Just to be clear, *these* overweight men are all body-shaming women.

[riversedge]

Laura ‏@SheWhoVotes Sep 29

Just to be clear, *these* men are all body-shaming women.

[MoonRiver]

1. Yep, and that's why we call them Deplorables.

[George II]

34. We'd need a HUGE basket to fit just those four into it.

[mdbl]

77. ROFL!

[Peacetrain]

2. Many of us in RT have commented on that

[Caliman73]

3. They are White, have money, and are in positions with some political or social power

They think it is their right to judge women and others. I am sure deep in their psyche, they feel the irony and the sting of their particular situation, but they repress that strongly and carry on with their arrogance because they have to defend their weaknesses with offence.

[whathehell]

56. They are MEN..

Male Privilege in action.

[Gothmog]

4. Irony is very clear here

[meadowlark5]

5. And only because they have fame and money

they have had and have the women they did/do. Not the most attractive deplorables themselves.

[asiliveandbreathe]

6. I got to thinking about the women behind the behinds...

Why? - (I know, I know - because of the intimacy, barf!) LOL....

[riversedge]

9. uga uga

[retrowire]

7. Dont body shame both ways, dont do it at all.

Last edited Tue Oct 4, 2016, 01:18 PM - Edit history (1)

We are better than that.

[MoonRiver]

10. It's not about body shaming. It's about the HYPOCRISY.

Are we supposed to ignore that really significant detail?

[retrowire]

17. sooo fight hypocrisy by being hypocrites? nt

[MoonRiver]

19. Why is pointing out hypocrisy being a hypocrite?

[retrowire]

20. because youre pointing out their hypocrisies

Whilst you yourself are engaging in their acts of hypocrisy and proclaiming you're above it.

It's... Stupid. And beneath us.

[MoonRiver]

23. I am NOT engaging in hypocrisy!

I think you may be a tad too sensitive.

[retrowire]

29. Mmmhmm ok.

I take the road of saying these men are pricks because they body shame women. That's it.

I'm too sensitive?

But you take the road of body shaming the men using their own logic because they're body shaming others, calling them hypocrites while also engaging in a hypocritical act yourself.

And that's reasonable. And okay.

Mmhmm okay.

[stonecutter357]

74. don has very small hands does that offend you?

[LanternWaste]

76. FFS, Horatian satire is not hypocrisy.

FFS, Horatian satire is not hypocrisy.

"Hey Stanley Kubrik... sooo fight hypocrisy by being hypocrites?"
"Hey Mark Twain... sooo fight hypocrisy by being hypocrites?"

Sounds so much more under-educated when said as such.

[retrowire]

78. sooo

I have to respect the method if it were done by great minds at some point?

Seriously, all I'm saying is "do unto others" and I've got about 5 people attacking me about the golden rule.

I'm just... Why fight so hard just so you can body shame body shamers? Just point them out as bastards and be done with it. Why is that so reprehensible?

[TiredTexan]

79. You have been given multiple reasons why

No one here thinks your advice is unsound.

Again, pointing out these powerful men's weight is not fat shaming. It is, however, "fact shaming."

This is not about weight, it's about men's belief that women are there for their viewing pleasure. It's about who gets to speak and be listened to, and who doesn't. If weight were really a flaw to such men, they'd either lose weight or stop calling women pigs.

This is a dominance play. They get to demand women look and behave in ways to please their sexual fantasies, and women had better do their bidding. Weight is disgusting on a woman showing her lack of control, a moral failing, but irrelevant to the character of a man. It's about power, and pointing this out by recognizing the hypocrisy and double standard is one of the few weapons women have.

You are willfully not getting this.

[Raine1967]

24. +1

[markpkessinger]

70. Indeed -- the hypocrisy and the sexist double standard! n/t

[anamandujano]

13. I'm not better than that. I feel sorry for their wives.

[Raine1967]

16. Pointing out hypocrisy is not shaming.

Yes we are better, better at pointing out the utter hypocrisy.

Do you see any women from the Trump campaign body/slut shaming people? I haven't and I am willing to be corrected on that point.

[retrowire]

18. But are we pointing out hypocrisy by body shaming men

And by that, being hypocrites ourselves?

[Raine1967]

21. Let me ask you, are these men over weight? nt

[retrowire]

22. Yes. nt

[Raine1967]

25. Are these men trying to shame a woman for her weight? nt

[retrowire]

26. Yes. nt

[Raine1967]

27. Why is there a problem with the OP pointing out the very thing we agree with? nt

[retrowire]

30. because theres the high road

Of saying, body shaming is wrong and these men are bad for that.

