Alana Massey: Taking Christ out of Christianity

[chervilant]

Alanna Massey writes:

When I tell my socially progressive, atheist friends that I’m “culturally Christian,” they’re momentarily concerned that I have a latent preoccupation with guns and the Pledge of Allegiance.

Using the term with devout believers gets me instructions that I just need to read more sophisticated theology to come around. I’ve tried hard to accept my fully secular identity, and at other times I’ve tried to read myself into theistic belief, going all the way through divinity school as part of the effort. Still, I remain unable to will myself into any belief in God or gods — but also unable to abandon my relationship to the Episcopalian faith into which I was born and to the ancient stories from which it came.

Although I am without a god, I am not alone.

***

I have not heard the term "culturally Christian," but I recognize the pull of thousands of years of history and tradition. This, I think, is why my adjurations are laced with "oh, God!"s and "Jesus H. Christ on a Cracker!" (I still don't know whence came that one...), and why it is certain isolation for me when I acknowledge that I do not believe there exists some jealous, vindictive, old, white guy in flowing robes holding forth in the heavens and watching (judging) our every move. (Actually, I count among my friends quite a number of "non-believers" whose honesty about their atheism gives me the courage to be more "out" with my own.)

I think the insistence that we are all born in sin was the first chasm I chose not to span. There have been others, but this is the most salient from my childhood. Now, with nieces and nephews who cling vociferously to their own versions of christianity--as well as a few who are creeping towards their own versions of atheism--I am reminded of my own journey away from the pervasive and persuasive minions of the fear-based fallacies of religious mythologies.

Like Ms. Massey, I miss the sense of community and support I found in the one church I attended for a wee time. However, I am finding my own sense of community and support with my fellow atheists. This new-found community with kindred spirits is proving far more enriching and intriguing.

I remain hopeful that our younglings will continue--in ever increasing numbers--to relegate fear-based mythologies to the dust bins of history, even as I recognize that our imminent extinction event will likely render such intellectual freedom moot. If you are interested in reading the rest of this article, you can find it here.

[chervilant]

11. Indeed, habits are difficult to break.

As Joseph Campbell observed, we need our myths and legends.

[onager]

2. Thanks. This line cracked me up.

Using the term with devout believers gets me instructions that I just need to read more sophisticated theology to come around.

Yeah, we non-believers get that suggestion a lot on DU. I think that first we're supposed to read the whole Bible in several versions to make sure we don't miss anything.

Then read all the early Church fathers from Tertullian on up, especially Aquinas. At some point, I guess, we work our way up to modern Sophisticated Theologians like Joel Osteen, Deepak Chopra, Karen Armstrong et. al.

By that time, our brains will have been overcome by Religious Stockholm Syndrome and we're so confused we will agree to anything. I consider it just a mental version of waterboarding.

[trotsky]

4. LOL +1 n/t

[chervilant]

13. A mental version of waterboarding...

It reminds me of a different form of water torture--the relentless single drip of water, infinitely applied.

[trotsky]

3. My only objection to such a term...

is that it implies so many things are due solely to (or uniquely associated with) Christianity, when they are clearly not.

[Curmudgeoness]

5. Actually, I think that many things in our culture are associated with Christianity.

Our laws are based, for the most part, on the Bible. The weekend, which includes Sunday, when so many businesses are closed, is based on the Sabbath. Many states do not allow alcohol sales on Sunday, or at least not on Sunday mornings. Christmas is a big deal, even for people who are atheist, since there is the time off of work for the holiday, and even retail stores closed. Even our vocabulary is laced with god-related terms----Oh, god, I wish I was thin. God damn it (and even just the word "damn&quot . I pray things work out for you.

I like to think that there isn't a lot of influence on my culture from Christianity, but there is and I don't even think about it.

[trotsky]

6. Oh certainly, but I'm thinking of things like democracy, civil rights, freedom of religion, etc.

Even holidays like Solstice or Spring Equinox. Not Christian - stolen/co-opted by Christians, yes. But not Christian in origin.

