The DNC does not send out sample ballots with

[MineralMan]

a candidate marked as a preference. It has been claimed that such a ballot from the DNC was sent out to voters in Massachusetts. Sample ballots like that, with a preference marked are commonly issued by individual campaigns or by organizations, but NEVER by the DNC.

Whether or not people think highly of the DNC, it is wrong to claim that the Democratic National Committee does such things to favor one primary candidate over another.

Just a PSA for people to think about. The DNC doesn't send out campaign literature for primary elections that focuses on an individual candidate. It's not what they do.

[MineralMan]

2. Why the wink?

Are you saying that I'm incorrect in this? I'd be happy to look at your evidence.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. That's nice.

It's good to know that the DNC wouldn't do something that might tip the scales in favor of one candidate over another.

[MineralMan]

7. I'm talking about a specific claim about a pre-marked sample ballot.

Do you have evidence to the contrary? If so, I'll be happy to look at it.

I was very specific in my original post about what I was discussing.

[kristopher]

11. Do you have evidence for Your Claim?

[brooklynite]

25. So, by your logic, the fact that nobody's seen God means that God exists?

Apparently, a specific allegation has been made. It's an allegation for which hard evidence (e.g. a sample ballot) would have to exist.

[kristopher]

28. Reading and Logic = D- (please study more)

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

23. You said:

"It is wrong to claim that the Democratic National Committee does such things to favor one primary candidate over another." That is a much more general statement than questioning whether the DNC sent out a pre-marked sample ballot to voters in Massachusetts. If you had meant to be that specific you could have said "It is wrong to claim that the Democratic National Committee sent a pre-marked sample ballot to voters in Massachusetts to favor one primary candidate over another." Is that what you meant to say, or do you not think the DNC has done anything to favor a particular candidate?

[MineralMan]

27. Thanks for the detailed parsing of my post.

That sentence you suggested, though, is not in my style, so I wouldn't have written it that way. But I appreciate your suggestion.

[kristopher]

8. ha ... Ha .... HA ....... Haha ....HAhaha .....

[FSogol]

4. True, but many love their tin foil. ALCOA!

[Agschmid]

10. Yup.

[berni_mccoy]

5. So, if the DNC funnels money to Hillary's campaign and her campaign hands out

Ballots with a marked preference, does that not imply the DNC is doing this?

[brooklynite]

26. The DNC doesn't funnel money to Hillary's account...because it legally can't

The DNC can only give $5,000 to a campaign. What you're probably complaining about is a joint-fundraising agreement in which contributors agree to give money to be divided between the DNC and and candidate. The type of agreement both Clinton and Sanders have signed.

[berni_mccoy]

54. Wrong.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511277476

[brooklynite]

55. A JFA...as I commented about in the thread

In private huddles, they urged state officials to sign onto an ambitious fundraising endeavorthat would allow Clinton’s presidential bid, the DNC and the state parties to scoop up and share big checks from wealthy donors. It would mark the earliest creation of a joint fundraising committee between a presidential candidate and the party, and it would be the biggest ever, thanks to a 2014 Supreme Court decision that knocked down a cap on how much donors could give to federal campaigns in a single year.

Sanders could do the same; he's chosen not to.

[berni_mccoy]

57. You are slicing a dicing it to make it palatable

The fact is Hillary has benefited from the fundraisers and the state committees have not, per the article. Nearly half the states didn't join for that very reason.

[brooklynite]

58. How much has Sanders raised for State Parties?

[yourpaljoey]

33. yes it does... and of course they are

[MineralMan]

46. What money has the DNC "funneled" to Hilary's campaign?

I think there's a very low limit on how much they can contribute to it. Hillary Clinton, on the other hand has participating in considerable fundraising for the DNC as part of the same agreement Sanders has with the DNC. Perhaps that's a point of confusion, since I don't believe that Sanders has done that kind of fundraising for the DNC.

If I'm incorrect in this, I hope you'll guide me to evidence that the DNC has funneled money to the Clinton campaign beyond their low statutory limit.

[virtualobserver]

6. you have restored my faith in our god damn democratic process

[whatchamacallit]

9. I thought you were out until after the primary

You made an official announcement and all.

[MineralMan]

12. Nothing I say is official. I'm not an organization.

It's fairly obvious that I have changed my mind about posting in GD . The evidence is this post.

Thanks for replying and kicking this thread.

[whatchamacallit]

20. Maybe you should try to be a little less dramatic in the future

[MineralMan]

24. I tried clicking on the ad there.

Didn't work. As a senior, I'd love to claim that $60K.

I don't see ads on DU for some reason. Nice screenshot, though.

[whatchamacallit]

32. Welcome back. We await your next BS pronouncements with baited breath

[yourpaljoey]

35. Ya vee doo, ya vee doo

[MineralMan]

48. Well, thank you. However, I do not eat bait, so

I never have "baited" breath. I don't even use bait while angling. I prefer artificial lures.

[UglyGreed]

13. .

[MineralMan]

15. Thanks to you, as well, for the thread kick.

As a mere human being, I always maintain my right to do as I please. That sometimes includes changing my mind about where to post on DU. I stayed out of GD for a while, and then decided to resume posting in this forum.

[NWCorona]

17. Nobody make me bleed my own blood lol

[UglyGreed]

19. LOL

[tk2kewl]

14. do you think David Brock might?

