A Catholic church schism under Pope Francis isn’t out of the question

[rug]

The conservative backlash against the liberal pope’s authority has been fierce, and is gathering momentum



‘The papal slipper may be on the other, liberal foot this time, but it has always booted bishops out.’ Photograph: Massimo Valicchia/NurPhoto/Rex

Thursday 30 October 2014 07.44 EDT

Until this weekend, I had largely believed in the liberal narrative which holds that Pope Francis’s reforms of the Catholic church are unstoppable. But the conservative backlash has been so fierce and so far-reaching that for the first time a split looks a real, if distant, possibility.

One leading conservative, the Australian Cardinal George Pell, published over the weekend a homily he had prepared for the traditional Latin mass at which he started ruminating on papal authority. Pope Francis, he said, was the 266th pope, “and history has seen 37 false or antipopes”.

Why mention them, except to raise the possibility that Francis might turn out to be the 38th false pope, rather than the 266th real one?

This is a fascinating nudge in the direction of an established strain of conservative fringe belief: that liberalising popes are not in fact real popes, but imposters, sent by the devil. The explanation has an attractively deranged logic: if the pope is always right, as traditionalists would like to believe, and if this particular pope is clearly wrong, as traditionalists also believe, then obviously this pope is not the real pope. Splinter groups have held this view ever since the liberalising papacy of Pope John XXIII at the start of the 1960s. I don’t think that’s what Pell meant, but it was odd and threatening to bring the subject up at all.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/30/catholic-church-schism-pope-francis-liberal-conservative

[TommyCelt]

1. I've been expecting this...and I don't enjoy being right about it <nt>

[rug]

2. The backlash may be met with another, stronger backlash.

[47of74]

5. If I was Francis I would be calling these guys to the Vatican right about now for a sit down

And my sit down with them would consist of me saying something like the following;

Hey look fellas. I didn't ask for this job but I was called by my brother Cardinals to do this job. And I'm going to do this job to the best of my ability, in the way I think our Lord would want me to proceed. You were all about papal infallibility when Benedict and John Paull II (may God rest his soul) were seated in the chair of Peter, even when it caused pain and division in the church. But now when I try to make the church a more Christ-like institution you start complaining and trying to undermine me? If you have concerns or suggestions I want to hear them. But this undermining of me stops here and now, unless you wish to be stripped of your ranks and spending the rest of your lives as simple parish priests in the Arctic Circle. And if that's what you want I suggest you sell all that fine crap you like wearing and invest in some heavy duty winter clothing now.

[okasha]

6. Surely McMurdo Station needs a chaplain, too.

[47of74]

7. That'd be good.

I forgot about them. That would be a good place to send a wayward Cardinal.

[Fortinbras Armstrong]

10. I'm thinking of Papal Nuncio to Greenland or Lesotho or North Korea

I'm afraid that I have no sympathy whatsoever for conservatives whining "We're not getting our way, so we're going to take our toys and go home".

[beemer27]

3. I hope that he stays true to himself.

There are many of us who are still Catholic, but have not been in full communion with the Church for years. Francis looks as if he wants to reunite all of the Church. Hopefully the ultra conservative wing of the Church will not sabotage him. I call on the Almighty to bless Francis, and grant him success in his quest.

[rug]

4. Amen.

[emotimatly]

8. Hypocrites

Ultra conservatives Catholics are in denial that their faith's theology has evolved and changed over the centuries. Doctrine is not static, although very slow to change, changes non-the less, often to accommodate the truth it can't see in some elements of scientific discovery and fact! And what does this thought of schism mean to the real word of Christ?

[rug]

9. Weicome to DU!

[Ink Man]

11. This Pope is all over the place.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2014/11/07/Pope-Francis-Warns-Against-Becoming-Pagan-Christians

Not all those who claim to be Christians really are, said Pope Francis Friday morning. Some are Christians “in name only,” he said. “They bear the name of Christians but live a life of pagans.”

In his homily at Mass, the Pope that there have always been two types of Christian, those who truly followed Christ and those who only pretended to. At the time of Saint Paul, there were “worldly Christians, Christians in name only, with two or three Christian features, but nothing more.” The Pope called this sort of people “Pagan Christians,” whom St. Paul called “enemies of the cross of Christ.” <snip>

[rug]

12. Welcome to DU!

Interesting story. Breitbart is considered a suspect source for its history of spinning news for a conservative agenda. Right now there are a lot of conservative efforts to marginalize Francis.

Here's the official source.

http://www.news.va/en/news/pope-at-santa-marta-enemies-of-the-cross-of-christ