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Number23

(24,544 posts)
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 06:14 PM Sep 2015

Well, my mom kind of blew my mind yesterday. Said she likes Bernie Sanders

and is supporting him. She also said that the behavior of his supporters has grossed her out so much that she's actually considering writing something about white liberal racism and would pay to publish it herself if that's what she needed to do, she was so gobsmacked by the antics of Sanders "supporters" in response to Black Lives Matter and other issues.

But I was really surprised by her saying she's a (qualified) Bernie gal. I say qualified because she was quite emphatic that she would happily vote for Hillary if that's what it came to. She ain't no nihilist, my mama. But like so many of the rest of us have said in this forum, she agrees with alot of what he's said. She sees the gaping holes in his campaign just like the rest of us do too but she is hopeful and even a bit excited that he seems to be on the same side of her with so many issues.

She also said that even though the #BLM is one of the most important issues out right now, that the activists there should be less combative and that they should do what they could to attract more people like Viola Liuzzo, a white woman who left her children behind to participate in the Civil Rights Movement and was murdered by the KKK for her efforts.

I reminded her that folks always accused King of being "too aggressive" and said that his tactics were all wrong too. She hemmed and hawed until I reminded her that she used to be a big time, dashiki wearing, Afro picking Black Panther supporter back in the day too. She laughingly conceded my point.

My mom. 'Qualified' Bernie Sanders supporter. Shocked the hell outta me.

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Well, my mom kind of blew my mind yesterday. Said she likes Bernie Sanders (Original Post) Number23 Sep 2015 OP
DeRay McKesson... OneGrassRoot Sep 2015 #1
Those tweets are great and very illuminating Number23 Sep 2015 #4
And I hope that SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #16
Greg Palast talked about Bernie being the only one there of the white persuasion randys1 Sep 2015 #52
I saw those posts but then J17 and MADem explained that the reason Hillary wasn't in the room was Number23 Sep 2015 #53
Oh, I'm still working on this Palast story Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #55
Chitown Kev, I appoint you the AA forum's Chief Investigative Reporter Number23 Sep 2015 #57
That has happened to me also. I am a huge critic of Hillary solely on economic issues. randys1 Sep 2015 #59
Do we have the same Mom, lol Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #2
Yep, my mom mentioned his marching with MLK ((all together now... GROOOOAANNN)) Number23 Sep 2015 #5
"...she'd run to the polls with a dozen black folks riding on her shoulders and vote for Hillary any scarletwoman Sep 2015 #6
+1000 nt steve2470 Sep 2015 #7
From the international perspective, Bernie is not known. When I talk to my colleagues they all live Number23 Sep 2015 #9
I don't know what kind of answer I could give them, either - re: Trump. scarletwoman Sep 2015 #17
Your mom sounds way cool! Please do encourage her to write "something about white liberal racism"! scarletwoman Sep 2015 #3
My mom is 64! So you guys are pretty close in age! Number23 Sep 2015 #8
Mine is 68...which brings up a point Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #11
Yeah, but when I reminded her that this is the same kind of crap that people spewed at MLK she Number23 Sep 2015 #12
True... Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #14
I'm from Detroit .... kwassa Sep 2015 #48
Not just talking about 1967 (or even black folks or EVEN race issues either. Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #50
yes, those rioting black people ..... oh, wait. Maybe not. kwassa Sep 2015 #54
Goodness, if the Chicago Cubs do somehow win the WS this year...Lawd have mercy Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #56
My mom is 65... onpatrol98 Sep 2015 #32
"she thinks Bernie Sanders would bankrupt America." Number23 Sep 2015 #34
My mom has made similar comments JustAnotherGen Sep 2015 #47
I've said it before and I'll say it again... Number23 Sep 2015 #51
Yeah - she's pretty great! JustAnotherGen Sep 2015 #58
Hey! I'll be 64 soon! SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #19
Happy (soon to have) Birthday, Susan! Number23 Sep 2015 #21
Sounds good to me. SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #39
I preferred Bernie at first... Stellar Sep 2015 #15
I am really angry at the "supporters" for causing that. nt SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #18
I got to the point a few days ago Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #27
Bwaaaaaah! SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #36
Your Mom and I are on the same page...n/t jaysunb Sep 2015 #10
Glad to hear it. Number23 Sep 2015 #13
I am not completely sold on the viability or approach of BLM jaysunb Sep 2015 #20
I totally understand and hear what you're saying Number23 Sep 2015 #22
Education is the key, and the first lesson we must learn and teach jaysunb Sep 2015 #24
For myself, I'm not about to offer any critique on BLM's tactics. scarletwoman Sep 2015 #23
Thank you for your empathy... jaysunb Sep 2015 #25
I really appreciate your reply. scarletwoman Sep 2015 #29
I like Bernie but I'm not voting for him. I agree with underthematrix Sep 2015 #26
Even Cornel West Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #28
I have a deep and abiding hate for Cornel West. I understand he went through a underthematrix Sep 2015 #30
I wasn't aware, until a little while ago SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #37
Cornel West was hesitant to endorse Bernie Sanders Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #40
I had no idea. You bring some deep and serious knowledge to every conversation you participate in Number23 Sep 2015 #44
Thank you, Number23 Chitown Kev Sep 2015 #46
I hear you and in large part agree with what you're saying. Number23 Sep 2015 #31
No Republican! SusanCalvin Sep 2015 #38
Tell your mom to write something portlander23 Sep 2015 #33
She is definitely considering it. I don't know how good of a writer she is though Number23 Sep 2015 #35
that's similar to Bravenak and what many others said JI7 Sep 2015 #41
"black people not liking sanders because of religion" Number23 Sep 2015 #43
My mom is supporting him too. :) Starry Messenger Sep 2015 #42
Damn, it would be nice if just ONCE you guys supported the same candidate, wouldn't it??? Number23 Sep 2015 #45
I know right! Starry Messenger Sep 2015 #49

