I keep hearing about this so called indictment coming against Hillary I'm not buying it.

[JRLeft]

I believe the threat is being used as a bludgeoning tool against her to help Trump.

[Trust Buster]

1. Their candidate could not win the vote count on the merits. So now they pray for a Hail Mary pass

so that the will of the people will be overturned and their losing candidate will be handed the nomination by default. Wow, what a mandate Sanders would have from the people.......LOL

[Bonobo]

2. That logic makes no sense in the case of this piece.

He tosses away Sanders as non-viable as well. I don't agree but it does tend to undermine your argument.

http://lawnewz.com/politics/hillary-clintons-emails-now-might-finally-take-her-down/

[seabeyond]

3. It really is humiliatingly embarrassing that their only win is praying for the destruction of our

Democratic candidate. That the people rejected Sanders and it has to be something like this, to give them the slightest of hope. Says a hell of a lot about them and their candidate that he cannot carry the vote, and now is working at under handed methods to overturn the vote of the people.

[JRLeft]

6. Sanders voters, we are not trying to help Trump.

I believe a lot of them, with the exception of some, I being oneof them, (who does not believe she will be indicted nor should she.) the majority truly believe she's going away. The Gop loves this because if the threat is viable til November it may cost her the election.

[seabeyond]

8. I think they desperately hoping she is going away. I believe they allow themselves

to not be open to fairness or balance in seeing the situation because they want her out so their candidate will win. I do not think it is at all about supporting Trump. I think it is a desperation for Sanders and will take him however they can get him, just or not. Right or not. Pathetic or not.

And, though my post is harsh to those feeding this, and the detriment of our candidate, and some may feel the GE; Thank you for your reasoned post. I appreciate it.

[JRLeft]

10. Wrong the GOP was always going to run the email. I think you're in denial.

You have to look beyond Bernie but she seem to be blinded by hate.

The threat of an indictment another Obama mistake appointing a Republican to head the FBI.

[seabeyond]

13. Who is blinded by hate? Republicans are going to use shit against any Democrat. It is Sanders

people using it that really is harmful. United, this takes a back burner. The upside is Sanders himself is not using it, unless he has started recently.

[JRLeft]

14. Agreed, but you keep blaming Bernie it's the Gawd Damn GOP.

[seabeyond]

22. I do not blame Sanders for the email to do. Sanders gets a thanks for not pumping it. I am

disgusted with his supporters using it. Hence my post you initially responded to. I believe, .... That was a while ago in this conversation and I have chatted in other threads. But the gist, that Sanders supporters using this to get a win for Sanders is shameful, imo.

Right?

[JRLeft]

26. If you've followedy post I never bring it up.

[seabeyond]

36. Dude... I thanked you for you level headedness right off the fuckin' bat.

[AgingAmerican]

17. They don't have anything on him

Except a bunch of failed Hillary talking points.

[JRLeft]

19. Bernie is right especially about income inequality but a lot of her supporters keep bashing instead

of looking at the facts. The truth is this country is headed in the wrong direction in a hurry.

[seabeyond]

21. I do nto think that Sanders is right and I think Clinton's policies way exceed Sanders. Nt

[JRLeft]

24. What part of her health care plan is better?

What part of her economic plan addresses poverty?

[seabeyond]

34. Again, people that could afford the health cost will be getting free too, and we are all getting

increase in taxes to pay for it, that includes paying for the health care of those that can afford it.

Her economic playing is always with the focus of leveling the playing field. I like how she address wall street better than Sanders pat.... Seigal/Glass. And Sanders does not level the playing field and the advantage is to the white middle and upper middle, that will receive first and we hope it will trickle down. Further, The $15 an hour cannot become a national minimum wage nor should it be, seeing how certain areas are significantly more expensive to live than others and a $15 an hour would literally put a lot of small business out.

[JRLeft]

49. Actually he addresses poverty, you can't even get her to say the

word poverty. Sanders addresses poverty by raising taxes significantly on the wealthy investing heavily into our infrastructure, setting up a medicare for all system that will create jobs, setting up tuitionless college system that would poor more money into the state institutions. That will generate more jobs.

Glass Steagall is big because it separates commercial banking from investment banking we need it back are other mechanisms needed to tighten up the system? You're damn right but as history have taught us complexity is the enemy to good.

One of the reasons Dodd-Frank is weak is because of its complexity.

Complexity means loopholes to exploit.

[seabeyond]

50. Sanders doesnt clear out the playing field while Clinton does so no, it won't be advantageou to the

poor like it will be to the middle class. taking care of college is addressing middle class and higher, not the poorest who are in survival mode and not being prepped for college. That is just one example of talking poor, but not doing the homework to see how it won't help.

