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digonswine

(1,485 posts)
Tue Feb 14, 2012, 05:03 PM Feb 2012

I am reading James Bradley's-"The Imperial Cruise"-

he states, that in the mid to late 1800's, nearly all educated intellectuals-western and western European-were taught and adhered to the Aryan mythology regarding race. Only Aryans were fit for democracy and self-rule, and all others in the "wasted spaces"-read-dark-skinned areas!- were to be subjugated and ruled over by Aryans for their own good.

He exposed Teddy Roosevelt as a showman fraud racist, and casts many others in a similar light.

This is a time in our history which seems to be ignored and glossed over.

Has anyone else read this book? Is it accurate? Any thoughts?

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I am reading James Bradley's-"The Imperial Cruise"- (Original Post) digonswine Feb 2012 OP
I've read it. I don't know how accurate it is as history. bemildred Feb 2012 #1
I haven't read it. ellisonz Feb 2012 #2
Thanks for the response and info- digonswine Feb 2012 #4
I suggest "The Politics of War" by Walter Karp for an alternative US-centric view of that period, bemildred Feb 2012 #3

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
1. I've read it. I don't know how accurate it is as history.
Tue Feb 14, 2012, 09:56 PM
Feb 2012

However white racism was ubiquitous from top to bottom of "Western Culture" up until the 1960s, and still is, though less virulent and overt than it once was, and the younger generations don't seem to buy it as much now.

I would guess that the facts in the book (who was where and talked to whom when etc.) are mostly supported by evidence, and when it speculates about thoughts and intentions then not so much. I am not aware of any big controversy about it, but I don't know if any academic historians have taken it on either.

ellisonz

(27,711 posts)
2. I haven't read it.
Wed Feb 15, 2012, 12:57 AM
Feb 2012

And so even though this is a subject about which I'm deeply interested, I'm going to resist characterizing the book one way or the other, beyond saying that I am generally skeptical of history from the top-down. I think leaders are more reactive to public pressures and public-driven events than they would care to admit. This could be said without too much trepidation about the decision to go to war in 1898 and about the decision to occupy the Philippines at large, which was not a matter of public debate, but of over-eager American soldiers. I would be reluctant about any analysis that places paramount importance on the idea that racism was all that well intellectually developed in terms of an "Aryan mythology" during the period, and was much more a matter of a base sense of superiority grounded in skin color and cultural sensibility.

Here is something from HNN that I found questioning some of the diplomatic analysis:

Wednesday, December 9, 2009 - 12:02
What Historians Make of James Bradley's Claims About Teddy Roosevelt's Responsibility for Pearl Harbor

Jonathan Tremblay
Mr. Tremblay is an HNN intern and Breaking News Editor.


James Bradley, in his recent book The Imperial Cruise: A Secret History of Empire and War, alleges that President Theodore Roosevelt encouraged Japanese imperialism. Bradley argues that the Taft-Katsura agreement reached between the United States and Japan in 1905 amounted to a ‘secret treaty’ that left the door open to Japanese imperialism in the Far East and even led to the fateful bombing of Pearl Harbor 68 years ago.

Bradley has repeated these arguments in an op ed in the New York Times and in an interview with HNN. Criticism and controversy are building around these claims.

More: http://hnn.us/articles/121196.html


Here are a couple works (two classic, two current) you might find to be more academic in their approach to this subject:

Imperial Democracy: The Emergence of America As a Great Power - By Ernest R. May
http://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Democracy-Emergence-America-Great/dp/1879176041/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1329280551&sr=8-1

Sentimental Imperialists: The American Experience in East Asia. - By John Curtis, James C. Thomson, Jr and Peter W. Stanley
http://www.amazon.com/Sentimental-Imperialists-James-Thomson/dp/0061319988/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1329280586&sr=1-1

The Blood of Government: Race, Empire, the United States, and the Philippines - By Paul A. Kramer
http://www.amazon.com/Blood-Government-Empire-United-Philippines/dp/0807856533/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1329281078&sr=1-1

First Great Triumph: How Five Americans Made Their Country a World Power - By Warren Zimmerman
http://www.amazon.com/First-Great-Triumph-Americans-Country/dp/0374528934/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1329281322&sr=1-2


I really do think we're still awaiting a good synthesis of the orthodox, revisionist, post-revisionist, and post-orthodox accounts that variously ascribe "American imperialism" to have been non-existent, bold-faced, bold-faced but absent-minded, and non-existent and absent-minded. The truth lies somewhere in between, and it is clear that although Roosevelt and his cohort were important and did guide policy, that something deep-down in the American spirit allowed them to achieve this coup. How that relates to the rat race diplomatically in the Asia-Pacific is certainly a curious subject, and any good analysis of this would have to run from the imperial contact until the formation of the Axis Alliance.

digonswine

(1,485 posts)
4. Thanks for the response and info-
Wed Feb 15, 2012, 05:46 PM
Feb 2012

I'll need to go into this more deeply when I've finished the book.

bemildred

(90,061 posts)
3. I suggest "The Politics of War" by Walter Karp for an alternative US-centric view of that period,
Wed Feb 15, 2012, 11:42 AM
Feb 2012

which also takes a dim view of McKinley, Teddy R., and Wilson, but views it through the lens of US politics, rather than racism, imperialism, etc.

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