2014 at the UN: 21 resolutions against Israel, 4 on rest of the world

[shira]

http://blog.unwatch.org/index.php/2014/12/17/2014-at-the-un-21-resolutions-against-israel-4-on-rest-of-the-world/

Who here would defend the UN's record on passing 25 resolutions this past year?

[procon]

1. Even as a rhetorical question,

your argument is weak.

[Fred Sanders]

3. Rhetorical question begging for an argument...SOP.

[shira]

4. You think 21 resolutions against Israel vs. 4 for the rest of the world....

....is justifiable? You don't have any problem with that?

[procon]

6. Is occupation and oppression justifiable?

Yes, I do indeed have a "problem" with that.

[shira]

7. Wow. Who can take anyone seriously who believes 21 resolutions...

...against Israel vs. 4 for the rest of the world in 2014 is justifiable?

The occupation could have ended in 2000 with the Clinton Parameters, accepted by the GOI and rejected w/o a counter-offer by the Palestinians. A deal that would've given the Palestinians close to all they were demanding.

Imagine the Kurds or Tibetans rejecting w/o a counter-proposal a peace deal giving them their own state and virtually everything they'd been asking for. Can't do it, can you?

The PA leadership chose more occupation over their own state, which they could've had for the past 13-14 years. A deal that ends the conflict once and for all isn't what they want. They can't make peace at this point like Sadat of Egypt. They'd be shot as traitors just like him.

[Scootaloo]

11. Oh! There it is again!

Your deep and heartfelt concern for Tibet!

Maybe we ought to send them a flotilla!

[shira]

15. I didn't mention concern. I'm pointing out the obvious & u can't refute it....

If the Kurds and Tibetans were offered just about everything they would want WRT their own sovereign state, they wouldn't run away from the negotiating table.

Why is this so hard for u to acknowledge w/o deflecting to something else?

I think your views on I/P are similar to those of any religious fanatic defending their beliefs. No amount of evidence could ever prove u wrong.

[Scootaloo]

24. So you're just making shit up about Kurds and Tibetans to justify your hate of Palestinians

Not that this surprises me - it's the only reason you've ever mentioned the people of Tibet.

[shira]

26. Wrong again. I'm pointing out the obvious & you can't handle it.

And rather than telling me what I think, try asking next time.

[Scootaloo]

43. I'm not telling you what you think. I'm telling you what you say.

And contrasting it to OTHER things you say. all set against the backdrop of reality.

You are making up shit about Tibet in order to use that imaginary scenario to attack Palestinian for doing something that never actually happened. You do this in order to help justify your hatred of Palestinian and your support for constant violence against them.

[shira]

44. You twist what your opponents say b/c your arguments are utter crap...

You tell me:

What other stateless people the world over - from the Kurds & Basques to Chechens & Tibetans - would flat-out refuse a state of their own and nearly everything they claim they want - like the Palestinians have done time and again?

Name one.

Or fold.

=====================

As to your claims of hatred of Palestinians, I realize you're against just about any and all criticism of Palestinian terror organizations dedicated to the mass murder of Jews - but such criticism is not the equivalent of hatred of Palestinians.

Do you realize how many times you've made up shit in order to bash Israelis? Your opponents here could make up a long list.

So using your very own words...

Scoot,

You are making up shit about Israel in order to use that imaginary scenario to attack the Israelis for doing something that never actually happened. You do this in order to help justify your hatred of Israelis and your support for constant violence against them.

[bemildred]

31. Yeah, rampant habitual whataboutism.

Which all falls under the label of "red herring." The fact that the rest of the world is fucked up does not mean you get a free pass. In fact it means pretty much the opposite, if you don't get your shit together, you get eaten too.

[Scootaloo]

2. What fascinates me is the consistency of the "No" votes

The United States, which seems to have turned murdering and torturing Muslims into its new national sport - even to the point of hailing torturers as "patriots" who had "tough jobs." Currently engaged in smiling smugly as its white police beat and kill black citizens.

Nauru, Palau, Micronesia, Marshall Islands - These nations' economies are actually directly tied to aligning their votes with the United States' in the UN. Seriously, they are heavily aid-dependent, and the US makes such aid conditional on those UN votes. I can't blame them, they don't have much by way of natural resources, and most of 'em will be underwater in thirty years. Get while the getting's good.

Canada - beats me. Stand-by-your-man syndrome with regards to the United States, I suppose.

So... When the only people standing in your corner is the guy who thinks "rectal feeding" is a patriotic act, his girlfriend, and four lunkies he's intimidated into being yes-men... I dunno, even if you're getting your way, maybe you ought to reconsider your position on stuff.

Imagine a resolution where the only "yes" votes are North Korea, the Seychelles, Saudi Arabia, and Belarus.

[shira]

5. 21 resolutions against Israel vs. 4 for the rest of the world in 2014

How is that justified from a human rights POV?