[JRLeft]

56. Actually she doesn't address the poor at all her plan addresses the top 10%,

her plan continues what Obama has already been doing. There will be no disruption of the widening gap.

[seabeyond]

58. College address those that can't afford, not those that can. Healthcare is directed to those that

cannot afford. Same with SS.

[JRLeft]

59. The income inequality gap goes up under neoliberal policies. Read the book "Listen Liberal" by

Thomas Frank.

[ancianita]

12. This is one Berner who has vociferously claimed that no indictment will come down, nor should it.

My post history shows that I'm not anti-Hillary and would never wish ill of her campaign.

To a man she's better than any of the very best the establishment opposition has.

If she's to be called establishment, herself, she is what that particular world forces progressive women to be if they want to play "insiders."

You might not appreciate or even care that most Berners are not anti-Hillary, but I just had to put that out here.

You can believe that they lurk, waiting for this place to get past primary passions and develop a supportive unity that beats Trump.

Trust building effort has to work both ways around here and in the party itself.

[JRLeft]

16. I don't hate her, I hate her policies and decision making especially on foreign policy.

She's still better than Trump economically. Foreign policy wise I have no idea who's more hawkish.

[seabeyond]

20. Maybe I posted to you in another thread, but I do appreciate your post.

That is why I have not given a lot of quarter to the slams on Clinton, because I know most Sanders supporters are reasoned and prefer Sanders, but will equally vote for Clinton if she is the nominee. Those that are getting themselves all in the PUMA 2016 mode are few, and I am simply not going to waste my time. I figure it is as likely they simply will never vote for a woman, or are not Dems anyway, and mostly are irrelevant.

But, I do know and love to hear, that is far from the norm.

So, ya. I get your post. It would be my position if Sanders ended up winning. He would easily and absolutely get my vote and I have really developed a problem with him thru this campaign, but he is by far a better choice.

Thanks,.

[JRLeft]

29. It's not sexism or anti democrat they will vote for Democrats like Barbara Lee.

They cannot stand neoliberal democrats. Neoliberal economic policies are protective of the top 10%.

[seabeyond]

37. There are plenty of men, and women too, who won't vote a woman President, just like they would not

vote a black president. They will vote a black congressman, yet not president. Hence needing that fuckin' glass ceiling shattered.

[JRLeft]

65. They won't vote for corporate democrats Bernie's supporters are informed.

[seabeyond]

66. I do not think most of Sanders supporters are informed.

[JRLeft]

67. Funny I haven't found one informed Clinton supporter yet.

[seabeyond]

68. Whatever.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

4. You couldn't be more correct.

[hrmjustin]

5. There are people openly rooting for it to happen here.

There are those here who have genuine questions and fears, but there are some here who troll DU over the issue.

I think we know the usual suspects.

[JRLeft]

7. Most people see this country on the brink of disaster and incremental changes especially with

climate change will be our undoing.

[riderinthestorm]

75. +10000 nt

[One_Life_To_Give]

9. Timing is wrong to help Trump

Assuming the unvetted story from the weekend was a known falsehood by the author. What is clear is the actuality of such would be well known before Labor Day. Which is when most Americans will start to pay attention to the election. The only candidate who could benefit from such would be Bernie and the NJ/CA primaries. But again that assumes the FBI doesn't throw water on the allegation.

[JRLeft]

11. This will drag on until November believe that.

[think]

15. She lied, broke rules & maybe some minor laws. But if Bush & Cheney can get away with the shit

they did Hillary won't have any problems at all.

At the most some of her inner circle will have to fall on their swords for things not even on the front burner yet.

But the system is corrupt and Hillary fits right in.


?itok=TT0P_v2k


?w=1000&h=667

[JRLeft]

18. It may cost her the election by depressing the vote. We will see.

The GOP needs a low turnout in order to win. She needs to beat Trump is economic policies will set us back 2 decades.

[SwampG8r]

23. Her nomination will.suppress the vote she is uninspiring

[Yurovsky]

28. As I've said before...

look at her appearances.. All of the excitement of a viewing at a funeral parlor.

Contrast with Bernie's events... Huge, SRO crowds, overflow into adjacent areas, enthusiasm out the wazoo.

Hell, Trump's Brownshirt rallies are far more electric than anything Hilary has ever done. And that scares me. She inspires very few people. Trump inspires those who we'd rather not vote. And I think Bernie is the only remaining candidate who can create sufficient to defeat Trump.

If low-energy Hillary is running against Trump and his army of morons AND THEN GETS INDICTED BEFOORE THE ELECTION, we'LL be stuck with Trump when we could have had Bernie. Let that soak in people. Hillary's potential indictment could crush the Democratic Party this November and set back progressive policies 20 years. I wish this were wrapped up already, but Since it is not she should step aside, but I know she won't. It's all about her and her quest for money and power.

