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cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
Fri May 2, 2014, 01:18 PM May 2014

This is the problem with ceremonial prayer

As justice William Brennan said in his incisive dissent to the majority ruling in the 1983 Marsh v. Chambers case that ruled that ceremonial prayer to open the legislative sessions was constitutional, the trouble with prayer is that you have no control over what the prayer giver will say even if you prescribe what prayers are acceptable, which you are not allowed to do anyway since that would be tantamount to having an official government prayer.

And we see that Brennan was indeed prophetic because of what happened yesterday at the supposedly ‘nonpolitical, nonpartisan’ National Day of Prayer, one of those occasions that public figures love and pander to, where they can show their piety publicly. It is supposed to be an occasion for bland pious utterances that anyone can get behind such as extolling America’s uniqueness and greatness, which is a surefire crowd pleaser.

But James Dobson, founder of the extremist Christian group Focus on the Family, threw a wrench in the works and took the occasion to attack president Obama on the issue of abortion, saying, “President Obama, before he was elected, made it very clear that he wanted to be the abortion president. He didn’t make any bones about it. This is something that he really was going to promote and support, and he has done that, and in a sense he is the abortion president.”
This caused one congresswoman Rep. Janice Hahn (D-Calif.) to walk out in protest, pointing her finger at Dobson and saying, “This is inappropriate”.

But what is truly inappropriate is having such an occasion at all and Hahn shares the blame because she herself is co-chair of the weekly congressional prayer breakfast and thus an active promoter of this kind of nonsense.
It is probably a good thing that people like Dobson use these occasions as political events. Maybe that will make people realize that you cannot contain extemporaneous prayer within boundaries and the best thing is to avoid having governmental prayer events altogether.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/singham/2014/05/02/this-is-the-problem-with-ceremonial-prayer/
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This is the problem with ceremonial prayer (Original Post) cleanhippie May 2014 OP
36 USC 119 merely asks the President to make a proclamation. The so-called struggle4progress May 2014 #1
All the more reason to take their toy away. AtheistCrusader May 2014 #2
If you ever figure out an easy path to repeal, let us know struggle4progress May 2014 #3
Don't take the day away; just don't schedule any speakers, other than the Pres. himself? Brettongarcia May 2014 #4
We can't tell a private organization not to "celebrate" the day if they want struggle4progress May 2014 #5

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
1. 36 USC 119 merely asks the President to make a proclamation. The so-called
Fri May 2, 2014, 01:58 PM
May 2014

"National Day of Prayer Task Force" is a private organization, chaired for over twenty years by Shirley Dobson, wife of Focus on the Family dude James Dobson

Politics are to be expected on the Hill, and use of facilities on Capitol Hill will be governed by Congress itself. Anybody with enough political clout is going to find members of Congress willing to help schedule facilities for their use on the Hill. Evidently the National Day of Prayer Task Force obtained enough support from members of Congress to schedule use of the caucus room of the Cannon House Office Building for its "National Observance" of the National Day of Prayer, which began with greetings from Shirley Dobson, followed by a long line-up of such rightwing speakers as Oliver North and (naturally) James Dobson. And that's not surprising, because the "National Day of Prayer Task Force" is a rightwing front, which organizes using the "National Day of Prayer" as a smokescreen




AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
2. All the more reason to take their toy away.
Fri May 2, 2014, 05:32 PM
May 2014

When my child uses a toy to beat someone over the head, I take it away until he can behave himself.

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
3. If you ever figure out an easy path to repeal, let us know
Fri May 2, 2014, 08:25 PM
May 2014

Nobody on our side of the aisle will want to put much time into that, not only because the law doesn't really do anything, beyond providing an opportunity for rightwing posturing, but also because any effort to repeal the law would provide at least as much (if not more) opportunity for rightwing posturing

struggle4progress

(118,268 posts)
5. We can't tell a private organization not to "celebrate" the day if they want
Sat May 3, 2014, 01:51 PM
May 2014

And the rightwing has been complaining regularly since 2009 that Mr Obama doesn't do anything for the "National Day of Prayer" beyond issuing a proclamation

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