OneGrassRoot

(22,920 posts)
1. DeRay McKesson...
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 06:41 PM
Sep 2015

I really admire DeRay a lot, so I was excited to see he and others met with Bernie earlier last week. This blog details Deray's series of tweets about that meeting.

It gives me more hope in Sanders' ability to continue to listen, learn and act on what he has learned.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/09/16/1421938/--CampaignZero-BlackLivesMatter-activist-DeRay-McKesson-has-meeting-with-Bernie-Sanders#

Number23

(24,544 posts)
4. Those tweets are great and very illuminating
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:25 PM
Sep 2015

Reading them it appears that the #BLM activists had to do a bit of work to get Sanders on the same page as they are. Which is very interesting.

It's encouraging that he appears to have gotten there in the end though. I truly hope that this dialogue is only the first of many.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
52. Greg Palast talked about Bernie being the only one there of the white persuasion
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 06:00 PM
Sep 2015

when he came to talk about the stolen election in FL and who was disenfranchised to steal it.

Greg says it is happening NOW as well, BTW.

I knew from the get go who Bernie was in relation to the AfAm community, but that doesnt do anybody any good.

Bernie had to show it and prove it, and he still has work to do, make it clear who he is and why...

I dont know why any Black person would trust a fucking thing ANY white person told them, by the way.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
53. I saw those posts but then J17 and MADem explained that the reason Hillary wasn't in the room was
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 08:50 PM
Sep 2015

because she was actually ORGANIZING a similar event with the CBC taking place around that same time.

But of course, that didn't get relayed that way here. What got relayed here that Hillary was "too busy" to be involved in the event that Palast mentioned and that must mean that it wasn't important to her. It was so stupid. And of course it got a slew of recs, because recs have always been way more important than honesty to this crowd.

I'm still fairly "meh" on Hillary, but I swear I find myself supporting her way more than I want to here just because of the unhinged stupidity and dishonesty of so much of the criticism here involving her.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
55. Oh, I'm still working on this Palast story
Tue Sep 22, 2015, 04:19 AM
Sep 2015

which he has changed...but I can't even find any verification ANYWHERE of his new story that this meeting supposedly occurred a few days before the 2004 elections; an emergency meeting at that...he changed this story on Thom Hartmann and says that it was in response to his report on voter "caging" in Florida.

