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frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
Sat May 1, 2021, 12:24 PM May 2021

Salem Witch Trials documents and other records

Last edited Sat May 1, 2021, 01:39 PM - Edit history (1)

Every once in a while, I feel the urge to once again snoop on my ancestors to see what they were up to. The easiest ones to check on are my dad's paternal ancestors, several of whom were involved in the Salem witch trials, as accusers and accused.

Here's where I find the best stuff, not only about the witch trials, but about other goings on in the American colonies in and around that time.

http://salem.lib.virginia.edu/home.html

This morning I decided to see what my distant great-grandfather Symon Tuttle was up to back then, so I went to the section Records and Files of the Quarterly Courts of Essex County and found quite a lot of interesting court cases described in which he was the defendant. (Once, he was charged with stealing a mare, but it was his mare, and Symon was stealing it back from his neighbor.)

Here, in 1664 (Volume III), Symon ended up with a big fine and a prison term for shooting off his mouth. It was 100 years before the Revolutionary War, but Symon was raring to go:



I find myself reading about cases that didn't involve any of my ancestors, because it's like watching a soap opera on TV - only better.

This entry (Volume VI 1675-1678) mentions Symon, but its focus is John Hathorne, who later became the judge in the witch trials. It appears he was an imposing figure even before the witch trials, and determined to have his own way. Somewhere I read about a living "witch" descendant living near the cemetery where Hathorne is buried who takes her little dog for walks every morning and lets the dog piss on his grave.



Anyway, I just thought some of you here might also enjoy snooping into the past.

EDITED to add:

The famous author Nathaniel Hawthorne changed the spelling of his name from Hathorne to Hawthorne because he was ashamed of his witch-trials judge ancestor, John Hathorne.

(Wiki) Nathaniel Hawthorne (July 4, 1804 – May 19, 1864) was an American novelist, dark romantic, and short story writer. His works often focus on history, morality, and religion.

He was born in 1804 in Salem, Massachusetts, to Nathaniel Hathorne and the former Elizabeth Clarke Manning. His ancestors include John Hathorne, the only judge from the Salem witch trials who never repented his involvement.

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Salem Witch Trials documents and other records (Original Post) frogmarch May 2021 OP
I too have ancestors who were involved in the Salem Witch Trials. MoonchildCA May 2021 #1
Interesting! frogmarch May 2021 #2
Nathaniel Hawthorne is also a distant cousin of mine! MoonchildCA May 2021 #3
That is awesome! frogmarch May 2021 #4
Who knows, both having ancestors from that time and place... MoonchildCA May 2021 #5
Thanks for this interesting op. It reminded me of some information concerning Ergot abqtommy May 2021 #6
Thanks for the link frogmarch May 2021 #7
It's an interesting thing to consider. I figure there might have been some ergot poisioning abqtommy May 2021 #9
That's for sure. frogmarch May 2021 #11
My ancestors Samuel and Ruth Perley frogmarch May 2021 #8
Thank you! Very interesting. smirkymonkey May 2021 #10
And thank you for frogmarch May 2021 #12
One of my ancestors was a juror in a witchtrial csziggy May 2021 #13
Do you recognize the name frogmarch May 2021 #14
Henry Herrick was one of my ancestors - but I misspoke csziggy May 2021 #21
It can be confusing! frogmarch May 2021 #28
One of my ancestors was named Aaron Harland csziggy May 2021 #31
Ann Putnam, one of the accusers, mother was also named Ann Putnam. MoonchildCA May 2021 #32
The Ann Putnam in my tree was born with that name and married Henry Kinne csziggy May 2021 #34
Rebecca Towne Nurse and her sisters Mary Towne Esty and Sarah Towne Cloyes Fla Dem May 2021 #20
omg, it just hit me that frogmarch May 2021 #29
Abigail Dane Faulkner is in my family tree wnylib May 2021 #15
Hers is an amazing and famous true story! frogmarch May 2021 #16
I don't have any books about her, but wnylib May 2021 #17
The Deerfield Massacre! frogmarch May 2021 #18
Yes, it was France, with their Indian allies. wnylib May 2021 #22
Wow, thank you! frogmarch May 2021 #23
Oops. A correction on the title of wnylib May 2021 #26
Thanks for the resource link. I have descendants involved in the trials. Fla Dem May 2021 #19
Sounds like a good movie for accuracy. wnylib May 2021 #24
Oh, geez! frogmarch May 2021 #25
I absolutely think of them as real people and honored to have them in my family's heritage. Fla Dem May 2021 #27
Satan was my Daddy jpak May 2021 #30
By what authority was the 'jury sent out again'? Wolf Frankula May 2021 #33
By the authority of the presiding judge. malthaussen May 2021 #36
Well, at least Symon didn't have parts cut off for seditious libel. malthaussen May 2021 #35

