Jan Brewer has aleady decided

[angrychair]

By saying nothing at all. When it was in the AZ house...she said nothing. When it was in AZ senate...she said nothing. When the bill hit her desk to become a law...she said nothing. Wrong is wrong. She could have stopped this bill at any point in the process by publicly coming out against it and shaming its sponsors. Vetoing the bill doesn't change the fact that the AZ state government voted FOR IT by a HUGE margin. Vetoing doesn't change the fact that AZ citizens voted those same house and senate majorities into power. As far as I am concerned, embargo the whole state and pull ALL federal aid and assistance and end all tax breaks for businesses based in AZ. Keep those measures in place until the "people" of AZ learn a valuable lesson and change their government. Would also serve as a good example to other states considering the same thing. WE SHOULD NOT TOLERATE THE HATE AND IGNORANCE OF THE gOP ONE DAY MORE.

[Skittles]

1. it is an embarrassment to America

this sh** isn't just anti-gay, it is anti-American

[rdharma]

2. AZ is hateful..... but it's a dry hate!

[brush]

3. A little background . . .

Last edited Wed Feb 26, 2014, 08:36 AM - Edit history (1)

In recent years the AZ state legislature has been hijacked by a cabal or extreme gop/teabaggers who outnumber the dems and thus can ram all these anti-anti-anti every thing bills through.

There are and always have been some blue pockets in the state however, so don't lump everyone in AZ together as right wing fanatics.

Tucson (Pima County), where Raul Grijalva and Gabby Giffords are from has long been a blue/dem area — Flagstaff as well. They both have universities in them — The University of Arizona and Northern Arizona University respectively — that has something to to with it.

Also for those of you old enough to remember, the Udall boys, Stewart and Mo, both prominent dems, were from Tucson.

Goldwater was from Phoenix. This kind of explains the dichotomy of the split. The two cities are huge rivals in everything from their politics to their universities' sports teams.

There was also a movement — too bad it died — when SB1070 was being rammed through 3 years ago for Pima County to secede from the state and form Baja Arizona. I sure wish that had passed as I have relatives in Tucson who are so pissed that those wingers up in Phoenix continue to embarrass the state.

[angrychair]

4. I do understand

and sorely sympathize with you. I don't say it to be mean, crude or unduly cruel but I stand by what I said. We, as sane, normal and rational citizens of the United States have stand on the bridge, barring the way forward and scream in one voice, "You shall not pass!" I make the book reference a little tongue-in-cheek but it is no less relevant a reference, we must bar these fools and the hateful and ignorant things they say and do from doing anymore harm than they already have done. Their actions are wrong and counter to the values this nation really does hold dear. No, we are not going to gather them up in put them in FEMA "re-education camps" or any such nonsense but it is time for the adults in the room to retake control of the conversation. "Crazy uncle Lou" has had his 15 minutes and it is way past time for his meds and a good night's sleep.

[TM99]

10. Brush is dead on.

And it is not even all of the Phoenix metropolis that has gone bat-shit Tea Party red. The cities of Phoenix and Tempe are vehemently opposed to this crude joke.

I am all for boycotts and fighting this legally in the courts if Brewer allows this to go into law. But punishing all of the Arizona citizens who do not vote for these idiots by pulling Federal funds is unacceptable.

Personally, having lived here almost 25 years, I am actually shocked at how the Tea Party religious fanatics took over. Goldwater was one of the first sane voices in the Republican party to warn against the rise of the religious right. I truly wonder how many are retirees and transplants from elsewhere.

While that is neither here nor there, I hope and pray that Brewer acts as she did with the expansion of Medicaid under the ACA. She did that for the right reasons, and I must give her credit for it. And trust me I have no love for that woman. She took her time on that decision as well not to pander to the Tea Party but instead to make sure that she had an air-tight legal case so they could not overturn her decision. By doing that, I and others now have more services again under AHCCCS.

I really do suspect that the delay is to make sure that once vetoed, this bill can never reappear again. It is simply wrong on all levels ethically, financially, and constitutionally.

[Herself]

20. Arizona is going to have to deal with it's bigots or

deal with boycott's.

