Sanders: I won't be as naïve as Obama was with Congress

[kpete]

Sanders: I won't be as naïve as Obama was with Congress

By ELIZA COLLINS 09/29/15 02:02 PM EDT

If Bernie Sanders were president, he wouldn’t be as naïve about compromise as President Barack Obama.

At least that’s what the Vermont senator told David Axelrod on the former Obama adviser’s first episode of his podcast “The Axe Files with David Axelrod.”

Sanders said that after a “brilliant campaign” Obama made a mistake by expecting that he could easily negotiate with the other party.

“He thought he could walk into Capitol Hill and the Oval Office and sit down with John Boehner and Mitch McConnell and the Republicans and say, ‘I can’t get it all. You can’t get it all. Let’s work out something that’s reasonable,’ because he’s a reasonable guy. He’s a pretty rational guy,” Sanders said. “These guys never had any intention of doing (serious] negotiating and compromising … I think it took the president too long to fully appreciate that.”

http://driftglass.blogspot.com/2015/09/bernie-speaks-truth.html

[randys1]

1. Well, remember, if Obama had done what ANY white guy could have done, he would have

been branded the ANGRY Black president.

As it is he bent over into a pretzel to compromise and to hear the GOP tell it, he is the least compromising president of all time.

Obama was in a no no no win.

[Uncle Joe]

3. I agree randys, Obama did have an additional psychological and sociological encumbrance.

A Jackie Robinson of Presidents.

[uhnope]

164. the OP is a lie. Sanders never called Obama "naive"

[Uncle Joe]

165. I know Bernie didn't, he just said that Obama made a mistake. n/t

[jwirr]

4. That is so true. But he has laid the ground work for us by

waking us up to the fact that we need hope and change. That together we could get that.

I like to think that Bernie is going to flesh that out for us and get some of it done and hope the next person can continue the revolution.

The mess we are in is not going to be over in one election or in a short time. This is something we are going to have to dedicate ourselves to for the long haul.

[portlander23]

5. Remember this?

Obama Goes Street

Bill O’Reilly found it fairly strange that, after clamoring for the President to show anger, many in the media then found it distasteful for him to turn around and express his frustration while trying to find “whose ass to kick” over the BP oil disaster. Of particular note was Drudge Report proprietor Matt Drudge‘s headline: “Obama Goes Street,” which O’Reilly saw as “nifty” and “kind of with it” but was amazed that anyone would see a hint of racial commentary in it.

He was branded as an angry black man for wanting to get justice for BP defiling the Gulf of Mexico.

[dorkzilla]

17. the guy literally could not win

and yet, I think he will go down in history as one of the good ones....I hope TPP doesn’t tarnish his legacy, as it surely will if it passes.

[roguevalley]

100. then I guess all of the above

explains him selling us out on TPP. By the way, Bernie is getting eaten up on a certain protected list over this. Just saying.

[dorkzilla]

119. That protected list is just a fine whine...

...that won’t get better over time. They’ll be embarrassed by it in short order. Getting eaten up over this is silly. How about Hillary saying she was putting the White House “on notice” over TPP? At least Bernie shoots from the hip - nothing Hillary says (when she finally says it) isn’t measured and rehearsed...and in the end she always leaves herself an out so she can “evolve” again.

I don’t see anything Bernie said that wasn’t true. I think Obama is an idealist (as am I, admittedly though as a business person I am a complete pragmatist) and thought he would prevail, but had a lot of really greedy, really bad people around giving him bad advice. He should have completely cleaned house when he was sworn in.

You know how you can tell they’re desperate? They compared Bernie to Ted Cruz. Fucking unbelievable.

[whathehell]

161. +1

[sabrina 1]

102. He should not have cared what such morons said or thought. They don't think. We need to get over

worrying about morons. People admire those who stand up and do what they think is right, and I doubt it was fear of these idiots that caused Obama to hold back, I think that is his personality and it's kind of offensive to me to attribute it to his being Black.

He should have paid more attention to the Progressives in his own party who he mostly ignored. THEY would have supported him.

