Lauder to ‘Post’: World now knows Abbas doesn’t want peace

[Fozzledick]

World Jewish Congress says: "The American government gets it...Abbas couldn't have done more to destroy peace process.”

The international community now sees and understands that the Palestinian Authority does not want peace, World Jewish Congress president Ronald Lauder told The Jerusalem Post on Thursday.
...
“This is one of the times when people realize what’s really happening and there is no question about it,” Lauder said. “How can Israel negotiate with an organization that wants its destruction?” Lauder, who is well connected with many world leaders, said the overwhelming sentiment among his contacts was support for Israel.

“Last night I was calling around from country to country, group to group, also within the US, to see what’s happening. There was no one I came across that said, ‘You know, it’s a good thing.’ Even the most left[- wing] groups.”

“Many times people have been critical of Israel and the peace process. What I heard last night was very different. I think the most important aspect is people get it, and the American government gets it, which is important. They realize that Abbas could not have done more to destroy the peace process.”

http://www.jpost.com/Diplomacy-and-Politics/Lauder-to-Post-World-now-knows-Abbas-doesnt-want-peace-350408

[DetlefK]

1. Bulldozing palestinian farms, forcing the inhabitants to flee, stealing their land ...

... and replacing them with israeli settlers is no way any hindrance to negotiations and instead a sign that Israel is fully committed to live peacefully alongside the Palestinians.

[King_David]

2. That happened during the negotiations?

Ok link the part that Israel "bulldozed Palestinian farms"--- go for it please.

No wonder American people support Israel in everything,there's so much blanket inaccurate hyperbole from you guys against the Jewish state that when real injustice is perpetrated nobody believes it.

[Violet_Crumble]

7. Yes, that's happened during the negotiations...

On Aug. 19, according to OCHA, Israel destroyed all the structures in the East Jerusalem Palestinian community of Tel al-Adassa. The same week, Israel re-demolished the Palestinian village of Araqib, in southern Israel, as it has done more than 50 times since 2010. On Sept. 11, Israel bulldozed almost all the structures in the West Bank herding community of Az Zayyim, rendering dozens of people homeless. Days later, Israel demolished all the homes of the village of Mak-hul in the Jordan Valley, and declared its ruins a closed military area, preventing the villagers' return.

And so it goes — a litany of catastrophes occurring on a small scale, in communities you have never heard of, all the year round.

These acts of eradication are a matter of routine practice, so routine that they rarely attract international media attention. Neither does the regular vandalizing, bulldozing or burning of Palestinian-owned olive trees , either by Jewish settlers — who generally act with legal impunity — or by the Israeli army.


http://www.latimes.com/opinion/commentary/la-oe-makdisi-settlements-israel-palestinians-kerr-20131118,0,1866660.story#ixzz2zwXAgHLK

[King_David]

8. Sep 11 ?

Last edited Fri Apr 25, 2014, 11:11 PM - Edit history (1)

Which farm ?

[Jefferson23]

29. The LA Times is not good enough either? Who should confirm this, the Israeli government? n/t

[Violet_Crumble]

56. Don't you get it? Bulldozed communities aren't farms!!

Just like bulldozed shelters the UN has built for Palestinians AREN'T FARMS!!! It has to be a farm, the farm has to have a cute name like Sunny Pastures, and there's got to be at least five alpacas and some chickens for it to be accepted as a farm. Plus it needs to be published on the reputable and trustworthy voice of the settler movement, PMW. Otherwise it's all anti-Semitic hyperbole designed to make people hate Israel!!!

[Jefferson23]

61. Silly me...I keep forgetting the important things. I better get with it. n/t

[azurnoir]

3. here are some examples but we'll be told they are not true or some such because they

did not come from Israeli sources

Israel bulldozes Palestinian homes, mosque Published Wednesday, March 26, 2014

Israeli occupation forces razed on Wednesday an East Jerusalem building that consisted of a medical center, a mosque and two apartments housing 11 people, local media reported.

The destruction of building was the latest in a series of almost daily demolitions carried out by Israel under the pretext of building without a permit.

But activists see the demolitions as part of a strategic effort by the occupation authorities to evict Palestinians from their homes to clear the land for the rapidly expanding Jewish settlements, considered illegal under international law.

Witnesses cited by Palestinian news agency Ma'an said occupation forces stormed the building, located in occupied East Jerusalem's al-Tur neighborhood, early Wednesday morning and forced everyone out before bulldozers got to work.

http://english.al-akhbar.com/node/19158

Settlers bulldoze Palestinian lands near Nablus to expand outpost

Israeli settlers on Thursday bulldozed private Palestinian lands near the northern West Bank village of Jalud south of Nablus in order to expand an illegal settlement outpost, a Palestinian Authority official said.