MoonchildCA

(1,301 posts)
1. I too have ancestors who were involved in the Salem Witch Trials.
Sat May 1, 2021, 12:54 PM
May 2021

Ann Putnam, a cousin, was one of the accusers. Thankfully, my 7-times great-grandfather, her uncle, Joseph Putnam, and his family opposed the trials.
At least later in life, Ann apologized for the roll she had played. She was young and caught up in the hysteria, and likely influenced by her parents.

One of Joseph’s sons, Israel Putnam, born after the trials, went on to become General Putnam, my 6-times great grandfather.

I also have the occasional urge to research that part of my ancestry.
I can always find something new to learn.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
2. Interesting!
Sat May 1, 2021, 01:10 PM
May 2021

If you scroll down this page, you'll see *Document: Deposition of Ann Putnam Jr. v. Sarah Good*

You can open this copy of the original document, but you may find it hard to decipher the handwriting.

http://salem.lib.virginia.edu/archives/ecca.html

MoonchildCA

(1,301 posts)
3. Nathaniel Hawthorne is also a distant cousin of mine!
Sat May 1, 2021, 01:59 PM
May 2021

Through the same side of the family. He was also a direct descendant of General Israel Putnam. I found the connection in my research many years ago, but I didn’t document it at the time, so I can’t remember which of his children he descended from. My 5-times great grandfather was Israel Putnam Jr. who became a colonel and fought alongside his father, General Putnam, in the revolutionary war.

Edit: I may be mis-remembering, as it seems Israel Putnam’s mother, Elizabeth Porter, was the granddaughter of William Hathorne, so that may be where the relation lies. I’ll have to do a bit more research to see if my other, possibly imagined, connection exists. Right now chores all calling.

It’s easy to get lost in this stuff, one finding always leads to another...

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
4. That is awesome!
Sat May 1, 2021, 02:34 PM
May 2021

Isn't it wonderful that so many records were kept? I am always thrilled when I make a new discovery in my family tree, and I'll bet you are too.

hey, Wiki says that Gen. Putnam fought at Bunker (Breed's) Hill. So did a long-ago uncle of mine, my gg-grandmother's brother.

Speaking of being thrilled at family tree discoveries, I was not so thrilled to learn that through my "witch" ancestors, Dubya Bush and Sarah Palin are my cousins - but what the heck, it is kind of funny.

MoonchildCA

(1,301 posts)
5. Who knows, both having ancestors from that time and place...
Sat May 1, 2021, 04:47 PM
May 2021

...we too could be distant cousins.
Then again, that could make me related to Bush and Palin... ugh, don’t want to go there.


Just did the math. So Elizabeth Porter, who was married to my 7x Great grandfather, was of course, my 7x great grandmother and granddaughter of William Hathorne—making him my 9x Great grandfather.

Totally new information for me.
Don’t know if I ever would have realized that without your post.

abqtommy

(14,118 posts)
6. Thanks for this interesting op. It reminded me of some information concerning Ergot
Sat May 1, 2021, 05:26 PM
May 2021

Poisoning that has been suggested as the cause of many "witchcraft" symptoms. Ergot is
a fungus that effects grain crops and can cause hallucinations, convulsions and death.
There's some information supporting this and other information saying it's not possible.
Here's a link to information supporting this.

https://digitalhistorysalem.weebly.com/ergot-poisoning.htm

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
7. Thanks for the link
Sat May 1, 2021, 06:08 PM
May 2021

I'd read about ergot poisoning before, and the problem I have with it with regard to the witch trials is that the so-called "afflicted girls" began flailing their arms, said they were being bitten and pinched by the accused women's specters ("specter evidence&quot , claiming the accused women's specters were bewitching them. The thing is, the girls could turn it on and off at will. Some of them later even admitted they'd lied.

Women were often afraid to be seen in public for fear someone would see them and accuse their specters of attacking them wearing the same clothes.