And then there's the OP that says, body shaming is wrong but also these men have bad bodies so thats hypocritical of them and I will judge this while standing high and mighty, yet also engage in the wrong act myself.

That's the difference. We can be better than that.

Just consider them wrong for it, don't join them. Fight fire with water. Not more fire.

[MoonRiver]

32. I refuse to ignore and/or defend hypocritical men, even if they are fat!

I am also not sure what you mean by going on the high road. Does that mean we just take the abuse meted out to us?

[retrowire]

33. nooo

I just told you what the high road is.

Consider them bad and wrong for their actions without engaging in the same action.

Never said ignore them or defend them.

[MoonRiver]

35. I don't think we're in disagreement then.

But it is a little hard to point out the hypocrisy without discussing why they are hypocrites.

[retrowire]

37. I just choose to not point out the hypocrisy whatsoever.

Their original act to begin with is something we universally agree as bad. So instead of engaging in that act in order to point out the hypocrisy, simply call it out as wrong.

Hillary wouldn't be on stage defending Mercado by saying, "I mean, LOOK AT THIS GUY, AMIRITE?"

No, because she's better, we're better. Or at least we can be!

[Raine1967]

39. I think all of us agree with the point.

I am quite confused.

[Raine1967]

38. Pointing it out is the opposite of ignoring them.

I am quite confused, you and I agree with the OP and yet you don't like that the OP made the point that you and I agree about.

[retrowire]

43. op didnt simply point out thay body shaming was bad.

The op body shamed the body shamers in order to make their point which I disagree with.

High road is simply calling body shaming bad. Like Hillary did.

This logic is not hard.

[Raine1967]

36. Are you a man?

I for one as a woman will not sit by in silence when men shame my sisters.

I have been shamed by people like those mentioned in the OP.

I have been told to take the high road and that was code for being quiet. That's my experience. Yours may vary.

[retrowire]

41. let me tell you a story about body shaming.

Last edited Tue Oct 4, 2016, 08:31 PM - Edit history (1)

I'm a man.

Married to a woman that society considers "beautiful". I do too of course. But my opinion isnt the point.

There was a song that came out, "all about that bass" which celebrated heftier women and I think that's fine. But. It mocked skinny women. It taunted thinner women.

I get it, it's catharsis for larger women who, have been totally disrespected by our society.

But does it give them the right to say comments to my wife like, "she needs a burger." "Oh my god who would be with that? Men like meat" and worse things.

In this scenario, the wronged became what they hated. Body shamers. Hypocrites.

Now my wife is a perfectly healthy weight. Believe me, no one would be concerned with her health. But women who have been wronged and have low self esteem? Oh they'll attack her.

And my wife can't have friends because of it. Men leer at her instead of them. Jealousy takes over. Goodbye friendship. And it's not even my wife's fault. Is that fair?

Anyways. I am a man. But I have empathy for women on both sides of the body shaming parallel. As well as men.

[Raine1967]

45. I am a woman. I think I have a better understanding now.

and I think with respect to you, that this is mansplaining.

Your opinion is exactly the point of our discussion.

[retrowire]

46. woop there it is.

My gender has rendered me no longer equal to you in the discussion.

I was waiting for that word. Yay for "equality". :/

I'll continue to be an ally. I just won't body shame the body shamers to make my points. Carry on.

[TiredTexan]

49. Your remedy requires women to suffer hypocrisy in silence.

Merely pointing out the hypocrisy of a fat person shaming another fat person makes the person pointing out the hypocrisy guilty of the same fault as the person originally doing the shaming?

That's the same logic that the alt-right uses to say calling out racism is racist.

It is impossible to point out hypocrisy related to fat shaming without pointing out that the person is a hypocrite because they are also fat. The real point is that being fat is not something to be ashamed of, and the original "shamer" doesn't get to apply a double standard without push back.

Silence isn't taking the high road. It's abdication to a gender double standard, and to victim-hood. And since this double standard only works to the detriment of women, you don't get to decide our response, or shame us for having a different response than you. You aren't taking the high road here, because you aren't affected by the double standard. You just sound smug and judgmental.

[retrowire]

50. i cant read the rest of your post since your first statement is wrong.

I never said to be silent or ignore it.

Ever.

I said that the high road is calling it deplorable as it is, without having to engage in the very act of body shaming the body shamers to make your point. Don't call them fat as well. That's stooping to their level.