[MineralMan]

16. I believe he is with the Clinton campaign.

Campaigns often send out such marked sample ballots, as I clearly said in the OP.

[tk2kewl]

18. do you think he might do it in a way that appeared to imply a DNC endorsement?

[MineralMan]

21. I doubt it. If that has happened, I will be glad

to look at the evidence, and would condemn such a thing. Do you have a sample of what you're mentioning? Please scan it and post it.

[tk2kewl]

22. i don't... i just know that Brock is not a honest man

and if someone is reporting that they received pre-marked ballot from the DNC, it sounds a lot like something he might do.

[MineralMan]

30. Never met him.

Is someone claiming that Brock engineered that ballot and pretended it was from the DFL? I haven't seen such a claim. If you have a ballot like that, please scan it and post it. Thanks.

[tk2kewl]

38. you do of course know his history though

i'd like to see the docs in question as well

[MineralMan]

41. Not very well, I don't.

I pay little attention to campaign staffs, really. As for the samples of that marked ballot, I doubt such a sample will be forthcoming. I'd welcome a look at it, though. I'm not in MA.

[tk2kewl]

42. you should google him... include Anita Hill in the search params

[MineralMan]

44. No thanks. He's not on my ballot.

Besides, I've seen information about that here on DU.

[brooklynite]

29. Not Presidential campaigns...

...I know of no instance where a Presidential campaign would endorse a specific down-ballot candidate. Too much risk of losing an otherwise supportive voter.

[MineralMan]

34. I don't think anyone is claiming that.

Here in Minnesota, after our primaries, the DFL party does print and mail marked sample ballots showing the candidates that have been endorsed by the party.

Individual candidates often distribute campaign literature suggesting a vote, though. Rarely do they also suggest voting for other candidates on the ballot for other offices. The reasons you gave for that are good ones.

[brooklynite]

47. Yes, State, County and Local Party Committees frequently endorse. Candidates and the DNC do not.

[MineralMan]

49. I know that our DFL party in MN

endorses candidates in the General Election, but only after our convention process has been conducted, where such endorsements are voted on by convention delegates.

[Kelvin Mace]

31. Thanks, MM

I really wish this country would establish rules about this stuff. But that is never going to happen. Election law is an omnishambles.

[MineralMan]

37. I think the actual party organizations are very careful

not to show preferences during primary campaigns in that way. Campaign practices are generally not regulated by law, as far as I know, though. Campaigns are sort of a free-for-all thing, with very few limits. The FEC and some state election offices enforce campaign laws, but they're often more honored in the breach than the observance, it seems.

I do know that the DNC doesn't officially endorse presidential primary candidates.

[Kelvin Mace]

40. Nah, I am referring to things like election times,

when commercials can run, robocalls, etc.

I would love to see things like the national election being either a holiday, or moved to a weekend over Saturday and Sunday, limits on when ads can run (such as x weeks before an election, y weeks before a primary), prohibitions on push polls, robocalls, etc.

[MineralMan]

43. Those are very different matters, really.

I'd certainly be in favor of the changes you suggested. I'm not fond of how campaigning is done, either. I'm also in no position to change any of it, really.

Having just hung up on a robocall from the MN DFL party encouraging me to go to my caucus, I'd agree that robocalls are a genuine annoyance. I don't mind getting calls from phone-banks for candidates, though, and always answer them if they're in my area code. During campaigns, I pick up the phone more often to answer calls from numbers I don't recognize, just for that reason.

[gcomeau]

36. While I have no particular reason to think the DNC did this particular thing...

Whether or not people think highly of the DNC, it is wrong to claim that the Democratic National Committee does such things to favor one primary candidate over another.

That sentence is a massive line of bullshit and we both know it.


I challenge you to provide a single explanation of the massive curtailing of the Democratic debate schedule this election season, ceding the airwaves to the Republicans and denying voters all that additional exposure to the Democratic candidates, other than "the candidate the DNC prefers already has massive name recognition and exposure to other candidates to allow voters to get to know who they are is not in her advantage".


I'll wait.

[MineralMan]

39. By "such things," I'm referring to specific targeted

mailings to voters. The DNC shows no such preferences during presidential primaries. Does the leadership of the DNC have a preference for a specific candidate? I wouldn't be surprised, but they aren't sending out mailings like this one. "Such things" refers to my specific example and similar things.

[gcomeau]

51. You can mean anything you want by "such things".

I mean "things that show a clear bias in favor of a specific candidate and act to rig things for said candidate."

I couldn't care less if those things are printed on mailings or delivered in alternate form, since that makes zip difference.... and if you think whether it's in a mailer or not is a meaningful distinction you're kidding yourself.

[NCTraveler]

45. You are an excellent resource for many of our new voters.

And your insight is valuable for us long-timers as well. You speak succinctly, with brevity, and backed by first hand knowledge and common sense.

[MineralMan]

56. You're too kind by half...

[alcibiades_mystery]

50. I got a sample ballot with preferences by the Cook County Dems

Here's the link:

http://www.cookcountydems.com/candidates.htm

That isn't from a campaign. But you're also right that it's not from the DNC. It's from the local Democratic Organization, which is probably what they're seeing in Massachusetts, too, and just mistaking it for DNC.

PS: I also received the sample ballot with the Hillary endorsement in the mail.

[MineralMan]

52. Thanks.

I appreciate seeing the link.

[Agschmid]

53. Yup.

Most likely.