Those accused of witchcraft didn't behave strangely - their accusers did. And it was all an act.


abqtommy

(14,118 posts)
9. It's an interesting thing to consider. I figure there might have been some ergot poisioning
Sat May 1, 2021, 06:50 PM
May 2021

and some common hysteria. The only truth we can know is that it was a deadly time for
anyone accused of witchcraft.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
11. That's for sure.
Sat May 1, 2021, 10:13 PM
May 2021

It's scary that even today there are people who believe in witchcraft. Years ago, a distant cousin I'd never met and I were sharing information online on our common ancestors who were victims of the witch trials - until he said he didn't think they were *all* really witches. Wow, I thought, and that was it for me.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
8. My ancestors Samuel and Ruth Perley
Sat May 1, 2021, 06:31 PM
May 2021

and their daughter Hannah were largely responsible for the hanging of Elizabeth Howe as a witch.

https://historicipswich.org/2019/10/12/the-witchcraft-trial-of-elizabeth-howe/

There was long-standing friction between Elizabeth Howe and her neighbors Samuel Perley and his wife Ruth, whose brother had married Elizabeth’s sister Deborah in 1662. For several years their daughter Hannah had experienced episodes in which she would fall into fits and say she was being pricked by pins, which Hannah claimed was the work of Elizabeth Howe. She told her parents “I could never afflict a dog as Goody Howe afflicts me.” The Perleys took the child to several doctors, the last of whom told them she was “under an evil hand”. Reverend Phillips of Rowley would later testify that he had visited Hannah as she lay ill and that Hannah had screamed that Goody Howe was in the room, going in and out of an oven. He rebuked her and her brother Samuel for crying out “Say Goodwife Howe is a witch! Say she is a witch!”. Young Hannah eventually “pined away to skin and bones and ended her sorrowful life”.


Colonial ovens were openings in the fireplace, beside the firebox. Goody Howe's little specter was going in and out of an oven.. Right.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
10. Thank you! Very interesting.
Sat May 1, 2021, 07:39 PM
May 2021

I live in Boston and am very interested in this history. I find it all so fascinating.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
13. One of my ancestors was a juror in a witchtrial
Sat May 1, 2021, 11:59 PM
May 2021

He and some of the other jurors later recanted their conviction- but it was after the woman was executed. I think it might have been Rebecca Nurse that they convicted.

What was odd was that his grandson much later married Rebecca Nurse's granddaughter. That couple were not my ancestors, just a branch in the family tree.

I'd have to hunt through my files to find exactly who my ancestor was.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
14. Do you recognize the name
Sun May 2, 2021, 01:37 AM
May 2021

from this list?

JURORS
Capt. Thomas Fisk, Sr., Foreman
William Fisk
John Bacheler
Capt. Thomas Fisk, Jr.
John Dane
Joseph Evelith
Thomas Pearly, Sr.
John Peabody
Thomas Perkins
Andrew Eliot
Henry Herrick, Jr.
*The list of jurors who served in the trial of Rebecca Nurse, above, does not include the many other jurors who served in prior and subsequent trials.*

(In the list is my ancestor Thomas Perley Sr. He also was a juror in the Elizabeth Howe trial, which strikes me as totally unfair, since his brother, wife and children were her main accusers.)

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
21. Henry Herrick was one of my ancestors - but I misspoke
Sun May 2, 2021, 01:20 PM
May 2021

It was his son, Henry Jr. that was on the jury for Rebecca Nurse but I am descended from Henry Sr's son Ephraim.

A different ancestor, Thomas Kinne (aka Keney and other variations) was married to Ann Putnam. Ann Putnam in my family was fifty years older than the one who was one of the accusers, but most likely was a relative.

ETA - Jone Dane might be a relative - I have a John Doane married to an Ann Perkins (another surname in the trails). Since spelling was not consistent, it could be the same man.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
28. It can be confusing!
Sun May 2, 2021, 06:38 PM
May 2021

Even as recently as a few generations back, I've run into similar problems while researching my family tree. My dad and his father and grandfather all had the same name, which isn't so bad, but trying to figure everyone out with the same names any further back than that can be a challenge.

Name confusion aside, it's still fascinating learning about our roots, isn't it? For me that would be especially anything having to do with the Salem witch trials.

I once told my husband I'd like to go back in time and give the accusers a good talking to. He said I'd be swinging in the wind in nothing flat. He was probably was right.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
31. One of my ancestors was named Aaron Harland
Mon May 3, 2021, 01:42 AM
May 2021

And his paternal line was Aaron Harland for four generations. Plus his son was named Aaron Harland. I haven't had the heart to see if a grandson was also named Aaron. Luckily at that point, his daughter Sarah married and that is where my line split off.