Clinton eg, was perceived to be very amiable and Dems were 'worried' again when stories got out that he 'had a temper'. So what?

That's the problem with Dems. Always holding back in fear of what a total idiot like Limbaugh might say. Laugh at them, mock them but never worry what idiots think. Look how far it got us by doing so?

Make THEM fear those who are RIGHT.

I am glad Bernie is not planning to 'negotiate' with morons.

The funny thing about bullies is they RESPECT those who stand up to them, because they are cowards and want approval. The more you back down from a bully, they more they enjoy forcing you to back down even further.

I do not believe Obama's reaction to them had anything to do with who he is, I believe he really wanted to compromise on certain issues, because, as he said, he was more of a 'moderate Republican in many ways'. And he may have thought that Repubs would like that. Who knows, but what those idiots need is someone who will not put up with their nonsense and when they try their tricks will use the power of the veto. After a while, they will fear that more than anything when they realize s/he means it.

[Scuba]

118. "Make THEM fear those who are RIGHT. " /\_/\_This right here_/\_/\

[AgingAmerican]

147. He should have ignored their 'potential' branding

[jeff47]

9. "Getting angry" wasn't an option, but pushing for chained CPI-E wasn't required. (nt)

[TheKentuckian]

11. Better angry than chump.

Also, being firm and a tough negotiator doesn't require chair throwing and flipping out.

Where does the idea that not rolling over equals anything like angry even come from?

[jfern]

13. He was branded a socialist communist Muslim Kenyan born terrorist Nazi

So what if he was branded some other things too?

[highprincipleswork]

28. How do you know?

How does anybody know what would have happened? He never tried!!!

When people scare you with what "would" happen, and it's never tested, well then you're just living in fear, and potentially living in a lie.

Like "big government is bad" and "government can't ever do anything right, or run anything correctly". Seems like Medicare and Social Security are pretty popular, and people don't want to see them cut. Most people want to see them expand.

So, the amount of propaganda repeating that goes on around here has simply got to stop.

That's what is so brilliant about Bernie. He is not prey to the propaganda. He is saying what he feels is so, and that is similar to the truth of what so many people are feeling. That's the genius of his campaign He's cutting through the b.s.

Join us in believing that the truth can win, as long as enough people stand up to say that is the truth for them as well.

As Bernie says, if enough of us stand together, anything is possible.

I can tell you one thing - if you live in their lie, you've already lost.

[Snap the Turtle]

61. Amen.

+1

[leftofcool]

129. Yea, bernie will just wave his magic wand and Republicans will fall at his feet.

[jeff47]

132. Have you noticed yet that you are the only one making that claim?

And have you noticed yet that you are also claiming Clinton can wave her magic wand and Republicans will fall at her feet?

Or is the cognitive dissonance a little too hard to work through?

[AgingAmerican]

148. So there are only two possible paths?

Capitulation or magic wand?

Your thinking is poisoned by the dysfunctional, defeatist Status Quo.

[highprincipleswork]

163. Like I say, propaganda

Have you ever noticed that when you don't try, your chances of success go way, way, way down? And, of course, when you work contrary to what you've said or promised, the delight of those you've promised to has a distinct tendency to go way down also?

So many people have become so convinced of what is right and good by right-wing echo chamber for decades that they barely recognize what reality is.

To many of us, Bernie is talking reality. And he is talking practical solutions that work in many other countries to problems that we have. I know we're an isolationist kind of country. But examples and evidence exist elsewhere that prove, for instance, that we pay more for medical care than anybody and get less!!!!!!!!

I like to think that someone speaking the clear truth can reach the American people where they live and feel and know the truth also, and that together we can make the fundamental changes that are necessary.

That is why I support Bernie. Even he himself does not promise to wave any magic wand. He admits that we can only do this by acting all together, even if and when he is elected President.

That's exactly what seems right and how I plan to do it.

Congratulations, Bernie, on reaching 1 million contributors faster than anyone else in history!!!

[ms liberty]

29. I agree. n/t

[EEO]

46. I don't think any Democrat would have had an easy time getting anything done.

Obama probably got it worse, though.

