2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumOne attempted step towards unity and reconciliation.
How about we all accept that everyone here cares about mostly the same goals, even though we have some policy differences and obviously differences in who we would want to lead the country.
So.
Bernie supporters aren't in it because of a cult of personality. It's not about Bernie, it's about what he stands for. They don't like Bernie because he's a white man. They care about social issues just as much as anyone, and saying that Bernie was a civil rights activist is not some excuse, it's a fact, and he deserves credit for it, and he's fought for civil rights since then very much while in congress. They don't support things like Single Payer because they are naive, they support it because it works great in a lot of the world, so it can be made to work here. And they are rightfully pissed off that the gains in wealth and income over the last many decades have gone almost all to the wealthiest few.
Hillary supporters aren't in it because they want Goldman Sachs to get bigger bonuses. Also not because it's "her turn" or because any woman will do. They care about poverty and inequality. They think campaign finance is broken. They think that 1%ers and big corporations have too much power. They don't just want to bomb everyone and steal their oil, they think that foreign policy is complex and there are difficult choices to make, and while you might disagree with the choices, they aren't made out of ruthless imperialism. They aren't using "experience" as an excuse to support a neo-liberal, they genuinely think that a person with Hillary's experience will be able to most effectively make progress on progressive issues.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)Baobab
(4,667 posts)And so millions of jobs are globalized.
Its on autopilot.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)realizes it lost the voting.
human nature. until they can't dispute the outcome, they won't reconcile
separate category for those that reject any vote that doesn't go their way as illegitimate--unity with such authoritarians is impossible anyways.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)This post, like all your others is not in good faith.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)morningfog
(18,115 posts)Sorry, you signed up solely to stir shit here. You've litter this board with repeated flame bait.
You are in no position to act like a peace maker and not worth trusting.
I predict you will be back to flinging your poo shortly.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)The internet, people get into it. People have 20 page wars over the best episode of Breaking Bad. Happens. You're calling me a Brock troll, hardly a friendly gesture. But I forgive easy.
We're all progressives, we do want the same thing.
Response to YouDig (Reply #18)
Post removed
Hell Hath No Fury
(16,327 posts)Nothing I hate more than some fucking noob showing up here and demanding we get in line. FUCK that shit.
TCJ70
(4,387 posts)...to Hillary supporters. It can't if you support her. Unfortunately, to non-Hillary sycophants, it does matter. Your posting history is full of garbage that completely disqualifies you from ever making a legitimate post like this. You made your bed, now lie in it.
By the way, did you ever find that thrown chair footage you swore everyone had?
YouDig
(2,280 posts)the same things. Small differences get exploded into big things during the heat of the primary.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)YouDig
(2,280 posts)We all get all divided over little stuff. $12 versus $15 minimum wage. OK, how about $13.50?
morningfog
(18,115 posts)DLevine
(1,788 posts)Hell Hath No Fury
(16,327 posts)on any given day.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)YouDig
(2,280 posts)hobbit709
(41,694 posts)YouDig
(2,280 posts)That was reported by witnesses. No, there was no video found, so maybe it didn't happen, but it was reported everywhere, I can hardly be blamed for repeating it.
What else? One post I said "Berners just want to vote for a man" was an ironic reply to someone who just said "Hillers just want to vote for a woman." I don't think that deserved a hide, especially since the woman thing didn't get one. Do you?
Then a post where I attacked Green voters as Trump-enablers. I stand by that, progressives who vote Green are doing exactly what Trump wants.
That leaves one. I didn't think it was a good idea for Bernie to debate Trump on Fox, but I crossed the line in the way I expressed it. That one I own. Plus the drinking-and-posting one.
But hardly the record of trolling that you make it out to be.
TCJ70
(4,387 posts)You're too kind to yourself.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)gollygee
(22,336 posts)I am a Bernie supporter but my reasons are different from that.
I don't see Bernie as having fought for civil rights continually for decades. I think his work decades ago speaks to his character, but I don't see him as stronger on this than Hillary. However, I am very confident either would nominate progressive SCOTUS justices and be on the progressive side of whatever civil rights issues came before them. And I don't know what else to expect from a President. It's not a battle between a civil rights champion and someone who doesn't care. It's a battle between two imperfect people who both care (although I still don't understand how Hillary thought Nancy Reagan was a voice of kindness during the AIDS epidemic.) They're both light years ahead of Trump.
I am totally with you on single payer. We spend plenty in this country on health care. I don't think it's an issue of raising more money. We have to get the same amount of money, but collect it differently. If my husband's work pays him more rather than taking money out to pay for health care, and if we pay what we now pay toward health care in taxes rather than directly to doctors and insurance companies, what difference does that make to me financially? It ends up being more in taxes, but not more of an expense to my family. It works all over the world and I think the suggestion that it couldn't work here is ridiculous. The only things that keep it from happening here are greedy corporations and obnoxious libertarians.
And then on gains in income. One thing Sanders supporters don't mention enough is that gains in income have actually gone to more than just the wealthiest few. People of color have had serious gains in income over the past few decades. Ignoring that is the kind of thing that sends a bad message to people of color. However, I agree that there have not been enough gains in income for people in general - of any race - and that way, way too much wealth belongs to a very few people. We are in a new gilded age. We need more wealth equity, and we need to continue to work on achieving parity for people of color.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)going around here and Twitter and everywhere that the two camps say about each other. But your point about civil rights is a good one. It speaks to his character like you say. And on top of that he's been on the right side of social issues in congress. It's not like he was a civil rights activist and just forgot about it, like some people on Twitter have implied.
I think both would be strong on social issues. That AIDS Reagan thing was a dumb thing to say, but still.
I also think both would be strong on economic issues though. Maybe you disagree that Hillary would. But I can tell you that her supporters aren't for her because we want more money to go to Goldman Sachs.
libtodeath
(2,888 posts)that Bernie supporters really care about progressive issues and Hillary supporters dont believe in more conservative ones.
That is why most of us that support Bernie worry about a Clinton Presidency.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)Neither side are the demons the other side makes them out to be.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)You are also staying really classy under very personal attacks. It's what we need to try and do.