My husband's family has a line that for six or seven generations had a Thomas and a John in the family. Sometimes his ancestor was John, sometimes Thomas. It was great when they got around to having middle names. Then there was the Thomas who basically drank himself to death. His wife had died in childbirth so brother John took the children in. So there were two Thomas and Two John in the younger generation that grew up together. Major confusion!

I was a little stressed reading about the witch trials. I had more fun reading about my ancestors who were so much trouble in the Massachusetts colony, they were kicked out and moved to Rhode Island which was much more liberal about religion. I've been trying to prove that the Providence Williams who was Roger Williams son in Rhode Island could be our Providence Williams who showed up in the Carolinas. No luck so far, but it would be nice to connect those two.

MoonchildCA

(1,301 posts)
32. Ann Putnam, one of the accusers, mother was also named Ann Putnam.
Sun May 9, 2021, 12:08 AM
May 2021

And her paternal grandmother was also an Ann Putnam.

Lots of Ann Putnams back in the day.

Ann Putnam, the accuser, was the cousin of my 6x great grandfather General Israel Putnam.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
34. The Ann Putnam in my tree was born with that name and married Henry Kinne
Sun May 9, 2021, 01:51 AM
May 2021

A generation or so before the witch trials. Same family, probably, but not the same person.

Fla Dem

(23,652 posts)
20. Rebecca Towne Nurse and her sisters Mary Towne Esty and Sarah Towne Cloyes
Sun May 2, 2021, 12:42 PM
May 2021

Last edited Sun May 2, 2021, 02:22 PM - Edit history (1)

were all tried and convicted as witches. Rebecca and Mary were hanged. Sarah was imprisoned. They are in my direct lineage through my maternal grandmother.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
29. omg, it just hit me that
Sun May 2, 2021, 08:53 PM
May 2021

Rebecca Towne Nurse was *the* Rebecca Nurse I've read so much about.

I am now watching Three Sovereigns for Sarah on Amazon Prime. Wow. Just wow!

wnylib

(21,432 posts)
15. Abigail Dane Faulkner is in my family tree
Sun May 2, 2021, 01:38 AM
May 2021

through my paternal grandmother.

Her father, Reverend Francis Dane, spoke out against the accusers, so the women in his family were promptly accused. Abigail was convicted, but was pregnant at the time, so she was sent to prison with her 5 year old daughter, who was also convicted and who innocently had implicated her mother.

Abigail was to be hanged after the birth of her child. Fortunately for her, Rev. Increase Mather had just returned from England and challlenged the use of spectral evidence in the trials. As the leading colonial minister, he was respected by the people.

When the wife of the colonial MA governor was accused, the governor intervened, threw out all testimonies and convictions based on spectral evidence, and released the convicted prisoners. Abigail's family successfully sued for damages and had her conviction legally overturned.

wnylib

(21,432 posts)
17. I don't have any books about her, but
Sun May 2, 2021, 01:56 AM
May 2021

will be interested in following up on this one. Thanks.

Off topic a bit, and maybe suitable for a thread of its own, but I do have some books about another colonial event that another branch of my grandmother's ancestors were involved in - the Deerfield Raid, aka the Deerfield Massacre, in Deerfield,MA. Over 100 Deerfield residents (1/3 of the village) were taken captive to Canada. Famous throughout the colonies at the time, it is now known only to students of colonial history, and to genealogy researchers whose families trace back to that event.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
18. The Deerfield Massacre!
Sun May 2, 2021, 11:41 AM
May 2021

I had never heard of it until I read your post. Now I have no choice but to read up on it. I suppose that since the captive Deerfield residents were taken to Canada, it was France who did it (?)

Thanks for the Deerfield heads up. I love this stuff!

wnylib

(21,432 posts)
22. Yes, it was France, with their Indian allies.
Sun May 2, 2021, 03:50 PM
May 2021

The raid on Deerfield was part of Queen Anne's War in Europe. It spilled over into the American colonies when the French king ordered the colonial Canadian governor to harrass outlying English villages in order to discourage the expansion of the English into territory that France wanted. Deerfield was the northwesternmost English village in Massachusetts at the time, so it was most vulnerable.

The attack on Deerfield occured on February 29, 1704, just before dawn, while the villagers slept. Some captives remained in Canada as French subjects or adopted members of tribes that participated in the attack. But a large number of them were ransomed back to New England in various ransom expeditions. It was my ancestor, John Sheldon, Sr. who ransomed back the largest number, including his own children, in 3 different trips.

