Guess what Paul Krugman said about Obama supporters in 2008.

[madfloridian]

Hate Springs Eternal

The bitterness of the fight for the Democratic nomination is, on the face of it, bizarre. Both candidates still standing are smart and appealing. Both have progressive agendas (although I believe that Hillary Clinton is more serious about achieving universal health care, and that Barack Obama has staked out positions that will undermine his own efforts). Both have broad support among the party’s grass roots and are favorably viewed by Democratic voters.

....Why, then, is there so much venom out there?

....I won’t try for fake evenhandedness here: most of the venom I see is coming from supporters of Mr. Obama, who want their hero or nobody. I’m not the first to point out that the Obama campaign seems dangerously close to becoming a cult of personality. We’ve already had that from the Bush administration — remember Operation Flight Suit? We really don’t want to go there again.

He doesn't care much for Berniebros either.

[99th_Monkey]

1. WOW. Now that's rather telling.

Mr. Krugman has been jonesing for his Clinton cabinet position now, for as long as Hillary's
been jonesing to get into the WH.

Why am I not surprised?

[madfloridian]

7. Does sound like a cabinet position desired.

[bjobotts]

34. He's Canadian. Plus it's just Krugman being Krugman.

He's a good economist whose opinion is worth hearing but he's just making an observation. Don't make it into something it's not...a huge problem.

[madfloridian]

37. His attacks on Clinton opponents are a little overwrought.

[sabrina 1]

73. There are better economists. He is outing himself as a proponent of Third Way economics. Someone

should direct him to Flint Michigan where those neoliberal policies, privatization, austerity which Hillary supports, were in full play and caused, what they have everywhere they have been put in place, disaster for the victims.

Can't say I ever paid much attention to his views, there are a whole host of economists whose views were of far more interest to me especially when they turned to be right.

Oh, and as an Obama supporter then and a Bernie supporter now, I guess I'm just one of those awful cultists who are 'looking for a hero'. Now that is Third Way propaganda if ever I heard it.

[madfloridian]

75. In fact that cultist stuff goes back to the Dean campaign...we were called that.

Broken record.

[Fast Walker 52]

50. sure seems like it!!!

[Zen Democrat]

2. Sounds like he's banking on a Hillary win. What's in it for Krugman?

He was against Obama.
He is against Bernie.

Promises must have been made.

[senz]

54. She makes behind-the-scenes deals.

That's how the Clintons operate.

[beam me up scottie]

3. Stop picking on Paul Krugman!

It's like someone sucker punching you then putting on glasses and expecting not to get hit back.

[madfloridian]

4. But but...he's so obvious.

Can't resist.

[Gregorian]

5. Krug who? I listen to Richard Wolff.

Richard D. Wolff is Professor of Economics Emeritus, University of Massachusetts, Amherst where he taught economics from 1973 to 2008. He is currently a Visiting Professor in the Graduate Program in International Affairs of the New School University, New York City. He also teaches classes regularly at the Brecht Forum in Manhattan.

Earlier he taught economics at Yale University (1967-1969) and at the City College of the City University of New York (1969-1973). In 1994, he was a Visiting Professor of Economics at the University of Paris (France), I (Sorbonne).

Education

BA in History from Harvard College (1963);
MA in Economics from Stanford University (1964);
MA in History from Yale University (1967); and a
PhD in Economics from Yale University (1969)

[floriduck]

36. Wolff is awesome. nm

[madfloridian]

6. Oooh, now he refers to a "contingent of idealistic voters"...well count me as one of those.

How Change Happens

Just to be clear: I’m not saying that someone like Mr. Sanders is unelectable, although Republican operatives would evidently rather face him than Mrs. Clinton — they know that his current polling is meaningless, because he has never yet faced their attack machine. But even if he was to become president, he would end up facing the same harsh realities that constrained Mr. Obama.

The point is that while idealism is fine and essential — you have to dream of a better world — it’s not a virtue unless it goes along with hardheaded realism about the means that might achieve your ends. That’s true even when, like F.D.R., you ride a political tidal wave into office. It’s even more true for a modern Democrat, who will be lucky if his or her party controls even one house of Congress at any point this decade.

Sorry, but there’s nothing noble about seeing your values defeated because you preferred happy dreams to hard thinking about means and ends. Don’t let idealism veer into destructive self-indulgence.

That's pathetic....more of back to the more like the other party so we won't be defeated stuff.

[Betty Karlson]

8. Ooh, sounds like someone has been ready for Hillary for a decade.

And he's becoming VERY impatient with the general public's reiterated desire for anyone NOT representing the status quo. The general public, meanwhile, is growing very impatient too.

