequently, as some "misunderstanding"????

WHAT THE HELL???????

This can only end badly. Dear God, this can ONLY end badly.

[drm604]

35. And this was on the very first day.

I hate to think what's coming.

[avebury]

42. I wonder if laws like that are all about

positioning society to the point that the powers to be will try to justify an even more militarized police force to "serve and protect" which would then further erode the civil liberties of all the sane people who don't feel the need to lock and load. If you think of life as a chess game you have to see where the end game is.

[drm604]

46. No, I think it's just a bunch of paranoid people

who apparently don't feel safe anywhere without a gun.

[avebury]

48. And they are not the brightest bulbs in the room.

They would be the perfect tool for any group with an end game of taking control of the country and squashing the bugs, I mean masses. Yes you can call be a cynic.

[jtuck004]

50. I live in a city where the re-elected state rep pulled a gun on a guy in a road rage

incident. He posted pictures of his opponent's home in the past election, perhaps so his gun-wielding supporters would know where she lives. Someone painted swastikas on his campaign signs and he took offense at that.

He helps make the laws.

We aren't paranoid.

[bvf]

72. Agreed.

But just because it's not by design doesn't change the potential effect over time.

I remember reading a post somewhere in the immediate aftermath of Columbine in which the writer simply stated, "The NRA is toast." If only something--anything--could make it so.

[The Wizard]

36. Attrition and natural selection

will prevail. The Lord works in mysterious ways.

[alfredo]

37. I wonder if there was a racial element to the first person's challenge.

[hack89]

47. It would appear that the guy who got arrested was black

no indication of the race of the guy he challenged.

[alfredo]

51. In the south you always have to suspect race.

[ieoeja]

61. Link?

[hack89]

62. It's in the OP. nt

[ieoeja]

63. Read both. Didn't see where either said he was Black. n/t

[hack89]

64. There is a picture of the guy being arrested. nt

[ieoeja]

66. Read both. Didn't see picture of guy being arrested.

One has a stock photo of a gun on someone's hip. But nothing related to the crime.

[hack89]

69. The Valdosta Daily Times link has a picture with the following captions

Valdosta Police detain a man following an aletercation[sic] at the Enmark on Park Ave. Tuesday afternoon.

It is in the upper right hand corner in an area labled "Related Photos"

[arcane1]

38. Who could predict this law would encourage assholes to act like bigger assholes?

It's a mystery for the ages.

[Enthusiast]

119. Yes. It's so mysterious.

[McCamy Taylor]

44. Under the law, the police can not ask to see a gun permit.

So, in many places, they can demand to see a person's birth certificate, but they must assume the gun is legal.

[valerief]

54. Even if the gun carrier is not white? I'm sure SCOTUS will fix that.

[rickyhall]

45. Speaking of the OK Corral, wasn't that just a "misunderstanding"?

[valerief]

52. I say let the AKKKers walk anywhere they want with their dicks out. Just don't let

them carry guns.

[1StrongBlackMan]

55. I normally don't read "gunz" OPs; but, this ...

According to the Daily Times, the first man, Ronald Williams, approached the second man in the store and demanded to see his identification and firearms license. Williams also pulled his gun from his holster, without pointing it at the second man. The second man responded by saying that he was not obligated to show any permits or identification -- then he paid for his purchase, left the store, and called the police.

Teased me into clicking through to the article. I wanted to see if there was a picture of the accoster, or better, a picture of the accosted, though I do have a picture in my mind's eye for both.

[hack89]

65. There is a picture. The guy who was arrested was AA. nt

[1StrongBlackMan]

70. Oh okay ...

I didn't click on the article, I just clicked on the TPM link.

[locks]

74. Paul Broun, Georgia Rep.

believes that Georgia's newly enacted "guns everywhere" law is a "God-given right." Don't many Christians believe that the devil always finds some way to convince fools like Broun that he's God?

[Helen Borg]

76. Reminds me of something...

Morricone's tunes come to mind...

[Politicalboi]

78. Here's the security cameras footage

[iamthebandfanman]

81. WHAT!?!?!?

You mean they couldn't just tell by lookin' at each other that they were both 'good guys' ???