Ghassan Daghlas, a PA official who monitors settlement activities in the northern West Bank, told Ma'an that settlers from the Shvut Rachel outpost had decided to expand their illegal settlement at the expense of nearby private Palestinian landowners.

The fields that were leveled belong to Ahmad Ibrahim Hajj Muhammad, he added.

Daghlas said that the Israeli government had granted the settlers construction licenses.

http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=677160

[King_David]

4. Maan?

LOL

[azurnoir]

5. yep Ma'an but thank you for proving my point :)

[Jefferson23]

6. Exactly, there are no Palestinian publications worthy of trust for some. n/t

[King_David]

9. Maan publishes the most antiSemitic

Jew hating vitriol. ( not Israeli but Jew) essays and what happens here?

This putrid hateful bigoted Jew hating publication is supported and continues to be used as a reliable source ?

Fuck Maan and their hate on Jews .

[Jefferson23]

10. No actually, they don't. You made clear there are no Palestinian publications

that you trust, period. So even without Ma'an, you would not name one you do trust, they are after all,
Palestinian.

[King_David]

21. Maan Jewish hatefest , just a sampling:

The website of Palestinian news agency Maan published an article "proving" that those fabricated documents were authentic, and the Palestinian Authority's television channel said the Jews were planning to corrupt the Muslims "through women and wine" – a strategy which also originates in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.



http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4481095,00.html

[Jefferson23]

23. A report from the Israeli government and they do not link nor print the alleged offense.

Your sampling is pathetic.

As you have made clear, there are no Palestinian publications that you trust.

Ma'an, same as all the Israeli publications that you do trust, have offensive comments/editorials
and they are not removed. Your focus is Palestinian publications..I get that.

[King_David]

25. I know which publications I don't trust

The Jew hating bigoted essay is still up on maan , supporting such a publication is not surprising, that's exactly what this debate is all about and such essays do get them support for their "cause".

That's the number one reason for Palestinian support in Europe and with a large segment of USA supporters who never heard of Palestine before but were attracted to messages such as this.

You can use Rense as a source too but people must know what we dealing with.

[Jefferson23]

27. Bigoted comments and editorials, all publications that are Israeli and otherwise you are fine with.

You have not abandoned those sources, and I will remind you, Ma'an is not and never has been
banned here on DU and for good reason. Is that your new objective now?

You are trying so hard to draw an exception for Ma'an while you have no issue with
Israeli publications doing the same thing.

[azurnoir]

17. Really so much so that Times of Israel uses them as a source?

http://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-jets-hit-gaza-during-unity-deal-celebrations/

[King_David]

20. Maans Hatred of Jews is acceptable to half the people posting here:

The website of Palestinian news agency Maan published an article "proving" that those fabricated documents were authentic, and the Palestinian Authority's television channel said the Jews were planning to corrupt the Muslims "through women and wine" – a strategy which also originates in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.



http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4481095,00.html

[azurnoir]

35. here is a short list off the times Ynet has cited Maan as a source recently

Hamas to PA: End cooperation with Israel - Israel News, Ynetnews
Apr 8, 2014 ... Hamas spokesman Fawzi Barhoun told Maan that Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas should take advantage of Netanyahu's move and ...
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4508729,00.html

Obama backs Kerry's peace efforts as talks falter - Israel News ...
Apr 4, 2014 ... ... Lapid, said he questioned whether Abbas wanted a deal, pointing to a lengthy list of Palestinian demands published on Maan news agency.
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4506934,00.html

Palestinians publish new list of demands: PM must agree to East ...
Apr 2, 2014 ... ... the meeting as a "fierce political battle", with Martin Indyk struggling to control heated exchanges between both sides, Maan reported.
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4506655,00.html

Kerry speaks to Netanyahu, Abbas after prisoner release canceled ...
Apr 2, 2014 ... The source described the meeting as a "fierce political battle," with Indyk struggling to control heated exchanges between both sides, Maan ...
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4506743,00.html

Israel says it is cancelling prisoner release - Israel News, Ynetnews
Apr 2, 2014 ... The sources, Maan reportedly described the meeting as a "fierce political battle", with Martin Indyk struggling to control heated exchanges ...
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4506663,00.html

