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Bill Maher & Alexandra Pelosi: Republicans Want Spending Cuts But Can’t Name One. (VIDEO) (Original Post) ProfessionalLeftist Mar 2013 OP
Really good. Thanks for posting this. Cleita Mar 2013 #1
I keep forgetting there are people like that "out there". dixiegrrrrl Mar 2013 #2
Baiting with taxes AlbertCat Mar 2013 #3
Well said... jjewell Mar 2013 #12
Part of the reason is the media's brainwashing. Dustlawyer Mar 2013 #4
It really angers me when mercymechap Mar 2013 #5
I tell them if people were paid more they would contribute more. Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2013 #8
Good point! mercymechap Mar 2013 #16
Bill Maher is wrong about Head Start not working. citizen blues Mar 2013 #6
One of his guests refuted that. Bill seemed to stand down. Cleita Mar 2013 #9
Here are some links to Brookings regarding the effectiveness of Head Start. MissMarple Mar 2013 #13
Brookings is a politicaly centrist organization that is Cleita Mar 2013 #15
I think in Texas it has been very helpful, especially when mercymechap Mar 2013 #17
Of course it is. Cleita Mar 2013 #19
I think most Brookings scholars want to improve Head Start and early childhood education. MissMarple Mar 2013 #18
Fine, then people shouldn't just put up that it doesn't make any difference Cleita Mar 2013 #20
Well said. We don't expect future National Merit Scholars from Head Start. maddiemom Mar 2013 #10
Head Start needs some work. MissMarple Mar 2013 #14
Thank you for the interesting read. maddiemom Mar 2013 #22
It doesn't work as well as one might hope. Outcomes and quality are highly variable. MissMarple Mar 2013 #11
The "spending cut" they want and refuse to say DOESN'T EXIST. Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2013 #7
Bill's right on this one... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #21
Just IMO ProfessionalLeftist Mar 2013 #23
I just caught this yesterday and shared it with others today... MrMickeysMom Mar 2013 #24
It's very well done ProfessionalLeftist Mar 2013 #25

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
2. I keep forgetting there are people like that "out there".
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 02:26 PM
Mar 2013

tis both a curse and blessing, I guess, to have a lifestyle that lets me avoid most people.

 

AlbertCat

(17,505 posts)
3. Baiting with taxes
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 02:50 PM
Mar 2013

I love how "Lame Talking Points" Feehery tries to "get ya" with the "and your taxes went up...."

No one ever points out that the rich people during those OUTRAGEOUSLY high Clinton taxes were rich then. That in the 50's and 60's and 70's when taxes were much higher than even during Clinton's terms, almost all of the families wealthy now were wealthy then. You'd think that a 40% tax bracket is gonna leave these rich folks destitute and living in a cardboard box.

And America is not going to go broke. It's not now and if it does in the future, it's because it didn't collect enough revenue.

Dustlawyer

(10,495 posts)
4. Part of the reason is the media's brainwashing.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 03:10 PM
Mar 2013

They only know to spout the talking points and have not given independant thought to the issues themselves. They are trained to be offended upon hearing anything not in line with their brainwashing so they don't even consider the other side of the coin. Here for example, the point was made that our spending is 24% of GDP, and our taxes are 19% of GDP. That is a problem, one with many solutions. Our side would say that the social programs are already at such a low level for individuals that they should not be cut further. The military on the other hand is huge because we are #1 if it kills us! We need that size to manipulate other countries to protect our ability to be #1. Currently, thats not working out too well for us. More importantly, they want the tax dollars. In education they want to privatize to get the tax dollars, in prisons... Yes we need controls on spending, we just differ in what we would cut.

mercymechap

(579 posts)
5. It really angers me when
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 03:21 PM
Mar 2013

I hear conservatives claim that the rich are already paying the majority of our revenue and ask what we think is fair.
Even when you tell them that you paid a lot more than Romney's 14%, they still don't get it and think, bravo for Romney, he earned it he deserves to keep as much of it as he can. Never mind that we earned our money too, and we're keeping a smaller percentage of what we earn than Rmoney! Duh!

citizen blues

(570 posts)
6. Bill Maher is wrong about Head Start not working.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 03:45 PM
Mar 2013

I'm really surprised he doesn't know better.