[kiri]

7. Our laws are NOT based on the Bible

"Our laws are based, for the most part, on the Bible."
This is a terrible MYTH.

The Bible never once mentions democracy. The Bible never once mentions freedom of speech or freedom of religion. It does not mention checks and balances and limitations on the power of the executive; nor an independent judicial branch; it does not mention elections or voting.

The Bible does not even mention tolerance for other believers, much less non-believers. There are more than 200 denominations in the US alone, and each claims to have the one true faith. The sheer number of claims makes it difficult to believe any one of them. And there are so many different versions of the Bible--including the Douay-Rheims used by Catholics that contains more books and different commandments! The KJV is well-known to have deliberately changed text to meet the political needs of the time.

The Bible provides no model for ‘good’ government or for personal freedoms. The Bible is a purely religious/theological document for some believers. The Commandments—10 or all 613 of them—do not represent American society.

We are not a Christian nation, nor a Judeo-Christian nation. We are a Constitutional nation.

[Curmudgeoness]

8. I am thinking more of the laws on the books

than the Constitution. Until not so long ago, there were Blue Laws in my state which required all stores to close on Sunday...this is in my lifetime and it was my culture growing up. Or how bars are still not allowed to serve alcohol on Sunday till after noon. And the definition of marriage. And why is it illegal for a woman to walk around topless? What about the tax-exemptions for religious organizations? Capital punishment? Abortion laws?

You are looking at the federal setup of this country. I am looking at the everyday laws that we are forced to adhere to.

Things are changing slowly away from strict adherence to Biblical teachings, but there are still a lot of remnants in our laws in existence.

[onager]

14. Yep, Thomas Jefferson researched that one...

Jefferson wrote that American law was based on English Common Law, which had absolutely no basis in the Bible or Xianity. For the very good reason that English Common Law got its start while Britain was still pagan. So it was impossible for America to legally be a "Xian nation," since its laws were rooted in a legal system pre-dating Xianity. (All of that is subject to the usual IIRC Disclaimer...)

Which doesn't help with Curmudgeoness' complaint - many local laws do get passed thanks to Xian bluenoses and buttinskis.

The whole nation did try one big experiment in moral do-gooderism. It was called Prohibition and didn't work out very well.

[Warren Stupidity]

15. thank you.

You are exactly right. At best we have laws formulated within our system of government to enforce christianity, or christian customs, on people. We can look to the non-christian greek and roman civilizations for where we got our ideas about government from.

[Binkie The Clown]

9. I can see myself becoming a "cultural Buddhist"

but never a cultural Christian.

I'm pretty much a pacifist, I use meditation to relieve stress, and do some yoga to keep my aging body flexible. But I really can't get into the whole deity thing, so I really couldn't imagine myself attending some kind of Buddhist temple or anything formal like that.

[AlbertCat]

10. but I recognize the pull of thousands of years of history and tradition.

"culturally Christian" is just a subcategory for Western Civilization.

I'm starting to think in terms of , not Jewish, Christian, Muslim.... but just Abrahamic religion.

They are part of western culture.... but so is Greek mythology and Roman mythology not to mention the Babylonian, Sumerian etc etc etc ... Judaism!....which are all part of the late-comer Christianity.

So most "culturally Western" folks are also culturally Jewish, Ancient Greek and Roman and a whole lot of other things. Why does the Christianity get a special place? Because it's what's around you now? Because it's more recent? Cultures are complex. Why stop at one place?


Like Trotsky points out in post #3....

[chervilant]

12. Some years ago, I had an interesting discussion with a fairly 'religious' friend

about the myth of the christ, and how that myth is a product of multiple previous mythologies, cobbled together in an oral history that spans countless lifetimes. I referenced Elaine Pagels and Barbara Walker. She would not speak to me for years.

I am not sure you read the article? I don't think she was using the term as a subcategory--more a description of her personal experience growing up with folk who "believe" inexorably.