Palestinians: Israel refused to free Barghouti as part of deal - Israel ...
Mar 31, 2014 ... According to Maan, Israel rejected Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas' request that it free Fatah official Marwan Barghouti, ...
www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4505791,00.html

http://www.ynetnews.com/home/0,7340,L-3341,00.html?sort=date&cx=partner-pub-5997776081861329%3A2132506582&cof=FORID%3A10&ie=UTF-8&q=Maan&sa=Search&mainSearchGoogle=Ynetnews&siteurl=www.ynetnews.com%2Fhome%2F0%2C7340%2CL-3083%2C00.html&ref=&ss=&siteurl=www.ynetnews.com%2Fhome%2F0%2C7340%2CL-3083%2C00.html&ref=&ss=

[King_David]

36. How does that clear maan publishing antiSemitic filth? nt

[azurnoir]

37. So your claiming that JPost, Ynet, ToI, Haaretz all use an antisemitic site as a source?

that's so fantastical it actually boggles

nothing to clear it was an LTTE which Maan printed a disclaimer too also charges of incitement on the part of Palestinian Media were tossed quite uncerimoniously out of Israeli courts

[King_David]

38. Court case had nothing to do with this filth they published

Which is still up on their site.
There's been a few times that maan has printed antiSemitic Jew hatred , some they retracted and removed.

The court case was about a different episode... I know it's confusing but maan keeps publishing this hateful Jew baiting bigoted shit.

[azurnoir]

39. Nope nothing here is confusing at all

especially the failed attempt to negate Palestinian news sources

[King_David]

40. Oh I think maan speaks for itself

No need for help from me.

They partake and publish in hateful anti Jewish filth.

This may not be important to half of the posters in this forum but since it was not directed towards them .

But as a Jew I take offense to publishing filth and hate directed toward me and my family and friends.

[azurnoir]

41. so the letter to the editor in Maan was directed at you?

you represent all Jews?, because gosh so does Lauder, unless of course you and Lauder are like minded?

[King_David]

43. That makes no sense but yes it was directed at me

And Lauder and Chomsky and J Street .

They published hate against all Jews.

This is not a new phenomenon in the world, the Protocols have been published many times through history and millions of Jews have died.

[azurnoir]

44. If it made no sense why did you reply?

oh that's right to complain about an LTTE again

[Jefferson23]

49. Wow..JStreet and Lauder and Chomsky are on the level of the Protocols? Link that please.

One for each of your accused.

[King_David]

50. The protocols hate printed in maan

Is aimed at all Jews .

What link are you talking about.

[azurnoir]

51. why do refuse to acknowledge what is was a LttE ? one that Maan posted a disclaimer to?

Is it that if full disclosure of facts is acknowledged it becomes less demonizing?

[Jefferson23]

54. Deception is the name of that game. n/t

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

73. Without question. Was it ever in question in the fist place.

But let's not discuss the real evils in Israel aimed at the continued ethnic cleansing of the Palestinian people.

The hasbaristas are having a tough time of it lately. I'm surprised that I/P isn't being plastered to and fro with articles of Israeli Beauty Queens and feel good stories to divert attention.

Why some have grabbed onto this Ma'an LttE, with disclaimer, and won't let go, after constantly being corrected, is purely comical in nature.

[Jefferson23]

88. Some will be fooled by it, it is a percentage game. Anyone interested can read the thread and see

the non-responses, the lack of links. The heavy reliance on avoiding to answer questions etc by him
are all there.

[Jefferson23]

52. Do you imagine people who read your posts that state claims are invisible?

Your nonsense about Ma'an aside, where is your evidence backing up your claims
about Lauder, Chomsky and JStreet.

I would appreciate a link to each accused.

[King_David]

57. Maans hateful publication of The Protocols of the a elders of Zion filth

Is directed toward every single Jew in the world including Lauder , Myself , Chomsky and J-street .

The protocols if the elders of Zion is not selective in the hate toward Jews ... There's no Seleksia among good Jews or bad Jews ... It's hate of ALL Jews ( Most definitely and 100% no link required --- that's AntiSemitism )

[Jefferson23]

60. You are relying on a link in Arabic, and refuse to provide a translation as you know

when you rely on Google for translation, it amounts to gibberish.

You have yet to provide anything to back up your claims. The only translated page has
been through Itamar Marcus, the bigoted settler living in the OPT, affiliated with Palwatch.

Itamar Marcus was completely discredited recently by an Israeli judge so his translation
should be met with skepticism. Nevertheless, if the letter to the editor is offensive and it
may very well be, it does not support your contention.

