A white privileged trump voter told me this

[boston bean]

"I voted for Trump because my son is thinking of going into the military and I didn't want that bitch who took money from foreign governments being commander in chief."

Yet, nuclear proliferation and using them if you have them is just fine and dandy.

And people think Hillary could have won this voter over with a clearer jobs message... I am LMAO at that thought.

[raging moderate]

1. But he doesn't mind that Trump did it.

IOKIYAR again.

[muntrv]

2. But he's ok with Trump's ties to Putin and Russia.

http://time.com/4433880/donald-trump-ties-to-russia/#4433880/donald-trump-ties-to-russia/

[Grey Lemercier]

9. a shit tonne of RW'ers actually think Putin is a good guy, and he has shed the "commie" shit.

They love his anti-LGBTQ agenda, his strongman image, and his appeal to white nationalism and tradition religion.

[TCJ70]

3. I get people not wanting to vote for Hillary...

...but I'll never understand anyone being comfortable voting for Trump.

[Grey Lemercier]

10. Millions upon millions decided to vote for neither by staying home.

Now they will feel the BURN of custodial democracy.

[Guilded Lilly]

4. Anyone using the term "that bitch" to describe Clinton,

has proven themselves a shallow, misogynist blowhard. And that goes for males and females.

Despite the intelligent and fierce efforts of secure, open-minded men, and strong, gender proud women, the fear and crude ugliness thrown at an infinitely sane, experienced and qualified person due to genital "formation" in favor of a hideously incompetent, oafish, mentally defective Cretin proves that The Shit for Brains Stupid thrives with resplendent ignorance in our country.

We haven't come that far at all, after all.
Our battle is far more insidious than many of us imagined possible.

[brer cat]

24. plus 1000

Wish I could rec this post. You nailed it, Guilded Lilly.

[Guilded Lilly]

56. I wish I was wrong! Thanks

[JHan]

29. The APA needs to list HillaryHate as a psychotic disorder..

[berksdem]

30. can we add to that..

the Dems who think Bernie lost it for HRC?

[JHan]

37. nope

[berksdem]

65. ah...

seems like you may suffer from the same.

[JHan]

66. Looks like false equivalencies is the theme of 2016

- no it is not the same
- the party became divided party partly because of Bernie's belligerence and persistence to stay in the game after it was clear he would never win the nomination. Yes that happened. Yes it was damaging.

[berksdem]

67. stop... just stop...

the false belief that Bernie is the reason HRC lost has been the biggest prevailing theme on DU as of late - and it is total BS. Maybe, if HRC and her campaign actually ran a 50 state campaign instead of ignoring portions of the voting populations she would win. Maybe, just maybe, if the DNC did not screw Bernie over he would have bailed out earlier and Hillary would have won. Maybe, just maybe, the HRC campaign should have really paid attention to the rust belt. Maybe, just maybe, if the majority of women voting would have voted for HRC she would win...

Stop acting like HRC is the golden rule. She was a flawed candidate that ran a flawed campaign. I voted for her and I did so with enthusiasm. I also predicted that Trump would win while being told that "things will be fine" and HRC "has it in the bag."

Right now the division within the Democratic party is the major issue. HRC and her supporters constantly blaming everyone except themselves for their campaign failures. If people would look at the party without living in a bubble things might go in the right direction.

As of right now - blaming everyone else for your failures makes things looks petty. The time is to reorganize as a party instead of splitting.

[JHan]

68. Where did I argue he was THE reason she lost?

[berksdem]

71. reading your previous post...

it is apparent that you believe Bernie was at least a big reason she lost.

[JHan]

69. How about everyone indulge in some introspection and admit it was a fked up year all around?

If I could critique Hillary, you could critique Sanders.

I have my criticisms of Hillary right here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512631083

[berksdem]

72. completely agree...

I have to be honest here - the amount of blame being thrown around on this site is what is really bothering me. I feel like some supporters, okay a lot, of HRC supporters around here are more than willing to blame everyone but the HRC campaign. No disrespect meant to you!! I am just getting a little tired of the constant blame-game.

IMO, the campaign was far from adequate and I want people to pull together to fix the issues. Not ignore the issues - Trump needs to be a one term president and it starts now. The Dems need to reorganize and game-plan to make sure we are in a position to recapture the seats in 2 years and the WH in 4 years.

Again, no disrespect... peace.

[JHan]

77. I think many are still sore..

From a year of insistent attacks against Hillary the person: rather than Hillary's campaign ..
A distinction can be made and is often not made..

I'm a young woman and it pained me to see it in full effect this year. I've never seen such vitriol leveled against a candidate for often the flimsiest of reasons, which is why I called it HillaryHate. I don't mind a fair criticism of HRC, however the toxic hate leveled against her was on another level I can't even begin to ..comprehend because if I do it will thoroughly depress me.