[bvar22]

9. Krugman should stick to his field of expertise:

Destroying the Working Class by helping The Clintons sell NAFTA.
He is real good at that,
but not so good at political hit pieces.
Laughably transparent.
A 5th grader could see right through his bull shit.

[bjobotts]

39. This Nobel prize winner is an excellent economist.His preference...

for Hillary over Bernie does not make his opinion bullshit. I support Bernie and Krugman. Look people just because a person prefers Clinton does not make them stupid or bad or full of bullshit so stop with the circular firing squad. Facts are not attacks and opinions are not facts...they are democracy at work. So stop with the insults already.
If you want to invalidate a person's preferences then tell why don't attack them for having one.

[truedelphi]

48. Yes, this is a Nobel Peace prize winner who has worked very very

Hard. But quite often his work ends up doing despicable things like bringing about NAFTA, rather than championing the cause of the middle class.

[Odin2005]

88. The economics prize is not a real Nobel.

It was an invention of Swedish banksters in the 60s.

[bvar22]

55. Your Nobel Prize Winning Economist's "theories"

especially the selling of NAFTA has done much damage to our economy.
That is not "theory". That is fact.


The Nobel Committee damaged their legitimacy and credibility after awarding President Obama the "Peace Prize" before he ever warmed up the seat in the Oval Office. I'll bet they regretted THAT one after the surges, drone assassinations, destruction of Libya, and spreading the WAR to other countries.

Former Nobel chief: Obama Peace Prize a failure

"Remember that Nobel Peace Prize that President Obama got in 2009? Well, maybe it wasn't such a good idea after all, a former top Nobel official said.

In a just-released book, Geir Lundestad, director of the Nobel Institute for 25 years until stepping down last year, said the prize committee had expected the honor to deliver a boost to Obama, something he believes did not happen.

Speaking to The Associated Press, Lundestad, who sat in on the secretive committee's meetings but did not have a vote, said the committee "thought it would strengthen Obama and it didn't have this effect."

"In hindsight, we could say that the argument of giving Obama a helping hand was only partially correct," he wrote, according to VG, a Norwegian newspaper."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/09/18/former-top-nobel-official-says-maybe-obamas-peace-prize-was-not-such-a-good-idea/72396794/

It seems that the secret Nobel Committee cares MORE about giving their favorites a "helping hand" than they care about actual science, peace, or contributions to humanity...
which makes then political, NOT impartial.

I've lost a lot of respect for Nobel Prizes.

[madfloridian]

65. He is allowing himself to be used politically as an attack dog. Not a good idea in the long run.

He is brilliant, I've read him for years.

But once a person or groups allow themselves to be manipulated into attacking good people who want the best for their party.....they lose a certain amount of credibility.

[Romulox]

10. Krugman is an apologist for Clintonian centrism now, as he was in the 90s. nt

[madfloridian]

62. You are exactly right.

[cali]

11. Krugman discredits himself

[madfloridian]

12. Yes, he does.

He's looking foolish.

[LittleGirl]

19. +1

I feel bad for trusting his expertise.
#FollowtheMoney

[mountain grammy]

27. Agree!

[MisterP]

13. he was actually right that there were many drooling Obot cultists

then he became one

[madfloridian]

18. "drooling Obot cultists" is a rather insulting phrase.

[MisterP]

22. to be fair many of them are now drooling Hilbot cultists

I'm not saying even 20% of Obama '08 or Clinton '16 people were/are slavering Jonestown fodder

there's no reason to pretend Rahm's corpo icebreaker is some closet liberal

[madfloridian]

25. Just as insulting when you say it that way.

[MisterP]

32. sorry, *bawling* cultists

and I don't care any more: they're cyberbullies that nobody's stood up to for almost two decades and have hollowed out the party into a warmongering machine that's hemorrhaging voters and entered an arms race to the right with the GOP that has left the country utterly dysfunctional

the only way to start any work with them is to start my making them stop being swaggering little hall monitors and Grover Dills, or to just identify and work around them

[madfloridian]

40. Okay, your first paragraph I agree with.

have hollowed out the party into a warmongering machine that's hemorrhaging voters and entered an arms race to the right with the GOP that has left the country utterly dysfunctional

Now that is true.

[Doctor_J]

69. I just got a post hidden for calling the Clinton supporters cultists

What makes you special?

[MisterP]

70. wizardry?