One political and historical significance of the raid is that it prompted England to take a more direct control over the colonies and to place troops in villages, housed in people's homes. The colonists welcomed this protection at first, but rebelled against this control and housing of troops at the time of the Revolution.

Hostilities from this raid and others led to the French and Indian Wars a few decades later.

There were other raids on English villages at the time, but this one became famous because of the large number of captives and the prominance of one captive family - the village minister, whose wife was a Mather, cousin to Cotton Mather. The members of his family who survived the attack and march to Montreal were ransomed back except for his 7 year old daughter, Eunice, who was adopted by a Catholic Mohawk family, converted to Catholicism, and married a Mohawk man. Eunice's relatives and all of New England tried, all her life, to get Eunice to return, but she refused, although she did visit them a few times.

Some recommended sources on the Deerfield raid:

1. an excellent, award-winning website, The Many Stories of Deerfield. It tells about the raid from all sides, English, French, and the various tribes involved. I don't have a link, but a search will turn it up.

2. A book, Captors and Captives, by Haefeli and Sweeney. The authors are local (to Deerfield) historians who describe the village and its residents prior to the attack, the atttack itself, and its effects on the village and on New England. They include a map of the village, a map of the route the captives were taken on to Montreal, and a chart of all the deaths and the captives and what became of them.

3. The Unredeemed Captive, by John Demos. It is the story of Eunice Williams, the minister's daughter who remained with her adopted Mohawk family. The title is a play on the title of a work published by Eunice's father, Rev. John Williams, after his return to Deerfield - The Redeemed Captive Returning to Zion. The Demos book uses historical facts, but told in a very subjective style from the various perspectives of Eunice and her family. Gives details of the raid and the march of captives from Deerfield to Montreal.

4. Rev. John Williams' published work on his captivity experiences. It is available as a reference in some libraries. It is written in the stilted language of an 18th century Puritan clergyman, with numerous Biblical and doctrinal references, so it is pretty dry, dull reading for modern people.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
23. Wow, thank you!
Sun May 2, 2021, 04:04 PM
May 2021

I know what I'm going to be doing today.

Your post is not only informative, it's intriguing! I can't imagine why the Deerfield story isn't famous everywhere. Wow!

wnylib

(21,432 posts)
26. Oops. A correction on the title of
Sun May 2, 2021, 05:40 PM
May 2021

the website. It is called: Raid on Deerfield, the Many stories of 1704.

I have not yet visited Deerfield, but before the pandemic, they had commercialized their history, similar to colonial Williamsburg, VA, but not as extensively. There is a museum with artifacts from the period of the raid and you could tour some of the houses that remain from that time, or duplicates of them. There were people in period costumes to explain or demonstrate lifestyles from 18th century Deerfield.

They are probably all closed now, due to the pandemic.

This raid is well known among Deefield descendants who, like myself, discover it during genealogy research. It is also known to people who study the colonial history of New England. Some descendants remained in the Deerfield area for generations. Most moved west over the Appalachians after the Revolution and founded small towns in northwestern PA, western NY, and eastern Ohio. After reading books on the raid, I recognized surnames from my home town of Erie, PA and now, in a small western NY city.

Fla Dem

(23,652 posts)
19. Thanks for the resource link. I have descendants involved in the trials.
Sun May 2, 2021, 12:21 PM
May 2021

Last edited Sun May 2, 2021, 02:25 PM - Edit history (3)

William and Joanna (Blessing)Towne immigrated from Great Yarmouth England settling in Salem Ma in 1635. They are my 10th great grandparents.

They had 8 children; Rebecca, John, Susan, Edmund, Jacob, Mary, Joseph and Sarah.

Edmund is our family's direct descendant.

Witchcraft trials.........

Joanna Blessing Towne was accused of witchcraft, but never brought to trial.

Rebecca married Francis Nurse and was hanged as a witch on July 16, 1692.

Mary married Issac Esty (Easty, Estey, Eastick, Eastie, or Estye ) and was hanged as a witch September 19,1692

Sarah was sentenced to prison.

The PBS video, "Three Sovereigns for Sarah" is based on their trial.

