An Israeli leftist finds glimmer of hope

[shira]

I was born into the Israeli left. I grew up in the left. I was always a member of the left. I believed that the day that the Palestinians would have their own sovereign state would be the day when Israel would finally live in peace. But like many Israelis of the left, I lost this certainty I once had.

Why? Over the last 14 years, I have witnessed the inability of the Palestinians to utter the word "yes" when presented with repeated opportunities to attain sovereignty and statehood; I have lived through the bloody massacres by means of suicide bombings in cities within pre-1967 Israel following the Oslo Accords and then again after the failed Camp David negotiations in 2000; and I have experienced firsthand the increasing venom of anti-Israel rhetoric that only, very thinly, masks a deep and visceral hatred for the state and its people that cannot be explained by mere criticism for the policies of some of its elected governments.

But one of the most pronounced moments over the past several years that has made me very skeptical toward the left were a series of meetings I had with young, moderate Palestinian leaders to which I was invited by virtue of being a member of Israel's Labor Party. I had much in common with these young Palestinian leaders. We could relate to each other. However, through discussion, I soon discovered that the moderation of the young Palestinian leaders was in their acknowledgement that Israel is already a reality and therefore is not likely to disappear. I even heard phrases such as, "You were born here and you are already here, so we will not send you away." (Thank you very much, I thought). But, what shocked and changed my approach to peace was that when we discussed the deep sources of the conflict between us, I was told, "Judaism is not a nationality, it's only a religion and religions don't have the right to self-determination." The historic connection between the Jewish people and the land of Israel was also described as made-up or nonexistent.

Reflecting on the comments of these "moderates," I was forced to realize that the conflict is far deeper and more serious than I allowed myself to believe. It was not just about settlements and "occupation," as Palestinian spokespeople have led the Israeli left to believe. I realized that the Palestinians, who were willing to accept the need for peace with Israel, did so because Israel was strong. I realized that, contrary to the leftist views in Israel, which support the establishment of a Palestinian state because the Palestinians have a right (repeat: right) to sovereignty in their homeland, there is no such parallel Palestinian "left" that recognizes the right (repeat: right) of the Jewish people to sovereignty in its ancient homeland....

[font color = "red"]cont'd (read on, it becomes more hopeful)[/font]
http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/tr/contents/articles/originals/2014/03/palestine-israel-mutual-recognition-wilf-dajani-daoudi.html#

[aranthus]

1. This is the important part of the article

This is what the author and her Palestinian counterpart agreed to:

"The Jewish people around the world and Palestinian people around the world are both indigenous to the Land of Israel/Palestine and therefore have an equal and legitimate right to settle and live anywhere in the Land of Israel/Palestine, but given the desire of both peoples to a sovereign state that would reflect their unique culture and history, we believe in sharing the land between a Jewish state, Israel, and an Arab state, Palestine, that would allow them each to enjoy dignity and sovereignty in their own national home. Neither Israel nor Palestine should be exclusively for the Jewish and Palestinian people respectively and both should accommodate minorities of the other people."

Who else will join us in our journey to find true partners on both sides?

[font color=blue]I will. Any other takers on this board?[/font]


Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/tr/contents/articles/originals/2014/03/palestine-israel-mutual-recognition-wilf-dajani-daoudi.html##ixzz2wSScYBkM

[shira]

2. I second that. It's a wonderful statement. n/t

[shira]

6. I suspect there are no takers among our opponents here. n/t

[aranthus]

7. We shall see. n/t

[shira]

17. It's not happening. Our opponents, at best, support 2 states....

One that is Palestinian and 100% Jew-free.

Another that is bi-national.

There's your 2 states.

The old Arafat phased plan. Not surprising in the least. Only surprising if they acknowledge what their true intentions are.

[aranthus]

22. They've said everything anyone needs to know about them. n/t

[shira]

23. Yep, the rest is hot air. n/t

[Israeli]

24. Hot air is what you and Einat Wilf ....

....are blowing shira .

Next you will be trying to convince me that Ehud Barak is a Leftist

" He deserves it

"An embarrassing moment was registered yesterday, at the memorial rally for the late Prime Minister Rabin. When Defence Minister Ehud Barak rose to speak, loud whistling and booing were heard in the audience" (Yediot Aharonot, November 8, 2009.)

