Prez of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary: death penalty good 'cos God told 950 year old man so

[muriel_volestrangler]

(OK, it was a man who lived to 950, strictly - he was only 600 or so when God told him this, shortly after God had wiped out all but 6 of the human race, and all but 2 (or 7?) of all other land species)

In Genesis 9:6, God told Noah that the penalty for intentional murder should be death: “Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed, for God made man in his own image.”

The death penalty was explicitly grounded in the fact that God made every individual human being in his own image, and thus an act of intentional murder is an assault upon human dignity and the very image of God.
...
American society is quickly conforming to a secular worldview, and the clear sense of right and wrong that was Christianity’s gift to Western civilization is being replaced with a much more ambiguous morality.

We have lost the cultural ability to declare murder – even mass murder – to be deserving of the death penalty.
...
God affirmed the death penalty for murder as he made his affirmation of human dignity clear to Noah. Our job is to make it clear to our neighbors.

R. Albert Mohler Jr. is president of The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. The views expressed in this column belong to Mohler.

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2014/05/01/why-christians-should-support-the-death-penalty/

This would appear to call for us to kill God, by the way, given God's behaviour shortly before this instruction, but I suspect that's not Mohler's point. He wants a return to the clear Christian value he loves of killing people.

[randys1]

1. Ahh religion

Rears its ugly head again, the stupid and mean are almost exclusively found in one religion or another

[cbayer]

2. Lol, right. There is no stupid or mean outside of religion.

That is as ridiculous as those who say there is no good or morality outside of religion.

[randys1]

4. maybe not exclusively but i dont know any stupid or mean atheists, not a one

[cbayer]

5. Oh, that's very lucky for you.

I know stupid and mean believers, stupid and mean non-believers and stupid and mean people somewhere in the middle.

Your sample seems skewed, but that shouldn't be a problem for you.

Anyway, on the other side of the coin. Are most, if not all, of the believers you know stupid and mean?

[randys1]

6. Belief in an invisible man in the sky who sees everything is childish

usually people who cling to this nonsense struggle with reality in other areas

a few religious folks want to be good people but not that many

says someone who went to catholic school for 12 yrs, spent 3 yrs in his twenties studying the bible 3 hours a day

been there, done that

[cbayer]

7. Dismissing huge swaths of people by calling their beliefs

belief in an invisible man in the sky is childish.

People who cling to this way of describing people with religious beliefs often struggle in many ways, the least of which may just be maturity.

A lot of non-religious people are able to discuss their disagreement with religion or their own non-beliefs without resorting to it. Many.

Glad you have found your own path. Hope you come to a place where you will be glad for others that have found a different one.

[randys1]

12. My comment of exclusively was arrogant and I apologize

I was driving home last night and remembered the atheist, right wing asshole I am dealing with on my home board, who hates minorities and non property owners voting, etc.

sorry, i was wrong and arrogant

[cbayer]

14. I'm assuming that you meant this response to me (you replied

to yourself).

I appreciate the apology and welcome you to the religion group.

There is a wide variety of participants in this group and many are believers of one stripe or another.

You may find that you get to know some people of faith and find you have much more in common with them than you have differences.

Of course that is more likely to happen if you approach them with an open mind and some tolerance for different ideas.

And I think you will find that reciprocated for the most part.

I truly do appreciate your backing down on this. It's a very hard thing to do on the internet.

[rug]

8. How long have you been posting here?

[randys1]

9. not long, why

tell ya what, i will stay out of the religious forum

i have grown up and no longer need religion, for those who still need it I guess I will just leave them alone

life is too short to argue with you about it

p.s. there is equal amount of evidence for the existence of leprechauns as there is for god

that is a fact

[rug]

10. It was a joke.

[randys1]

13. but i can be an asshole so you kinda got me thining

[Starboard Tack]

17. Are you suggesting that Leprechauns do not exist?

You must lead a very sheltered life, or you haven't yet learnt how to squint properly.

[randys1]

18. I am still looking for my first UFO or bigfoot

[Starboard Tack]

19. Damn, you have been missing out on life.

Though I must admit I haven't managed to spot Bigfoot yet. Then again, he hides.

[cbayer]

11. If you are looking for a certain someone, he's around these parts lately.

[Starboard Tack]

16. You are very lucky. Maybe you haven't met enough yet

Hi, I'm an atheist who occasionally is stupid. I am also mean, at times, especially toward fellow atheists who display bigotry toward people of faith and gang up on believers.
Good job you didn't grow up in Stalinist Russia

[Igel]

3. Leaving the smart and mean for ideologies, I guess. n/t

[Goblinmonger]

20. There are plenty of stupid and mean atheists.

Exhibit 1: Ayn Rand.

I also have my moments.

[Iggo]

15. How fucking stupid does one have to be to believe that shit?

[Goblinmonger]

21. What is really frustrating to me

are those who will brush off this Noah revelation like it is ridiculous and then expect me to take the parts of the Bible they agree with seriously. It's just a book. It hold special weight only because it is the basis of a major religion and not because it is especially good. It's not really all that well written and though it is spattered with some good lessons, those are outnumbered by the horrible stuff in there.

[nil desperandum]

22. Death Penalty

I don't hold any religious beliefs at all, I am however not opposed to the death penalty.

It's all well and good to state someone will be held with no chance of parole for the rest of their lives in a cage, and then we place those prison guards responsible for these monsters in harm's way as some of these murderers become even more efficient in prison. The AB is a great example of what happens with monsters serving life in prison without chance of parole, they commit almost one fifth of all murders in prison while having less than one half of one percent of the total prison population...what mechanism exists to control these inmates who appear to be able to operate with impunity inside the prison system? These gangs have had their leaders dispersed but communications still take place and hits are ordered.

Guards and their families are targeted, in one day three guards were killed at three separate facilities to send a message to the guards letting them know they are not safe from the AB while inside their workplace. This is just one gang, it's certainly the most violent and effective but it's not the only gang at work in prison.

Short of strapping them to a table and feeding them intravenously for the rest of their lives it's clear given any opportunity to use violence they will take it. How do you address that? How do you eliminate the threat when these gangs have proven they can kill guards in a supermax under constant lockdown?

I think the death penalty is the only tool we have, gruesome though it may be. These are not people who will ever be rehabilitated nor will they ever be allowed to walk outside a prison wall again. The death penalty may prove to be the only method to break the power of some of these national scale criminal enterprises.

[onager]

23. He's a liberal by SBC standards.

Back in 1981, the President of the Southern Baptist Convention (SBC), Bailey Smith, got a message from Gawd that he proudly announced to the faithful:

God Almighty does not hear the prayer of a Jew.

Smith's bloviating wrecked 20 years of "interfaith dialogue" between Jews and Southern Baptists.

It also swung the whole SBC hard to the right, with help from Jerry Falwell's politicking. The SBC remains a bastion of conservative Fundiegelicalism to this day.

For one example: where previously Baptists were encouraged to dialogue with Jews, after this blow-up they were told to actively proselytize Jews and try to convert them.

I know all that because I'm from the Deep South and have many relatives/friends who are Baptist preachers, missionaries and other church workers. I've heard them complain about the structure of the SBC. All the major committees are controlled by hard-line Fundies, and anyone who disagrees with them gets sidelined/ignored.

Here's a good article on Smith's statement and its aftermath:

http://www.ethicsdaily.com/sbc-presidents-anti-jewish-remark-helped-spark-conservative-revolution-cms-6311

[stone space]

24. I suppose that God was just kidding with that 5th Commandment thingie. (nt)