Like Hillary, with class, call them out and take them down. But don't do what they do in order to do it. Fight fire with water. Not more fire. I don't really understand why that stance is illiciting anger from anyone. No need to call it hypocrisy, it's wrong to begin with. Call it deplorable. Why go further and do the same that they do?

Never said ignore it. Never said be silent. :/ That's the second time I've been accused of that. Weird.

[retrowire]

51. also to add because its funny..

"that logic is the same logic the Alt-Right uses to say calling out racism is racist".

No. My logic is called "Do unto others" aka "two wrongs don't make it right."

The alt right uses deflection. This op isn't deflection. It's outright body shaming men who body shame women.

I don't think Hillary would do this.

[retrowire]

48. and just to add...

The point of the discussion was men's opinions on womens bodies.

Not MY opinion in the least. Since I don't share that opinion.

[TiredTexan]

59. Again, you miss the point

Not pointing out the fact that they, too, are fat, perpetuates the double standard and allows the hypocrisy to stand unchallenged. Your proposed solution is really no solution at all. Calling out their behavior without noting their weight misses the very crux of the unfair bigotry of their actions. These fat men are respected, listened to, afforded deference, elected to office, and hold public positions that give them the impression that the rules they apply to those they deem less than them don't apply to them. They can be fat and not suffer any consequences from that, but women, well that is another matter altogether.

The only way to point out the double standard, their prejudice and malice, is to point out that these fat men are gleefully criticizing and denigrating others they think are inferior to them for traits they share with those people. That is the definition of hypocrisy.

Because you are a man, and you are attempting to impose your judgment and opinions on how women should behave, how we should act, all with respect to something you will never face, you aren't a good ally. Whether you recognize it or not, you are mansplaining, demanding that women behave the way you think they should. You should just stop and listen rather than thinking you know better how women should respond to blatant bigotry and ridicule of the type we face every day from cruel, hateful men in positions of power. You aren't helping.

[retrowire]

61. I'm not a good ally?

Well, I'll just continue Hillary's example of taking the high road and not being a hypocrite. I'm sure she, as a woman, would agree. Or, since my stance is the same as hers, does that make her a bad ally?

Keep putting up walls of divisiveness, I don't care. I'm an ally. I kill em with kindness, I fight fire with water and I do unto others.

That's that. I'm actually sorry if that knocks your pedestal a bit. And, even if I were a woman, I would know better than to stoop to their level. Because gender makes no difference when it comes to being a better person.

It's an actual shame that knowing that I'm a male suddenly invalidates my entire stance. Notice, people were engaging me up until someone asked me my gender. Then after that, "Mansplaining. Disregard." That's a sad way to go about achieving "equality."

Again, I never said to ignore it, enable it or not fight it. Hillary is fighting it just fine. Guess what she's not doing? She's not calling Trump fat. Because she's classy. And we can be too. You can fight them, without becoming them. You cannot have it both ways and consider yourself as taking the higher road. Period.

[TiredTexan]

64. Sorry, you strike me as sanctimonious to a fault.

You are a privileged man, pretending to take the high road while really sitting in smug judgment of those in situations you've never faced, and will never face.

Pointing out a fact, that these are fat men ridiculing women for being overweight is a mere statement of truth of their hypocrisy. It only becomes "stooping to their level" if one assumes that being overweight is somehow bad or immoral, and pointing this out, is also immoral. Doing either of those things is not wrong, and I would argue that the failure to speak such truths to power is, in and of itself, a moral failing. In other words, I believe you are taking the low road, the easy way out, by not calling this behavior out as hypocrisy. And the only way to point out the hypocrisy is by pointing out that the men calling women fat are themselves overweight.

Further, you have no idea what Clinton thinks on this issue, and pointing to her as authority for your argument is a clear logical fallacy known as "appeal to authority."

Stop telling women what to do, what to say, how to act, for indignities you have no clue about. You are merely perpetuating and prolonging the suffering caused by other men.

I can't speak for any other women, but I'm damn sick and tired of men denigrating me, and the other men telling me what to say and how to feel, and how to act in response to my denigration.

Stop it.

[retrowire]

67. im literally doing what Hillary is doing.

You stop it. Wow.

[TiredTexan]

68. You have no idea what Hillary is doing.

Her surrogates have been openly pointing out the hypocrisy of heavy men ridiculing the weight of beautiful women. I've heard at least five different iterations of this theme in the last two days. They would not do so without her knowledge and approval. In fact, Hillary herself pointed out just today how ridiculous Trump was criticizing a Miss Universe for her weight.