[Garrett78]

58. Yep, as others point out, Trump has taken money and then some from foreign governments.

At the heart, it's about bigotry. Misogyny, sexism, racism, xenophobia, etc.

[TheFrenchRazor]

83. the B-word is right below the surface with a whole lot of Trump voters. surprise. not. nt

[Txbluedog]

5. I'll bet they'll be real proud when Trump starts unneeded wars

and gets their son killed

[treestar]

6. Yes, what a moron

there is no reasoning with these people.

[bdamomma]

22. yes that is correct

he is gathering up his army to do his bidding. Does anyone believe this guy gives a crap about people dying? a big NO.

[David__77]

76. One candidate called for considering a no fly zone in Syria.

Implementing that would necessitate confrontation with Syrian and Russian forces. That candidate actually wasn't Trump.

[maryellen99]

8. You believe Trump is a peace loving hippie???

A rapturist is in the running for Secretary of Defense but Hillary is the warmonger? GTHOH.

[maryellen99]

13. Excuse me I don't live in a bubble

A lot of people I know voted for him and it was either the economy,race,the Dallas Police shootings,BLM,and abortion. Not one mentioned Syria.

[emulatorloo]

19. Yep. Comey letter was one of their excuses as well.

Nobody talked about Syria. They certainly didn't vote for Trump because he was more "liberal" than HRC.

[maryellen99]

26. Thank you nt

[astral]

55. He talked about syria on a number of occasions.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/16/politics/donald-trump-syrian-refugees/index.html

[Maru Kitteh]

63. That fucking idiot couldn't point to Syria on a map if you floated him the first two letters of

each country and pointed with both hands.

[Grey Lemercier]

12. rapturist is in the running for Secretary of Defense

I would LOL, but it actually may indeed happen and so I will just shiver.

We are entering a maelstrom of geopolitical delta, its mind boggling we have arrived at thsi place in time.

[maryellen99]

14. Isn't Tom Cotton in the running? He's a rapturist nt

[Grey Lemercier]

15. yes, I was agreeing with you

I was tempted to lol because the sentence itself sounds insane but its TRUE.

Btw, Cotton was my number one pick to win rethug POTUS nomination in 2020 if shitgibbon had not won.

[maryellen99]

16. If he's picked we are so screwed

We will be in a war with Iran within 6 months of trump taking office. He'll be in a for a nasty shock when his bff Vlad takes the side of the Iranians.

[Grey Lemercier]

17. Iran is a huge cleavage point, here is a really good article on it

President Trump and the Iran Nuclear Deal

http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/11/16/president-trump-and-the-iran-nuclear-deal/

As President-elect Donald Trump prepares to take office over the coming months, one of the thorniest foreign policy questions he will have to address is what to do about the Iran nuclear deal. During the campaign, then-candidate Trump repeatedly criticized the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action for being insufficiently tough and threatened to walk away from the agreement if elected.

Trump’s critiques of the deal have merit. While the deal has slowed Iran’s progress towards a fully realized nuclear program, the front-loaded nature of the sanctions relief means that Iran has enjoyed many of the benefits before fully living up to its obligations for the duration of the agreement. Similarly, the deal’s sunset provisions mean that the agreement at best delays Iran’s program and, in many ways, provides them with a patient pathway to the bomb.

Further, the promised vigorous enforcement of non-nuclear sanctions related to Iran’s continued support for terrorism, human rights abuses, and the development of ballistic missiles has yet to materialize, in large part because the Barack Obama administration appears reluctant to threaten the stability of the deal. And though Obama promised that sanctions could be “snapped back” into place if Iran was found in violation, in truth the triggering of such a mechanism would be politically difficult, particularly because many of our allies may no longer share the same concerns about Iran’s malign activities.

Yet, while the JCPOA is imperfect, tearing up the agreement during Trump’s first few weeks in office would carry significant consequences. Although the president could walk away from the agreement and re-impose sanctions, Iran has already received approximately $100 billion. Walking away would allow Iran to continue its work on the nuclear program while enjoying this significant financial windfall.

snip

[niyad]

39. darn, looks like I missed a troll!!

[maryellen99]

40. Yep claimed Trump is liberal while HRC is a warmonger

It also accused me of living in a bubble.

[niyad]

41. do you ever wonder what some of these people are on???

[maryellen99]

43. Yes nt

[emulatorloo]

18. Yeah yeah, Trump is a "liberal". As a racist predatory capitalist, he's the "change" candidate too

[hueymahl]

28. You are correct - as much as many on this site don't want to believe it

Trump was able to position himself to the left of Clinton on several issues by taking populist positions.

He did it on foreign policy, where he came across as isolationist while Hillary came across as a globalist just fine with continuing the policy of intervention.