I have found no record whatsoever that ANY meeting (emergency, secret, or otherwise) took place. I do know that some member of the Judiciary committee wrote a letter to the GAO AFTER the November 2, 2004 election but that was a Conyers/Nadler/Robert Wexler letter. I have skimmed through Palast's books...nothing...skimmed through media reports....nothing but the relatively interesting fact (which I remembered when I read it) that Bill Clinton left the hospital to go campaigning for Kerry...I recalled how weak Clinton looked in those 2004 campaign events.

So that little lie (and bereft of any documentation, that's what I consider it to be) still gets told.


Number23

(24,544 posts)
57. Chitown Kev, I appoint you the AA forum's Chief Investigative Reporter
Tue Sep 22, 2015, 04:43 AM
Sep 2015
I have found no record whatsoever that ANY meeting (emergency, secret, or otherwise) took place. I do know that some member of the Judiciary committee wrote a letter to the GAO AFTER the November 2, 2004 election but that was a Conyers/Nadler/Robert Wexler letter. I have skimmed through Palast's books...nothing...skimmed through media reports....nothing but the relatively interesting fact (which I remembered when I read it) that Bill Clinton left the hospital to go campaigning for Kerry


Looks like we've got a mystery on our hands!

Can't wait to see what (if anything) you can dig up on this.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
59. That has happened to me also. I am a huge critic of Hillary solely on economic issues.
Tue Sep 22, 2015, 11:37 AM
Sep 2015

As an ACTUAL Democratic Socialist, unlike a bunch here who arent really but they like Bernie, or they think they do etc

Anyway, as such I have a huge issue with all status quo and she is and Bernie isnt.

HAVING said that, the attitude of the str8t, white, heterosexual men around here telling YOU how to vote, well it drives me crazy

.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
2. Do we have the same Mom, lol
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:00 PM
Sep 2015

My Mom is a Bernie Sanders supporter as well.

Thing is, she became one prior to me telling her a little bit about his civil rights background.

And...my Mom feels no need to dis Hillary Clinton either...in fact, she still likes Hillary but does say that Hillary is way too vague a lot of times

I actually agree with Mom about Hillary...although I "get" why Hillary is that way.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
5. Yep, my mom mentioned his marching with MLK ((all together now... GROOOOAANNN))
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:30 PM
Sep 2015

and she was impressed with that.

She was also less than impressed with the fact that there doesn't seem to be much on the record of his involvement on black issues since then but my mom grew up in the South during the 50s and 60s. Given the things she's seen first hand in her life, she has a pretty low bar for praising white people and their commitment to black rights and even she was kind of lukewarm on the "Bernie Sanders: Civil Rights Icon" meme that his supporters have been trying to shove down everybody's throat.

I was telling her that I don't know anyone that's actually excited about Hillary and she agreed with that. But she said that she'd run to the polls with a dozen black folks riding on her shoulders and vote for Hillary any day of the week over any of the Republican offerings.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
6. "...she'd run to the polls with a dozen black folks riding on her shoulders and vote for Hillary any
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:38 PM
Sep 2015
...day of the week over any of the Republican offerings.

I would hope that all of us would do the same - whether it's a dozen black folks or a dozen white folks.

I don't care how awful anyone thinks Hillary is, she is still far and away better than ANY Republican on offer. And I say this as someone who really does not like, and has never liked, Hillary. But I will vote for her with no problem if she's the nominee, because the alternative is too unthinkable.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
9. From the international perspective, Bernie is not known. When I talk to my colleagues they all live
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:48 PM
Sep 2015

in mortal terror and perplexity that Donald FUCKING Trump is doing as well as he is in the polls.

