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kentuck

(111,076 posts)
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 09:27 AM Nov 2016

What if the "recounts" do show a significant discrepancy in the vote totals?

But not enough to change the results?

What if there was a conspiracy by Republican Governors to manipulate the votes?

On top of the reported voter suppression in some states, how would the people react to such news?

14 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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EL34x4

(2,003 posts)
3. There won't be any states "flipping"
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 09:37 AM
Nov 2016

Recounts may net one candidate or the other a few hundred votes at most. People are delusional if they think Hillary is going to get anywhere remotely close to the thousands needed to change even a single state into her favor.

Short of being struck down by the Hand of God, Donald J. Trump will be sworn in to office at noon on the 20th of January, 2017.

kentuck

(111,076 posts)
4. I think most people agree with you.
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 09:44 AM
Nov 2016

But, if a significant number were to change, what impact would it have?

 

EL34x4

(2,003 posts)
7. Nothing good, that's for sure.
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:18 AM
Nov 2016

First off, Trump isn't just going to give up electoral votes without a fight. So there's that.

Millions of Americans, including many Democrats, believing the election was stolen.

Complete loss of faith in our electoral process, our system of government, our political institutions.

Stock market tanks. Millions lose their jobs. Rioting in the streets as essential government services are shut off and grocery stores no longer receive deliveries. High-ranking military defections. The wealthy sending their money overseas as banks fail.

Two shadow governments; Trump impotent and powerless from his tower in New York and Hillary Clinton, impotent and powerless from the White House.

Men with guns in the streets making the rules.

Just my speculative 0.02$.

kentuck

(111,076 posts)
10. Wow! That's 1984ish !
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:31 AM
Nov 2016

But, it is not out of the realm of possibilities, in my opinion.

We should treat this guy as if he were an escapee from a mental institution and taken over our government.

Partisanship had grown to the point where the old adage, "divide and conquer" became possible. The political Parties had grown so far apart in political thought, that it was not possible to unite for anything. They could not communicate with each other.

This created the environment for a person like Donald Trump to take control. His celebrity controlled the media by creating controversy, almost daily.

For most, it is a scary time.

We must be very vigilant if we wish to keep our freedoms.

DFW

(54,330 posts)
5. Even if not
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 09:49 AM
Nov 2016

If a manual recount (or, even better, expert forensic examination of the voting machines) uncovers evidence of deliberate Republican-favoring manipulation, that will be enough to throw Trump's presidency under a cloud of well-deserved doubt, and the Democratic Party can deliberate on what to do from there.

If, as you say, the exercise uncovers no wrongdoing and changes only a few hundred votes, we are no worse off than before.

But this will be more than just a "recount." This will be, or should be, anyway, a thorough investigation into whether there was manipulation of the popular will in the three states in question. If there is solid evidence found, then the whole use of electronic machines, as well as their reported result, is put under a cloud of suspicion. If what my DARPA family member tells me is true--and he hasn't changed his stance in 14 years--and this is finally a lead story on CNN, then we can finally ditch them altogether.

pnwmom

(108,973 posts)
6. If the results are insignificant we could be worse off than if we hadn't done a recount at all.
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:01 AM
Nov 2016

Because these recounts won't be able to uncover all types of hacking -- it is possible to hack into an electronic machine without leaving traces -- we could be giving false assurance that our systems are adequate.

They are not. We need paper ballots or electronic machines that leave a verifiable paper trail.

But Philadelphia county and the area around Miami both rely on electronic paperless machines that can be easily hacked, according to computer experts. So do a number of other swing states. But if the recounts suggest that everyone went fine, then it could hurt us in the future. The argument would be made that in 2016 we'd wasted $7 million on the three recounts that proved nothing was wrong -- why do that again?

While all the attention is focused on this issue, no one is talking about the millions of votes purged from registration systems or voters required to produce ID's that they didn't have. That's what probably tipped the election -- that and James Comey's two letter bombs.

DFW

(54,330 posts)
8. Illegal voter purging won't get any better under Trump, and certainly not under the next SCOTUS
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:20 AM
Nov 2016

As for the machines, I think the DARPA people could uncover hacking or fraudulent programming. Some first year student from MIT maybe not. It depends on who is doing the forensic checking. If it is not done by experts who know what to look for, then they might as well not spend the money. This has to be treated with all the seriousness of looking for a terrorist program designed to make all our domestically-stored nuclear warheads detonate at midnight on New Year's Day, because the threat to our country's integrity is that great.

pnwmom

(108,973 posts)
9. It was a computer scientist professor from MIT who said these machines
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:28 AM
Nov 2016

can be hacked in a way that leaves no traces.

And we don't know that any of the machines will undergo forensic checking. A recount is usually just recounting the paper ballots or checking the calculations -- not forensically examining the machines.

And the recount will definitely NOT "be treated with all the seriousness of looking for a terrorist program designed to make all our domestically-stored nuclear warheads detonate at midnight on New Year's Day, because the threat to our country's integrity is that great."

That's why I think we might be worse off.

kentuck

(111,076 posts)
11. I think it is a worthwhile effort, also.
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:36 AM
Nov 2016

If there is no integrity with our votes, there can be no integrity in our government. It is a very serious situation.

We need immediate voter reform, that will have a paper trail, from every precinct in America.

If they cannot do that, then we may have to actually, in reality, "drain the swamp". What other choice would we have?

dmosh42

(2,217 posts)
12. It might show a system that won't be trusted for the 2018 election, or it might put to rest all the.
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 10:52 AM
Nov 2016

rumors of "hacks" or other attempts to disrupt the elections. From that standpoint it will be worthwhile.
My own view is I can't see this huge surge of rust belt workers suddenly see Trump as the 'great hope'!

2naSalit

(86,515 posts)
14. I think
Sat Nov 26, 2016, 12:24 PM
Nov 2016

it cold result in far more contention than the 2000 catastrophe presented and further undermine the integrity of our government and elections. Could get ugly, but I think we are headed toward some pretty ugly times regardless of what comes into being now.

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