[Duval]

169. +1 eom

[JDPriestly]

49. So he should have risked offending the Republicans and the right.

Instead he played it safe and sorry.

Hey! Maybe he should have done some polling on whether Americans elected him because we wanted an ANGRY Black president. Maybe we wanted that.


It would not surprise me if that is what Americans wanted.

[randys1]

159. Played it SAFE?

then how do you account for these OVER THREE HUNDRED accomplishments?


http://pleasecutthecrap.com/obama-accomplishments/

Do I need to copy and paste all 300+ of them?

Have you ever looked at this list?

[JDPriestly]

162. Boosted charter schools; allowed banks to foreclose on Americans and then buy the properties

they foreclosed on and resell them so that the banks would have a steady stream of interest income and the homeowners -- no equity and the loss of any wealth built up in the value of their homes.

The TPP.

An economy that is barely making it, even after 7 years of "recovery."

The proof that the economy is in the dumps is the low bank and Fed interest rates. If the economy were moving, we would have higher rates.

Obama did not excite Democrats enough to get people out to vote in the mid-terms. That is the problem.

We are going to have to do much better in the future.

That's why I am supporting Sanders.

[dreamnightwind]

171. You weren't supposed to notice any of that

Correct on all counts.

[yeoman6987]

81. The president started out with a democratic congress

Both houses which was nice to get some things done. And then 2010 came and that was it. No more house and that hurt.

[leftofcool]

130. Absolutely correct!

[Bluenorthwest]

2. Obama was stuck on bipartisan dreams and kept pushing that whole trope to the point of

distraction. Bernie is spot on about that.

[jwirr]

6. I think I know were he was coming from. My family is also

a mixed racial family. He was raised by a white family and from them he learned to love and they loved him back. He actually believes that this world can live together just like many in my family think that.

[kelliekat44]

72. Hey, even Rodney King asked "Can't we all just get along?" nt

[jwirr]

124. Yes, hope that things will get better seems to be buried

deep in all of us.

[LondonReign2]

135. However, the answer, when faced by the drooling morons that make up the Republican

Congressional delegation, is a resounding "NO!"

Obama might have been right to try initially. However, Bernie is right that it shouldn't have taken him 6 years to figure out the scum he was dealing with. Instead, he began every negotiation on the Republican side of the field, and saved his strongest effort for fighting his own party on the TPP.

[AgingAmerican]

93. And he would punt on first down

I still cringe at the thought of it.

[enid602]

7. obama

Obama and company used the most agressive and wily tactics to get Obamacare passed. No trick was spared. He was ruthless. He knew the opposition would fight tooth and nail. If anyone is naive, it's Bernie.

[stevenleser]

8. Yes, I love how a guy who couldn't get anything passed in the senate now wants to tell Obama how its

done.

He and Ted Cruz want to be President after the senate basically has told both of them to take a long walk off a short pier everytime they have proposed something, but they are both trying to pretend they are some kind of great leaders.

And yes, I compared Sanders to Cruz, because they are both ineffectual senators claiming they should be President.

[bvf]

50. What crap.

Sanders:

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/browse#congress=113&sponsor=400357

Cruz:

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/browse#congress=113&sponsor=412573

[stevenleser]

54. LOL, your own links prove it. Exactly one bill by each of them was enacted. All the rest have not

been made into law.

[bvf]

59. It proves your subject line is a pure lie.

and that you should learn to read. From the first link:

Sanders introduced 3 bills that became law in the 113th Congress. Keep in mind that it takes a law to repeal a law. Very few bills ever become law.

That's two lies in two posts. You're batting 1.000.

[stevenleser]

62. Only if you use logic twisted into a Gordian knot. The two are ineffectual senators and your links

prove it.

How embarrassing for you. You set out to prove something and instead proved the exact opposite.

[bvf]

69. Well, if you can't explain your lies,

I guess invective is all you have.

[JackInGreen]

95. It's always a riot

PaY no mind to the pro-trolls friendo, but damn they can be entertaining.