I work with Aussies, Brits, Indonesians, Indians, Philippinos, a couple of Americans and some of everything else and NO ONE understands how Donald FUCKING Trump is doing as well as he is. They are absolutely TERRIFIED that he could become president. I cannot articulate to them how much I share that same fear. And the rest of the Repub options aren't too much better. My mom actually referred to Ben Carson as "evil" and I have not heard her say that about many people in my life.

A few of my colleagues feel that the end result will be the establishment Dem (Clinton) vs the establishment Rep (Bush) but even the ones that feel that way are nervous as hell and absolutely baffled at Trump's success. They don't get it and keep asking me what the hell is going on. And what's sad is that I don't have any answers for them at all because I don't understand it either except for that he appeals to the absolute worst in this country. The ignorant. The entitled. The bigoted. And the racist as hell. And as much as America loves to pretend that all of this has gone away, that racism is no longer an issue, the ascension of a black man as president has done absolutely nothing but show how pervasive and powerful all of this still is.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
17. I don't know what kind of answer I could give them, either - re: Trump.
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:27 PM
Sep 2015

My best guess is that it's a perfect storm of the effects of TV addiction and consumerism, the culture of celebrity fetishism, lack of quality education, and the inherent bigotry of the national zeitgeist of "rugged individualism".

I cannot, for the life of me, understand how anyone can look at Trump and not see a disgusting, bigoted, lowlife, vulgar ignoramous blowhard who is totally unqualified for, and unworthy of, the office of President of the United States.

Most frightening of all is to contemplate that these Trump supporters will vote! It's absolutely horrifying!

The ignorant. The entitled. The bigoted. And the racist as hell. And as much as America loves to pretend that all of this has gone away, that racism is no longer an issue, the ascension of a black man as president has done absolutely nothing but show how pervasive and powerful all of this still is.


I have to be honest - I had no idea how pervasive anti-black racism still was in this country until Obama won the White House. It was an extremely painful eye-opener, for sure. I ought to have known, because where I live (rural northern Minnesota), the inherent racism of the dominant culture is mainly directed toward American Indians - but I thought that was just peculiar to that group because they have not had the same degree of nationally publicized vocal advocacy that African Americans have had.

There is so much about this country that just plain hurts the heart.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
3. Your mom sounds way cool! Please do encourage her to write "something about white liberal racism"!
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:17 PM
Sep 2015

That would be wonderful - it needs to be done! We've all been witnessing a full-blown, real-life, real-time case study of "white liberal racism" ever since BLM showed up at NetRoots Nation.

Sanders supporters ought to be damn humbly grateful that your mom has been able to get past their "antics" to give her own (qualified) support to Sanders - no thanks to them.

I'm much in the same boat - I'll vote for whoever the Democratic nominee turns out to be, but I've mostly preferred Sanders - I just haven't been able to get past the obnoxiousness of so many of his supporters.

Btw, I'm thinking I might be close to your mom's age - I'll be 66 in November.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
8. My mom is 64! So you guys are pretty close in age!
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:41 PM
Sep 2015

That is so cool.

We've all been witnessing a full-blown, real-life, real-time case study of "white liberal racism" ever since BLM showed up at NetRoots Nation.


Ain't that the ever loving truth?? Books will be written about this shit. Of this I have no doubt. And those books will hopefully be taught in courses. And white liberals will never be able to wiggle themselves out of accusations of racism again by screaming "hey, I'm a LIBERAL!!1 We can't be racist!one!" because all everyone will ever have to do is point to the behavior of far too many Sanders supporters at Black Lives Matter, at black attendees of Netroots Nation, and seemingly at black people in general.

Sanders supporters ought to be damn humbly grateful that your mom has been able to get past their "antics" to give her own (qualified) support to Sanders - no thanks to them.


That is pretty much verbatim exactly how I feel about the situation. VERBATIM.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
11. Mine is 68...which brings up a point
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 07:58 PM
Sep 2015

FTR, my Mom has said nothing about the BLM protests (I don't think that she is aware of them, to be honest) but there is this...

I COULD imagine that a number of older African Americans not liking those actions too much, especially the Seattle action.

