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struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 08:53 PM Sep 2015

Kim Davis is no Rosa Parks

By Michael Gerson
September 7 at 7:35 PM

... Whatever their intentions, these people are doing great harm to the cause of religious liberty and to the reputation of their faith ...

... there is no serious case to be made for the right of public officials to break laws they don’t agree with ...

As a conservative, I believe that facts and circumstances matter, and often complicate simple rules. A sheriff or magistrate in New Hampshire in the late 1850s would have been justified in choosing to look the other way rather than enforce the Fugitive Slave Act. Some Northern juries flatly refused to implement that law.

But those were choices made at the foggy extremes of political theory. Whatever your view of Justice Anthony M. Kennedy’s ruling on marriage, granting a wedding license is not in the same category as participating in a legal system that supported chattel slavery ...


https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/kim-davis-is-no-rosa-parks/2015/09/07/e821d528-533b-11e5-9812-92d5948a40f8_story.html

I won't be quoting Gerson much; but in the Davis matter, it may be important for us to understand where the political center actually lies -- and that is far from Davis

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struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
1. Kim Davis Is Not a Patriot
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:09 PM
Sep 2015

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
8:39 PM ET

The martyr business in America is booming ...

On Sunday, around 300 supporters gathered outside the jail where Kim Davis, the Kentucky clerk who refused to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples, is being held. They waved signs like “Kim Davis for President” ... The crowd in itself is not newsworthy — you can get 300 people to support pretty much anything ...

... The Orthodox Jewish clerk at the DMV cannot deny you a driver’s license because you eat ham. The Muslim clerk at the Social Security office can’t deny you benefits because you drink liquor. The Christian Scientist clerk at the IRS cannot audit your taxes because you chose medical help. Practice your religion in freedom; just don’t make everyone else practice your religion ...

It’s pointless to question Davis’ sincerity, because there’s no way to determine whether she’s a pious zealot or savvy businesswoman looking to cash in on her notoriety ...


http://time.com/4024556/kareem-abdul-jabbar-kim-davis/

struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
2. Yes, Kim Davis REALLY belongs in jail
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:13 PM
Sep 2015
I heard from a number of readers who asked if I really meant it when I said that .. Kim Davis belongs in jail.

Yes.

Kim Davis belongs in jail. Really.

She was order by a court to perform her duties as prescribed to her in the oath of office that she took, voluntarily, and she isn’t doing so. That’s contempt ...


http://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/op-ed/ejmontini/2015/09/04/kim-davis-same-sex-marriage-contempt--court/71713122/

RKP5637

(67,104 posts)
3. Kim Davis is bring used as a tool as they try to drive a wedge into the separation of church/state
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:13 PM
Sep 2015

so "if" she succeeds this will set precedent for their next crack in the separation of church/state. I think it's far more than just about Kim Davis.

struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
7. It won't work. You just have to look at the numbers.
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:30 PM
Sep 2015

About 50% of folk support gay marriage. About 35% oppose. About 15% are undecided.

Not all that 15% will ever make up their minds; those, that do, won't all oppose gay marriage

Among the 35%, a large number will support the rule of law

There's no advantage to being an ideologue: Davis wouldn't be in jail right now if she'd refused to issue licenses herself but allowed her deputy clerks to issue them

RKP5637

(67,104 posts)
11. Yes, as you say in one of your posts, Kim Davis will be forgotten in history. IMO she has
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:57 PM
Sep 2015

an overinflated sense of self worth in her fight against issuing marriage licenses. In many ways this reminds me of the struggle in the sixties.

struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
4. History tells us Kim Davis will lose
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:15 PM
Sep 2015

Joseph Gerth
6:52 p.m. EDT September 5, 2015

Let’s get one thing clear. Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis wasn’t jailed on Thursday because of her religious beliefs. She was jailed because she is a government official who refused to follow a legal and direct order from a federal judge designed to protect others' constitutional rights.

It’s a classic case of a local authority disagreeing with federal courts and trying to push back – only to lose in the end.

It happened when Arkansas Gov. Orval Faubus called out the National Guard to keep black students out of Little Rock’s Central High School nearly 60 years ago.

President Dwight D. Eisenhower, a Republican president who understood the rule of law, ended that fiasco when he federalized the Arkansas National Guard troops and sent them back to their barracks. He then sent in 101st Airborne to protect the African American students ...


http://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/politics/gerth/2015/09/05/gerth-history-tells-us-kim-davis-lose/71766496/

struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
5. Clerk Kim Davis will be a lonely footnote in history
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:19 PM
Sep 2015

By Connie Schultz
Posted Sep. 5, 2015 at 9:00 PM
Updated Sep 6, 2015 at 3:57 PM

... She thinks God wants her to be a martyr. To her and those using her, our ridicule — our persecution — is proof that she is right ...

We don’t need to mock Davis for justice to prevail. If we are to live our message, that all marriages are equal, then I’d rather treat her with the respect she has denied others. She can believe whatever she wants. Same-sex marriage is the law of the land, including in Rowan County.

Davis is a flawed human, and in that, she has a lot in common with the rest of us ...

I do, however, want to know why it is that the meanest of my fellow Christians claim they get their marching orders from God while the decent ones just keep acting like Jesus, loving everyone as best they can ...

http://www.gastongazette.com/article/20150905/NEWS/150909281

TexasProgresive

(12,157 posts)
6. Here are the oaths of office that she took.
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:29 PM
Sep 2015

It is plain to me that she either must carry out her sworn duties as county clerk or resign.

Kentucky Constitution: Section 228 for all offices.

I do solemnly swear (or affirm, as the case may be) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of this Commonwealth, and be faithful and true to the Commonwealth of Kentucky so long as I continue a citizen thereof, and that I will faithfully execute, to the best of my ability, the office of .... according to law; and I do further solemnly swear (or affirm) that since the adoption of the present Constitution, I, being a citizen of this State, have not fought a duel with deadly weapons within this State nor out of it, nor have I sent or accepted a challenge to fight a duel with deadly weapons, nor have I acted as second in carrying a challenge, nor aided or assisted any person thus offending, so help me God
.

This oath is for County Clerks in particular.
“I, _____, do swear that I will well and truly discharge the duties of the office of _____ County Circuit Court clerk, according to the best of my skill and judgment, making the due entries and records of all orders, judgments, decrees, opinions and proceedings of the court, and carefully filing and preserving in my office all books and papers which come to my possession by virtue of my office; and that I will not knowingly or willingly commit any malfeasance of office, and will faithfully execute the duties of my office without favor, affection or partiality, so help me God.”

struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
8. The second is for county court clerks: that used to be the same office in KY but is not now the same
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:33 PM
Sep 2015

in every county, though it can be the same (perhaps if the county clerk decides also to serve as county court clerk)

TexasProgresive

(12,157 posts)
9. The 1st is the most telling to me
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:36 PM
Sep 2015

swore to uphold the constitution of the United States of America. The U.S. Supreme court has spoken.

struggle4progress

(118,280 posts)
10. Confronted with that argument, she might point to section 233A of the KY constitution
Mon Sep 7, 2015, 09:52 PM
Sep 2015

which is the familiar "one man and one woman" thing

But it doesn't matter. Nobody is forcing her to issue licenses. She's in jail because she refuses to allow her deputy clerks to issue licenses. Not all deputy clerks are willing to issues licenses; and the one who won't (her son) isn't in jail either

It's easy to understand: she currently gets out of jail just by agreeing to let her deputy clerks issue licenses

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