Religion
Related: About this forumThe U.S. Is Retreating from Religion
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/the-u-s-is-retreating-from-religion/...In the figure, the dark lines show the fraction of respondents in each group for each year of the survey until 2016. The shaded areas show predictions, based on a statistical model of the relationship between year of birth, age, and religion.
...We can get a better view of generational changes if we group people by their year of birth, which captures information about the environment they grew up in, including the probability that they were raised in a religious tradition and their likely exposure to people of other religions. The following figure shows the share of people in each religious group, for birth years from 1880 to 1995:
Interesting trends.
AJT
(5,240 posts)that trend will not be allowed to continue.....
trotsky
(49,533 posts)We just need to vote.
No guarantee that the non-religious will vote Democratic, but they generally do so in very large percentages so that's a great sign.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Does this mean that theism is dying?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)the survey measures religious affiliation, not theism.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Unless one defines "religion" as belonging to a specific group and/or congregation.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)That person still hasn't proved their claim.
Everyone is waiting.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)trotsky
(49,533 posts)No one needs to take you seriously until you do.
You DEMANDED I prove a claim of mine from months ago, and I did.
Now show that you hold yourself to the same standard you hold others.
Prove your claim. Be a decent person, prove it or admit you made it up. Wouldn't that be the "Christian" thing to do? Are you a Christian?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)followed by a statement that is incorrect.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)My apologies!
But I've proved my claim, as everyone has witnessed. You are only humiliating yourself more by denying it.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Taking each sentence as separate. 1-2-3, in that order.
I hope that this helps.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)But you ARE a Christian. Cool. Perhaps you will finally act like a good one.
Time for you to prove YOUR claim.
What good does it do to dwell on this, guillaumeb? You are only making yourself look worse.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)You can explain that assertion is proof if you wish, but reality does not work that way.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)Prove your claim.
I'm still waiting. Shut me up. Prove your claim. Do it. Can you?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Any who follow this silly issue know it also.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)If you proved your claim, then link to it.
Shouldn't be hard.
if you actually did it, that is.
Link to your proof.
I dare you.
NeoGreen
(4,031 posts)Mark me down as waiting for a response/answer too.
Just sayin'.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)Screaming at everyone else to document every statement (or his deceitful modification of it) that they make (to his ever-changing requirements), while steadfastly refusing to back up anything he says.
People notice this. They understand he is not to be taken seriously.
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)It comes to mind.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)People who believe in God or spirits but are not affiliated with any group often describe themselves as "spiritual" rather than religious. I do think there is a distinction to be made between organized religion and individual spiritual practice. Organized religion is trending down. I haven't seen any surveys on individual spiritual practice.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,271 posts)2nd definition Google gives me. So, no, the title isn't "misleading" in any way.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)Still waiting.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Which I do not expect to happen anytime in the near future.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)snooper2
(30,151 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)MineralMan
(146,262 posts)The graphs have meaning, if you understand how such charts work. You might not like that meaning, but it is there in the curves the graph represents. They look very much like exponential curves, actually at their earlier shallow angles, but the angles are increasing. We shall see where they head.
If you look at population curves, you'll see a similar exponential shape. The curve continues to steepen over time. Will the curves in those charts continue that progression? We'll have to wait and see. The human population curve doesn't trend upward at an angle over 45 degrees for hundreds of thousands of years, but then steepens quickly.
Have you taken a class in statistical analysis? You should.
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)I have doubts we'll ever fully cure theism, but I'll take all the progress we can make.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Are you implying that theism is a sickness, a disease of some sort?
What an interesting and revealing comment.
Cartoonist
(7,309 posts)That's the word the RCC uses to describe homosexuality.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Another revealing comment. But I do not judge all non-theists by the words of a few.
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)As long as they don't actually practice christianity?
Mariana
(14,854 posts)"Practicing Christianity" is such a vague term that it really is meaningless. There are thousands of Christian denominations and millions of unaffiliated Christian individuals. Each of them "practices Christianity" in a particular way, and each is sure they are "practicing Christianity" the right way, and all the other Christians are doing it wrong.
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)Don't look at me. I'm not the one who invented rubbish like, "Hate the sin, not the sinner."
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)It's communicable and it kills a lot of people.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)I suspect it would not play as well in a classroom or debate setting.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)who sing about peace on earth then start holy wars?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)What do you call people who drop atomic devices on civilians in the name of freedom?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)An interesting position.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)What type of belief system, what type of believer, calls committing a war crime a patriotic act?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Most wars in history have involved what we today consider war crimes. But nobody thinks a nation state should not have an army, should not have a right to defend itself or is really that surprised when it does terrible things in war (except maybe it's own citizens, who are almost always subject to war propaganda). On the other hand, religions claim to come in the name in the name of peace and unity. A religious war should be an oxymoron. But unfortunately it isn't.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Agreed. So if people who claim to subscribe to a belief system start a war, what do we say about that? Do we condemn patriotism, or do we condemn those who use patriotism to justify war?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)We must disagree.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)is not related to patriotism. It's an opinion about history that is shared by billions of people around the world who agree that historical events happen for certain reasons.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)wherein a country, or the concept of country, is the object of the belief.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)faith based on a series of beliefs but not formalized into a religion; also, a fixed coherent set of beliefs prevalent in a community or society
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/belief-system
Some people insist that belief can only be applied to a formal religious system, but any set of beliefs can comprise a belief system.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)GOP voters and Democratic voters seem to have quite different views.