You also ignored the link you were offered backing up the post in #1, which was to
the LA Times. Ma'an has no more bigoted comments than Haaretz and Ynet, JPost.
Those publications you continue to rely on..no problem for you....your only exception is Palestinian publications,
it is a fact you ignore, at your will. You ignore the disclaimer from Ma'an, they have the same disclaimer
as the Israeli publications, again, a disclaimer you ignore, but after all, they are Palestinians.

When asked you would not name one Palestinian publication you find reliable...none.

You expect to be taken seriously without any evidence to your claims, and you're confused, explanations
and links are required, most especially when you use scurrilous methods to achieve your goal.

It is amusing to read your posts, although I doubt that was your intention.

You're up a creek without a paddle and it seems you have dug yourself in so deep that you feel
obligated to repeat falsehoods whenever Ma'an is mentioned...interesting deceptive practices.

[King_David]

67. I think google translate gives enough info

To any fair minded person reading the essay published by maan to realize it's antiSemitic filth . Despite all the other noise in your posts. Anti Jewish hate should never be supported on a website such as DU which supports the Democratic Party ... A party with deep Jewish roots and involvement .

[Jefferson23]

68. Then post the translation. The only noise is coming from you, and your refusal to answer

questions and supply evidence to your claims. You have supplied nothing, thus far.

You do not speak for all Jews, not by a long shot, although you seem to imagine that you do.

[King_David]

69. The Protocols of the Elders of Zion

Is a filthy hateful attack on every single Jew worldwide no matter who speaks for us.

[King_David]

70. The Protocols of the Elders of Zion

Is a filthy hateful attack on every single Jew worldwide no matter who speaks for us.

Link to hateful essay:

Use google translate...

http://www.maannews.net/arb/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=672533

[Jefferson23]

71. Games and deceptions, no English translation from you. ok.

Clearly, there is a good reason you will not post your evidence in English.

Shameful tactics you have used here.

[King_David]

75. Ever heard of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion?

That's the shit Maan published .

WTF asking for an English translation ?

Not surprised , for shame .

(HINT : It's no accident no ones rushing to your defense here)

[Violet_Crumble]

77. Ma'an didn't publish The Protocols of the Elders of Zion...

And I think it's very reasonable to ask for English translations of something when people can't read Arabic and have no other way of knowing what it says. Not sure why yr so outraged that someone's asking for it. I'd post the translation here, except then you might start calling DU a vile, Jewish hating site for publishing it, or some crap like that. So I'll post the translation link, but I'm not sure if it'll work and it's a pretty shit translation from the look of it coz it makes little sense...

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/BV.aspx?ref=IE8Activity&a=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.maannews.net%2Farb%2FViewDetails.aspx%3FID%3D672533

From the little sense I could make of it, the author appears to believe that the Protocols were real and freemason, masonic, satanic, blah blah blah. It's all a bit hard to make out with the translation.

What no-one should have any problem making out is that fucking prominent disclaimer at the top of the page. Articles and opinions posted reflect the opinion of the author and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the site.

If this was written by an employee of Ma'an and wasn't a reader comment type thing, I'd be in total agreement about Ma'an as a source. But I've seen disturbing and bigoted reader comments in plenty of other publications, and in some cases Israeli ones. My preference is for media sources not to publish those sort of things, and unlike you, I don't turn a blind eye to bigoted comments when they're aimed at Muslims and Arabs, but not owning any media, I don't get to hold much sway there.

So, Ma'an as a news source is every bit as reputable as sources like Ha'aretz, imo. Greeting any news item with shrieks of 'but they published the Elders...' just comes across as rather silly and an attempt to discard the news without even bothering to think about it.

btw, not sure why you think Jefferson needs anyone to defend them. Yr the one who's been making accusations that have turned out to be incorrect...

[King_David]

79. It's not the first time Maan published extreme antiSemitic Jew hating filth

And has had to remove such after
" pressure " to do so.

This particular hateful Protocol garbage Jew hating filthy essay has been up on Maan for many months , and apparently they quite comfortable leaving it up there.

Maan has zero credibility as it's now been shot and exposed on more than one occasion.

[Violet_Crumble]

81. Instead of repeating the same thing over and over, why don't you read what was posted?

http://sync.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=62624

What's not sinking in for you? This was something a reader wrote, not an employee of Ma'an. And considering the disgusting anti-Arab/anti-Muslim poisonous reader comments in Israeli publications that you turn a blind eye to, it's not Ma'an that's got zero credibility, imo...

btw, I'm curious. Are there any Palestinian media sources you do find credible?

