Israel/Palestine
Related: About this forumIsraeli Army Destroys Water Cisterns And Dwellings In Southern West Bank
Zenuta, West Bank – At around 10 a.m. on Tuesday, a group of Palestinians from the village of Zenuta watched from across a valley in the South Hebron Hills as two Israeli army bulldozers suddenly appeared and destroyed their village’s water cisterns, cave dwellings and stables. The village, divided by a valley, is just 3 kilometers from the Green Line, at the southern tip of the West Bank.
The bulldozers in Zenuta were accompanied by five army jeeps, three vehicles from the Israeli Civil Administration, and a charter bus of Israeli soldiers, trying to keep activists and members of the press from entering the village. A group of about 20-25 Palestinian men, women, and children who were there at the time sat in front of one of the bulldozers in an effort to stop them. They were quickly removed, however, by the army and the destruction commenced.
In total, four water cisterns, two caves, two houses and six stables were destroyed. Zenuta is a small village of seven families with a herd of 400 sheep. The army destroyed the houses of two families, each with seven children, as well as six stables holding sheep. Perhaps most devastating of all in a region starved for water, the army bulldozed the village’s cisterns, holding water collected from winter rains. The cisterns cost NIS 15,000 each, an incredible toll amounting to about a year and half’s wages for the average Palestinian worker in the area. The cisterns had been filled with water after a winter that brought the best rainfall in at least 10 years, according to residents of the area. Now two young boys walked around with the only two bottles of water left in the village offering it to visitors.
Mohammed Khaled Samamry, the owner of one of the houses destroyed, was indignant. “Can you live without water?” he asked, his hand trembling slightly with frustration. ”What can we do without water? What can we drink? You see what they do to us, the Israelis? They left the kids sitting under the sun, the sheep in the field. Where will we sleep tonight?”
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http://972mag.com/israeli-army-destroys-water-cisterns-and-dwellings-in-southern-west-bank/54743/
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AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)
atreides1
(16,072 posts)At least that would be a quicker death...without the suffering!
libodem
(19,288 posts)I'd say more but I don't want to be sounding anything like an antisemite. I love the Jews. But I detest this evil behavior by Israel.
Bradlad
(206 posts)How does that happen? I can't think of any nationality whom I "love". Many nationalities have their endearing qualities as well as some obnoxious ones. And every nationality or group of people, delineated by "national" or any other denominator, and consisting of over a dozen or so members - will have its share of both saints and assholes. Having either endearing or obnoxious qualities, or saints or assholes in a population, has nothing to do with their right to defend themselves and their borders from attack.
It's not necessary to love any national group - just to treat them and judge them for their collective actions with a consistent and rational set of rules that respect human rights - especially the most basic human right to defend their state and their families from non-defensive aggression and violence. If the obsessed Israel-haters of the world could get past this simple obstacle there may some day be a chance for peace in the ME.
libodem
(19,288 posts)I love native Americans, I know it is irrational but I was raised as a liberal. My statement might have sounded hokey or corny but I meant well. I don't want to ever appear as someone who dislikes the Jewish people because I care about how the people in Palestine are treated. I teh gays too.
Bradlad
(206 posts)I applaud your sentiment and desire to be sure not to discriminate against non-whites. But it's always good to remember that individuals in any group can be either good or bad. No groups are immune or are likely to have all of one or the other. It's especially important to remember that bad people are present in every group of humans you can describe. Sometimes white "guilt" that liberals like us seem inclined to adopt is an avenue for deception by others who find ways to take advantage of that emotion.
Bad people learn at a young age that strong emotions shut down a person's ability to reason. All successful fraud and deception is dependent on some strong emotion in the person being deceived that can be identified and then taken advantage of.
Once deceived, the results can be devastating to one's self as well as others that one cares for. IMO that's one reason that the Palestinian narrative in all its permutations and versions is so easily accepted by the MSM - who's journalists and reporters are mostly liberals. My advice is to always be open to the possibility that anyone you meet from any ethnic group including your own is very possibly a wonderful and kind person who would not deceive you or take advantage of you. But be cautious and observe them skeptically and carefully for a while before you allow them to color any important decisions that you make. Like whether to buy the used car they are selling or the narrative they are peddling.
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)You say that -- but you never call.
King_David
(14,851 posts)Is it like an unconditional and reciprocal type love?
Was it love at first sight?
Is it never ending love?
Can you share your love story with us?
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)... I just LOVE the goyim?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)
And so long as you don't add "...in a Bechamel sauce, served over rice pilaf".
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)It's a COOKBOOK!
libodem
(19,288 posts)So maybe I just think I love the story of the struggle of the Jewish people through the ages. It is not recipicated, I am pretty sure I am notoved back.
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)Could it be something you said?
libodem
(19,288 posts)I just don't want to be thought of someone who is reflexively anti-Jewish because I care that the Palestinians are being consistently shit on. But if I'm that unlikeable because I have an opinion maybe all Jews hate me. Fine You win.
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)... you're already in deep enough, pardner.
arikara
(5,562 posts)especially given their history how they can treat others like that.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)What does that comment mean?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)Well...just going out on a limb here, but...suffering doesn't always ennoble. Sometimes, it creates both a fixation with doing whatever it is they feel is necessary to guarantee there will be no repeat of the past suffering(understandable)and a desire for some sort of revenge(also understandable, if less commendable). Some transcend and use their pain as a motivation to work for a better world, but you can't just demand or expect that of people.