[AtomicKitten]

14. Repeating the same criticisms rather lets the air out of this effort by Krugman.

[madfloridian]

63. You are right. The attacks don't sting as much.

[AtomicKitten]

64. the barrage coming at Bernie is impressive

[retrowire]

15. HAHAHA I like the first paragraph too!

The bitterness of the fight for the Democratic nomination is, on the face of it, bizarre. Both candidates still standing are smart and appealing. Both have progressive agendas (although I believe that Hillary Clinton is more serious about achieving universal health care, and that Barack Obama has staked out positions that will undermine his own efforts). Both have broad support among the party’s grass roots and are favorably viewed by Democratic voters.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAHA

OMG That's rich! Krugman's a freaking shill!

[whathehell]

79. So he FAVORED universal health care when Hillary wanted it..

but rejects it now that Bernie does.....I see.

[ErisDiscordia]

16. He is dead to me

[AzDar]

17. Krugman needs to take many seats.

[frylock]

20. Krugman is clinging tenaciously to the gravy train.

[bvf]

21. He's hearing voices.

They're all murmuring, "Treasury Secretary Krugman..."

[madfloridian]

47. .....

[Stargleamer]

23. He criticizes Bernie's plans, but is mum about Hillary's

WTF is up with that? I mean it, WTF is up with that? Are her plans picture perfect?? Or does she not have the guts to come up with a plan to get us to Single Payer like Bernie is trying to do? Can't you realize how disingenous and unfair it is, not to least compare and contrast Bernie's plans with those of Hillary's??

[ChisolmTrailDem]

24. She demonizes her opponents. That's uhhhh...welll uhhh...it's not normal behavior. nt

[Todays_Illusion]

26. The poor guy, so wants a cabinet post but has once again picked the loser.

[Kip Humphrey]

28. Wow, deja vu all over again!

[mountain grammy]

29. K&R

[Armstead]

30. You beat me to it.

I was thinking, when I had a spare moment of perusing the Interwebs for all the similar stuff from camp Clinton towards Obama's awful cultlike bullying supporters in 2008.

Same crap, just recycled with a different name.

[madfloridian]

31. Well, there's more I think. I supported Obama then, and I remember the ugliness well.

There's a lot to compare.

[appalachiablue]

33. Please, I'm counting on nay sayers to summon fresh material. The ponies,

pie in the sky, idealism, rainbows and unicorns are worn verbiage. There must be many other synonyms. But 'Utopia' exists, the one enjoyed by the high level, neoliberal investor class based on numerous reports published in the last 20 years documenting steady decline for working Americans and the middle class. Given the direction change is inevitable.

[Akamai]

35. I like Krugman's views on many things, including his absolute criticism of austerity, his

embrace of the government being the employer of last resort, etc.

However, his views on the Bernie are misguided, I believe.

[MisterP]

44. Krugman of course has moved the goalposts: he's long insisted Obama's anti-austerian,

not neoliberal, a Keynesian even!

it's the blank-screen effect--if Krugman likes it he assumes the guy he's chosen likes it

[Akamai]

72. Yes --probably true. Hard to avoid "confirmation bias."

Also research shows that religious people tend to think that God agrees with them. And certainly the Republicans think this way.

[Bluenorthwest]

38. Recycled attacks and this time he's against universal healthcare....

It's really offensive to see someone phone it in like this. I've seen a few DUers who attack Bernie using the same material they used against Obama but I assumed a paid professional would work up some fresh stuff just to keep himself looking awake.

[bjobotts]

42. He's not against Universal Healthcare.He's Canadian.

[madfloridian]

43. I think you have Krugman mixed up with someone else. Born in NY.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Krugman

[FloriTexan]

41. Kick!

This part cracked me up: "although I believe that Hillary Clinton is more serious about achieving universal health care"....

[madfloridian]

45. Weird looking back at other primaries.

[MerryBlooms]

46. Rec & Kick.

[Bill USA]

49. thnx 4 link to Krugman article. He correctly points out the intolerance of Bernie's True Believers

Health Wonks and Bernie Bros

So Charles Gaba, whose excellent site ACA Signups has been a huge secret resource for those of us covering health reform, is getting the Bernie Bro treatment. Never mind his long service to the cause of covering the uninsured (and his declaration that he’ll support either candidate in the general): [font size="+1"]his carefully laid-out explanation of his support for Hillary Clinton’s incremental approach means that he’s a corrupt tool of the oligarchy.

Oh well. Meanwhile, the Sanders skepticism of the wonks continues: Paul Starr lays out the case. As far as I can tell, every serious progressive policy expert on either health care or financial reform who has weighed in on the primary seems to lean Hillary. This could be because being in the trenches of the health care fight gives you an acute sense of the possible, and because having paid close attention to the financial crisis makes you a shadow-banking, not too big to fail guy. Or it could be because they are, one and all, corrupt corporate lackeys. I report, you decide.