[King_David]

82. As I said it's not the 1st time

There's a pattern here.

[Violet_Crumble]

84. And as I said, you need to read the article in the post I linked to...

Or do you need me to type the whole thing out word for word for you? While I'm totally sure yr not interested in facts, DUers reading on would be, which is why I'm happy to sit here and patiently point out that not only are you ignoring information when it's given to you, but you have an entirely different attitude when Israeli media have allowed bigoted anti-Muslim/anti-Arab comments from their readers to appear.

You didn't answer my question about what Palestinian media sources you do trust. I take the silence as being that there's none, and it's solely because they're Palestinian, not for any other reason...

[Jefferson23]

83. Your deceptive practices to deceive may fool some, but not all. That is the problem

you face. You will not post it in English because you know it translates poorly to make
your point, which is..you decided to hold Ma'an, a Palestinian publication to a different
standard than Harretz, and Ynet, JPost, Times of Israel. One sees these offensive comments
on an almost daily basis on all these news sources, there is no pattern exclusive to Ma'an.
You make up false charges as you go along, regardless..your contempt for the Palestinians
is astonishing. You ignore all information located in post #77, post#81 On edit to add post# 58.
Evidently, you have been avoiding facts for a long time.

You are well aware that comments/editorials that are offensive remain at each of those
publications..each hold bias toward each other, often with stereotypical offensive language.
You take no issue with those publications, none...only Palestinian news sources.

Ma'an, you have decided, and all Palestinian publications cannot be trusted as a source,
and you think I need someone at DU to defend me?? You are funny, in a sad fashion.

This construct of yours is to grant yourself the trumped false sense of righteousness
to throw scurrilous charges against an entire people via the Palestinians media, Ma'an.


The bigoted settler, Itamar Marcus, attempted this very same thing in a lawsuit
in Israel and failed..you appear determined to pick up his cause for him.

I will remind you of post#60, you have refused to answer anything:

You are relying on a link in Arabic, and refuse to provide a translation as you know

when you rely on Google for translation, it amounts to gibberish.

You have yet to provide anything to back up your claims. The only translated page has
been through Itamar Marcus, the bigoted settler living in the OPT, affiliated with Palwatch.

Itamar Marcus was completely discredited recently by an Israeli judge so his translation
should be met with skepticism. Nevertheless, if the letter to the editor is offensive and it
may very well be, it does not support your contention.

You also ignored the link you were offered backing up the post in #1, which was to
the LA Times. Ma'an has no more bigoted comments than Haaretz and Ynet, JPost.
Those publications you continue to rely on..no problem for you....your only exception is Palestinian publications,
it is a fact you ignore, at your will. You ignore the disclaimer from Ma'an, they have the same disclaimer
as the Israeli publications, again, a disclaimer you ignore, but after all, they are Palestinians.

When asked you would not name one Palestinian publication you find reliable...none.

You expect to be taken seriously without any evidence to your claims, and you're confused, explanations
and links are required, most especially when you use scurrilous methods to achieve your goal.

It is amusing to read your posts, although I doubt that was your intention.

You're up a creek without a paddle and it seems you have dug yourself in so deep that you feel
obligated to repeat falsehoods whenever Ma'an is mentioned...interesting deceptive practices.

[King_David]

85. AntiSemitic bigoted hatred of Jews

Is "offensive " ???

That's what you think?

Well millions of Jews in history have perished and died because of this thing you describe as "offensive" .

[Jefferson23]

86. Deception is your game, over and over and over. Refusing to post evidence is deception.

Refusing to supply a response to questions is telling about you.

[Violet_Crumble]

87. Yes, it is offensive...

When people make bigoted comments, including anti-Semitism, it *is* offensive.

And as Jefferson points out, you never complain about bigoted comments that appear in Ha'aretz or any other Israeli publication.

[King_David]

91. It's a lot more than "offensive"

It's Israel's Raison d'être .

[Jefferson23]

72. Continued deceptions and no answers to all the other questions you were asked in post#60.

Very telling.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

74. Why not post it, dave, and drop the drama?

[Violet_Crumble]

64. I think I deciphered what Dave was saying...

It's kind of hard to tell with the weird punctuation and half finished sentences, but I think he was saying the hate is aimed at them as well...

[Jefferson23]

65. Yea, I misunderstood..but bizarre just the same. n/t

[Jefferson23]

48. His selective outrage, only Palestinian publications he has issues with..even though he knows the

sources he relies on do the same thing...which is leave offensive comments/editorials to remain.