I do hope that some of the more obnoxious Bernie supporters (and there are Bernie supporters that are totally cool) to at least take a glance at this thread...

Number23

(24,544 posts)
12. Yeah, but when I reminded her that this is the same kind of crap that people spewed at MLK she
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:02 PM
Sep 2015

actually took that point. For the last 40-50 years, we've had (relatively) calm black protest and movements lead by the (relatively) calm NAACP and the like.

BLM has shaken things up in a way that the NAACP never could with their calmness and politeness. And like I told my mom, if any person (particularly non-black ones) are put off by the screams of BLM instead of what they are actually screaming ABOUT, then we don't need or want them.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
14. True...
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:05 PM
Sep 2015

and I mean, I AM from Detroit, "calm" and "polite" protests really aren't in the nature of my city and never have been, really.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
50. Not just talking about 1967 (or even black folks or EVEN race issues either.
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 12:20 PM
Sep 2015

Or for that matter, even protests.

I am still a little bitter about the way the national press covered the aftermath of the 1984 World Series.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
56. Goodness, if the Chicago Cubs do somehow win the WS this year...Lawd have mercy
Tue Sep 22, 2015, 04:28 AM
Sep 2015

I remember when a lot of them were riding north on Gratiot after the game, I hadn't given so many high fives in my life...an then to hear the racist dog whistles (it WAS about a week and a half before Devil's Night after all, lol) on the national news the next morning on my way out the door to school...

Have never seen those pictures of 1984, though...thanks.

onpatrol98

(1,989 posts)
32. My mom is 65...
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:54 PM
Sep 2015

My mom is 65 years old and is fully supporting Hillary Clinton. She told me she thinks Bernie Sanders would bankrupt America. She thinks he was originally in it to move Hillary to the left and then started getting a taste of possibilities. Not to mention, she wasn't impressed with his little foray into fiction writing. LOL. She's quite emphatic about it. She's not crazy about Hillary Clinton, but she's dead set against Bernie Sanders. When I told her about the shenanigans on DU, she thought it par for the course.

Originally, when I was considering Bernie Sanders, she made it plain she'd thought I'd lost my mind.

Now, of course, my dad was an Obama supporter before she was. She originally supported Hillary Clinton then, as well. But, she jumped ship fairly early. My Dad...well, he concurs. He doesn't think Bernie has a chance. My dad is 66. He is going to support the eventual nominee regardless. As for Joe Biden, they haven't thought much of him since the whole...clean cut black man comment, or whatever he said about the president.

Yep, these two are a tough crowd. For all the talking I do on DU, I tend to lay low with those two. I'm completely out of my league. I told them I thought Bernie may have a chance. My father thought it unrealistic at best to think that America was ready to elect a card carrying socialist.

Tough crowd...

Number23

(24,544 posts)
34. "she thinks Bernie Sanders would bankrupt America."
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 10:11 PM
Sep 2015

I don't know. Bush gave it his best shot and I don't think that anyone could come close to the valiant effort that he made to destroy this country.

I don't think it's the "socialist" bit that America isn't ready for. I think the fact that Sanders is somehow still not a Democrat is a much harder sell.

Your mom is like alot of black people in that she supported Hillary because she was the sure thing until Obama started getting some serious recognition. But alot of that black support for Hillary never dissipated, it just went to another candidate and was a major factor in him becoming president -- twice. It's still there and she's already capitalizing on it in droves.

JustAnotherGen

(31,811 posts)
47. My mom has made similar comments
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 04:54 AM
Sep 2015

She will be 68 in November - white woman. She was at the March on Washington with her parents. And she doesn't understand why some liberals (white) in her age group can be frustrated with BLM.

First you disrupt to awaken people.

Then you drive policy.

"How quickly people forget that long before MLK took center stage there was a disruptor named Medgar." - JAG's mom

Number23

(24,544 posts)
51. I've said it before and I'll say it again...
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 05:43 PM
Sep 2015
"How quickly people forget that long before MLK took center stage there was a disruptor named Medgar." - JAG's mom

Your mom is a TRUE sister.

