Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Zorro

(15,740 posts)
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 09:30 AM Oct 2021

Marie Antoinette's Adultery Unmasked by Modern Science

In a recent study employing a technique called X-ray fluorescence spectroscopy, scientists discovered formerly redacted phrases on eight letters between Marie Antoinette and the Swedish count Axel Fersen, who was rumored to have been her lover. Further analysis revealed that the correspondence had been censored by Count Fersen himself. The altered words, which included “beloved,” “adore,” and “madly,” have now sparked something of a controversy: Are these recovered phrases additional evidence of an affair, or are they not?

The answer to this is a resounding yes. Just to set the record straight, no queen, Marie Antoinette included, used a word like “beloved” lightly to a man other than her husband. She could be punished for adultery, and even possibly executed, for doing so. That’s a pretty big risk to take if you don’t mean it, and it is why Fersen, who kept copies of these letters and feared they might fall into the wrong hands, edited those particular words.

It has long been suspected that Marie Antoinette was in love with the Swedish count. In 1779, her attraction to Fersen was so obvious that the Swedish ambassador noted that the queen could not disguise her feelings in public. The diplomat was thrilled when his countryman left to fight in the American Revolution and a scandal was avoided. But after Fersen returned in 1783, there is substantive evidence of intimacy. The documentation includes the exchange of secret letters, as well as Fersen’s diary, which is filled with entries detailing how much he loved someone named “Elle” (his code name for the queen), but how he couldn’t wed her because she was already married. But the most significant disclosures came from the head of the royal guard at Versailles, the Comte de Saint-Priest, who reported that, when Fersen was in town, he stayed over, often for days at a time, at Marie Antoinette’s private sanctuary, the Petit Trianon, and that the king was aware of the affair but the queen had somehow gotten around him.

Then there are Marie Antoinette’s pregnancies. Before the arrival of Fersen, it took her seven years to conceive her first child, a daughter. Nearly three years elapsed between the birth of this first girl and her next child, a son. This latter period corresponds to the years that Fersen was away fighting in America.

https://news.yahoo.com/marie-antoinettes-adultery-unmasked-modern-025251858.html

9 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies

hlthe2b

(102,233 posts)
1. Women are not free of misogynistic recrimination even after death--even after beheading, it seems.
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 09:35 AM
Oct 2021

This only underscores how little society has changed that an entire field of research is funded to further excoriate her and other famous women. Of all the important historical research that COULD have been funded... Uggh.

luv2fly

(2,475 posts)
2. So it was just about 250 years ago...
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 09:41 AM
Oct 2021

Some days it seems like it will take that long to expose all of tRump's treachery.

lapucelle

(18,252 posts)
3. Putative love messages are not adultery.
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 09:58 AM
Oct 2021

The real news is the science behind the discovery of redacted terms of endearment in Marie Antoinette's correspondence.

2D macro-XRF to reveal redacted sections of French queen Marie-Antoinette secret correspondence with Swedish count Axel von Fersen

Abstract
During the French Revolution, Marie-Antoinette, queen of France and wife of Louis XVI, maintained a highly secret correspondence with the Swedish count Axel von Fersen, her close friend and rumored lover. An unidentified censor later redacted certain sections of the exchanged letters. This presumably sensitive content has been puzzling historians for almost 150 years. We report on the methodology that successfully unraveled this historical mystery. X-ray fluorescence spectroscopy was used in macroscanning mode on the redacted sections. Specific data processing was applied to improve the legibility of the hidden writings (elemental ratios, statistical data reduction, multimodal images fusion, unmixing procedure, and image treatments). This methodology successfully revealed the redacted contents of eight letters, shedding new light not only on Marie-Antoinette and Fersen relationship but also on the author of the redactions. It will also be of great interest for other historical and forensic cases involving the disentanglement of superimposed multi-elemental materials.


https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.abg4266

stopdiggin

(11,300 posts)
5. isn't it a little hyperbolic to claim
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 11:07 AM
Oct 2021

that a written "beloved" was so dangerous as to risk 'execution' - and then later in the same article reveal that Antoinette's husband (and most likely half the court) was aware of 'extended stay overs' at the Queens apartments?

The fact of the censorship (for whatever reason) is a given - the hype over the explosive, extremely sensitive and life risking affair seems to be somewhat overwrought. (IMO)


FakeNoose

(32,634 posts)
6. Most of the royals had arranged marriages, in France and elsewhere
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 12:03 PM
Oct 2021

How can anyone be surprised if the royals had affairs, when they were forced to marry people who were almost complete strangers? So what if Marie Antoinette preferred someone other than her husband King Louis XVI. I find it hard to believe they would have executed her for that. What about those rumors about the kings - some of them were gay, some were demented, some had advanced syphilis. Most of them had honeys on the side. How is a queen supposed to get pregnant by her own husband if he can't or won't perform?

Clearly Marie Antoinette (who came from Austria) was hated by the commoners who had an abiding resentment for all royalty and aristocracy by that time. The French Revolution didn't just happen in 1789, it took generations for the anger and resentment to fester and finally lead to the overturning of the royalty. The sanitizing of letters and documents after-the-fact, well I guess that's understandable when people were getting beheaded on a daily basis.

CTyankee

(63,903 posts)
7. There's a film entitled "The Madness of King George" that is delightful in what servants at the
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 01:00 PM
Oct 2021

palace were saying about the King's treatment by looking at his daily stools and urine.

Aristus

(66,326 posts)
8. My favorite line from that film isn't about George's bodily effluvia, however.
Sun Oct 31, 2021, 02:19 PM
Oct 2021

"It's awfully early, Majesty!"

"Six hours of sleep is enough for a man, seven for a woman, and eight for a fool."

"Well, we didn't get to sleep until one, Sire, so that's only four hours."

"Is that insolence?"

"No Sire, it's arithmetic!"

Response to Zorro (Original post)

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Editorials & Other Articles»Marie Antoinette's Adulte...