[JDPriestly]

76. The misunderstandings and hatred of Israel on DU is appalling to me.

I grew up in the post-war period. I can't believe how ignorant DUers are of the reasons for the establishment of Israel as a Jewish state and the history of Palestine as part of the Ottoman Empire and then the British Protectorate. It is just astounding. It's as if some DUers do not know anything about the concentration camps and the Holocaust and the dilemma of Western allies after the war regarding how to do what would be right for the many orphans and survivors from the Holocaust. I cannot understand this callous attitude.

[Violet_Crumble]

78. The only misunderstanding is on yr part...

Probably before you decide yr going to sit there and call everyone else ignorant, you might want to read the actual thread yr posting in. A false accusation was made about Ma'an (that'd be the post you replied to), and instead of reading and finding out for yrself, you fling around some condescending stuff. See, I understand the reasons for the establishment of Israel, and am pretty well versed on the Holocaust, but you seem to think that such knowledge must equal unbending support of Israel, where criticism means you hate Israel. That's a very silly attitude for anyone with knowledge of those things to take, imo...

btw, here's a link to some information you should read before commenting any further.

http://sync.democraticunderground.com/113462527#post58

[King_David]

80. Exactly

It's clear to see on display right here.

[Violet_Crumble]

89. So if I don't agree with you about Ma'an, I hate Israel?

Wow...

[Jefferson23]

90. Former Israeli minister says public brainwashed about Abbas

snip*Former Labor party Minister Efraim Sneh at his office, 2014

The text of the interview follows:

Sneh: The Israeli public has undergone brainwashing in recent years, so that even if Abbas says something right, no one listens to him. This, in my view, is more of a failure of the opposition than an achievement by the government. I’m going to say something harsh, and I don’t care if I’m attacked for it: The propaganda and brainwashing that the Israeli public has undergone on the Palestinian issue are Goebbelsian in style . This is Goebbelsian propaganda.

Al-Monitor: Isn't this an exaggeration?

Sneh: I mean what I say. The people in Israel are brainwashed. They’ve simply been led to despair of peace and told that Mahmoud Abbas is the next thing after Antiochus. The anti-Palestinian propaganda is Goebbelsian propaganda. That’s the way it is. If an Israeli government minister says about Mahmoud Abbas that he’s the leader of the greatest terrorism on earth, what can one say? As we know, it was Abbas who, in the second intifada, spoke out very courageously against the violence and against Arafat. He has traditionally objected to violence. So the minute the public hears more and more of these things, it trickles down.

Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2014/04/efraim-sneh-mahmoud-abbas-brainwash-media-negotiations.html#ixzz300HNW65I

[JDPriestly]

92. By agreeing to unity with Hamas, Abbas made all of Sneh's statements into lies.

Hamas is a violent, terrorist organization. There is no way that Israel can negotiate with Hamas unless it changes its course and agrees to seek peace. Hamas is armed and ready to fight Israel. The rapprochement between Hamas and Abbas strongly suggests that in spite of his rhetoric, Abbas is seeking to sabotage the peace negotiations.

[Jefferson23]

93. Really? You stand with Bibi on that, the international community does not.

For your information Bibi has more than once negotiated with Hamas.

You might want to read the WH's response too.

The smartest move Abbas made so far was to sign those treaties, I hope he signs onto more
of them. Under international law, they deserve and have a legal right to a viable state, not
a Bantustan. You want peace, stop the settlements and get the hell out of the West Bank.
You want to end terror, begin there.

[King_David]

22. But a Bigoted Jew hating publication is acceptable to those in this forum

Who "support" the Palestinians because of -------?

One wonders what motivated a lot of people to support the Palestinian cause with such enthusiastic gusto that this becomes their cause célèbre . Witness Greta Berlin as a great example and multiple other extremist right wingers like her.

Here's maan again ...

The website of Palestinian news agency Maan published an article "proving" that those fabricated documents were authentic, and the Palestinian Authority's television channel said the Jews were planning to corrupt the Muslims "through women and wine" – a strategy which also originates in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.



http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4481095,00.html

[Jefferson23]

24. Not true about Ma'an. If anything, you keep making yourself clear about Palestinians

publications...you trust none of them.

[King_David]

26. The Jew Hating classic antiSemitic essay is still up on their site

http://www.maannews.net/arb/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=672533

It's no mistake, it attracts supporters to their cause. This is the reason BDS is gaining ground and the reason more people with no connection to Israel or Palestine are attracted to this conflict .

Jewish Hate finds common ground .