I think love of country is one component. A belief in the goodness, the necessity, of that country.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)be·lief
1.
an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.
"his belief in the value of hard work"
2.
trust, faith, or confidence in someone or something.
"a belief in democratic politics"
synonyms: faith, trust, reliance, confidence, credence
"belief in the value of hard work"
Do you accept these definitions. If so does "love" fall under definition 1 or 2? Is it possible to love something without believing in it either its necessity or its goodness? To be a patriot, must you have trust faith or confidence in the United States? How many liberals have that trust in the United States now? How many conservatives had it under Obama?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)So I think that it is self explanatory.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)"faith based on a series of beliefs but not formalized into a religion"
That's YOUR chosen definition for a belief system. We're gonna roll with it!
Your definition says that not every belief system is a religion (it's "NOT formalized into a religion" ), but every religion IS a belief system.
So you just confirmed you have been making a logical error this entire time. Every time someone criticizes religion, you leap in with your "but... but... patriotism" shtick.
But your chosen definition says that patriotism isn't formalized into a religion.
Religion IS formalized, and contains specific beliefs. Those specific beliefs are sometimes clearly harmful, and result in the harm done in the name of religion.
However, you can't complain that patriotism is just as bad, because nothing you identify as being part of patriotism is actually, FORMALLY, part of "patriotism" because it's not formalized. According to the definition that YOU provided.
Way to go, dude. You just humiliated yourself again. This is way too much fun.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)5,798,314 so far this year.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)I've lost track, since you make it so easy tripping yourself up all the time.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)trotsky
(49,533 posts)You have in the past noted how stupid you think I am, so it's nice you are helping. Way to go!
NeoGreen
(4,031 posts)...it boils down to just 2 basic concepts:
But you know as well as I, patriotism is a word; and one that generally comes to mean either: my country, right or wrong, which is infamous; or my country is always right, which is imbecile.
it applies to 'religious beliefs' too.
But you know as well as I, faith is just a word; and one that generally comes to mean either: my religion, right or wrong, which is infamous; or my religion is always right, which is imbecile.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)But, in contrast to your apparent binary world view, there are other options.
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)But my day job involves locking myself in a small room to have arguments with doctors and judges. Rest assured, when discussing a serious matter with well-prepared people who can not only articulate their own position but at least correctly define my own position, I approach it much differently than talking about religion with you. After all, those situations have absolutely nothing in common.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Would you agree?
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)I genuinely don't have a sense of superiority--all that time with doctors and judges does keep me humble and remind me how much time I definitely don't spend as the smartest guy in the room.
But since you will incorrectly define any position except your own--which you refuse to define at all--you have to accept that one of the consequences of those failures is how people view you. That's not about me. There's also the other matter you're being called on by somebody else. That's not about me, either.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Perhaps you should consider a career as a carpenter.
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)Mixing those just once resulted in millions dead and billions with quality of life damaged. No thanks.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)were you implying that religious belief is, in your view, a mental disorder?
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)Some are at least conceivably defensible under the right circumstances if you squint and hold your head just right. Within the overall umbrella of "theism" falls some absolutely insane crap, though. Sadly, the stuff which most needs to go is also the stuff which is going to be the hardest to eradicate. Of course, you refuse to indicate whether or not you're in that group.
And if you would care to insist that I have to pretend that it's all sane because religious liberty prevents me from calling bat-guano crazy exactly what it is, I have one thing to say to you: Go ahead and drink the Kool-Aid.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Deliberate overstatement? An expression of personal feeling?
Pope George Ringo II
(1,896 posts)I have hopes that there will come a day when anyone who can handle reality on their own will choose to do so. When that happens, we can talk about curing the rest. As it is, there are some who could stand to be cured now.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)I mean, couldn't build a sheep shed LOL...
So he quit and found out he can make a living walking around telling funny stories...
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)If He had been.................
SonofDonald
(2,050 posts)That's why I say keep your religion to yourselves, don't ever point it towards me, I have no problem with your beliefs as long as you do so.
If not, then it's fucking on......
NeoGreen
(4,031 posts)... be more Nones than Protestants."
Worth repeating:
...and among the youngest adults, there may already be more Nones than Protestants."
trotsky
(49,533 posts)Careful, this upsets the sensitive religious folks among us. They need to know that belief is god is as strong as it ever was, even stronger, that nothing is changing, etc.
NeoGreen
(4,031 posts)..."god now, god tomorrow and god forever!"...
Talk about railing against the tide...so to speak...
Turbineguy
(37,295 posts)preferring Mammon since it pays so much better.
Ohiya
(2,224 posts)Go Nones !!