[Scootaloo]

8. How interesting then, that 59 resolutions were adopted in 2014 by the UNSC alone

http://www.un.org/en/sc/documents/resolutions/2014.shtml

And it looks like nearly two hundred, if not more, by the General Assembly: http://www.un.org/en/ga/69/resolutions.shtml

Here's an idea; The AJC's UNWatch is full of shit, and you're a total schmuck for believing it.

[shira]

16. The OP refers to UNGA resolutions. Country-specific condemnations.

Look at your list and try to find other country specific resolutions other than one each on Iran, Syria, N.Korea, and Ukraine.

You won't find others resolutions condemning any other country other than Israel.

Meaning nothing condemning human rights luminaries like:

Egypt
Turkey
China
Saudi Arabia

etc....

[Scootaloo]

20. Oh, I did.

There are zero Israel-specific condemnations on the UNGA list. Unwatch chooses to read every resolution that mentions Palestine as an attack on Israel.

This is because unwatch is shit.

And then we look at the UNSC list, and we see all those resolutions that actually have teeth - UNGA resolutions are non-binding, UNSC ones are binding. You'll find everyone on there exceot China (it can veto resolutions against itself) and Turkey (nato member, its three allies in the council veto for it.)

You're getting outraged over non-binding acknowledgement of Palestinian existence, and ignoring binding resolutuions against the nations you insist are getting away.

Which is about par for the course, I suppose.

[oberliner]

21. Your list actually supports the claim

The resolutions indicated match up with the list at your link.

Doesn't it seem strange that a resolution condemning human rights violations in N Korea gets 20 NO votes and 53 abstentions, but a resolution condemning human rights violations in Israel gets only 8 NO votes and 11 abstentions?

That seems a bit out of whack considering the relative degree of each country's human rights violations.

[Scootaloo]

22. There are no resolutions "condemning Israel"

Please, go read the condemnations of North Korea, Iran, and Syria. There is no way you can look at a resolution reaffirming the rights of Palestinians to self-determination, and complain that it's a worse condemnation of Israel than these eight-page documentations of theh orrid shit those three nations are actually being condemned for.

But, it's not the actual content that worries you and Shira and David. It's not the actual results that bother you (there will be none, of course, and you know it.)

It's the fact that Palestinians are being acknowledged as existing. That Israel's 50-year occupation is still in the news. You'd rather it be swept under the rug, kept quiet and invisible. Thus, any mention of either Palestine or the occupation of Palestine, sends you into a frenzy of rage.

[shira]

25. Sure there are. 20 UNGA resolutions. See here....

http://blog.unwatch.org/index.php/2014/12/17/2014-at-the-un-20-resolutions-against-israel-3-on-rest-of-the-world/

Extracts from all 20 resolutions are at the site above, with links to the actual copy of each resolution.

Only 4 country-specific UNGA condemnations on the rest of the world combined. You'll find none of this derogatory rhetoric in anything other than 4 countries condemned. Look for yourself.

You can have your opinions but you can't make up facts.

[Scootaloo]

29. I did look for myself Shira. there are no condemnations of Israel

Unless you're the sort of dipshit who thinks mention of Palestinians is inherently an attack on Israel.

[shira]

46. None? Here's 5, which is more than the 4 against the rest of the world combined....

Amazingly enough, these 5 are similar to the language employed by the UNGA against Ukraine and Iran.

In order to be consistent, you'd have to argue the UN did not even condemn Iran or Ukraine.

Deplores those policies and practices of Israel that violate the human rights of the Palestinian people and other Arabs of the occupied territories…”

Extract: “Gravely concerned about the extremely difficult socioeconomic conditions being faced by the Palestine refugees in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, particularly in the refugee camps in the Gaza Strip, as a result of the recurrent military operations, continuing prolonged Israeli closures, the construction of settlements and the wall, and the severe economic and movement restrictions that in effect amount to a blockade…”

Extract: “Expressing grave concern about the continuing systematic violation of the human rights of the Palestinian people by Israel, the occupying Power…”

Extract: “Deeply concerned that the Syrian Golan, occupied since 1967, has been under continued Israeli military occupation.”

Extract: “Expressing grave concern about the extremely detrimental impact of Israeli settlement policies, decisions and activities in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, including on the contiguity, integrity and viability of the Territory …”

Call these statements anything you want other than condemnations - but this country-specific critical and condemnatory language simply DOES NOT EXIST in UN General Assembly Resolutions from 2014 for any other country other than Syria, Iran, N.Korea, and Ukraine.

Find anything condemnatory like that against any other country in 2014 regarding UNGA resolutions passed.

Or fold.

[oberliner]

35. Yes, you are right

Deplores, but not condemns.

[Scootaloo]

38. Deplores a specific policy. Which happens to actually be deplorable. In one resolution.

Which is a very different thing from condemnations of an entire country, its leaders, and basically everything they do. Which is what Iran, Syria, and North Korea got from the General Assembly.

Are you done with your breathless outrage yet?

[oberliner]

40. No it doesn't

Last edited Thu Dec 25, 2014, 03:24 PM - Edit history (1)

It deplores human rights violations in general, very similar to the resolution with respect to North Korea which had much less support in the GA than the one on Israel.

