2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumSomething's Wrong In Arizona: Voter Rolls Not Updated; People FORCED To Take Provisionals...etc.
http://usuncut.com/news/arizona-polling-disaster/I Voted Early, But Hearing Crazy Things (again!)...From People @ The Polls...
merrily
(45,251 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)this pattern.
merrily
(45,251 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Alternative thesis: this election fraud stuff is the product of hyper partisan imaginations
merrily
(45,251 posts)Why don't you just admit that you pretended to know what three people you never met are "sensing" and move on, or just move onm instead of continuing to flail?
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)with zero evidentiary support.
So I have no need to stop flailing, as I for one never started.
merrily
(45,251 posts)So is implying you know what Bernie and others sense. If you want wacky, Carnac, that might be it.
BTW, you might read up some time on "conspiracy theory" and people who throw that term around lightly.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Babel_17
(5,400 posts)unless you can back it up. It's akin, imo, to how Senator refers to the transcripts of Secretary Clinton's Goldman Sachs speeches. Can any of us prove she said anything she'd now find embarrassing? Is any respected journalist suggesting they wouldn't be, to one degree or another?
Things can be curious, suggestive, worth looking into, and even just plain suspicious seeming. When it comes to elections, we know we need to pay attention to such things.
Suppressing the vote just has an out and out terribly real history in our country.
merrily
(45,251 posts)no question, but I do appreciate it and agree with some of it.
Babel_17
(5,400 posts)We don't know, but there are many plausible scenarios besides "nothing to see here" and "oh my god, call the FBI!".
Could be anything, I'm not a mind reader.
merrily
(45,251 posts)workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Like all the outrage over Bill Clinton at polling places. Not one peep out of Bernie who undoubtedly would be raising hell if something was actually wrong.
Some of Bernie's fans love to stir the pot. Especially in states where Hillary is expected to do well.
merrily
(45,251 posts)but neither of those things have anything to do with pretending to know what other people are sensing.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Alleging voter fraud or obstructing access at polls by Bill Clinton?
I guess I missed that. Thanks.
merrily
(45,251 posts)My reply listed four states. You said there had not been one peep. I said that was false. It was.
I also said the times for other peeps has not expired. It hasn't.
Which statement that I actually did make do you think is false?
FloridaBlues
(4,007 posts)The people are getting provisional ballots to see if indeed they did register before feb deadline .
People need to pay attention to their state rule
I read a lot of indies showing up at a closed primary.
merrily
(45,251 posts)Even just the subject line of the OP mentions more than that.
peacebird
(14,195 posts)Being denied as well. Sounds like the same bull crap we have heard about in several other states.
sweetloukillbot
(11,007 posts)I don't think it's a conspiracy but it is bad mismanagement. They cut polling places by 2/3.
elleng
(130,865 posts)peacebird
(14,195 posts)Pisces
(5,599 posts)Being given provisional ballots. The problem is that there are only 60 polling sites down from 200. The lines are oytrageous.
AzDar
(14,023 posts)Several people I know had trouble due to being registered as Republicans or not found at ALL. Polling places being moved/closed seemingly w/o notice...
jwirr
(39,215 posts)on the registration papers at the poll.
DJ13
(23,671 posts)..either a Bush or a Clinton is worried they might lose?
FloridaBlues
(4,007 posts)farleftlib
(2,125 posts)I think not.
Else You Are Mad
(3,040 posts)Whether it is by the GOP or the Democratic party, election fruad is much more pervasive than most think. Everyone focuses on voter fraud, which is very rare and not election fraud perpetrated by elected and party officials. It is a nothing to see here folks kind of situation that REALLY needs to be fully investigated.
Response to Else You Are Mad (Reply #5)
cyberpj This message was self-deleted by its author.
Else You Are Mad
(3,040 posts)Every district in every county in every state should be prepared, there is no excuse for 'glitches' or a too large a showing. It is not like the county/party administers didn't have enough time to prepare. Any of those 'mistakes' or 'glitches' should be highly suspect. I have no problem with my preferred candidate losing legitimately, but when there is even a hint of election fraud that is unconscionable and needs to be investigated.
Chichiri
(4,667 posts)marions ghost
(19,841 posts)--yet most people aren't concerned. (Especially if their candidate comes out ahead).
Else You Are Mad
(3,040 posts)But, personally, I would be concerned even if my candidate won by election fraud. It is a very serious crime that cannot be allowed because of it resulted in a preferred outcome.
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)we have an antiquated, discriminatory and insecure election "system" that is allowing for all sorts of fraud and corruption. The political parties don't want voters to know how bad it is.
At least more of these cases are coming to light.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)when you have millions of records in each state, there's going to be the occasional mixup between the person filing and the bureaucracy processing the filings. people move, and forget to update their address, or the state's records system has an error manually entered.
that's why provisional ballots exist.
I've heard voters for candidates of all stripes complaining in elections over the years.
Frankly, I think we should do it like Australia, make voting mandatory and they'd have to have everyone registered.
giftedgirl77
(4,713 posts)be provided with all necessary acomodations to vote.
Earth_First
(14,910 posts)oldandhappy
(6,719 posts)sufrommich
(22,871 posts)in states where Sanders won.
MineralMan
(146,286 posts)And the source is some website called usuncut.com
I'd like to see corroboration from some site I've actually heard of.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)Why is that?
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)Provisional ballots are almost never counted. Forcing voters to use one is almost certainly invalidating their vote.