Bill Maher's statement about how kids in Head Start and kids who aren't are the same is exactly the success of Head Start! Head Start helps kids who are disadvantaged and would otherwise be behind. These are the kids who will typically struggle through school and be more likely to drop out. Head Start levels the playing field. It gives disadvantaged and vulnerable kids the boost they need to be at grade level going into kindergarten and 1st grade.

The fact that Head Start kids are the same as other kids is the point! The truth is Head Start has been a successful early education program. It's an investment in this country's future we cannot afford not to make.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
9. One of his guests refuted that. Bill seemed to stand down.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 04:13 PM
Mar 2013

That statistic he got was from a right wing source. Maybe he'll go double check his source now.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
15. Brookings is a politicaly centrist organization that is
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 06:39 PM
Mar 2013

mostly upper middle class in focus. Considering that the Heritage Foundation, that seems to be wrong on most things, says the same thing, I believe the study is suspect. I think you will find this study more accurate:

http://home.uchicago.edu/~ludwigj/papers/NYAS-LudwigPhillips-HeadStart-2008.pdf

You don't have to read all of it right now. Just skip down to the Conclusions on the last two pages. It sums up that those who conducted the study think the program still has merit, could improve but is still cost effective and well... effective.

What is missed is that it also serves as day care for low income women and I think that is why these studies are being put out there to discredit the program. After all, why should taxpayer's money be used to baby sit minority and poor children?

mercymechap

(579 posts)
17. I think in Texas it has been very helpful, especially when
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 07:38 PM
Mar 2013

many of the kids in pre-K come from minority families that speak Spanish at home, gives these kids a chance to learn English before they hit first grade. This article seems to be very pro pre-K.

http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/sarameads_policy_notebook/2012/11/researchers_find_texas_pre-k_programs_improving_kids_elementary_achievement.html

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
19. Of course it is.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 07:43 PM
Mar 2013

The study referenced by Maher smells of astroturf. I used to be able to spot it when the insurance industry was trying to discredit universal health care. Oh, all the studies from so called reputable organizations about how awful the Canadian and European health care systems were. Finally, thank God Michael Moore put a stop to it by taking Americans who couldn't get health care to Cuba where they were treated by the Cuban national health system. The problem is that the misinformation is carefully seeded and then develops a life of its own in getting spread around. Maher should know better.

MissMarple

(9,656 posts)
18. I think most Brookings scholars want to improve Head Start and early childhood education.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 07:40 PM
Mar 2013

Most of the articles there support improvement of Head Start which the article you link to does as well. It also cites an article cowritten by Isabel Sawhill who is at Brookings. If the quality and effectiveness of Head Start are to be upgraded, the programs must be critically evaluated. That will certainly hurt the feelings of some and be applauded by others.

Which study or evaluation do you believe is suspect? I have no idea what the Heritage Foundation's position is. I would guess that if they have similar findings, they would reach a different solution than Brookings, not improvement, but across the board defunding or outright dissolution.

Personally, I believe Head Start should enroll children younger than three, and be required and funded to allow for quality day care. The organizations who receive the Head Start grants must have their programs carefully evaluated. Defending them for what good they do bring is not enough. The results are not where they need to be. Anyway, the right will target Head Start for not being cost effective or, if Head Start does succeed consistently, they will say we don't need it. You just have to love how predictable they are.

I think we agree that the communities and families that Head Start serves need more, purposefully targeted, interventions than just day care and Head Start. It just isn't enough.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
20. Fine, then people shouldn't just put up that it doesn't make any difference
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 07:51 PM
Mar 2013

after the third grade. That only makes people think, oh well time to end the program. I agree community and families need more when there isn't enough. But ending 'not enough' because it supposedly isn't working when it is, is very cynical IMHO and that's what these articles are about.

maddiemom

(5,106 posts)
10. Well said. We don't expect future National Merit Scholars from Head Start.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 05:47 PM
Mar 2013

We do expect that they'll start with a BIT more of an even playing field that might help them to get there. You shouldn't have to be a professional in education to understand that. When I think of the poor (often even ragged) elementary kids I knew in the fifties---there is no comparison today with that dreaded government help.

maddiemom

(5,106 posts)
22. Thank you for the interesting read.
Sun Mar 24, 2013, 05:15 AM
Mar 2013

Growing up in a quite liberal family in the fifties and sixties, I was aware of the attitude that there were people around who "didn't really want to work." Actually there were a few we knew who fit that stereotype. (usually a bad back). That their kids should still have the chance to advance was not in question among liberals such as my parents. Prior to the JFK/LBJ era, I truly remember kids who were running around dirty and ragged. They showed up that way in school and tended to drop out as soon as possible. This isn't something that I actually ever saw when I became a teacher in the late sixties. Everyone had decent clothes and the opportunity for good nutrition. Kids showing up dirty and ragged at school was something that hasn't existed in years.