States with serious corruption have to deal with their corrupted govt.

Women in Texas allowed their state to run over them. It's up to women and their spouses, brother's, fathers, sons need to stand shoulder to shoulder with women for their civil rights and equality in the work place.

Procrastination, and every man for himself allowed this to happen.

No man, is an island.

[TM99]

21. True but many here seem to forget or neglect that

ALL states have some bigots and corruptions.

Remember Governor Reagan & Schwarzenegger of CA? How about Governor Mitt Romney of MA? The current governors of ME, WI, and PA? All of these states were once bastions of BLUE!

The not so funny thing here in Arizona is that we had a Democratic Governor, and fucking Obama made her the Homeland Security chief leaving us with Jan Brewer the last few years. Her elevation to governor helped secure a way for the Tea Party to oust even decent Goldwater Republicans and men like McCain, who was recently called too 'liberal' by the Tea Party GOP here. Obama could have tapped anyone else but instead left us in the hands of a wretch of a woman.

I know you are not meaning to preach, but honestly Arizona didn't elect Brewer. We got stuck with her. We are doing the best we can, and most of us are appalled at this sick piece of legislation.

[Herself]

23. I'm not judging the good people of AZ, I'm just saying what is before you

Silence is acceptance.

People in Arizona know who the people that are emboldened by their religion, and they have been left unchecked.

When this bill was in process, where were the people of Arizona that are against it? In the streets? Protesting?

United voices are putting presser on Brewer, and we are from all across this country. The loudest voices need to be Arizonians. Those are the people that vote in upcoming elections. The CINO's are bold because the majority in your state doesn't vote. Just like every other state, I'm sad to say.

[TM99]

29. Silence?

We were not silent -

http://www.thegailygrind.com/2014/02/21/thousands-protesting-arizona-license-discriminate-gays-bill/

http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2014/02/activists-protest-at-arizona-capitol.html

http://www.azcentral.com/community/phoenix/articles/2008/11/15/20081115protests-ON.html?nclick_check=1

Protests in the thousands occurred in several of our major cities. Businesses, politicians, and activists took to the streets, to Twitter & Facebook, and went on local and national news outlets to protest this bill.

Given the bill's passage last week and the veto today, I would say things progressed to a better conclusion here in Arizona than have elsewhere in a very short time.

Jan Brewer said in her statement: "Religious liberty is a core American and Arizona value. So is non-discrimination." Hell even Obama had to 'evolve' on his position on gay marriage.

[Bluenorthwest]

25. I have worked in Arizona in the past, both major cities, and I simply will not take

the risk of doing so again. To work there means to make myself a target in the press and your damn economy is not worth the security risks that come with bigoted venues.

[TM99]

28. I am truly sorry that you have had experiences like that here.

While that reality exists for sure, there is also a great deal of support, community, and love for all as well. My partner is a bisexual woman, my Padrino is a bisexual male, and a dear friend is a transgender woman, and all have had very little discrimination thrown at them whether in professional or interpersonal situations.

Am I saying it doesn't exist? Of course not. However, I presume that even the state you live in has pockets of hatred and discrimination that you avoid as well.

Hopefully the veto will usher in some more intensive changes here and you will once more feel like Arizona is a welcoming place.

[Herself]

30. South Carolina is probably much worse than Arizona being that

they claim to be the buckle of the bible belt. You don't even have to be gay here, just fit a stereotype. Tag you are it.

If I drive 8 miles across the NC boarder, it's a whole different experience.
Rarely to I spend a dollar in SC because of their hate for anyone that isn't "born here"

[TM99]

31. I was born in TN and raised in NC.

NC has really changed for the worst since I was a boy, and SC seems to have gotten even worse than it ever was.

[brush]

13. I know. That bill is "Jim Crow" all over again

Unfortunately it looks like the whole state is going to have suffer because of the extreme gop/teabaggers.

[Jamaal510]

5. At least if she

really supported the bill, she could've at least said so. By not giving an answer either way, she is doing nothing except come off as yet another spineless Republican afraid to stand up to extremists.

