Joan Walsh: "Catholics need to preach what we practice"

[MarkCharles]

"When 98 percent of Catholics use birth control, why is Obama in hot water for making sure insurance covers it?"
BY JOAN WALSH

"Let’s make a couple of things clear here. Obviously, the law won’t force Catholics to use contraception. And 98 percent of Catholics already practice birth control (and not the “natural family planning” kind), according to the Alan Guttmacher Institute. It’s not as though Catholics are an endangered minority of true believers being forced to transgress a fervently held and widely practiced church rule. This battle is over a Catholic Church teaching that even Catholics ignore almost unanimously.

The administration’s requirement comes from the Institute of Medicine within the National Academy of Sciences, which considers contraception access part of a total healthcare plan that brings down maternal and infant mortality rates. The government sets minimal basic standards for the benefits and safety conditions employers must provide to employees. What if Catholic hospitals and universities and public agencies objected to occupational safety rules for doctrinal reasons? Child labor laws? Would people argue they should be exempt from those regulations? Of course not."

MORE: http://www.salon.com/2012/02/02/catholics_need_to_preach_what_we_practice/singleton/

[geckosfeet]

1. Still ruminating on this in 2012?

No wonder the catholic church has become almost irrelevant on the issue of birth control.

http://www.salon.com/2012/02/02/catholics_need_to_preach_what_we_practice/singleton/

Now Catholic bishops are urging priests and parishes to rise up against the Obama administration’s alleged violation of religious freedom. It’s bad enough that men with no credibility on the issue of sexuality get to tell their fellow Catholics what to do. They do not get to tell the American president what to do.

Paradoxically, Dionne chides Obama for his contraception decision given the great lengths the president went to in order to make sure that his healthcare reform legislation wouldn’t fund insurance that covered abortion in 2010. But as Dionne himself notes, the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops continued to dissemble anyway and insist the bill still provided abortion funding, despite a very public compromise by the president that angered many pro-choice Democrats. As the president has learned the hard way on many fronts, the politics of placating extremists only leads to more extremism. Obama was absolutely correct to draw a line in the sand here.

On edit - added 'on the issue of birth control'. Although I do believe that the catholic church's positions are irrelevant on many other issues as well.
Second edit - added excerpt from OP's link

[Goblinmonger]

6. I think the "no credibility on the issue of sexuality" is a tired old chestnut.

I have a good number of long-term friends that are priests and I can tell you that they have had sex in their past, currently have sexual feelings, and do understand the issues.

[cbayer]

2. Great article by Joan Walsh, who is a self-identified Catholic.

I watched the Friday News Shows last night and found the discussion of this really illuminating.

The male commentators, from both the left and right, described this decision as an unmitigated disaster for the Obama administration.

The female commentators, again from both sides, praised it.

Go figure.

[skepticscott]

3. Catholics like Walsh are so cute

They flaunt virtually every tenet of their faith, and yet they still cling to it like a life preserver, in favor of any other. And they pompously denounce the egregious wrongs perpetrated by their church when it is mainstreamedly expedient to do so, all the while acting as if they've discovered and are boldly declaring something that intelligent people haven't known for a long time.

Gary Wills is an even more obnoxious purveyor of this type of pap.

[Angry Dragon]

4. The Catholics have to figure out if the pope and cardinals are the church,

or the people are the church.

[edhopper]

5. The apparent answer

as far as the Vatican and Clergy are concerned is the people are not the Church. This was self evident in the child abuse scandal. They chose to protect themself over the victims in the congregation. People can choose the church they want, but Catholics should realize they are not the Church and never will be. Martin Luther figured that out.

[skepticscott]

7. Many Catholics also fail to grasp

that the RCC is not a democracy, and never will be, despite all of their quaint little protest groups, and their profession to want to change the church "from within" (code for "we don't have the balls to send a message by actually leaving the Catholic church, so we'll fool ourselves into thinking that we can change things in any meaningful way if we stay&quot

[edhopper]

8. That's the thing

Unless they are a priest, they are not "within the church".

[Dorian Gray]

12. I understand

why people who are not Roman Catholic feel that way. What happened within the church was disgusting, and it made people turn away in droves. However, when one believes the main tenants of the church (Nicene Creed) to be true and when one was raised as a Roman Catholic and identifies as such, it's difficult to leave the church.

The sins of others, even priests, Bishops, Cardinals and the Pope, don't change the theological tenants of Roman Catholicism. Having said that, I'd be lying of the overtly political nature of the Vatican and even my local diocese didn't give me pause and question the structure of the church. It's evident that it's run by human beings who often have more concerns for the economics of the church than for the human beings that the church is comprised of and supposed to serve.

Some people respond to this by leaving the church, while others focus on a local grassroots activities. And still others stick their heads in the sand.