JustAnotherGen

(31,811 posts)
58. Yeah - she's pretty great!
Tue Sep 22, 2015, 05:56 AM
Sep 2015
Her parents were huge financial supporters of the NAACP. They had a solid sense of right and wrong. She said she saw her dad cry like a baby twice while growing up - Kennedy and Evers. She was away at University when MLK was murdered so didn't see it first hand.

My grandfather was severely dyslexic but managed to craft a serious construction business in So Cal with my grandmothers help. He had tremendous respect for Medgar's education and that he chose to risk his life in public service. His example is why in bigoted sexist SoCal he deliberately hired black and Hispanic foremen and managers and women architects, engineers, etc etc. his twin brother took those same steps in Pittsburgh at his machine and tool factory.

He could have died leaving his wife and daughter tens of millions but chose to lose business by sticking to Medar's principles.

Stellar

(5,644 posts)
15. I preferred Bernie at first...
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:22 PM
Sep 2015

until his supporters started calling me some of everything insulting and then I was done with it. Bernie must be the last man standing for me to vote for him.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
27. I got to the point a few days ago
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:14 PM
Sep 2015

where I said I would vote for Jill Stein on November 8, 2016 before I voted for Bernie sanders because of those obnoxious motherfuckers.

I am not at that point TODAY, but the obnoxious ones must believe that their shit don't stank!

Number23

(24,544 posts)
13. Glad to hear it.
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:03 PM
Sep 2015


Do you agree with her comments about Black Lives Matter too or just agree with her qualified support for Sanders??

jaysunb

(11,856 posts)
20. I am not completely sold on the viability or approach of BLM
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:39 PM
Sep 2015

which is in itself an odd position for a person that completely abandoned the "traditional" non violent movement very early on preferring the militant, in your face tactics of the black nationalist movement. But,I think my age, (72) cynicism and a better understanding of the real problem (institutional racism) makes me feel their efforts have been co-opted by the very people they seek to address and therefore will only go as far as the establishment will let them.
Please don't misunderstand, I very much appreciate and respect the goals of BLM, I'm just more informed by personal experience and history itself.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
22. I totally understand and hear what you're saying
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:44 PM
Sep 2015

I think my mom is in the same boat. She was the most militant thing she could be in the 70s and now, like you, her understanding of the issues and her mellowing with age have just given her a different perspective on things. It may be a wiser perspective, or just a more mellow one. But it is definitely different.

But she's taught me damn near everything that I know about who I am. She is one of the many reasons I am so incredibly proud to be black, even with all of the difficulties and pain that come along with it.

jaysunb

(11,856 posts)
24. Education is the key, and the first lesson we must learn and teach
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:59 PM
Sep 2015

is awareness of who we are, how we came to be in this situation, followed by solid doses of self pride and respect. Only when our offspring are encouraged and nurtured to build on the progress made over the last 150 years, will we be able to rise from a totally broken people to regain our rightful place among the worlds people. We must unlearn many of the destructive mindset behaviors that we've adapted to insure our survival.

So in a word, as a strong follower and student of Malcom X, we must clean up our own house and encourage our "friends" of other races to work harder with their own people to persuade and argue for a different perspective.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
23. For myself, I'm not about to offer any critique on BLM's tactics.
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 08:57 PM
Sep 2015

I just don't feel that I have the right.

My feeling is, if they think that this is what they need to do to be heard, I'm not going to second guess them. I'm white, I do not have their experience of what it's like to live as an African American. I do my best to empathize with their pain, but I know that I will never have to live it.

All I can think of is this: if my own children were being abused and murdered just because of the color of their skin, you damn well bet that I would be screaming to high heaven about it! And I wouldn't give a shit who I inconvenienced with my screaming.

jaysunb

(11,856 posts)
25. Thank you for your empathy...
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:06 PM
Sep 2015

and I agree that people should "use any means necessary" to stop the latest assault on my people, but as I said in my post, " my age, personal experience does not give me a lot of confidence in some of the approaches and tactics that the group has employed.