Synopsis
This is a true story based on transcripts of the Salem Witch Trials. Sarah (Vanessa Redgrave) and her two sisters are put on trial for suspicion of witchcraft. While her sisters are hanged, Sarah is sentenced to a prison term to be served in a box barely large enough for her to lie down in. When she is released, her family name is cleared and all she is given for all she has suffered are three gold sovereigns- coin of the realm at the time.

Abby Williams, the preacher's niece, starts getting into fortune telling and such illegal activities, as taught to her by the slave Tituba. Other local girls get into it, and then start acting strange. Abby and the girls eventually start to name local people as 'witches' and blame their sicknesses on witchcraft. Hundreds are accused and sent to jail, though there are many who doubt the truth of the accusations. Among these are three sisters, Mary, Rebecca, and Sarah. All are kept in jail for quite some time, until Mary and Rebecca are found guilty, though they pleaded innocent. They are hanged, and due to over crowding, Sarah is sent to a farm until her hearing. She is kept in utter isolation in a chicken coop, getting very sick and lonely, until family comes to save her. The madness is over, though the clever girls, along with one 'afflicted' mother, first succeeded in giving enough 'evidence' so that 19 people were hanged on the count of witchcraft, and one was pressed to death. The story is told to a court 10 years later by Sarah, wanting to clear the family name. Though they can not immediately decide on guilt, or give her compensation, the three judges do give Sarah 3 symbolic sovereigns, one for each of the lives that had suffered.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090164/plotsummary?ref_=tt_ov_pl#synopsis


The movie is on Amazon Prime

wnylib

(21,432 posts)
24. Sounds like a good movie for accuracy.
Sun May 2, 2021, 04:26 PM
May 2021

I've always thought that the girls' behavior started as a result of fear and guilt over their activities with Tituba. For kids brought up in such a strongly religious community, the guilt over dabbling in forbidden practices would have been strong enough to produce hysterical behavior. It's also possible that Tituba tried to guarantee their silence with the threat of a curse if they talked, although therexis no record of such a threat, AFAIK. That threat would set up a strong internal conflict for girls who were taught the necessity of confessing and repenting of sins and the dire consequences of not repenting.

In the end, when they finally did admit to consulting with Tituba, and it was labelled as witchcraft, there was powerful social pressure on them to deliver what people expected to hear, especially with some coaching from Ann Putnam's mother.

frogmarch

(12,153 posts)
25. Oh, geez!
Sun May 2, 2021, 04:38 PM
May 2021

The more I learn of what those accused of witchcraft went through, the more horrified I become. I think, how could this have happened? How could people have been so stupid as to believe in such superstitious nonsense? Then I think of some of the wacko goings on today and realize that crazy thinking is still out there

It's wonderful that you know about your ancestral family, and it's clear to me that you think of them as having been honest-to-goodness real people, not just names in your family tree. Joanna and her daughters Rebecca, Mary and Sarah accused, Rebecca and Mary hanged, Sarah imprisoned...my god!

Thank you for the movie information! I'll watch it tonight and tell my kids and grandkids about it too.

Fla Dem

(23,652 posts)
27. I absolutely think of them as real people and honored to have them in my family's heritage.
Sun May 2, 2021, 05:56 PM
May 2021

To think they immigrated from England for a better life only to be murdered 50+ years later, What courage they had.

Wolf Frankula

(3,600 posts)
33. By what authority was the 'jury sent out again'?
Sun May 9, 2021, 01:13 AM
May 2021

IIRC under English and Scots law, when a jury said 'Not guilty' or 'Not proven' that was it. The trial was over. The judge violated the law.

Wolf

malthaussen

(17,187 posts)
36. By the authority of the presiding judge.
Sun May 9, 2021, 02:05 PM
May 2021

This happened quite a lot in earlier trials when the jury returned a verdict that the judge didn't like. Considering that in the example cited, all three rulings were first against John Hathorne, and then in his favor, I'm guessing he had some influence with the presiding judge.

In one trial of William Penn (that I personally find very funny), the jury was sent out four times and refused to return a verdict to the judge's liking. Especially when there was any political/religious context to a trial, as in the "slander" charges shown here, the verdict tended to have little to do with the facts, or with law.

This is the doctrine of jury nullification, which has famously raised its head from time to time in recent history.

https://www.1215.org/lawnotes/lawnotes/jurynul2.htm

-- Mal

malthaussen

(17,187 posts)
35. Well, at least Symon didn't have parts cut off for seditious libel.
Sun May 9, 2021, 01:44 PM
May 2021

A few days in the stocks would have done him good.

-- Mal

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