[TrollBuster9090]

83. CORRECTION: Georgia's 'Guns Everywhere BUT THE GEORGIA LEGISLATURE BUILDING' Law.

As far as I know, you're still not allowed to haul guns into the Georgia Capitol building. The Georgia Republicans are sleazy, but they're not STUPID. Getting shot in a crossfire between an OPEN CARRY moron and a STAND YOUR GROUND moron is a danger that only us PLEBS have to endure.

[frylock]

84. an armed society is a polite society. except when it isn't.

[BrotherIvan]

104. My guns are extremely polite!

[Dopers_Greed]

85. Maniacs

At least these assholes pointed their guns at each other, rather than a sane bystander

[ManiacJoe]

91. They did not point the guns at each other either.

Just brandishing.

[bvf]

105. "Just brandishing." This time. How long do you think before that changes?

I hope I'm wrong, of course, but I give it a month, conservatively. This was day one, remember.

Not to excuse the incorrect account you replied to, mind you, but really, how long do you think it will be before someone takes aim?

How much longer before someone dies, or at least ends up in ER, likely at your expense?

[ManiacJoe]

118. It's not a problem in the other states.

Is there something special about Georgia we should be worried about?

[blkmusclmachine]

92. Good reason to BOYCOTT this deeply backwards state. (Sorry, Atlantans!)

[RebelOne]

107. I am a Georgia resident,

and we are not all backwards. Most people I know here are very progressive. There are a few that have backwards views, such as my brother-in-law who hates Obama. My son, his wife and my 18-year-old grandson (who I have brainwashed to vote Democrat) are all hard-core Democrats as I am.

[Paladin]

131. You have damn near 30,000 posts.....

...so this old Texan doesn't really need to tell you that your pleas on behalf of your state's progressives are futile, here. Sad but true....

[SummerSnow]

94. ....

[secondvariety]

98. Insanity.

I'd like to think that a stupider law couldn't be written, but I thought the same thing when Florida passed SYG. When it comes to gun laws, common sense and civility and the right not to be around nervous armed Joe the Plumber types isn't important.

[DeSwiss]

106. K&R

- And the convo went something like this:

1st-Good-Guy-With-A-Gun: Howdy pardner. I see you got yersef a nice piece o' iron o' justus a hangin' off yer hip there, mind if I see your license? {takes gun from its holster}

2nd-Good-Guy-With-A-Gun: Why hell naw, good buddy. And I just might report you to the authorities for impersonating the police. {gives nervous clerk money}

Clerk: If ya'll don't want nuthin' else, I'll crawl under the counter now.

1st-Good-Guy-With-A-Gun: {Grits teeth menacingly and pirouettes on the balls of his feet as the other man moves toward the door.}

2nd-Good-Guy-With-A-Gun: {talking to 911 on his cellphone} And he took it out and showed it to me! {listens} No, he didn't try to do anything with it but he seemed very proud of it the way he held it so reverently. {listens} Are we talking about the same thing???

[Enthusiast]

120. ...

[Ruby the Liberal]

108. Darwin's Law in action

“Essentially, it involved one customer with a gun on his hip when a second customer entered with a gun on his hip," Childress said.

Because whoda thought that would ever happen?

[Enrique]

112. Tom Tomorrow illustrated this encounter

two months ago...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024972106

[yuiyoshida]

113. THIS MAYBE NEXT....

[alcibiades_mystery]

117. Did they shoot each other's balls off?

No?

Pity.

[Nihil]

122. Ah, something for everybody:

You have the complete gun nut ("the first man&quot and the responsible gun owner ("the second man&quot .

The gun nut tries to provoke a reaction by aggressive behaviour that relies on
him wearing his threat openly then waving his metal penis substitute in an illegal
manner.

The responsible gun owner who is merely exercising the new law keeps calm,
behaves sensibly and resolves the situation with exactly the correct behaviour.

Mind you, the facts that

1) the problem only arose because the gun nut saw someone else with a gun

and

2) the correct resolution of the problem didn't require the second man to be armed at all

puts a slight dent in the pro-gun argument but at least it proves publicly that such people
do exist.

Well done Mr Second Man and GFY Mr Gun Nut.

[CincyDem]

126. Always hard to do a "mine's bigger" claim...

...when they're both out there in the open for everyone to see. LOL

[iscooterliberally]

127. With Freedumb comes great irresponsibilityness. n/t

[rafeh1]

129. wait

Wait till they meetup after drinking the beer rather than before