[Jefferson23]

30. Still peddling a non English translation I see. You don't want to rely on Itamar Marcus, the settler

living in the OPT for a translation?

Ma'an, is not banned on DU and never has been, is that your goal?

You have previously made clear there are no Palestinian publications you trust.

[King_David]

31. Google translate is adequate to get a taste of the Jew hateful essay. nt

[Jefferson23]

32. Then post the translation..why do you consistently refrain from doing that?

Itamar Marcus, the bigoted settler living in the OPT is the only website I am aware of who
has offered any translation.

There remains the fact that Ma'an is and always has been an accepted source for DU.

There remains the fact that the vast majority of Israel publications, that you rely on,
do not remove their offensive comments/editorials. They do the same as Ma'an, which
is to list a disclaimer but you single out a Palestinian publication and do not trust any
Palestinian publications..got it.

Interesting that you keep highlighting such nonsense.

[King_David]

33. You can translate it yourself

Google or Bing translate suffices.

The rest of your post is just noise and deflection.

The hate in that essay is directed against myself and my family -- fuck sure I take offense and so do American people and Democratic Party reps when Jews are attacked.

Extremist Jew hating usually right wingers wouldn't take offense or support such antiSemitic hateful bigoted tripe displayed in that essay.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

45. Now that's a classic line of BS, dave.

Accuse a source of being bad, then when pushed to prove it the offended screamer runs and hides from their responsibility.

Amateurish at best, dave.

[Jefferson23]

46. No, it is you avoiding to bring your evidence...no matter how often you are asked you refuse to

produce it. Asking for evidence is not deflection, I do not think you even understand the term.

Ma'an is falsely accused by you, and it is not a news source banned now nor at any time at DU,
for good reason.

You have no response to the fact that your sources, Israeli and otherwise, as long as they
are not Palestinian are fine with you..they allow bigoted comments to remain.

Your outrage rings hollow.

[azurnoir]

34. it's a letter to the editor and Maan posts a disclaimer to all of those

which might be why he doesn't want to translate it

[Jefferson23]

47. Yes, I think that is quite right.

[Violet_Crumble]

58. It is. Here's the disclaimer that Dave's ignored...

Articles and opinions posted reflect the opinion of the author and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of the site

That's why Dave didn't want to link to it. Not sure what he's doing in this thread, but my first impression was that it's some sort of clumsy attempt at Google-bombing coz he just repeats the same thing over and over and ignores what's been said in the post he's replying to.

Also, shaayecanaan posted some information long ago (Dave's been peddling this nonsense constantly for a long time) that's what actually happened, and unlike PMW, doesn't omit what doesn't fit into its agenda to portray Palestinians as raving anti-Semites. The author of the Daily Beast article is polite and describes it as omissions rather than the blatant dishonesty it was...

Having said that, it’s important to note that in its response to al-Shami’s post, PMW omitted or failed to obtain some relevant facts, most importantly that the post appeared in a subsection of Ma’an’s opinion pages reserved for the reading audience—sort of a long-form letters-to-the-editor section—and was not written by anyone on staff at Ma’an. The employee who allowed the post to appear was, of course, on Ma’an’s staff, and anyone who oversees the publication of vicious Holocaust denial (whether glorified letter-to-the-editor or not) certainly deserves censure. Yet it’s an important distinction to make.

Furthermore, PMW suggests a kind of duplicity on Ma’an’s part by noting that al-Shami’s post “was posted on Ma'an's Arabic website and not on its English site,” without also clarifying (or, possibly, knowing) that none of Ma’an’s opinion pieces appear in English translation. There’s no case-by-case decision to keep certain material from English-reading eyes; opinion pieces are exclusively in Arabic.

Another thing PMW got wrong, according to Raed Othman, CEO of Ma’an Network (which includes Ma’an News Agency, as well as television, video, and radio production), is the question of Ma’an’s funding. The headline of the PMW post reads “European-funded Ma'an published Holocaust denial,” but Othman reports that while the network did once depend on foreign donations, it’s been self-sustaining for three years, and today the only outside support goes toward training courses for journalists and the like.


- See more at: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/02/15/palestinians-need-to-learn-the-lesson-on-antisemitism.html#sthash.dGHvYd72.dpuf

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=33237

I find it telling how Dave doesn't have any problem with the vitriolic anti-Arab/Muslim hate posted in the comments sections of Israeli sources, and when there were calls to kill Palestinians posted on FB, his response was this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/113451529#post2

[Jefferson23]

62. Thank you! Excellent, and bookmarked. I appreciate it, Violet. n/t

[Violet_Crumble]

63. No worries. I expect it'll get ignored by some just like it did when shaay posted it n/t

[Jefferson23]

66. Yep, but I like documentation..I find it valuable..so thanks. n/t

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

11. You've been proven wrong by two posters, dave.

Last edited Sat Apr 26, 2014, 12:33 AM - Edit history (1)

Instead of acknowledging that fact you seemingly wish to double down on a 15 watt version of lulz.