[skepticscott]

14. Lots of denominations adhere to

the tenets of the Nicene Creed. What exactly does Roman Catholicism have that none of the others do that justifies continuing to support it in the face of so many egregious offenses?

[Dorian Gray]

15. Transubstantiation

And I also included being born and raised within the church. For many, there is a culture that goes along with it.

And local parishes may meet the needs and desires of congregants.

You asked, and I'm answering. We could further argue. Honestly, I don't really want to. It is what it is.

[MarkCharles]

16. I think some Protestant faiths believe that, too!

I'm not sure, haven't studied much religion in 30 years!

The "local parishes meet needs" statement. Well, so do local Protestant and Jewish houses of worship, as do Mosques, too.

[Dorian Gray]

20. Transubstantiation

is not a Protestant tenet. I do think that Eastern Orthodox churches believe it, though.

All those houses of worship may meet the needs of their local congregants/members/adherents. Most of them are culturally raised within that faith, and they find a house of worship that most meets their needs.

I've said to other posters that I'm not really in this discussion to argue. (I'm going to Las Vegas today, so I couldn't even spend the time doing it even if I wanted!) But, I'm providing an answer to a question asked: Why would people remain catholic. Basically they grew up Catholic and it's familiar to them, they adhere to the main tenets of the religion, and/or they like their church community. Those are my answers.

I'm not defending the church from years of sexual abuse. Just answering a very basic question.

[skepticscott]

17. Except that there is no transsubstantiation

it's always bread and wine and always has been. TS is just imagined. Ask anyone with a wheat gluten allergy. Other denominations are honest with themselves and stay happy with symbolism.

[Humanist_Activist]

18. Yeah, that was one of the nuttiest ideas that caused me to question my faith in Catholicism...

just couldn't bring myself to believe it, one of the first dominoes to fall, so to speak.

[Dorian Gray]

19. Right

a question was asked, and I answered.

I have no intention on getting into a long winded argument over then tenets. I question things all the time myself. I was just answering the why people would still be catholic.

[skepticscott]

22. There's no need for a long-winded argument

Just explain to us why, if the host REALLY transforms into the true body of Christ, people who have a wheat gluten allergy and eat it have the same negative reaction as they do before "transsubstantiation". That will end the discussion on the spot. Simple, right?

Have at it.

[Crunchy Frog]

9. Oh that would be interesting, but I think you can go to jail for that sort of thing.

[Silent3]

10. 98% sounds like a number pulled out of somebody's ass

While I don't doubt that a majority of adult American Catholics support the use of birth control, the idea that 98% use birth control -- especially meaning non-church approved methods of birth control -- seems like a ludicrously high percentage.

First of all, not all Catholics are sexually active. Many are without partners, or are too young, or are too old and infirm, to be sexually active. Some are asexual. Some Catholics are sexually active but for one natural reason or another (such as menopause) are infertile, making birth control irrelevant.

Even if I give this number a huge benefit of the doubt by turning the claim into "98% of currently or previously sexually active adult American Catholics are using or have at one time used artificial birth control", I'd have a hard time believing that was true, that you couldn't find more than 2% who manage to stick with official church doctrine through some combination of church-accepted birth control (abstinence, "rhythm" method, infrequent sex) and acceptance of pregnancy whenever it happens.

[Dorian Gray]

11. I think that #

included the idea that they used some form (including Rhythm Method and Withdrawl, as well as those not approved by the Church) at some point in their lifetime.

[Silent3]

13. If the number does include Church-approved methods...

...then it's a number which is beside the point for the argument being made.

The larger point probably remains true, however, that a majority of American Catholics aren't against artificial birth control either, and would like to have medical insurance cover it no matter who's providing the insurance. I'd just prefer to see this case being made without misleading and faulty numbers, which someone might attack to deflect the important point.

[muriel_volestrangler]

21. It's "non-approved methods", and came from a 2006-2008 survey of over 7,000 women

(aged 15-44) and was published in the form getting quoted in 2011. The 98% figure is for all those women who have ever had sex, and refers to using, at least once, some non-approved form of contraception, not 'regularly' or 'currently'.

Among all women who have had sex, 99% have
ever used a contraceptive method other than natural
family planning. This figure is virtually the same,
98%, among sexually experienced Catholic women.

Only 2% of Catholic women rely* on natural family
planning; even among Catholic women who attend
church once a month or more, only 2% rely on this
method (not shown). Sixty-eight percent of Catholic
women use highly effective methods: sterilization
(32%, including 24% using female sterilization,) the
pill or another hormonal method (31%) and the IUD
(5%).

*Refers to sexually active women who are not pregnant, postpartum or trying to get pregnant.

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/Religion-and-Contraceptive-Use.pdf

[cleanhippie]

23. To do so would be for catholics to acknowledge and accept that they church is hypocritical...

And that just won't do.