Voter suppression seems to be getting overlooked as a factor.

[Garrett78]

So, I'm just starting this thread to remind folks that the Shelby County v. Holder (5-4) decision of 2013 was (and will continue to be) very devastating.

Given how slim the margin was in numerous battleground states, I think it's possible voter suppression alone is why we aren't talking about President-elect Clinton.

[Duckhunter935]

1. That was probably

The deciding factor in my opinion

[SharonAnn]

6. I think it was the most important part of the election process that cost HRC the election.

The voter suppression effort was large, across many states, coordinated by the GOP and the Crosscheck software. It disenfranchised hundreds of thousands of voters. I think it was especially important in Wisconsin and north Carolina.

In addition to "purging" voters from the roles, there was organized reduction of number of voting days and a severe reduction in the number of voting locations.

And now I'm hearing about how the DMV voter registrations in North Carolina got lost in "some" districts. The districts that would most likely vote Democratic.

[Takket]

2. meanwhile voter fraud is continually discussed in the media even though the instances of it

can be counted on one hand.

[Exilednight]

16. The irony is that many on this very board are demanding recounts due to

vote tampering.

Eventually, the Republican party will use this against us. I already hear the right-wing policy wonks gearing up their debate now - "Look, Democrats wasted all this money on recounts accusing voter fraud. This is why we need voter ID laws."

I wish people would use their brain before posting. No recount is going to change the election results. Sure, Hillary might get more votes than she had, but she will not get enough to swing three states and turn the tide.

[Garrett78]

17. There's a difference between voter fraud and election fraud.

Not to mention voter suppression, which we know is a reality. Election fraud (on a substantial scale) may also be a reality. But we know voter fraud is virtually nonexistent.

[Exilednight]

18. Good luck trying to convince the masses of the difference.

[Garrett78]

19. Agreed.

It's about as likely as winning over Trump supporters by tweaking the Democratic Party's economic messaging. Yet many DUers seem convinced that Dems can win them over.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

3. It's huge

We need to be fighting the suppression laws themselves, but we can't really afford to wait for them to be overturned or voted down.

We need to be reaching out the to people to help them learn how to check on their registration - where they "Crosschecked out" and don't even know it? If so, let's help them find that, and then help them re-register.

In states with strict voter ID laws, we need to help people get the IDs they need. That might be helping them find out online how to get a birth certificate, or when we're able and they're not, paying for that documentation. Or maybe it's paying the fee for the ID, or driving them to the DMV for a state ID card, helping them fill out the paperwork.

If they have to cast a provisional ballot, helping them get the documentation they need to the right place by the deadline so that their vote counts.

Until we can get the laws changed, we have to work to counteract the damage they're causing.

[Hoyt]

4. I thought most picture ID laws were overturned. The "crosscheck" thing only seems to apply if someon

actually tried to vote after many years (admittedly I haven't followed that one closely). And that probably worked both ways. In the majority of states, one can vote early or even by mail, so those folks certainly had ample opportunity to vote. While I support same day registration, I'm just not convinced the type of voter suppression above had a lot to do with this loss. Now intimidation by white wing deplorables might have had some impact.

[Garrett78]

5. Here's an article detailing what took place in just a few of the battleground states:

https://thinkprogress.org/2016-a-case-study-in-voter-suppression-258b5f90ddcd#.bdaqncqkq

Not to mention voter intimidation tactics, and the lack of sufficient polling sites in urban areas.

[SharonAnn]

7. No, Picture ID laws were not overturned. They're still on the books.

And suppressing hundreds of thousands of votes, perhaps more, had a huge impact. Why are you trying to pretend that it wasn't an issue? It was an enormous issue. Don't underestimate the impact.

[Garrett78]

8. I don't think Hoyt is "trying to pretend" anything.

I think he's asking genuine questions. Nothing wrong with that.

[Hoyt]

9. In most states if you don't have a picture ID, you can show a utility bill. Do you know of a state

that is different? If a voter was refused a ballot, I agree with you. If not, you are just blowing smoke.

[Raastan]

10. In Indiana, you must have a picture I D

Utility bills only work if you want a library card in Indiana

Let's hear it for Mitch Daniels and Mike Pence....

[Hoyt]

12. I agree Indiana's rules are tough compared to many red states. One can probably get away with

absentee voting if you are too ill to get a voter ID, over 65, don't think you'll be in town, etc. Don't need a photo ID for that. I'm not sure those rules work just against Democrats, but Hoosiers need to change that before allowing any basketball to be played in the state.

[Nay]

14. In VA you have to have a picture ID.

[Raastan]

11. Read Greg Palast's article in Rolling Stone, 9-8-16 about Crosscheck

Last edited Sun Nov 27, 2016, 07:20 PM - Edit history (1)

[Hoyt]

13. Again, if anyone walked up to vote 11/8/16and was denied by "crosscheck" that should be investigated

I've not seen any evidence of that on any significant level (actually not 1 person). Palast says 400,000 were removed from voter registration due to crosscheck in a state, but I've yet to see one person denied a vote. Those that vote probably registered elsewhere when they moved. They voted there and were removed where they used to live.

I think everyone should vote with few restrictions. In fact, I'm OK with painting your forehead red, white, blue so you can only vote once, and that's it. But, I just think we are barking up the wrong tree in most cases. I'm sure there were a few ignorant white wingers who might have been told they weren't registered, not that I really give a darn about them.

[Raastan]

15. If you read the article or Google Crosscheck, an explanation of how it works is given

You may not even know at the time that your vote won't be counted.

Crosscheck and many other suppression tactics is not barking up the wrong tree when it explains why Rumpus was able to get some of the votes he got in the places he got them.

[red dog 1]

20. Speaking of voter suppression,

Last edited Sun Nov 27, 2016, 09:29 PM - Edit history (1)

Greg Palast did a piece in Rolling Stone called:
"The GOP's Secret War on Voters" (Aug. 24, 2016)
http://www.gregpalast.com/rolling-stone-expose-gops-secret-plan-steal-vote/


He also wrote this, after the election:
"The Election was Stolen - Here's How"
http://www.gregpalast.com/election-stolen-heres/

BEFORE A SINGLE VOTE WAS CAST, THE ELECTION WAS FIXED BY GOP

"Starting in 2013 - just as the Supreme court gutted the Voting Rights Act-
a coterie of (GOP) operatives, under the direction of Kris Kobach, Kansas Secretary of State, created a system to purge 1.1 million Americans of color from the voting rolls of GOP-controlled states.
The system is called 'Crosscheck'"

CROSSCHECK IN ACTION

Trump victory margin in Michigan: 13,107
Michigan Crosscheck purge list 449,922

Trump victory margin in Arizona: 85,257
Arizona Crosscheck purge list 270,824

Trump victory in North Carolina: 177.008
North Carolina Crosscheck purge list: 589,393



(From Mother Jones Magazine)

WISCONSIN:
300,000 registered voters lacked the Voter ID necessary to cast their ballots.
Trump won Wisconsin by only 27,000 votes