Lastly, I have not doubt if this atrocity were occurring to you or yours I'm betting your voice would be heard and the situation acted on. But, that's another story.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
29. I really appreciate your reply.
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:20 PM
Sep 2015

I can't think of anything else to say but "thank you."

On edit: I ought to have also said that being here in the AA group is always a learning experience, and your post is very much a part of that.

underthematrix

(5,811 posts)
26. I like Bernie but I'm not voting for him. I agree with
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:10 PM
Sep 2015

the focus of his policy agenda. But Bernie does not have the executive skills to run the country and any person of color who is thinking about voting for him in the primary should think the geopolitical environment in which the the next President will operate. Governing is coalition building and getting what you can which is not always what you want.

underthematrix

(5,811 posts)
30. I have a deep and abiding hate for Cornel West. I understand he went through a
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:28 PM
Sep 2015

lot of shit as a black academic. That's not easy. But in his rage and jealousy he has seen fit to say things about PBO that are unforgiveable. i will always hate his sorry ignorant ass.

I don't get the connection you are making between Cornel West and the geopolitical environment. Geopolitical refers to the global political environment.

SusanCalvin

(6,592 posts)
37. I wasn't aware, until a little while ago
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 10:33 PM
Sep 2015

Of things he said and the opinions as to why. (One of the reasons I hang out here.) I hate it when people are petty, which is what he appears to be, at least in this instance.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
40. Cornel West was hesitant to endorse Bernie Sanders
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 11:35 PM
Sep 2015

based on the Israel/Palestine issue

I don't hear my dear brother Bernie hitting that, and I'm not gonna sell my precious Palestinian brothers and sisters down the river only because of U.S. politics," he said in an interview with Grit TV. "The truth cuts over and against whatever the political arrangement is. So we've got to be able to somehow keep track of anti-Jewish hatred, which is evil, and occupations of whatever sort--in this case, the vicious Israeli occupation that's evil as well."


If some I/P stuff starts jumping off...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/zahra-haider/bernie-sanders-stand-for-_b_8142236.html

Here's a better link and a fuller West quote:

West, ever-critical and stubbornly conscientious, was an early skeptic of then-Senator Obama’s campaign in 2007-08, only to sign on to the Obama team and do 65 events for the candidate after a conversation between the two convinced West of Obama’s progressive bona fides. Similarly, West has withheld a ringing and thorough endorsement of Sanders, citing Sanders’ positions on the Israel-Palestine conflict.

“But I also think, in terms of foreign policy, on the one hand we have escalating anti-Jewish hatred around the world, and we’ve got to fight anti-Jewish hatred under all conditions,” West began. “On the other hand, we have a vicious Israeli occupation that needs to be highlighted, because occupations are wrong.”

West continued: “I don’t hear my dear brother Bernie hitting that, and I’m not gonna sell my precious Palestinian brothers and sisters down the river only because of U.S. politics. The truth cuts over and against whatever the political arrangement is. So we’ve got to be able to somehow keep track of anti-Jewish hatred, which is evil, and occupations of whatever sort—in this case, the vicious Israeli occupation that’s evil as well. And I think Bernie might pull back on some of those issues.”


http://www.salon.com/2015/06/24/bernie_sanders_cornel_west_the_radical_alliance_that_could_change_everything/

Number23

(24,544 posts)
44. I had no idea. You bring some deep and serious knowledge to every conversation you participate in
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 01:40 AM
Sep 2015

on this forum. I hope that you know that.

Chitown Kev

(2,197 posts)
46. Thank you, Number23
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 01:58 AM
Sep 2015

At times, I will acknowledge that like many others, I can bring my share of trolling and vitriol, lol...I don't like to do that but...

Number23

(24,544 posts)
31. I hear you and in large part agree with what you're saying.
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 09:51 PM
Sep 2015
But Bernie does not have the executive skills to run the country

I think that is one of the reasons so many people have no idea who he is despite his long career in Congress.