He deserves it. For daring to come there and address a crowd of peace-seekers, Ehud Barak should be noted down in the Guinness Book of Records. With a record level of chutzpah to his name, or of mendacity. Or both."

http://adam-keller2.blogspot.co.il/2009/11/he-deserves-it.html


A Flash Presentation of Barak's "Generous Offers"
@

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/downloads/baraks_offers/barak_eng.swf

[shira]

25. Rabin would have enthusiastically endorsed Wilf's statement. Why not you?

"The Jewish people around the world and Palestinian people around the world are both indigenous to the Land of Israel/Palestine and therefore have an equal and legitimate right to settle and live anywhere in the Land of Israel/Palestine, but given the desire of both peoples to a sovereign state that would reflect their unique culture and history, we believe in sharing the land between a Jewish state, Israel, and an Arab state, Palestine, that would allow them each to enjoy dignity and sovereignty in their own national home. Neither Israel nor Palestine should be exclusively for the Jewish and Palestinian people respectively and both should accommodate minorities of the other people."

Who else will join us in our journey to find true partners on both sides?

[Israeli]

26. Rabin would have said .....

stop blowing hot air shira .... like a propeller

( ...he really meant "ventilators", an instrument that turns around itself, making noise and not producing anything )

ref : http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/avnery/archives_article71/

[shira]

27. Would you have agreed w/ that statement during the 90's when Rabin was alive? n/t

Last edited Wed Mar 26, 2014, 08:02 PM - Edit history (1)

[shira]

8. Who else here agrees with this statement? Anyone? Hello? n/t

[Israeli]

3. :laughing:

Einat Wilf is a Leftist ..... since when ?

" This week one of their prominent representatives participated in the press conference where a fresh ideological movement was announced, and proved that redemption will certainly not come from those quarters. The titles, proven successes and impressive resume won't help. There's no such thing as a successful politician without a clear-cut worldview, honesty and courage.

She sat there as a striking ornament beside Edud Barak, wearing giant earrings, articulate, elegant, impressive in her appearance, young, educated and promising. And then the air went out of any promise she had. Named by Forbes magazine as one of the world's most promising young women, she turned out to be a major phony while still a political rookie.

MK Dr. Einat Wilf turned out to be nothing more than an ordinary hack. If we once had an MK-electrician from Ashkelon who sold his soul for a Mitsubishi, this time it was the MK and Ph.D. holder, graduate of the Insead business school, who sold her soul to head a minor committee in the Knesset. Between Wilf and Alex Goldfarb there is only one line, the line of opportunism.

Two lost years, 40 lost years, and the academic promise of the alleged left is in no hurry. The left? Wilf explained that she is heading for the mythical center. Labor is too left wing for her. Benjamin Ben-Eliezer is post-modern, Isaac Herzog is post-Zionist, as Barak put it. So be it.

Who needs young people like Wilf, conservative and opportunistic. Their predecessors are enough.

An ideological fellow of Orit Noked? A partner to the philosophy of Shalom Simhon? A year in the Knesset, and she's already been a member of two factions. And not a single interesting initiative, beyond calling for the removal of Yitzhak Rabin's portrait from her faction's meeting room.

It was no coincidence that Wilf once said in a Haaretz interview that she admired Abba Eban and Benjamin Netanyahu. They're also graduates of the right universities and masters of hollow rhetoric.

The new politics that Wilf is offering is disturbing: free of any worldview, burnished with cliches about "Zionism" and "vision," "education" and "future."

Its proponents don't like the "endless rehashing of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict," as Wilf put it. They want high-tech, nanotechnology, prosperity and progress, and above all - success and staying away from the mouth of the volcano.

Neither the occupation nor the destruction of democracy, neither the social rifts nor the racism disturbs them: That wasn't taught at Fontainebleau's Insead or practiced at McKinsey. "

Source: http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/redemption-won-t-come-from-israel-s-young-success-stories-1.338049

[azurnoir]

5. Here she is in an op-ed for Israel Hayom

http://www.israelhayom.com/site/newsletter_opinion.php?id=6691

I can see why she is beloved by some here that along with with being NGO Monitor but still she's no Leftist

[Mosby]

9. That was an ugly hit piece by Levy

He comes off really hateful and bitter about something, does he have a problem with successful women?

[Israeli]

10. Nope ....

he has a problem with liars Mosby.

So does Peace Now who uninvited her from a Peace Now conference on the grounds that she serves on the International Advisory Council of NGO Monitor.

NGO Monitor is a self-appointed watchdog group that looks in to the operation of Israel’s non-profits, mainly those on the left. It is highly critical of many of the groups, including Yesh Din and B’Tselem, close allies of Peace Now, and constantly criticizes them .

As for " successful " ....she went with Barak and his Ha'Atzma'ut party they defined themselves as Centralists .......great success that was

She is not a Leftist Mosby .....but she sure has shira fooled ...or does she ?

