To clean up coal, Obama pushes more oil production

[Omaha Steve]

http://apnews.excite.com/article/20131223/DAARTA380.html

By DINA CAPPIELLO

DE KALB, Miss. (AP) - America's newest, most expensive coal-fired power plant is hailed as one of the cleanest on the planet, thanks to government-backed technology that removes carbon dioxide and keeps it out of the atmosphere.

But once the carbon is stripped away, it will be used to do something that is not so green at all.


In this Oct. 21, 2013, photo, construction continues at the Mississippi Power's Kemper County energy facility in central Mississippi near DeKalb, Miss. The power plant is designed to use a soft form of coal called lignite in a gasification process to generate power. The plant, America’s newest, most expensive coal-fired power plant is hailed as one of the cleanest on the planet, thanks to government-backed technology that removes carbon dioxide and keeps it out of the atmosphere. Once the carbon is stripped away, it will be used to do something that is not so green at all – extract oil. Power companies sell the carbon dioxide to oil companies, which pump it into old oil fields to force more crude to the surface. (AP Photo/Rogelio V. Solis)


It will extract oil.

When President Barack Obama first endorsed this "carbon-capture" technology, the idea was that it would fight global warming by sparing the atmosphere from more greenhouse gases. It makes coal plants cleaner by burying deep underground the carbon dioxide that typically is pumped out of smokestacks.

FULL story at link.

[pscot]

1. We keep hearing how intelligent the President is

But things like this make you wonder. Just what the hell is he thinking.

[kristopher]

2. This isn't Obama's doing

There are a few energy issues you can attach directly to his name - he has used his authority to dramatically increase the use of renewables at Federal facilities in order to grow that industry for example.

But to say that his support for CCS is responsible for the outcome in the OP is BS. There are far too many twists and turns along the way for any reasonable person to place blame like that.

That said, the ALEC led effort to structure the energy system in a way that favors the entrenched players is going to prosper until we get control of all both chambers of Congress AND the presidency. They have the market power and position so preserving the status quo is a win for them.

As for the logic behind the CCS > methanol, it can be narrowly justified as a fairly significant increase in the overall efficiency of the coal, improving the ratio of energy to carbon. However, that narrow view is like support for nuclear - ultimately it just gets in the way of the kind of change we must have. We need to discard the centralized thermal system and move to a distributed renewable system in order to achieve real meaningful change.

[Nihil]

3. His support for CCS is directly enabling the fossil fuel lobby.

Yes, he has done some very good things with regards to getting renewables adopted
but anyone other than a totally blinkered cheerleader would have to admit that his
active support & promotion of the CCS scam is *completely* supporting the
fossil fuel industry.

There is no way to paint that particular turd in a favourable manner.

Every bit of direct support that fossil fuels gain is making the change game harder.

Having a president who still supports oil, coal & natural gas is not good.
Supporting his bad characteristics with the sole claim of "The one before was worse"
(or "The one after will be worse&quot is not sufficient either.

[kristopher]

4. Bullshit.

Every responsible person with any concern whatsoever about climate change supports the effort to find an effective path to carbon sequestration. It is everything you say it is, but the payoff if we do find an effective method of decarbonizing fossil fuel's emissions would be huge.

Why don't you take your Obama bashing elsewhere. He isn't a God that is aware of the fall of every sparrow; he is a political leader trying to guide a ship with mutinous crew willing to drown everyone to get an extra allotment of mead.

[Nihil]

5. Bullshit yourself.

He isn't trying to find "an effective path to carbon sequestration", he is
encouraging the fossil fuel industry to increase their profits whilst supporting
their greenwashing by pretending that their current CCS scam is in any way,
shape or form beneficial to the planet.

With regard to my alleged "Obama bashing", which of my points in the
previous post do you believe to be untrue:

1) His support for CCS is directly enabling the fossil fuel lobby.

2) he has done some very good things with regards to getting renewables adopted

3) his active support & promotion of the CCS scam is *completely* supporting
the fossil fuel industry.

4) Every bit of direct support that fossil fuels gain is making the change game harder.

5) Having a president who still supports oil, coal & natural gas is not good.




> Why don't you take your Obama bashing elsewhere.