Most people don't turn into saints just because they've felt pain. Some do, some don't.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Israel orders demolition of 8 villages for army training ground
Israel regards the 1,500 residents of Khirbet al-Majaz, Khirbet al-Tabban, Sfai, Khirbet al-Fakheit, Halaweh, Mirkez, Jinba, and Kharoubeh as squatters, although the villages predate the establishment of the state of Israel by over 100 years, the report said.
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=506983
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Complete with statements from both the Palestinians and the Israeli government about this incident.
I mean that explanation presented by the representative from the IDF interviewed for this article was just ridiculous.
Oh wait...
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)any?
oberliner
(58,724 posts)No attempt was made to present any so one can only assume, as apparently a respondent did on this very thread, that the Israelis simply like to kill Palestinians.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)kind of speak for themselves and Israel doesn't seem to give much explanation except in the case I noted above to say they were squatters albeit the villages existed prior to Israel, but I guess it's better than they were built without permit
oberliner
(58,724 posts)The Jerusalem municipality may offer to voluntarily relocate some 1,500 Palestinian residents of the city's Silwan neighborhood - currently living on top of an archaeological site - to alternative lots in East Jerusalem, residents say.
The option was brought up by city council and East Jerusalem portfolio holder Yakir Segev, in meetings with the residents.
The 88 houses at issue were constructed without permits in the Al-Bustan area of Silwan and are slated for demolition. They stand in an area known as the King's Garden, defined as being of great archaeological importance by the Israel Antiquities Authority.
http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/jerusalem-offers-to-voluntarily-relocate-1-500-palestinian-residents-1.270570
Stuff like that.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)have heard anything about the several thousand Bedouin that Israel was locating to a convenient location -next to a garbage dump?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)Can a cistern be weaponized now or something?
What part of "destroying villages is ALWAYS wrong" do you not get?
shira
(30,109 posts)...are evil and they're all liars by default.
Therefore Israel has no right to exist. It's a fascist rogue state and is committing slow-motion genocide against innocents.
Great example of propaganda, BTW.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)Last edited Thu Aug 30, 2012, 04:37 AM - Edit history (1)
You know there couldn't possibly be a justification for destroying an all or even a significant part of a village and depriving people who'd lived in that village, and whose families had probably lived in it for centuries, of their water supply. Nobody in this town was a terrorist, shira. And it's not as though Israel was going to be wiped out if this village was left alone.
Just admit this was indefensible.
shira
(30,109 posts)...that you don't even have to hear the Israeli side?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)There's no excuse for destroying a village and depriving people of their water supply. It really IS that simple. Nobody in this village was a terrorist...and it's not a crime to have a Palestinian village NEAR the Green Line.
But I'll humor you...have Bibi & Co. even offered an explanation for this incident?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)...they normally wouldn't wait for somebody to show up and interview them about it-they'd issue a statement announcing precisely what that reason was. This is a government that's usually pretty fast on the uptake when it comes to making the case for controversial actions on their part.
The fact that they haven't in this case. at least so far, strongly suggests that this was, at least, a major screw-up on somebody's party, or perhaps something worse.
Shira, have YOU actually heard any official explanations for what was done here?
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Do you even know?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)And clearly, the point of destroying the water cisterns was to ultimately make it impossible for the village to remain in place.
Can you at least admit that there's no possible justification for destroying the cisterns? It's not like it could be weaponized, for God's sake.
If there'd been any good reason for doing this, any honorable reason, wouldn't the IDF or the Defense Ministry have said something publicly by now?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)read the first few paragraphs it describes Zentua quite well or are you saying that by some standards Zentua did not qualify as a village? or do you have proof that there is still a village?
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Sean O'Neil does describe it quite well. Maybe he should write novels.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)There's simply no excuse for destroying an entire village. None.
These were innocent people just quietly living their lives.
Purveyor
(29,876 posts)By John Vidal, The Guardian
Thursday, August 30, 2012 8:12 E
The Gaza strip faces a water crisis that will soon make it “unliveable” unless plans for a $500m desalination plant are approved by banks, delegates at a water conference in Stockholm were told this week.
Water for the 1.6 million people – half of them children and two-thirds refugees – who live in just 365 sq km of land bordering the Mediterranean comes entirely from the shallow coastal aquifer shared between Gaza, Israel and Egypt, which is only partly replenished each year by rainfall. Decades of overpumping and heavy pollution from salts and waste water has left the aquifer highly degraded and in danger of irreparable damage.
UN hydrologists say no more than 55 cubic metres of water should be abstracted a year, but present exploitation rates run at around 160m³. If this continues, says the UN, it could result in the water table dropping to a point where massive sea water intrusion permanently destroys the source within a few years.
In addition, the little water available is heavily polluted by nitrates from uncontrolled sewage, and fertilisers from farmlands, making 90% of the water unfit for human consumption. With the Gaza population expected to increase by 500,000 within eight years, and nearly 25% of all illnesses in Gaza water-related, the urgency for countries to put aside differences and address the issue is growing.
MORE...
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/08/30/water-crisis-will-make-gaza-strip-unliveable/