This is just another ploy of voter suppression.
This is insane. We need uniform election procedures for every single state.
sufrommich
(22,871 posts)and most of those are thrown out because voters have been taken off the voters roll. In primaries,the number one reason is voters belonging to the wrong political party trying to vote in a closed election of a party they aren't registered to vote in. Provisional ballots that are proven to be legitimate are always counted.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2014/10/09/354534487/rules-for-provisional-ballots-all-over-the-map
The fail-safe for many voters who run into problems at the polls such as a lack of ID or an outdated address is called provisional voting. The person votes, and his or her ballot only counts after the problem is resolved.
But many of these ballots never do count, raising questions about how good a fail-safe they really are.
<snip>
MineralMan
(146,286 posts)Putting elections in federal hands would require a constitutional amendment, which would have to be ratified by the states. How likely do you think that would be? Reality often bites.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)I did not suggest "putting elections in federal hands," simply that uniform procedures and guidelines be adopted by states.
That's a doable reality.
MineralMan
(146,286 posts)the Supreme court. The only national election is for President, and there are federal laws regulating those for the General Election. There are also laws regarding voting rights. However all other elections are state issues, including congressional elections. It's a constitutional issue.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)MineralMan
(146,286 posts)Citizens of each state must insist on it. Just as I said. Elections are a state function. Many states do very well with elections. Minnesota is a good example. So is California. Other states don't do as well. People in those states need to insist that they do better.
Elections in this country are run by the individual states. How's your state doing?
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)California has a pretty good track record running elections.
I'd like to see states adopt Oregon's mail-in voting system. It's cheaper and increases participation. Their system of checks and balances has been for the most part secure. So far it seems a win-win.
MineralMan
(146,286 posts)Minnesota's not even close to that, though. CA might do it before too long, though. I lived in CA most of my life, and it has a very good election system. MN, too. Other states are mixed, and I don't really know most of their reputations.I see it as a problem, too, but there's no solution except state by state change.
That's one state's rights issues that will be almost impossible to change. It's up to the people in each state to demand change. Nothing else will work.
kerry-is-my-prez
(8,133 posts)surprised me.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)kerry-is-my-prez
(8,133 posts)registered at the same time and place. Had to demand a provisional ballot - was not offered one and they were almost taken aback - like it had never happened before. I wonder if they really handled it properly. I stressed the fact that my boyfriend was registered successfully and I wasn't.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)... is better than nothing.
Your anecdotal story should make us all check on our voting status before it's too late. Thanks for that.
Pisces
(5,599 posts)Out the information. If independents didn't know what to do, they have themselves to blame. There is no conspiracy. Get outraged about why the 2 campaigns didn't make sure everyone knew the rules before the deadline!!!
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)They did that initially by putting off the few scheduled debates until after the summer, yielding coverage to GOP candidates and their debates almost exclusively for months on end. But there was also no real official national DNC voter registration drive of any magnitude. That is their responsibility. I agree the candidates should have made the effort to take up the slack; Candidate Obama was on top of that in 2008. Still, stupid shit like not having enough ballots is cropping up in state after state. That's unacceptable.
amborin
(16,631 posts)Tarc
(10,476 posts)Matt_in_STL
(1,446 posts)I miss the days when Democrats cared about everyone having their vote counted. I guess that assumes you are one though and I hate to assume.
Tarc
(10,476 posts)Tweets and blogs ain't proof.
Matt_in_STL
(1,446 posts)I bet you were a hoot in 2000 and 2004.
Tarc
(10,476 posts)Matt_in_STL
(1,446 posts)Yep, reject them out of hand. Cool.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Everybody knows that.
Its not some big conspiracy.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Don't know the rules
Hilarious
Karmadillo
(9,253 posts)alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)Progressives have never lost an election ever, doncha know?
Cowpunk
(719 posts)They pulled this crap a few years ago here in Omaha.
http://www.thereader.com/post/polling_place_changes_hit_older_omaha_harder
DCBob
(24,689 posts)They should have checked their status before voting.
SamKnause
(13,091 posts)They only have 60 polling places for the entire state.
Some people have been in lines for over 3 hours.
They have not updated their system.
People are being given provisional ballets.
People are using their phones to document what is going on.
AzDar
(14,023 posts)and changed registration in plenty of time, yet STILL are forced to use PB due to the rolls not being 'updated'... Nope, nothing to see here...
Not to mention polling places changed/closed... malfunctioning handheld units @ check-in, etc.
CentralCoaster
(1,163 posts)Zorra
(27,670 posts)Never assume your vote is going to count, or be counted. Never assume that you are just going to show up at the polls and be able to vote.
I recommend registering for early voting. Fill out your ballot, and send it in the day you get it. Then call the county clerks office and verify that they have received your ballot.
If you cannot vote early, or prefer going to the polls, always call your county clerk's office 45 days before an election and ensure you are registered to vote, eligible to vote in the upcoming election, and verify that you are registered as a member of the party of your choice. If someone verifies your info, write down their name and the date and time you called.
In Arizona, before the 2012 election, I looked up my voter registration on the internet, and, surprise! Nothing. I called the county clerks office and harassed them until the problem was straightened out. If people are vigilant about being able to vote, and about their vote being counted, it will make it far more difficult for the establishment to cheat us out of our votes.
PADemD
(4,482 posts)That would give the voters enough time to register under the proper party.
If AZ has to pay double just to run a primary, then that may be incentive for them to get it right the next time.