Why don't you take your blinkered cheerleading to the BOG if you are not
prepared to accept that your hero deserves criticism on the above points?

[kristopher]

6. Whatever, dude.

Your case is no more valid when you restate it than it was the first time.

We've heard a lot of arguments against POB based on the kind of unrealistic expectations that are the foundation of your posts, and they are usually coming from Republican demagogues or people parading around in tri-corner hats. You might want to ask yourself if you aren't buying into a current of anger and dissatisfaction that is BY DESIGN intended to cause people to point the finger at the "hero" of the Dems. It's the same thing they did to Carter, and remember what that got us - Reagan.

Seriously, look at the way you used "hero". Your sneer came screaming through the keyboard precisely because it follows a path blazed by the Limbaughs and well trod by every rightwing internet warrior since Al Gore ran for president. I know you aren't rightwing, but you are certainly following their lead with your inappropriate criticisms. You aren't holding his feet to the fire, you are assisting those who are deliberately fomenting discontent by steering it at the wrong target.

Why the hell aren't you placing the blame where it belongs, on the wingnuts that are obstructing the meaningful action on climate that Obama clearly would love to pursue? They are the people we need to get rid of, not Obama.

[NickB79]

7. Ahem

http://www.nationaljournal.com/energy/obama-touts-increased-oil-production-in-weekly-address-20131118

In his weekly address, President Obama seized on new data showing that the U.S. has begun producing more oil than it imports to argue that the country is steadily moving toward energy independence.

The president also attributed increased production, at least in part, to federal support for exploration and drilling.

"After years of talk about reducing our dependence on foreign oil, we are actually poised to control our energy future," Obama said. "Shortly after I took office, we invested in technologies to reverse our dependence on foreign oil and double our wind and solar power, and today we generate more renewable energy, with tens of thousands of good American jobs to show for it."

In making his claims, the president cited Energy Information Administration data released last Wednesday: "Just this week we learned that for the first time in nearly two decades, the United States produces more of our own oil, here at home, then we buy from other countries. That's a tremendous step toward American energy independence."

It's one thing to "guide a ship with mutinous crew", it's quite another to pat said crew on the back when they're actively rioting and call it "a tremendous step".

[kristopher]

8. What is it, exactly, that you expect of the President of the United States?

Do you think any person in that position who takes their responsibilities seriously is allowed by those responsibilities to behave in a manner you insinuate would be appropriate?

When you figure out how to install an Emperor with an unopposed dictatorial mandate, let the rest of us know so that we can stop you before you commit a blunder we'll all regret.

Again I ask, what is it - exactly - that you expect of the President of the United States?

[NickB79]

9. 2013 In Review: Obama Talks Climate Change–But Pushes Fracking

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2013/12/2013-obama-talks-climate-change-pushes-fracking

Again I ask, what is it - exactly - that you expect of the President of the United States?

I expect him to not ACTIVELY PROMOTE more fossil fuel production.

He could tout the US solar boom in interviews (which he does).

He could tout the US wind boom (which he does).

He could tout the increasing fuel efficiency standards in cars (which he does).

He doesn't have to publicly TAKE PRIDE in the US boom in oil and gas production. Yet he still does. Every time he so much as mentions the oil and gas boom in a positive light, it gives the fossil fuel industry more positive spin.

He doesn't have to be an Emperor to keep his mouth shut. He doesn't have to be an Emperor to actively fight to reduce the number of permits the fed. gov. issues for drilling on public lands.

[NickB79]

10. Michael Froman, Top U.S. Trade Official, Sides With Tar Sands Advocates In EU Negotiations

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/24/michael-froman_n_3984115.html

Building the Keystone XL pipeline is only part of the equation. Once the Canadian tar sands are pumped and piped to refineries on the Gulf Coast, the industry still needs to find buyers for its end product -- much of which will be exported.

That's where U.S. Trade Representative Michael Froman comes in.

Environmental groups in the U.S. and the European Union are worried that Froman, the chief trade official for the United States, has been quietly working to pressure the EU to make it easier for U.S. refiners to sell oil from the tar sands on the European market. They say Froman is pushing his EU counterparts to weaken environmental guidelines related to greenhouse gas emissions in order to facilitate easier oil exports.

Michael Froman was appointed by, and reports directly to, Pres. Obama