I'm afraid we're all fucked.

[2banon]

48. Yep, Bingo.

It won't even be a Fitzmas, I don't believe.

If I'm wrong, they're playing a very dangerous shell game.

[2banon]

52. well, it hasn't happened yet, saying it's true, is like saying Hillary already "Won", the nom..

She hasn't been indicted of anything, and she hasn't won the nomination at this point in time, at this hour.

If something later develops in the snooze cycles, it still remains to be seen whether it's just another fitzmas shell game in play.

so far, all i'm seeing is "she WILL be indicted.. nahh.

Bush, Cheney, Karl Rove, Scooter Libby... etc, etc, etc and others haven't faced a number of illegal activities, so neither will HRC.





.

[ucrdem]

27. Basically they're stalling while they root through the dumpsters.

Their M.O. is to produce a surprise indictment in the last week of the election and march the Dem mayor and city council off to the pokey while the GOP claps. They did it in my town, they've done it in others. They've had to improvise on this one as they don't really have anything yet and the stronger the candidate the more timid they get.

Now here's a thought: they probably won't take out Hillary but imagine what they'd have hit Sanders with in late October. Hello President Trump.

[JRLeft]

31. Wrong if there was something there Hillary would have used it.

[ucrdem]

33. She wouldn't because she doesn't want to alienate Dems who support him.

She can get by without them in November but it's much better to try to include them so she's really pulled her punches and put on a happy face. And if they dig hard enough they can always find something or someone. They've practiced political bullying for decades. Remember Hoover?

[BillZBubb]

39. Utter bullshit. She did everything against Bernie including the race card.

Slimeball Brock, Hillary's buddy and ethical double, wouldn't stop at anything. They've got nothing on him.

Trump would go with Sanders is a "communist" and that would get him the republican base and that's it.

She's already alienated Democrats using Brock and it's too late to undo that.

[ucrdem]

40. Such as?

And as a point of reference there's the "social media" campaign Sanders has been running which has been pretty sleazy.

[SpareribSP]

53. Correct the record astroturfing

And continued "Berniebro" smears have been awful.

[ucrdem]

54. Clinton astroturfing? Can you link to some plausible evidence? A negative Twitter graphic,

for example?

[JRLeft]

60. David Brock's paid trolls.

[SpareribSP]

61. There's plenty of anti-Sanders negativity.

However it's hard to tell if it's paid or not, because that's behind closed doors. Exposing astroturfing is difficult, but from the whole "barrier breakers" email Correct The Record themselves said they were paying money for people to post online pushing the "BernieBros" narrative.

[JRLeft]

62. He paid 1 million dollars to smear Bernie.

[ucrdem]

69. I don't see that at all. By its own account it's meant to "correct the record" and encourage

Sanders supporters to consider supporting Clinton. In other words it's a charm offensive, not a smear campaign, also mainly a Twitter operation:

Among the many Hillary Clinton supporters attacked online, superdelegates have been subject to vicious attacks for supporting her. Even the director of MoveOn, which has endorsed Sen. Sanders, denounced this harassment.

In response to these attacks on supporters and superdelegates, Correct The Record is launching the Barrier Breakers 2016 digital task force. While Hillary Clinton fights to break down barriers and bring America together, the Barrier Breakers 2016 digital task force will serve as a resource for supporters looking for positive content and push-back to share with their online progressive communities, as well as thanking prominent supporters and committed superdelegates on social media.

Correct The Record will invest more than $1 million into Barrier Breakers 2016 activities, including the more than tripling of its digital operation to engage in online messaging both for Secretary Clinton and to push back against attackers on social media platforms like Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, and Instagram. Barrier Breakers 2016 is a project of Correct The Record and the brainchild of David Brock, and the task force will be overseen by President of Correct The Record Brad Woodhouse and Digital Director Benjamin Fischbein. The task force staff’s backgrounds are as diverse as the community they will be engaging with and include former reporters, bloggers, public affairs specialists, designers, Ready for Hillary alumni, and Hillary super fans who have led groups similar to those with which the task force will organize.

Lessons learned from online engagement with “Bernie Bros” during the Democratic Primary will be applied to the rest of the primary season and general election–responding quickly and forcefully to negative attacks and false narratives. Additionally, as the general election approaches, the task force will begin to push out information to Sanders supporters online, encouraging them to support Hillary Clinton.