And yes, governing is coalition building. You're absolutely right. But I won't begrudge my mom or anyone that wants to support him. At least not now. I agree with you that there is far too much at stake to ever even contemplate having a Republican in the White House. We cannot allow that to happen.

SusanCalvin

(6,592 posts)
38. No Republican!
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 10:35 PM
Sep 2015

I'd throw Bernie under the bus right now if I thought it was necessary to avoid a Republican. But I don't. I think he has some very smart people working for him.

 

portlander23

(2,078 posts)
33. Tell your mom to write something
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 10:04 PM
Sep 2015

I'm a white liberal, and reading these discussions, I'm learning that what I don't know is a lot. My first reaction to BLM interrupting Bernie was anger and resentment. When I reflected on it, regardless of the tactics, what they're talking about is a lot more important than someone giving a speech.

As uncomfortable as it is to admit, that gut reaction comes from a place that's very ugly at worst, and ignorant at best.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
35. She is definitely considering it. I don't know how good of a writer she is though
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 10:13 PM
Sep 2015


but I'm willing to bet that what she writes will be absolutely sincere and genuine, if nothing else.

As uncomfortable as it is to admit, that gut reaction comes from a place that's very ugly at worst, and ignorant at best.

It is amazing of you to admit that. I know that wasn't easy. And I sincerely appreciate it.

JI7

(89,247 posts)
41. that's similar to Bravenak and what many others said
Sun Sep 20, 2015, 11:49 PM
Sep 2015

one reason i can continue to support Sanders is because i think many of the worst of his so called supporters would be behaving the same way if it was someone else. Elizabeth Warren comes to mind the most since many of them were supporting her and acting the same way .

so i don't see it as something Sanders himself is causing . in fact i see the total opposite with him.

it will be difficuilt for Sanders to win minority votes against clinton but that has more to do with the relationship the clintons built up with various people . it's not about sanders himself and i have noticed some clinton people claiming it has to do with black people not liking sanders because of religion which is bs.

hillary ended losing losing the black vote to Obama but she still did well enough with them to stay competitive and that is the realistic goal for Sanders.

i hope your mother writes the piece you mention and you can post it here.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
43. "black people not liking sanders because of religion"
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 01:37 AM
Sep 2015

What in the world???! Are there seriously no depths that some won't go to pretend that his lack of support in minority communities might simply be because people may not know who he is or just don't find him impressive??? That is just insane.

The constant attempts by some to portray black people as bigots just blows my mind. Throughout the history of the United States of America, it has never been black people that have repeatedly denied other people their rights at the ballot box and through legislation. It's been very clear who that's been and it has NOT been us.

i hope your mother writes the piece you mention and you can post it here.

That would be awesome. Don't know when that would happen but if she gives the okay, I'd love to.

Starry Messenger

(32,342 posts)
42. My mom is supporting him too. :)
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 01:03 AM
Sep 2015

In 2008 she was gung-ho for HRC and I tried to get her to vote Obama, but she said she wanted just once to vote for a woman for President. Now I'm for HRC and she's for Bernie. Her anxiety about her SS is a pretty big concern right now, so I think he pings on that for her.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
45. Damn, it would be nice if just ONCE you guys supported the same candidate, wouldn't it???
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 01:43 AM
Sep 2015


Her anxiety about her SS is a pretty big concern right now

Is your mom older than my mom? Mine is 64. She still works and I have in all honesty never even heard her talk about Social Security, retirement or anything like that. I think she still thinks she's got another 30 years in the workforce.

Starry Messenger

(32,342 posts)
49. I know right!
Mon Sep 21, 2015, 10:15 AM
Sep 2015

Mom is 71 now and living on a limited income, although she does have a pension from a city job she had, she knows she is very lucky. She has a windfall penalty on her SS as a result, and any bump is a little help. She grew up in poverty and still worries she will be living in a ditch someday. Even though she knows I would never let that happen...!

Moms! Your mom sounds like she could go another 30 years in the workforce! I think mom would have liked to have worked longer, she ended up having to retire early due to some workplace changes, but she still keeps busy!

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