You need to recognize that I am not the one telling anyone how they should act or feel - i.e., telling you that you must point out these hypocrisies, or feel any particular way about them. In contrast, you are telling me, and all the other women commenting here, how to act, and how to feel. So, it's only fair that I get to tell you to stop. You are the one bossing everyone around, imposing your moral judgments on women who don't agree. We are responding, loudly, that "you aren't the boss of me." There is a very real difference between trying to control someone else, and objecting to attempts to being controlled. Your right to swing your fist ends when it connects with my face.

If you can't tell by now, women are pretty sick of being criticized for things men do all the time, and being told what to do. You are doing both.

Stop it.

[Skittles]

66. mansplaining at its finest

my wife can't have friends

[tenderfoot]

52. Your concern for corpulent unattractive sexist assholes has been duly noted.

eom

[retrowire]

53. yes.

Me doing exactly what Hillary would do is due for notation.

Yep.

Let's all attack the guy who's following the whole "do unto others" spiel.

I'd rather do what Hillary does than what Trump does. And tweets like this? His specialty.

So enjoy your catharsis people. I know it makes Trump feel good at 3am.

[Rex]

62. How do you know it is body shaming? Those men have other things in common.

You shouldn't broad brush like that.

[retrowire]

63. topic title "overweight men" kinda paints the picture. nt

[TiredTexan]

65. Only if you assume being overweight

Is somehow, in and of itself, a bad trait. How can mentioning someone's extra weight be anything but neutral unless there is a judgment implicit in the comment inferring that being heavy is worthy of disapprobation?

[stonecutter357]

73. you seem very concerned.

[Motley13]

8. Hillary should go for the chubby + vote

she could easily win Alabama & Mississippi

[BobTheSubgenius]

11. They shame men, too.

Although they do it silently.

[meow2u3]

12. Part of me wants to see these hypocrites get a taste of their own medicine

Fat guys are the last ones who can afford to sit in judgment of rotund women, so they should be punished with the same measure they've dished out for decades: loss of power, income, and status. Let them see how it feels like.

That's the only way conservatives get it--when it happens to them or one of theirs.

[GusBob]

14. the big difference being they are full of shit

fat tubs of shit

[thesquanderer]

15. Men aren't shamed by the size of their waist. Only by the size of their... hands.

Though apart from that, western society (at least) has long valued women primarily for their beauty, and men for their "success." (And no, neither is fair.)

[SleeplessinSoCal]

28. The extra large world of misogyny. n/t

[apcalc]

31. In a cartoon last week there were two others in the fat boy body shaming group - Aisles, and Bannon

[Gamecock Lefty]

40. Hillary should never have said 50% deplorables!

She should have said 90%!!! At least!

[Helen Borg]

42. "Men"? "Pigs" would me more appropriate.

[rivegauche]

44. Each one scummier and more disgusting than the next.

Maybe it's because a woman is going to be POTUS soon, but I've been really seeing so much misogyny all around me. Everywhere. I've always been a feminist, and very sensitive to piggery, but it feels like things are getting a lot worse. I've had to stop socializing with some people because I just won't tolerate it. I've gotten to the point where telling people to GFY is normal, which isn't good. Does the cause no favors, I know.

[bucolic_frolic]

47. GHWB turned "liberal" into a word of scorn

"deplorables" just might stick too

[world wide wally]

54. And their condom sizes are "S", "XS", and "Shrink to Fit"

[MoonRiver]

57. ...

[Maru Kitteh]

55. Trump calls women fat;

[IrishEyes]

58. There are many men who think its okay.

It doesn't matter how big or unattractive they are, they will put down any woman who doesn't match their unrealistic expectations. They put down women for being too fat, too thin, too flat chested, too curvy, too tall, too short, etc. Fortunately, many more men are not like them. These four men are not physically attractive but that would be okay. Many lovely people are not physically attractive. It is what is inside them that is truly repulsive, ugly and sickening.

[Dawson Leery]

60. Reminds me of many of my school bullies.

Football/Wrestling were popular with them. They picked on the physically weaker kids.

[lonestarnot]

69. Ackety!

[DesertRat]

71. K&R

[ErikJ]

72. Its OK for fat men to body shame women

because there's a double standard. OK for men but not women. Pretty sick and twisted.

[Vinca]

75. Hunka hunka burnin' love . . . ROFLMAO.

If a woman takes a vow of celibacy and starts to weaken, all she needs to do is look at these photos.