[Mosby]

11. Why did she join Labor then?

was that a trick or something?

She went to Harvard, then Cambridge where she earned a PhD, worked for Shimon Perez, won an MK spot and has written three books. She seems like a very successful women to me.

[shira]

13. She's a liberal. To the far Left, that means rightwing along with Republican conservatives...

The far Left Stalinists and the far Right brownshirt fascists both hate liberals.

It's hard these days telling the extreme bozos apart.

[Israeli]

15. Avoda are far Left now shira ....

....

You should ask those that she badmouthed when she left the party and joined Barak what they think of her .... they would not be as polite as Gideon Levy I assure you .

Here is what it means to be a Leftist in Israel shira ....

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/archive/1382094685/

So you are an American liberal are you ?
Good to know ... now I'm beginning to understand some of the comments on here directed towards Liberal Zionists .

[shira]

16. According to Avnery's definition, Wilf is leftist.

According to certain leftists here, none of Israel's old Labor were leftists - from Ben Gurion to Rabin.

So who gives FF?

[Israeli]

19. She went with Barak shira ...

http://forward.com/articles/134817/in-abandoning-the-labor-party-barak-solidifies-coa/

Most agree that by leaving the Labor Party, which he led, before it left him and committing himself to stay with the right-wing government led by Netanyahu, Barak has significantly strengthened Netanyahu’s hand. Four other Labor Party Knesset members followed Barak into his new party, and the guarantee of the new party’s continued presence as part of Netanyahu’s ruling coalition strengthens the coalition’s survival, even if the remaining Labor Party members go into opposition, as expected.

Since Barak’s return to politics in 2004, the left has become increasingly uncomfortable with him. He was immensely successful in business during his absence from politics, and the media drew much attention to his reported love for extravagance. This was often reported alongside his seeming lack of interest in the economic troubles of Labor’s working-class voters and the party’s left-wing social agenda. Barak’s spending habits made news most memorably in 2009, when the State Comptroller’s office revealed that he had spent $128,000 of state money during a visit by him and his entourage to the Paris Air Show — compared to $33,000 that was spent the previous year.

Criticism of Barak has been especially intense over his involvement in approving Israeli Jewish settlement-building projects in the occupied West Bank and his role in the Gaza military operation of 2008–2009. Much of the left, including lawmakers from Labor, opposed his decision to enter Netanyahu’s coalition after the 2009 general election and have since scorned him for failing to push forward the peace process.

In recent months, the left’s political distaste toward Barak has grown to personal distaste toward him felt by many across the political spectrum. “Lately he is perceived as a person who has very low emotional intelligence; he is perceived as a person who doesn’t know how to deal with people, but doesn’t care,” said pollster Camil Fuchs, a Tel Aviv University statistician.

......into the political wilderness .

[shira]

20. But there is nothing in Avnery's definition that would exclude Wilf from being on the Left. n/t

[King_David]

21. Comments like this?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=57842

[Israeli]

14. She didn't stay long now did she ?

Nobody said she wasn't a successful women Mosby .... that was your dig at Gideon Levy ...you should read all of his article again . It says it all about how she is viewed by the Israeli Left .
She has been anything but a successful politician .....and she is not a Leftist .

[shira]

18. What do u find offensive in Wilf's statement about 2 states?

"The Jewish people around the world and Palestinian people around the world are both indigenous to the Land of Israel/Palestine and therefore have an equal and legitimate right to settle and live anywhere in the Land of Israel/Palestine, but given the desire of both peoples to a sovereign state that would reflect their unique culture and history, we believe in sharing the land between a Jewish state, Israel, and an Arab state, Palestine, that would allow them each to enjoy dignity and sovereignty in their own national home. Neither Israel nor Palestine should be exclusively for the Jewish and Palestinian people respectively and both should accommodate minorities of the other people."

Who else will join us in our journey to find true partners on both sides?

What's wrong with this?



You think Rabin would have rejected this? I don't.

[aranthus]

28. Israeli's non-answer speaks volumes. n/t

[azurnoir]

4. Einat Wilf is a member of the Rightwing NGO Monitor she is no Leftist

http://www.ngo-monitor.org/article/dr_einat_wilf_joins_ngo_monitor_s_international_advisory_board

[shira]

12. She'd easily be a liberal democrat here in the USA if elected to office.

The problem today is that far left marxists and communists have hijacked what it means to be left. They would argue that Kennedy and Moynahan, if alive today, are right-wingers or neo-cons.