And if that isn't creepy then what is?

[LuvLoogie]

55. It wasn't Israeli bulldozers...

It was rams' horns. And Palestinian olive groves are given to spontaneous combustion.

[Fozzledick]

12. As expected some people still don't get it

but will use any excuse to rationalize continuing the war.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

13. You just described yourself perfectly, fozzle.

You just don't get it. End Israeli apartheid now!

[Violet_Crumble]

14. I get that Lauder's anti-Obama and loves Netanyahu...

And he's consistently going to write dribble about how the Palestinians are war-mongering antagonists, while Israel is never wrong, and if it makes a mistake, it's only coz the timing's wrong coz those hateful Palestinians forced Israel to do what it does, blah blah fucking RW blah...

Lauder: That was bad timing. But the Israeli government has made extraordinary concessions: It has accepted the idea of a Palestinian state, a moratorium on settlement building, and it has removed over a hundred roadblocks in the West Bank.

SPIEGEL: And yet, that lip service to a two-state solution was only paid following pressure by Obama. As a close friend of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, aren't you biased?




Lauder: On this, I don't represent my friend, but Jews world-wide. I would have written the same letter if someone else were prime minister in Jerusalem. Over his attempts to engage the Muslim world, Obama has strongly neglected the relationship with Israel.


http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/world-jewish-congress-president-ronald-lauder-obama-has-strongly-neglected-the-relationship-with-israel-a-690417.html

Why anyone on a liberal forum like DU would expect that people would take shit this guy spews seriously is a bit mystifying to me.

As for 'continuing the war', have you happened to miss the many, many steps Israel has taken to ensure that any chance of peace is scuttled? The only peace Netanyahu wants is one that involves peace for Israel, and a future where the Palestinians don't have their own state, or security, or peace...

[Fozzledick]

42. Two perfect examples.

[Violet_Crumble]

59. Yr replying to yrself, so can I ask what yr talking about?

What's the two 'perfect examples' and what are they examples of would be a good start...

[Violet_Crumble]

15. Is anyone else wondering what Lauder considers to be the world?

Because if as I suspect he's confining it to the US he's in for a bit of a shock when he sees that there's a lot of support for unification amongst the Palestinian factions which leads to future negotiations with someone who speaks on behalf of all the Palestinian people...

[King_David]

16. As with anything else,

Yes there is a big world out there but the USA is the most important player out there with everything basically .

That's just the way it is .

The baseball yearly competition is called the World Series ( I guess this world includes Canada )

[Scootaloo]

18. By that logic, Gabriela Isler is the most attractive woman in the universe

After all, she's "Miss Universe!" it must be true!

Even if we shrink "world" down to the United States, Lauder's still full of shit, and is trying to present his own war-boner as the certified (Rather than certifiable) opinion of the US.

[King_David]

19. Wasn't defending Lauders position on anything ,

He's a completely different story and not a good choice for the position he's now holding .

I was explaining that the USA is the most important player in the world.

[elfin]

28. I now think NEITHER side wants peace because

They can get so much more money and attention from their various benefactors if the conflict threatens to go "hot" at any minute.

Instability with renumeration is their status quo. Peace may actually seem threatening to them in a perverse way. Am sick and done with BOTH sides.

If a natural disaster wiped out all the "holy" sites, they would fight to the death over waves in the sea.

[Harry_Scrote]

53. Extreme people on each side care not about peace.

I used to get bullied. A lot. And so I get why some would have a knee jerk reaction to what is perceived as anti-semitic writing on the web, in the news etc.

The only way I learned how to cope with bullies is to stop being a victim to them. And that meant changing how I saw myself relative to the perceived bully. I pointed at my bullies and told them they were such. But then I stopped complaining about them to my peers and family. I resisted their bullying attempts merely by stopping them when they tried to push me down. I took martial arts. I learned how to stand up to them without becoming bullyish myself.

I stopped complaining and started resisting. Peaceful protest, to me, makes more sense than constant complaint about anti-semitism. Shine a light on your bullies, fine. But be careful, because it's a fine line until you risk being perceived as a victim with which no one knows how to help you.