MissMarple

(9,656 posts)
11. It doesn't work as well as one might hope. Outcomes and quality are highly variable.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 05:55 PM
Mar 2013

Early childhood education needs a makeover, especially in poverty stricken areas.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/opinions/2010/10/11-head-start-haskins

"A new approach is needed. One that has been suggested- defunding these programs-would amount to giving up the fight against major social problems such as educational failure and poverty that damage millions of American lives. A far better alternative is to use rigorous evidence about "what works" to evolve Head Start and other federal efforts into truly effective programs over time, and to use sophisticated models to trace their longer-term effects on children's life prospects.

This approach draws on the insight that most of these programs are actually broad funding streams that finance multiple models and strategies ("interventions&quot . Although evaluations may show that the program as a whole has little or no positive effect, certain specific interventions within it may indeed be effective. An example of this in preschool education is Project Upgrade, a Miami-Dade County, Fla., initiative that trained teachers of low-income preschoolers in language and literacy instruction. Its interventions were shown in a large randomized evaluation to increase the development of children's vocabulary and early reading skills by four to nine months over the course of a single school year, compared with the control group.

Other, nonpreschool examples of research-proven interventions include career academies in low-income high schools (shown to produce a long-term increase in earnings averaging $2,200 per year); the Success for All whole-school reform in grades K-2 (shown to increase schoolwide reading ability in 2nd grade by 25 percent to 30 percent of a grade level); the Nurse-Family Partnership, which provides nurse-visitation services to low-income first-time mothers (shown to produce sustained reductions of nearly 50 percent in child abuse and neglect); and the Carrera Adolescent Pregnancy Prevention Program (shown to produce 40 percent to 50 percent reductions in teenage girls' pregnancies and births).

Such instances of proven effectiveness are rare, in part because rigorous evaluations are still uncommon in most areas of social policy, including education. But their very existence suggests that evidence-based reforms in Head Start and other federal social programs could help them evolve to become much more effective."

This is a link to some other articles.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/commentary?start=1&expert=Ron+Haskins&sort=ContentDate&topic=Head+Start

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
7. The "spending cut" they want and refuse to say DOESN'T EXIST.
Sat Mar 23, 2013, 03:57 PM
Mar 2013

They are CONVINCED there is a type of welfare out there specifically for minorities that white people can't get and it's the #1 expense in government.

MrMickeysMom

(20,453 posts)
21. Bill's right on this one...
Sun Mar 24, 2013, 12:16 AM
Mar 2013

People can't even bother to look at the math when they talk about cuts and government spending. Just how much the salary is cut is an example. However, it's not an excuse to provide Congress what we don't have in health benefits.

People are angry, but they are too dull and obtuse to figure it out... What's it going to take for people to start to put 2+2 together again. These questions about their every day existence and the existence of mankind in this growing neo-feudalistic state is driving me crazy.

ProfessionalLeftist

(4,982 posts)
23. Just IMO
Sun Mar 24, 2013, 11:06 AM
Mar 2013

An educational and informational news source - one that uses facts and informs and isn't driven by corprat priorities and propaganda. What news USED to be.

It would feature programs such as this:



Frankly, most 20-somethings I know have no CLUE how we got into the mess we're in - economically, politically or socially. Only when they've been apprised of that - of the historical context of where we are now - will they begin to get a CLUE about how to get out of it. Then, there will be many different ideas but at least they'd not be dumbfounded and perhaps not as complacent.

MrMickeysMom

(20,453 posts)
24. I just caught this yesterday and shared it with others today...
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 12:27 AM
Mar 2013

It's an example of what public education should be, whether it's in school or on public television.

Very clearly presented, isn't it?

ProfessionalLeftist

(4,982 posts)
25. It's very well done
Mon Mar 25, 2013, 07:42 AM
Mar 2013

And since the guy's an economist, I figure more than a politician with a carved-in-stone set of ideologies, he knows his stuff.

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