He did it (incredibly) on bank regulation by attacking tax breaks for VC's and alluding to fighting (in a racist way) the international banking cabal. Hillary's history of speeches to big banks killed her here - no other candidate could he have done this with).

He did it on trade (and this was the big one) where he came across as the hero of industrial workers who as going to save blue collar jobs. And if there was one area that killed Clinton, it was her position on free trade (which I happen to agree with, but it lost her the rust belt).

These are not the only reasons Hillary lost, but they were certainly important ones. In the end, he ran a populist campaign that appealed not only to our baser instincts but to the fears of a block of voters that should have been solid Dem votes - blue collar union members. That Hillary lost this group, really is inexcusable.

[maryellen99]

46. Trump voters are going to be in for a nasty shock when he proves he's no isolationist nt

[hueymahl]

50. Yep. One of many nasty shocks.

And I will take zero pleasure in saying "I told you so."

[maryellen99]

54. One of my hubbys cousins I'll have to bite my tongue on

She only voted for him because he's supposedly "pro life" and Christian. I think she's being petty and ticked because I put the Hillary H as my profile pic on FB the day of the election and a meme the next day about Trump supporters being hypocritical due to telling us to accept Trump because they supposedly gave Obama a chance LOL. This cousin ignored my post about my husband having cancer surgery in January and wished another one of his cousins a happy Anniversary

[David__77]

78. I agree with your assessment.

I can understand some voters drawing a conclusion that Trump and Clinton couldn't be neatly assigned points on some left-right ideological spectrum.

I strongly disagreed with Clinton on the matter of Syria and "no fly zone." I voted for a candidate (Clinton) that I disagreed with on the matter of "no fly zone," while still seeing that issue as vitally important. I found her answers to questions about the implications of confronting Russia in the context of implementing such a no fly zone to be insufficient "non-answers," as often handed out during government press conferences.

[radius777]

84. white blue collar i.e. Reagan Democrats have been voting GOP

for a generation now. They are very right wing, aside from perhaps a few issues (such as unions) that affect them personally.

These are people who embraced Reagan, the ultimate free-trader/union buster because he told them about 'tax and spend liberals' who were giving their money to 'welfare queens.'

Most if not all of these Trump voters who were supposedly upset at the "globalism" and "establishment" of the center-left Clintons/Obama had no problem pulling the lever for establishment right wing Koch-puppet GOP senators all over the country.

This election was about white identity, and backlash to the election of the first black president and potentially the first female president.

[griloco]

20. But Hillary won....

[Cosmocat]

21. I get it, totally. I think what people are struggling with

This circles back to the identity politics thing.

IF the discussion was about the economy and other more substantive things instead of 1 1/2 years of Trump saying horrific things about non-white, non-Christians and democrats running to the defense, maybe things would have turned out different.

But, I agree, this vote, as frankly every vote for the last three decades, has been 100 percent cultural.

[Nay]

62. Exactly. Way back when, the Pubs decided that they weren't going to win on their

economic policies of "rape and rob everybody and leave them for dead."

Sooooo, they picked a few emotional hot buttons and have worked them to death. It has been a successful strategy, but the Dems continue to believe (falsely) that the American public is intelligent enough to discern their own economic interests; put aside its racism, sexism, xenophobia in its decision-making; keep their own religious beliefs out of their voting decisions; know basic facts about government, history, propaganda, health, etc.; and is, on the whole, not mentally ill.

Should the Dems dump rationality for a few election cycles and nominate Democrats who are 'demagogues,' charismatic speakers, firebrands, salesmen of the highest skill? YES. It's the only way, folks.

[Cosmocat]

64. YEP

We are bringing cupcakes to a gun fight.

[heaven05]

23. or policy arguements

of which HRC laid out completely. No these voters went for"making ameriKKKa a white male domain, again, again, again. Sexism, racism is truly their motivating reason for voting in drove/legions this election, not policy(s) and not jobs.

[mountain grammy]

25. BINGO!

[Sunlei]

27. campaign Hillary said, no boots on ground to assist russia & assad. tumps wants to help russia

and so do republicans.

[WhiteTara]

31. Oh my! She took money for charity

and he gets paid or gets loans from foreign governments. The irony.

[LaydeeBug]

32. She's a Trump Chump...He took money from the Muslims. Nt

[Hayduke Bomgarte]

33. His son is magnitudes more likely

To be just so much cannon fodder with drumpf than with HRC, and this guys is ok with that?

Alrighty then.

[flying-skeleton]

34. And people think drugs are dangerous

When Republican dispensed "Stupid Juice" is mind altering.

