HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Topics » Foreign Affairs & National Security » Israel/Palestine (Group) » How Israel Stole Land

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 07:42 PM

How Israel Stole Land

16 replies, 1875 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 16 replies Author Time Post
Reply How Israel Stole Land (Original post)
Galraedia Aug 2014 OP
orpupilofnature57 Aug 2014 #1
Loudly Aug 2014 #2
orpupilofnature57 Aug 2014 #3
Post removed Aug 2014 #4
orpupilofnature57 Aug 2014 #5
Name removed Aug 2014 #9
NRaleighLiberal Aug 2014 #6
Aerows Aug 2014 #15
2naSalit Aug 2014 #7
Agschmid Aug 2014 #8
kayecy Aug 2014 #10
orpupilofnature57 Aug 2014 #11
kayecy Aug 2014 #12
orpupilofnature57 Aug 2014 #14
Igel Aug 2014 #13
kayecy Aug 2014 #16

Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 07:45 PM

1. The alloy of history, SPIN .

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 07:47 PM

2. It's not OK but it is.

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Loudly (Reply #2)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 08:11 PM

3. Good example !!!!

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Galraedia (Original post)


Response to Post removed (Reply #4)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 08:42 PM

5. Welcome, " certain people " ?

 

1st post syndrome ? Disgruntled ? OR A TROLL?????????

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to orpupilofnature57 (Reply #5)


Response to Post removed (Reply #4)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 08:48 PM

6. off to chew on some eucalyptus leaves? that's a curious entrance you made...

"allow"?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NRaleighLiberal (Reply #6)

Tue Aug 5, 2014, 12:30 AM

15. I know

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Post removed (Reply #4)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 08:51 PM

7. Indeed...

Certain people shouldnt even be posting here.

Perhaps you fit in that category.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Post removed (Reply #4)

Sun Aug 3, 2014, 08:58 PM

8. Oh boy.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Mon Aug 4, 2014, 03:06 AM

10. To get back to the message in the clip.......

To get back to the message in the clip.......is it spin, lies or near-truth?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kayecy (Reply #10)

Mon Aug 4, 2014, 07:31 AM

11. MSM (Misanthropic Sycophant Monsters)

 

Playing with Smoke and mirrors to create a narrative, which is their only agenda .

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to orpupilofnature57 (Reply #11)

Mon Aug 4, 2014, 07:36 AM

12. I am genuinely interested in your view..............

Your version of how things developed post 1917 is what?........I am genuinely interested in how friends of Israel see the past. Biblical right to Palestine?.........Jews deserved a homeland?.......It was the Palestinians fault?.........It was all Britain's fault?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kayecy (Reply #12)

Mon Aug 4, 2014, 07:37 PM

14. It is and has been since 1948 OUR fault US

 

Last edited Mon Aug 4, 2014, 08:09 PM - Edit history (1)

We interpreted the bible to the world, the right of Jews to Israel, Vilifying Palestinians, and without our support Britain would have been in no position to parcel out land to people without legal claim . American Jews and American media facilitated by the American government, SPUN off of WWII atrocities a new nation and a new people, Israelites, Not the Jewish people of the bible .

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Galraedia (Original post)

Mon Aug 4, 2014, 10:24 AM

13. Fast forward a century.

There are millions of illegal immigrants in the US. Probably just more illegal immigrants from Thailand than Jewish immigrants in your video.

How much land have they stolen? Because if they've been stealing land--going in with firearms or even just with sticks and driving the owners off the land in order to claim it for their own, that's something law enforcement and the FBI should be all over. And the legal immigrants ... getting their 1/2 acre or whatever upon entering the country! All that land going from citizens and residents to immigrants.

Doesn't work that way, does it? Immigrant =/= illegal seizure of land. Something else is needed. Like the actual illegal seizure of land. At the time, of course, there was a problem in Palestine. It was illegal for Jews to own land. They often didn't know it and would "buy" land only to have their deeds revoked. Dumb immigrants, being taken advantage of like that (and we act like only racist Americans do such things). The Jews set up some front organizations or got Palestinians to buy land for them, but the latter was dangerous because the Palestinians might face execution as a result. In one case, a "settlement" in Gaza, Jews bought a piece of land in the '30s and lost it. They re-bought it but lost it during the Egyptian occupation of Gaza. Then they bought it a third time after '67 and, well, Hamas took it when the Israeli government forced the 'settlers' to leave because under Palestinian laws Jews still can't legally own that land, even if they paid for it three times.

For the serious "taking of Palestinian land" you have to look at two main events. The first was the assumption of state ownership of state-held lands when Israel declared independence; this land had been held by the Ottoman Turks, then taken over by the British, so I'm not sure it could be described as "Palestinian" in a legal sense, even though the locals treated it often as their own. Under Ottoman law a kind of squat-farming on one type of state-owned land was permitted, with ownership granted to the person who used the land for agricultural purposes for so many years. The result was that the Ottomans would go in and destroy the groves or crops to preserve state ownership if it was land they wanted to keep.

The second was the confiscation of land owned by Palestinians no longer in residence after they fled or were expelled. This was precisely mirrored by what happened to Jewish land and real property under the Jordanian and Egyptian occupied territories after Jews fled or were expelled.

This is still the primary way of confiscating land for new settlements, with a wrinkle. The Ottoman deed system was a nightmare and *nobody* has really fixed it in some parts of Israel. Often there are competing deeds. In some cases land was fraudulently sold to Jews and the sale revoked after a new deed issued. In others, the land was fraudulently sold to Arabs and a fake deed issued. Deeds were produced for private ownership of state-owned lands, but the paperwork not actually valid. Absentee owners might own land and sell it, while local felaheen seemed to own it and would sell the same land. The Jordanians transferred property for which deeds already existed. This was a society where corruption was (and still is) rampant and often not seen to be a moral problem unless it's publicly exposed, and often considered a virtue if it helps your family/clan or hurts the hated Jew (or other hated group). Even Hamas' anti-corruption campaigns hurt primarily non-Hamasians with the occasional Hamas figure that needs purging, and would probably celebrate the defrauding some groups. As governments came and went, they often transferred property without properly invalidating the deeds of those not sitting on the land.

But this is just ownership of land. Don't confuse ownership of land with control over territory by a sovereign state. As "all" of the territory held by Israel became Israeli and presumably under the control of a Jewish state, much was still owned by Arabs.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Igel (Reply #13)

Tue Aug 5, 2014, 01:02 AM

16. Not so fast.....

"There are millions of illegal immigrants in the US. Probably just more illegal immigrants from Thailand than Jewish immigrants in your video."

Yes there are, but the the US was almost uninhabited whereas Palestine was quite densely populated and cultivated by an ancient people.

Why shold the Palestinians have been forced by Britain and the US to accept a massive immigration of European Jews into their land simply because they were not a sovereign state?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread