2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumDonna Brazile's comment about northern and southern AA voters on CNN
Last edited Wed Mar 9, 2016, 04:46 PM - Edit history (2)
In discussing tonight's primary results, Donna Brazile said
Interesting, esp. in light of a lot of conversation I've seen on DU.
ETA: video
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)So Donna is saying blacks in the South were being 'pandered' to? Gosh, I wonder at whom that particular comment is aimed...
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)But it still was an odd and rather insulting thing to say about Southern black voters.
Luminous Animal
(27,310 posts)vote in the south.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)If you had heard the discussion, you would understand the context.
They were discussing Trump in the the General Election, not tonight's primary - and she was making the point about how Trump would have to appeal to huge percentages of white voters in the Rust Belt:
"Donald Trump will make some of these rust belt states a lot more competitive because of his ability to galvanize and speak to that anger and pain (of white blue collar voters) but don't underestimate black folks. Black voters in the north vote differently than black voters in the south. You can't pander to them. You've got to have a strong economic message."
As I said, it was a bizarre comment to make - it wasn't a slap at Hillary Clinton, but it was an insult to Southern black voters.
Luminous Animal
(27,310 posts)why is it QUOTED in parentheses?
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)referring to in that sentence so I put it in parenthesis for clarity.
Autumn
(45,064 posts)Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)I was watching it and that's how I recall.
You are using quotation marks but I'm not sure why. Where are you finding that transcript?
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)And they were talking about Trump.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)After all, Trump doesn't appeal to almost ANY black voters, ANYWHERE. So her comment isn't really relevant to Trump's performance. She was moving to another point.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)But, as I said. It was a stupid comment to make.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)After reading the context in your post #12, I see where you are coming from. But it just doesn't make sense to me to read that as a Trump related comment. I mean, do you really think her point was that that, in order to get rust belt AA vote in November, Trump will have to have a strong economic plan, and not rely on mere pandering? That would be odd, as I don't think he's ever been accused of pandering to blacks. As far as I've seen, he basically ignores the AA community, except when he's throwing AA out of his rallies.
Having seen the video in post #19, I think what happened is that she was wrapping up her Trump thought (ending with the word "pain" , and then her tone and body language seems to shift in a way that could possibly be saying, "but, Van, getting back to what you were saying about black folks..."
From that perspective, she seems to be saying that Hillary pandered to get her AA vote in the south, but that strategy was weakening against Bernie's stronger economic platform in the north. I have to admit, though, that that's not something I'd have expected her to say either!
Chitown Kev
(2,197 posts)but I think that her analysis of the differences between Southern and Northern voters is essentially correct, though.
Jarqui
(10,123 posts)Between the two, I have trouble seeing Bernie described as a panderer. He's been advocating the same stuff for 40 years.
Ms Weathervane appears to be the target of those remarks.
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)persuasion tactics (A large portion of southern AAs are conservative religious Dems.) That's why Utah, with it's high LDS population, is the scam capital of the U.S.
Jarqui
(10,123 posts)I do not understand why the blacks are so supportive of her.
Yes, I've read what some have stated, etc. But I think they're being suckered by a snake oil saleswoman.
Bernie's got lofty aspirations but he's explained how they work and how they'll come into effect - only if we deliver a real mandate in the House and Senate.
If Hillary doesn't get a mandate, the GOP will obstruct her just like Obama and like they would Bernie. So I don't have a problem with lofty goals when he's laid out the conditions.
Bassomar
(58 posts)Zen Democrat
(5,901 posts)JimDandy
(7,318 posts)marions ghost
(19,841 posts)and I'm in the South.
"Christian Identity candidate" = Hillary --explains a lot of it I think.
She can sell that image pretty well, especially in conjunction with her emphasis on children.
Tanuki
(14,918 posts)You can't be serious.
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)--didn't know about this religious group. Thx for info.
Let's change it to working her Christianity for votes in the Bible Belt.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)As an Obama 2008 supporter who remembers how nasty South Carolina got then it was hilarious and kind of surreal to see Clinton wrap her arms around Obama now. Not that I think that is why she is winning support from African Americans...I give them more credit than that. I think she is just better known among AA's, and Sanders has an inherent disadvantage there because he is from a very white state. Howard Dean struggled with African Americans in 2004 probably for the same reason.
Autumn
(45,064 posts)upset some people.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)jillan
(39,451 posts)ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)To the "Confederacy" discussions everyone was poo-pooing.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)But two black pundits, paid by the MSM that so many of you despise, say it, they speaketh the truth that "lends credibility" to the argument?
Got it.
But here's a clue - the fact that Donna Brazile said it doesn't suddenly give it credibility. She's a talking head who is speaking from the cuff and whose opinion is no more valid than anyone else's. And the notion that black voters - wherever they are - are any more susceptible to manipulation and pandering than you or other Sanders supporters or any other voter in other parts of the country is pure, unadulterated bs.
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)And get back to me.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)The fact that Northern black voters and Southern black voters don't vote together in lockstep does not mean that the Southern blacks are susceptible to pandering.
That's a baseless and insulting assumption.
noiretextatique
(27,275 posts)Southern people tend to be more conservative, that includes black people.
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)More conservative, more Fundy Christian, more closely knit in voting because of past abuses.
There is a difference that is regional, it's not only about race. But as usual, that's all people see.
Jackie Wilson Said
(4,176 posts)be accurate probably.
noiretextatique
(27,275 posts)There are regional differences in political attitudes...that was the point.
Chitown Kev
(2,197 posts)I would say that traditionally, the issues faced by Northern black voters vs. Southern black voters are a bit different...and that is still the case...
http://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/voter-id.aspx
noiretextatique
(27,275 posts)How does that explain why Sanders got 35% of the black vote in Michigan, and much less in Southern states?
AzDar
(14,023 posts)Hiraeth
(4,805 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)There are reasons for that, historic and cultural. Hopefully that talking point will die
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)And that AA people put their money in homes, not the stock market and that many were hurt badly by the mortgage crisis. They seemed to be saying Bernie's message about the bail-out resonated.
Nyan
(1,192 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)the north and south aa constituencies are different, that is clear now, and the southern group seems to be more loyal to the clintons.
i hope what she meant was something along those lines
but lets look at the reality. for whatever reason, the truth of the difference between bernie and hillarys economic policies was not resonating with southern aa's. why is a question that will be learned more perhaps as the races and analysis continue
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)yourout
(7,527 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)sadly, a passerby would be an improvement over dws, but i do think brazile would do a good job.
a kennedy
(29,655 posts)I didn't get why she was happy about his win......was excited that the race was going to go into June. Just not getting what she meant by that statement.
kenn3d
(486 posts)that both camps would be wooing her superdelegate vote for a longer time ("more love for me" she said)
a kennedy
(29,655 posts)thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)Has Donna Brazile actually made any statement of support for either candidate? I know that, in the past, she has generally been a strong supporter of Hillary, but I don't know if she has actually put forth any position in this particular race.
I didn't happen to hear her say she was happy about his win, anyone happen to have a clip of that for more context?
noiretextatique
(27,275 posts)As someone told me the other day. I guess if you tell the truth these days, you aren't 'really' black. I agree with Donna.
Vattel
(9,289 posts)that conveniently cast the worst light possible on Sanders and his supporters. They should be ignored. Most of them imply that Sanders should pander to AA voters in the way that Clinton does. Fuck that.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)thesquanderer
(11,986 posts)Chitown Kev
(2,197 posts)are very very ignorant.
Remember, black folks in the North rarely had to deal with "civil rights" in the same that Southerners dealt with it. Segregation in the north was de facto as opposed to de jure. Northern blacks have had voting rights, that was a big reason for the Black migration. Laws against Southern-style Jim Crow were already on the books, the Northern battles were more about how to enforce those laws that were already on the books.
The civil rights movement in the North always had a stronger economic component; witness some of Dr. King's difficulties in organizing in the North even within the black community
I could explain more (after all I was born and raised in Detroit) but notice that I only said that Bernie's comments along these lines were ill-advised and stupid...I never said that they were wrong.
BernieforPres2016
(3,017 posts)David Brock and the Clinton campaign would be crucifying him.
I watched CNN's election coverage last night and Donna Brazile was very fair in her coverage, to my surprise.
Chitown Kev
(2,197 posts)is what you need to understand what Donna Brazile is talking about here.
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)Have you read the book, A Nation Under Our Feet by Steven Hahn?
Chitown Kev
(2,197 posts)I did a book group on Sweet Land of Liberty at Daily Kos...I am completely familiar with this material
http://www.dailykos.com/news/SweetLandofLiberty
NWCorona
(8,541 posts)Thanks!
Herman4747
(1,825 posts)for decades, it is good to learn that this won't work with the northern blacks. "You can't pander to them," Ms. Brazile says, "you've got to have a strong economic message."