The task force currently combats online political harassment, having already addressed more than 5,000 individuals who have personally attacked Secretary Clinton on Twitter. The task force will provide a presence and space online where Clinton supporters can organize and engage with one another and are able to obtain graphics, videos, gifs, and messaging to use in their own social spaces. Additionally, the Barrier Breakers 2016 task force hopes to embrace the creativity of Hillary Clinton’s supporters by sharing their efforts and content with other groups.

http://correctrecord.org/barrier-breakers-2016-a-project-of-correct-the-record/

[JRLeft]

73. Here's the link.

http://m.dailykos.com/story/2016/4/21/1518537/-Clinton-SuperPac-Admits-to-Paying-Internet-Trolls

[ucrdem]

74. Thanks, but all these stories are reporting or commenting on the press release I posted above.

The "troll army" is a meme based on the press release. There were at least a dozen OPs and countless replies here announcing this devious development but it basically seems to be a PR effort to establish a positive narrative going into the General. I don't know why they had to announce it which would seem to diminish the effect but no one can say they aren't being honest about it. Personally I haven't yet seen evidence except for the graphics on the page I linked to which have been re-posted once or twice here:

[frylock]

43. It's cute that you think that Dems haven't already been alienated.

I think the party fucked the pooch with their little shit show in NV.

[ucrdem]

51. Are you talking about the disruption, the vandalism, or the death threats?

Because those are all examples of Clinton delegates being bullied.

[frylock]

63. Don't forget the thrown chairs and the chants of "speak english".

[ucrdem]

70. The people responsible for that behavior aren't Clinton supporters. nt

[frylock]

71. The people responsible for that behavior exist only in the fevered mind of Hillary Supporter.

[lmbradford]

57. Lol..

Really? Just like she didnt throw the kitchen sink at Obama?

She has tried eveything she had but there just wasnt much there.

[pdsimdars]

30. That only says you don't know much about what the problem really is and / or you don't

care about national security. Otherwise you would be upset like all the people at the top of the intelligence community are.

Here's a good place to educate yourself.

http://thompsontimeline.com/The_Clinton_Email_Scandal_Timeline

[JRLeft]

32. Wrong if there was going to be an indictment it probably would have happened by now.

I do not care for Hillary at all well at least her policies. I don't know her personally, but her decision making is abysmal.

[BillZBubb]

41. That's absurd. The FBI has thousands of pages of emails to go through and analyze.

They've got to create links to key threads. If at that point, they have prima facie evidence that a crime or crimes were committed, they start the interviews.

They start at the bottom with the interviews and work their way up to the target. The interviews only recently began. That takes time again to analyze and sort the transcripts.

The fact that they have started interviews and that it is taking so much time indicates that a recommendation for indictment is now fairly likely. It's is just the opposite of your position. If there was no prima facie evidence, this would have been over already.

[frylock]

45. I don't know how anyone can look at this and think that she's going to come out unscathed.

I don't have any doubt that there will be a recommendation for indictment. Whether the DoJ elects to follow that recommendation will remain to be seen.

[BillZBubb]

46. Agreed. The FBI is more than likely moving toward a recommendation to indict.

Then the DoJ, with consultations with the White House, has a big decision to make.

[frylock]

44. Incorrect. The FBI is making sure their ducks are in a row.

If there were no course for a recommendation for indictment, this thing would have been wrapped up weeks ago.

[pdsimdars]

64. You haven't been following this so you don't really know what you are talking about.

I find that annoying when people make declarations based on nothing other than what they "feel"
like "should" be the case, etc.

Didn't I give you a link to that site that will get you some actual informaiton. This guy posts here and other places.

Paul Thompson's link

http://thompsontimeline.com/The_Clinton_Email_Scandal_Timeline

[KingFlorez]

35. That's a new one

[Orsino]

38. It's either the end of her campaign, or a lot of fuss over mothing.

Depends on which spin you like.

[BillZBubb]

42. Whether you buy it or not is immaterial. The FBI is working on it.

They are building a case. Given the fact that they are interviewing the Clinton staff, the chances that the FBI is moving towards recommending an indictment are high.

The fact that Hillary's lawyer has sent up a trial balloon saying the FBI can't make her do an interview should be a red flag to anyone paying attention. Refusing an interview is on par with pleading the Fifth.

[Demsrule86]

55. No they are not

The GOP FBI guy is stringing it along to damage Sec. Clinton. I have no idea why Pres. Obama appointed that GOP loser. Hopefully, this is the end of his career because when Clinton becomes president he is toast. She has way more experience in dealing with GOP haters and won't reach across the aisle which is futile.

[azurnoir]

47. so in your opinion who's behind it? Bernie or Trump?

but FWIW I don't think she'll be indicted either, if the investigation gets anywhere near that her campaign will choose a 'goat' from it's very own ranks and sacrifice it in the style of Scooter Libby , probably shortly after June 20

[nadinbrzezinski]

72. The FBI is indeed investigation and

from experience, they are not working on your or my calendar. It is crazy. But the OIG report was the first to confirm the broadest of what is at play

[riderinthestorm]

76. I don't believe she'll be indicted either. Comey's rec however is a different story

A recommendation to indict will hang around her neck til November.