[questionseverything]

78. he offered the amendment that got us a one time in history fed audit

http://thehill.com/policy/finance/96559-sanders-agrees-to-modify-measure-requiring-fed-audit

[bvf]

92. Yes.

Last edited Wed Sep 30, 2015, 01:26 AM - Edit history (1)

Don't expect an answer, though. The poster's M.O. seems to consist of two actions:

1. Lie.
2. Run away.

[LondonReign2]

137. And never, ever, ever admit to beign wrong

The poster is almost Bushian in his ability to claim to never have been wrong.

[jfern]

107. Sanders was amendment king in the House

These claims of him being an ineffective Congressman are ridiculous.

[JDPriestly]

51. Please tell us about all the bills that Hillary proposed and got passed in Congress.

Bernie has gotten a number of measures passed including changes to the ACA to permit community healthcare centers and measures having to do with Veteran's Affairs. Veterans in general really like him because he has stood up for them over the years.

If Biden's work on Bankruptcy Reform is praised just because it passed, that is a great shame.

I'd rather vote for a candidate who proposes good bills and amendments that lose than for a candidate who sponsors or proposes a horrible bill like the Bankruptcy Bill and it passes and imposes unfair hardships on people who don't deserve it.

Of course, Hillary wasn't in Congress very long, so her record is pretty barren. She voted the right way on some bills but she doesn't really have that much experience in Congress at all.

[stevenleser]

53. Nope, Fail. Bernie is the one claiming he can do better than Obama. None of the rest of what you

wrote applies.

[JDPriestly]

60. Bernie knows the members of Congress, Republicans and Democrats.

Neither Hillary nor Obama know them as well as Bernie does having served with so many of them so many years. Hillary knows Democrats outside of her work in Congress, but only spent a few years working with them in Congress.

Bernie knows Congress very well, and its members.

[stevenleser]

65. And that familiarity has done nothing for Bernie but breed contempt. None of them support him.

They don't support his bills.

[bvf]

71. Which explains why three of his bills

were enacted into law in the 113th.

You're a hoot.

[JDPriestly]

77. They will when he is president.

And even if he reaches compromises on his proposals, the bills that result will be stronger and more progressive than any compromises that Hillary might reach. That's because Bernie's starting negotiation point will be much further on the side of the people than Hillary's would be.

[AgingAmerican]

150. Anyone could

Hillary would have been better than Obama. Obama would go into a 'negotiation' by giving them a bunch of free stuff before the 'negotiations' even started.

Obama was the worst negotiator in US history.

[questionseverything]

74. i can live without "compromises" like the welfare "reform"

legislator should be like doctors and

DO NO HARM

[JDPriestly]

76. Yes.

[DebJ]

23. Ummm...that was with a Democratic Congress, duh.

[enid602]

36. naive?

There were 59 dems in the Senate at the time. They needed a super majority to get it passed, so they conviced Arlen Spectot to change parties. They had to get this passed quickly, as Ted Kennedy had just lost his seat to Scott Brown. The house dems took the highly unorthodox step of voting on the Senate bill 'as is.' The house barely passed the bill on 3/23/10 219 to 212. 34 dems voted against it, as did all repubs. Naive my ass. Duh. FDR and LBJ would have been proud.

[uponit7771]

41. +1, FDR had an 83% progressive congress and LBJ had a 71% progressive congress... progressive

... not just left leaning.

Obama had less to work with and did just as much legislatively but I hear more knocks of Obama from Sanders than I hear support.

Sanders was never the person who wanted Obama to be...

I'm starting to thinking there's some FUD there, I'm trusting something less now than before

[JDPriestly]

55. Are you sure about this?

"Ted Kennedy had just lost his seat to Scott Brown."

I thought Ted Kennedy died, and Scott Brown won a special election or something like that.

Brown is a member of the Republican Party, and faced the Democratic candidate, Massachusetts Attorney General Martha Coakley, in the 2010 special election to succeed U.S. Senator Ted Kennedy for the remainder of the term ending January 3, 2013. While initially trailing Coakley in polling by a large margin, Brown saw a sudden late surge in the polls and posted a surprise win to become the first Republican elected to the U.S. Senate from Massachusetts since Edward Brooke in 1972.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Brown

[enid602]

67. you're right

Sorry, was in a bit of a rush. Ted died, and Brown was elected. They HAD to get the bill passed immediately.