[angrychair]

6. I respectfully disagree

By saying nothing this whole time she has more than conveyed her tacit approval of the bill. Right now all she and her staff are doing is crunching the numbers to see if she can sign the bill and still get re-elected if she runs again.

[LoisB]

7. Glad to see I'm not the only one thinking this. As far as I am concerned, she

definitely wants to sign it. Maybe she can just say it's Obama's fault.

[HappyMe]

11. You're probably right.

She had plenty of time to say that this crap would be vetoed. I think she pretty much only cares about herself and her career.


I heard on GMA that she has until Saturday, and that she said that she will do what's best for Arizona.

[AlinPA]

15. It looks to me like she is just going to let it become law without acting on it. Then she can say

"Who, me? I didn't sign it"

[blkmusclmachine]

8. Let AZ seceed.

'Bye!

[TexasProgresive]

9. What you suggest is traitorous

I suppose it is your right of free speech but it is still wrong.

[demwing]

12. you "suppose"?

[gussmith]

17. Can't Espouse It If You Can't Spell It

Secede, could you mean?

[former9thward]

18. What side did you support in the Civil War?

I think we know.

[urotsukidoji]

14. DU zealots, seriously?

Seriously, DU zealots, much? Shut down our whole state? cut us off? Kick us out of the union?

Settle down, zealots. I'm a Graduate level educated, Liberal, free-thinking scientist in Arizona. I'm married to another one. There are TONS of us here. Arizona is beautiful...especially for those of us that appreciate billions of years of history and evolution by natural selection.

We didn't vote for these idiots. We CLEARLY DON'T AGREE with their bronze-age, misogynist, homophobic, bigoted, small-minded nonsensical bullshit. It makes us just as angry as you. More so.

But give us a break...we smart folks have jobs and kids too. Lighten up on the "fuck 'em all!!" mentality. It's just not constructive.

[former9thward]

19. The haters will never stop hating.

They live for it. People like the OP should stay out of the state. I don't want them here no matter what their supposed politics.

[Paladin]

22. Lots of luck with that plea for tolerance. I know where you're coming from.

Such requests for discernment haven't worked very well for DU'ers in Texas. Haters are going to hate, regardless of political stance. Sad but true.

[ChazII]

26. Thank you!

Your common sense helps this fellow Arizonan feel like there is hope. I agree with your words, "lighten up on the
'fuck 'em all!!' mentality."

Now that Gov. Brewer has vetoed this bill I wonder how many DUers will come an visit Arizona to show their support for those that worked to defeat this bill. (My guess would be zilch but I a pessimist.)

[gussmith]

16. Such Logic

Thinking that way we should embargo every state that had a majority of votes for Bush and Cheney. Apply your 'logic' to every despicable action ever taken, why don't you. BTW, Rick Scott will not state a position; and there is the story on DU 'Georgia wants to allow diners to kick gay people out'. Oh, and the Texas lawmaker says it is fine to call immigrants "wetbacks". There are so many lessons to be learned; you would be a great teacher.

[Iceberg Louie]

24. Following this plan would only give ammo to the red-meaters

They would cite it as proof that the left consist of "jackbooted thugs" and "freedum haters". My sister, a hardcore Hannity devotee, and my mother, who is fairly liberal, both live in the Phoenix area. Unfortunately, the predominant cultural climate I've seen while visiting leans somewhere between the "guns in schools" crowd and tinfoil-hatters.

[babylonsister]

27. Your crystal ball failed thankfully.

[SmittynMo]

32. You're dead on.

She caved under national pressure, not state pressure. This does not change the facts you mentioned. Boycott their asses, and vote these idiots out of office.

[gussmith]

33. Oh Angrychair - The Headline Is:

"It's over in AZ, but not in KS, MO, MS, OH, OR, SD ..."

Let your boycotts begin.

[angrychair]

34. i get your point

I do. Doesn't change the message. Brewer didn't veto the law because it was wrong but because it became economically and therefore politically unpalatable. Your are NEVER going to change the mind of these batshit crazy bigots. You will always have change of hearts on a micro-scale but never on a macro-scale. You have to shape the message and the effort to make it impossible to achieve their goals. You have to make it so financially and politically untenable that it isn't worth the effort. That is the point i am trying to make.