Also, I think the general point is valid that there are many more UN resolutions dealing with Israel (let's not say condemning) than other countries.

Can we agree on that at least? And, if so, is it reasonable to say that isn't fair and possibly speaks to a bias in the UNGA?

No need to be breathless nor outraged.

[Scootaloo]

42. Keep dragging those goalposts around, oberliner

The claim you were trying to support is shit. Your position is shit. The source is shit. The entire apparatus behind your side of the discussion is shit.l You know this, so you're trying to skootchie some way to make it not shit. Which isn't going to succeed, because, again, it's all shit.

You need a philosophy that isn't comprised of fecal matter, oberliner. Might i suggest anarcho-capitalism? It's only mostly shit, which puts it ahead of Zionism in the philosophy department

[King_David]

45. Cyber- bullying

You bring me into every negative post you make .

I am not even involved in this discussion subthread at all and yet you draw me into it.

[King_David]

9. "The only people standing in your corner"

If Algeria introduced a resolution declaring that the earth was flat and that Israel had flattened it, it would pass by a vote of 164 to 13 with 26 abstentions.

Abba Eban


Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/abbaeban167935.html#SbFql7vuGB2E564z.99

There ain't nothing new under the sun....

[Scootaloo]

10. Has Algeria introduced such a resolution?

No? Abba Eban was just making some old shit up and presenting as if it were fact?

You're right; nothing new under the sun.

[oberliner]

13. "The United States...turned murdering and torturing Muslims into its new national sport"

Is this your actual belief?

[King_David]

14. It sure gives context to ALL Scootaloo posts.

[Scootaloo]

19. Until this administration or the next gets the balls to prosecute torture.

And other assorted war crimes committed under our flag since 2001. So long as the perpetrators get called "patriots" and are rewarded with slaps on the back, it is what it is

[oberliner]

34. Muslims in particular?

Or just murder/torture in general?

[Scootaloo]

37. Well, I don't think too many Wiccans were receiving "rectal feedings" at Lithuanian "black sites"

And it's been about what, forty years since we last laid waste to a Buddhist country, so...

[oberliner]

39. What about South America?

There are claims of some pretty brutal torture there at the hands of US surrogates with nary a Muslim to be found.

[Scootaloo]

41. I'm speaking of current attitudes.

People behind that need to be prosecuted, of course - and I don't give a shit if they're 90 year old men in a hospital with "breathing problems" or not, drag 'em to a jury and have a rope ready.

However, for the last decade and a half, our nation has been getting its fun by shoveling hummus up the asses of Muslim prisoners. And declaring the perpetrators to be "patriots" apparently.

[bemildred]

32. Pretty much. It's not all of us, but it is plenty of us.

Dick Cheney is not an aberration. He is one of a long line of jingo assholes in this country, it goes waaaay back.

And it's not just us either, there is no nation on the planet that is immune from assholery.

[oberliner]

33. Muslims in particular?

Or just murdering/torturing in general?

[bemildred]

36. Well, it starts out with slavery ("negros") and genocide ("native americans"),

which has jack shit to do with Muslims, other than that they have been known to be fond of slavery too. But generally they never industrialized it like we did.

But so has most of the planet been "fond of it too", once we became civilized, you've got to have somebody work those fields. And nobody does that all their life unless compelled.

[GitRDun]

28. LMAO

A little perspective can be very useful.

[azurnoir]

12. 2013 at the UN: 21 resolutions against Israel, 4 on rest of the world

The U.N. General Assembly in 2013 adopted a total of 21 resolutions singling out Israel for criticism — and 4 resolutions on the rest of the world combined. See the texts and votes below.

The four that do not concern Israel are: one on Syria, a regime that has murdered 120,000 of its own people, and one each on Iran, North Korea and Myanmar.

http://blog.unwatch.org/index.php/2013/11/25/this-years-22-unga-resolutions-against-israel-4-on-rest-of-world/

Interesting though that a resolution affirming the right of the Palestinian people to self determination is seen as anti-Israel does that mean the inverse to that is Pro-Israel?

[azurnoir]

17. 12/19/14 UN General Assembly seeks North Korea ICC charges

The UN General Assembly has voted in favour of referring North Korea to the International Criminal Court to face charges of crimes against humanity.

The resolution was passed by 116 votes to 20, with more than 50 abstentions.

The UN Security Council is expected to discuss the resolution on Monday, but it is likely to face stiff opposition from China and Russia.

North Korea said the resolution was "a product of political plot and confrontation".

A UN report released in February revealed ordinary North Koreans faced "unspeakable atrocities".

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-30540379

[shira]

18. Good. It's still something like 20 resolutions against Israel....

....versus 5 for the rest of the world combined.

No condemnation of Saudi Arabia, China, Cuba...

[Scootaloo]

23. Maybe Israel ought ot introduce such resolutions.

But that might damage its lucrative relations with Saudi Arabia and China, mightn't it?

[bemildred]

30. Self-pity and hate are such a toxic combination. nt