[uponit7771]

39. +1, at some level that line Bernie is pushing is full of shit

[Evergreen Emerald]

10. Ummm...he has been in Congress for decades. What has he done?

Yes, Bernie you are the outsider.

[DebJ]

24. That's weird. I've not heard Bernie refer to himself as an 'outsider'.

[uponit7771]

40. Have you NOT seen the picture of Sanders leading the 4 billion person march for Single Payer?!?!?!?

Me neither

[enid602]

70. stuff

I don't think he's promised anything. He's just for a lot of good stuff that sounds really, really cool.

[uponit7771]

73. yeap, someone said he's captain obvious and that's what it looks like for now. Still think he'd be

... kick ass but he's promising pony's he know he can't get with this congress

[jeff47]

133. Congress.gov is available for you to paruse.

You'll find he's passed more bills and amendments through the current, Republican-insane Congress than any Democrat.

Now, tell me again how he can't do anything because Republicans.

[progressoid]

158. ...

[GoneFishin]

12. Nobody forced him to give away the Public Option behind closed doors. He was either naive or he

supported the idea that Americans should pay extra for their health care so that health insurance company executives could keep collecting multi-million dollar paychecks siphoned from the wallets of U.S. citizens and taxpayers.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

30. I believe that Lieberman was the one who helped kill that

by withholding his vote if it didn't get taken out- and Obama had no votes to spare to pass ACA. Tough choice but aren't we glad we got something modestly good through?

[GoneFishin]

79. I was. But looking at recent rate hikes it looks like the rates are back up to about 60% of where

they were before ACA. So I assume that it won't be long before they overtake the old pre-ACA rates.

The Public Option was negotiated away behind closed doors in meetings with the insurance companies before public discussions even began. It was one of BO classic negotiating techniques of "I'll meet you half way, ok three quarters of the way, ok seven eighths of the way, ... "

[Proud Liberal Dem]

173. Congress was on the cusp on approving it however

until Lieberman threw his big tantrum in the Senate. If Congress got it through, do you think that President Obama would have refused to sign it (w/the PO)? Or were he and Lieberman secretly collaborating to kill it?

[GoneFishin]

174. He had no difficulty twisting Dennis Kucinich's arm to get what he wanted. That feigned impotence

act wasn't convincing then, and since I have watched BO fight for TPP I am more certain than ever that if BO doesn't fight vigorously for a cause then it is because he really doesn't want it.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

175. As far as ACA goes

It was on a razor's edge right there at the end. I don't think that he had much leverage and/or wanted to risk the whole thing falling down over the PO. I agree that it would be the next sensible reform for the ACA- once Congress shifts back to Democratic Control (under a Democratic Presidency).

[GoneFishin]

176. Single payer/public option was given away behind closed doors before the start, not near the end.

[mopinko]

125. he dropped it because it was clear it wouldnt pass. period.

[GoneFishin]

126. Uh-huh

[questionseverything]

149. we had a good house bill,all we had to do was use reconciliation or the 50 vote threshold

which was used to pass he aca.......here is a discussion that explains it

////////////////////////////////////////
Rethugs were trying to fight its use before it was used.

Here is how the vote went down.

http://politics.nytimes.com/congress/votes/111/senate/2/105

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/26/health/policy/26health.html

In a fitting finale to the yearlong health care saga, the budget reconciliation measure that included the final changes was approved first by the Senate and then by the House on a tumultuous day at the Capitol, as lawmakers raced to complete their work ahead of a two-week recess.

The final House vote was 220 to 207, and the Senate vote was 56 to 43, with the Republicans unanimously opposed in both chambers.

The reconciliation bill makes numerous revisions to many of the central provisions in the measure adopted by the Senate on Dec. 24, including changes in the levels of subsidies that will help moderate-income Americans afford private insurance, as well as changes to the increase in the Medicare payroll tax that will take effect in 2013 and help pay for the legislation.