[Else You Are Mad]

35. As was shown by Obama and Clinton before him...

It doesn't matter if the president is a Democrat or a Republican, America will always be at war. The military industrial complex needs war to make billions in profits, so they lobby and bribe politicians to go to, or stay in, war. On top of that the middle east has a ton of oil, and the petroleum companies need to keep that sweet oil flowing.

[okieinpain]

36. 1 n/t.

[urgk]

38. Wait, that isn't an anti-Trump comment?

"...I didn't want that bitch who took money from foreign governments being commander in chief."

Could have fooled me.

[maryellen99]

42. This has been on my mind lately..Do you think the Republicans are going to reinstate the draft? Nt

[OnionPatch]

44. No, not this voter.

She would not have gained the vote of any rabid, right wing voter no matter what she said. But my feeling (having grown up in the rust belt) is that If she had put forth a stonger message about jobs, she could have won the votes of many more independents in the states she lost.

[world wide wally]

45. Middle America is not sending us their brightest...

They are sending racists, misogynists, idiots, obnoxious loud mouths….. and I assume some are good people.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

47. Your counter-example is only one anecdote. It does not defeat the "clearer jobs message" angle. nt

Last edited Tue Nov 29, 2016, 01:20 PM - Edit history (1)

[TonyPDX]

48. Sorry-- I can't help thinking that if she'd have actually highlighted

the policies that Bernie promoted, instead of incorporating them into her platform and never mentioning them again, her support would have been wider.

[SleeplessinSoCal]

49. Hillary hate was a business strategy.

The Clintons probably needed to put more of their foundation's focus here at home. Even great work elsewhere is not appreciated by the American conservative mindset

[bullimiami]

51. He hates Hillary based on lies and propaganda. As designed.

[Gothmog]

52. WOW-this voter is an idiot

[ananda]

53. And yet here's Trump extorting money from foreign powers..

.. even in collusion with Russia!

Words fail at the ignorance and hypocrisy of Reeps!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

57. Republicans vote for a thug who they hope will kick liberal ass....

The more we complain, the more they cheer.

[JCanete]

59. Is your point that Clinton has been a GOP punching bag for so many years,

that the establishment had no business pushing her forward as an almost unopposed choice in our primary season? Because I agree, it was a strategic blunder.

Trying instead, to use it as a reason to say we shouldn't look at economic policies is silly, and beside the point anyway. Are you okay with the way we approach economic inequality in this nation? Do you think that things have been and are dandy? Or should we actually have a message promoting policies that will make lives better across the spectrum of the poor and middle class?

[boston bean]

60. No. Is your point anti clinton?

[JCanete]

61. No, of course not. I think it was hubris that she was run and ran. But that said, its kind of

Last edited Tue Nov 29, 2016, 05:29 PM - Edit history (1)

rear-view mirror thinking, because I was pretty damn sure up until election day that this wasn't going to be a contest. I do think you can hook enough people with an economic message married to a social agenda. It worries me when there is a push-back against what would be good policy, and granted that isn't exactly your point, but you are indirectly disparaging a message that pushes towards a better platform on economic justice.

[Ken Burch]

70. OK...what you've actually done there is made the case that Hillary couldn't get elected.

Last edited Tue Nov 29, 2016, 06:04 PM - Edit history (1)

It doesn't mean we couldn't have won with anybody else.

Elizabeth Warren was free of any past history Trump could have attacked her on

And , for the record, I think Hillary COULD have been elected if she had emphasized economic issues in the Upper Midwest, for the record. Not played down other issues, but talked about the good things we DID have in the platform that would help people who were facing economic uncertainty.

[boston bean]

74. Oh. That is what i did?

[Ken Burch]

75. Actually, yes.

In fairness, that person wouldn't have voted for ANY Dem.

But there were nonvoters or minor party voters we could have turned into Dem voters with a somewhat different approach, or with a candidate who hadn't been the subject of a thirty-year hate campaign from the right.

I don't understand why some people here are so invested in denying that economic issues played any significant role at all. It looks to some of us as though the motivation for that is to make sure we don't break with the big donors on Wall Street or adopt any policies that seek to rein in corporate power.

Addressing these issues, such as support for some kind of reindustrialization strategy for the Upper Midwest, wouldn't require us to stop fighting institutional bigotry or even to force us to fight it less.

[boston bean]

80. Really.. They wouldn't have voted for any Dem, but I said Hillary was unelectable?? wokay..

[Ken Burch]

81. That sort of voter would be out of reach for us no matter who we nominated.

That wasn't the kind of person Bernie was talking about trying to appeal to.

And at the same time, you have illustrated how difficult it was always going to be to elect HRC.

Not sure why you'd be arguing so hard for a "change nothing" strategy. We can't win in 2020 by default, by "staying the course".

[boston bean]

82. So, what was it I proved again?

[iluvtennis]

73. simply pathetic (n/t)

[barbtries]

79. how incredibly stupid.

smh