Religion
Related: About this forumWhat good is religion?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/on-faith/wp/2013/09/09/what-good-is-religion/By Sigfried Gold, Published: September 9 at 11:21 am
mage: Kevin Ambrose
The work of self-transformation can be done through psychotherapy, religious practice, reading self-help books, independent resolutions and intentions, consulting coaches, gurus, psychics, body healers, mind healers and faith healers of all stripes. People come to the work of self-transformation in moments of despair, moments of hope, after long reflection, through happenstance, and some, myself included, make the pursuit of self-transformation the central work and preoccupation of their lives.
By self-transformation I mean a somewhat ill-defined effort to be a better person, whatever that may mean to any individual. Education is transformational, but taking a course in engineering is not the kind of overall self-improvement Im talking about. A course in literature, philosophy or music appreciation might, intentionally or unintentionally, lead to a more expansive sense of ones humanity or purpose in life; so that kind of education might be included when we consider the set of tool available for self-transformation. Engaging in psychotherapy, listening to a sermon on forgiveness, or resolving to meditate daily are unambiguously acts of attempted self-transformation.
A few hundred years ago, religion had a monopoly on the self-transformation business. Self-transformation, moral improvement, efforts to get oneself or others to be morally better, have always been a central concern of religions (at least the ones sometimes referred to as Axial-Age religions), but seldom their sole concern. Religions also concern themselves with explaining cosmology, acquiring political and economic power, establishing and legislating social norms, killing or converting heathens. If religions stuck with helping people, non-coercively, in their attempts at self-transformation, they probably would not be ignored, hated or ridiculed as they are by growing numbers of the religiously disaffected.
Religions have certain advantages in the self-transformation arena that cant be matched by secular forms of this work. One is the idealif not actual attitudeof religions towards money. Although the financial costs of religion can be quite high (giving away a tenth of ones income is not uncommon), payment is generally voluntary; newcomers and poorer congregants can usually enjoy all the benefits of community, moral guidance and support, meaningful rituals, comfort in times of adversity, without having to pay more than they choose. Disingenuously or not, religions claim to be motivated by concerns beyond money, and obligate themselves to at least put on a show of providing services unattached to remuneration. For people outside the social welfare system, secular self-transformational help must be paid for. Much of the support in a religious community comes from other congregants rather than from paid clergy. As a special case, 12-step recovery fellowships, which include some of the largest organizations in the world, offer their members access to daily or hourly support, essentially for free, that could only be matched among secular service providers by extremely expensive in-patient treatment centers or psychiatry wards.
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rrneck
(17,671 posts)every religion, political party, art, sport, and any other assorted meme succumbs to wealth by becoming the source of a revenue stream. The only difference may be that some are designed to produce revenue and others are not. It's a lot easier to walk away from a source of inspiration when it becomes iniquitous if it does not define itself in terms of absolutes and bound itself in eternity. When they do that they start the process of closing doors instead of opening them.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Do you think that there is no true altruism in some organizations?
While I agree that both money and power can easily corrupt just about any organization or individual, I think the argument he makes for religious groups to get back to doing what they do best is interesting, if not convincing.
rrneck
(17,671 posts)The question is not whether there is true altruism, but how much it gives balanced against how much it takes. In the end it always comes down to resources, which is to say property. And AA has property just like any other organization. I guarantee somebody out there somewhere makes a living off AA. If that person is human, he or she will want more. It's what humans do. And even if everybody that works for AA is a saint, it is surrounded by others that are not.
You hardly ever hear the followers of a religion shouting "throw the bums out!". Irreverence, not piety, is soul of social justice.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Young guy who decided he was only going to do what he wanted to do, whether it paid or not.
He's still doing it, but he's now making some money off it.
I live very simply and I don't want more when it comes to material resources.
I would put up the example of Moral Mondays as an example of followers of a religion shouting "throw the bums out". And then there was Jesus. I think both irreverence and piety can drive social justice, and usually it is both.
rrneck
(17,671 posts)I like this guy.
Moral Mondays runs off the world's oldest natural resource: human emotion. Martin Luther was a simple pious man as well and look what happened to protestantism. And that whole Jesus throwing the money changers out of the temple thing didn't slow them down much. Like I said, sooner or later the same thing always happens. Hell, even Grandpa Dobri rides the bus now.
That's not to say all religion is bad or those who believe in it are fools. It's just that there has to be some sort of check on its ability to use emotion to motivate people. We have the solution to that problem. It's called liberal nationalism. The wall between the church and state has to be high and wide because there is no way the state can compete with promises of divinity and eternal life. We can't tell people what to believe because regulating religion is like regulating sex, people are going to do it no matter what. But if we focus the function of the state on the equitable distribution of resources, we have a common currency upon which to base equity. When religion gets involved, and sometimes when it doesn't, piety becomes currency with disastrous results.
Your rights stop at the other fellow's nose, no matter how you may feel about it.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)"I don't see any other way to get these things, therefore we need religion."
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)"a more expansive sense of ones humanity or purpose in life"
Begs the question in that there IS a purpose in life to be known, and that someone, some thing, or some ideology can give you insight into a purpose from without, rather than within.
Not sure why engineering can't lead to a more expansive view of humanity, given some engineers actually build things that humans use. Meaning they have to know what humans want, they have to know what materials are best available, preserves natural habitat upon which we are reliant, structures, shelters, commerce that is affordable to the target audience, etc. And given that engineers get out in the field, they see humanity first hand.
I build. I make. I do so, for humans, not machines. If I come up with a shelter for someone, but I built it in a fashion that the target audience cannot use, or cannot afford, it is useless.
Engineers of some types also have to cater to people of certain needs. Try designing a home for a person who cannot stand.
Don't tell me engineers cannot lead to a more expansive sense of Humanity. The author of this article is supremely ignorant.