If you can explain...

[Duppers]

[Duppers]

1. Osteen

[Brainstormy]

2. Doesn't even make sense. n/t

[Duppers]

3. Seriously?

Believers say god must be real because all of this could not have come from nothing! God created the universe.
(https://www.amazon.com/Universe-Nothing-There-Something-Rather/dp/1451624468)

So, who created god? "Gees, never thought of that."

[Brainstormy]

4. But it says "if you can explain God without a Creator"

who's ever tried to do that? It's like saying if you can explain God without God. It makes no sense. I'm not talking about the something from nothing angle. These words make no sense. It's circular.

[Duppers]

5. Yup.

That's just it - using their reasoning, god cannot be explained without having another creator god. Etc, etc. They do not recognize their own fallacies.

The "something from nothing" angle is their most presented reason as to why "there MUST be a god. How else do we explain everything?"

[camelfan]

6. Lots of people have tried to do that...

It's called the Cosmological Argument, and you can read the Wikipedia article about it here: [link:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmological_argument|

Also, you can let the great explainer do his thing here: [link:

|

[Brainstormy]

8. No, no, no

That's not the same idea as "a god without a god." I give up.

[Jim Lane]

11. Think of "Creator" in that sentence as meaning "prior cause" (n/t)

[maddiemom]

9. Has always just driven me CRAZY!

Especially because the finest minds throughout my life have no idea either. Agnostic is the only sensible way to think, because being a total atheist is little better than being a true believer in various religions. Either way, I don't expect to ever know. I've followed this board, but never contributed because I really have nothing to add that would make any real difference. My brother wondered why our 91 year old mother was clinging to life even though she had little quality of life left. I knew why. About the same time a young woman I'd known throughout her growing up years committed suicide. We weren't close, but this was a puzzle to all who knew her. As a teacher, and even before, I've known probably a dozen young suicides over the years. WTF?

[Mr.Bill]

7. Well, they explained that one very simply in Catholic school.

"God has always been. He was not created."

Third graders believed it.

[rurallib]

10. and that is usually the answer I have heard in various videos

and believers see no problem with that explanation.

"God always has been and always will be" Baltimore Catechism - remember it well.

[Mr.Bill]

12. I was born in Baltimore.

Went to my first Catholic school in Alexandria when we moved there. I went through first and second grade and started third, then we moved to California. I continued Catholic school until the sixth grade. Actually very good schools. I probably could have passed most tests I took in high school when I was in the sixth grade. I was possibly the only Atheist altar boy in the church. I did it for the money. It was customary to tip the altar boys for funerals and weddings. $5 was not uncommon. That was pretty good money in the early 60s.

[raven mad]

13. LOL..............

[raven mad]

14. True. And.............

[beam me up scottie]

15. That always makes creationists angry.

But who created God?

NOBODY! HE JUST IS!

They miss the old days when they could just burn us at the stake for blasphemy, it was easier and prevented more people from asking pesky questions about deities and science.