Just to be clear, Sanders himself is not at fault here. And if Hillary is the nominee, I expect him to do what she herself did in 2008, and will surely do if he wins an upset: make it clear that whatever their differences, and whatever the primary loser’s personal frustration, there’s no comparison with the reactionary extremism of all the GOP candidates.

But it’s disappointing to see so much intolerance over what are basically differences in strategy, not goals.

gosh, has Krugman been reading the Sanders supporters posts on DU??? He'S spot on with regard to intolerance of other opinions and demonization of the opponent and any of her supporters!


If you don't fall in line with bernie supporters thinking you are OBVIOUSLY A "CURRUPT TOOL OF THE OLIGARCHY" ...LOL!!!!

[madfloridian]

52. The use of the word cult or "true believers" is to me unforgivable.

I was called that when I supported Howard Dean in 2004. I was called that when I supported Obama in 2008.

Now I am being called that in 2016 when I am supporting Bernie Sanders.

It's use is almost meaningless now, and in a way it shows desperation.

[Bill USA]

58. should I call for the violins? I supported Obama and nobody called me a TBer. Maybe it was because

I could articulate reasons for my support.

[Scootaloo]

80. Well, when you pen an article just to talk shit about people...

Can't complain when they fire back.

Especially when you tried the same thing eight years prior.

Krugman's problem is that a more progressive economy means he can't play the act of "lone prophet in the wilderness" anymore. And while I suppose he's able enough as a Keynsian economist, I would hardly think he's the only one. A Sanders administration would return keynsian economics to the mainstream, and krugman would have to compete (oh, the horror) with lots of other economic wonks of that stripe.

By hte way, your font seems to be a little haywire.

[madfloridian]

81. Well said, can't complain when they fight back.

Yes, he must be using larger font. Many do, but it shouldn't carry over for us. That's strange.

[MADem]

51. Obama admitted, just the other day, that his supporters were OTT in 08.

Maybe you missed it?

President Obama even brought up these attacks during an interview with Politico this week.

"The truth is in 2007 and 2008, sometimes my supporters and my staff, I think, got too huffy about what were legitimate questions Clinton was raising," Obama said, adding that he sees this manifesting in Sanders' movement in 2016.

http://mashable.com/2016/01/29/bernie-sanders-berniebros/#a2knMtxPdmqR

The entire interview is fascinating--worth either reading or listening to:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/01/off-message-podcast-transcript-obama-218167

[madfloridian]

57. All supporters of everyone except Hillary are "over the top"....

at least that's what I hear here.

[GeorgeGist]

82. Perhaps you missed it ...

SOME.

[MADem]

85. No, I didn't miss it--I provided the link for you to click on, and read. nt

[Lage Nom Ai]

53. Saves him money

and time when he can reuse the same crap every election cycle.

[madfloridian]

78. lol there you go.

[senz]

56. Krugman cannot mitigate Clinton's negatives

by attacking her opponent's supporters, and it is her negatives that will sink her.

[madfloridian]

59. But he'll give it a heck of a try.

He is not fond of Bernie or his supporters.

Frankly I'm tired of just Bernie's supporters being fussed at.....the others are not so hot themselves.

[senz]

60. Yes, he's putting massive effort into this

and it's clear his objectivity has gone out the window.

[Autumn]

61. Yeah but Operation Pant Suit is like way fucking cool.

[madfloridian]

66. I'm getting a wee bit tired of all the warnings going out to us berniebros to behave.

Annoying as heck.

[Autumn]

67. It's all recycled bull shit.

[madfloridian]

83. ....

And a LOT of it.

[Warren DeMontague]

90. why, one would almost think someone is deliberately trying to push a narrative.

Imagine that!

[SoapBox]

68. Same old...same old...

It gets rather tiresome!

And are people like him SO dumb, that they don't know that all their crap can be retrieved by a simple Google search?

So dumb.

[madfloridian]

76. .....

You are right.

[Zynx]

71. And then most of those extremely ardent supporters turned against him.

[olddots]

74. but he has a groovy liberal beard

he must be wicked smart .

[madfloridian]

77. .......

I always consider men with such beards as intellectuals.

[Baitball Blogger]

84. Yeah, it does seem like there are some who truly believe that what is best for NYC

is best for the country. I can't see any other reason behind all this concern over candidates that are willing to take on Wall Street.

[merkins]

86. This primary reminds me of that quote:

"Only when the tide goes out do you discover who's been swimming naked."

So many wonks, pundits and pols that I thought were progressive .. its a revelation.

[Mc Mike]

87. I'm backing Bernie, and still like Krugman.

He's done a lot of good writing. He's just wrong, in this case.

[Warren DeMontague]

89. A VERITABLE OBAMABRO BROPACALYPSE, IT WAS!

GOD DAMN BROBAMAS.