The bill also delays the start of a new tax on high-cost employer-sponsored insurance policies to 2018 and raises the thresholds at which policies are hit by the tax, reflecting a deal struck by the White House and organized labor leaders. It also includes changes to close the gap in Medicare prescription drug coverage known as the doughnut hole, and to clarify a provision requiring insurers to allow adult children to remain on their parents’ insurance policies until their 26th birthday.’

Many of the changes were intended to address the concerns of House Democrats, as well as to bridge differences between the original House and Senate bills and to incorporate additional provisions sought by Mr. Obama.
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Response to nameremoved (Reply #230)Sat Sep 12, 2015, 09:16 PM


questionseverything (2,347 posts)
232. reconciliation was not used on the good house bill that included a public option

which is what rachel and the left wanted

it was used on the final insurance bill the third wayers wanted

[leftofcool]

14. So an ineffective Senator telling a Democratic President he shouldn't compromise.

Hello, Bernie, your lack of compromising skills is exactly why you don't have any endorsement from your colleagues.

[floriduck]

31. Wrong and UNcool

He just won't play the "Pay to Play" game between lobbyists and politicians, like some running for President.

[book_worm]

15. OK, but how will Bernie get legislation out of a GOP House

and possibly a GOP Senate. Yes, I know he'll use the bully pulpit but that won't get these nutty republicans especially in the house where they have safe seats to do anything.

[BlueWaveDem]

18. Read the article. He has no idea himself.

"But Sanders didn't have a firm answer on how he would more successfully broker those deals." Color me shocked.

[redstateblues]

32. The bully pulpit thing is a non starter

[JDPriestly]

57. Teddy Roosevelt used it quite successfully.

[redstateblues]

86. The Republicans will cower I'm sure

If that is your plan good luck. How about a plan to win back the state houses and redraw the districts in a way that reflects the electorate. It's gonna take more than Bernie to effect change.

[JDPriestly]

91. The only way to do that is to give the American voters something to vote for. The Third Way,

DLC Democrats don't give voters who are living in a bad economy to this day, have lost their jobs, their homes and their futures, a reason to get out and vote, not in local, state and off-year federal elections.

[AgingAmerican]

94. The Bully Pulpit is the only way to get things done

nt

[bettyellen]

96. "Sanders didn't have a firm answer on how he would more successfully broker those deals." So....

maybe you should pass along your suggestion!

[AgingAmerican]

151. Those weren't deals

Those grand bargains were handouts of stuff they could never get on their own, with little to nothing in return. Most naive negotiator in US history.

[jeff47]

134. Well, he's gotten more bills/amendments passed through this Congress than any Democrat

Congress.gov is a very handy resource.

More to the point, Sanders has always said he can not do it alone. The point of his candidacy is to shatter the fallacy that only Republica-lite can win. So that we can actually build a party that will fight to change things.

Reagan didn't radically change US politics on his own, despite the Republicans worshiping him as a golden calf. At best, he started the ball rolling.

[LondonReign2]

138. How will Hillary get legislation out of the House? On what issue/votes are Republicans

going to side with Hillary?

[Hydra]

16. Bernie is being polite

There was a great sigh of relief from the DLC when they forced a lose in 2010- they wouldn't be expected to do Dem things anymore. That was such a horrible time for them to have to bear.

[Phlem]

19. yep.

I recall Obama announcing the he was a "New Democrat" during his acceptance speech after campaigning as a populist. Obama knew full well what he was doing.

[jfern]

20. 11 dimensional chess: lose 63 House seats so that your base

will stop pressuring you to actually do things for them.

[nashville_brook]

25. 11-dimensional chess finally makes sense!

mind blown. ptew.

[Hydra]

27. I always posited that the people claiming 11th D chess

Were been played in a game of checkers.

[840high]

35. ...+1

[MisterP]

90. actually the DNC was *relieved* when Brown took Massachusetts because with the Supermajority

gone the pressure to pass bills was off: we quickly learned that keeping the money flowing didn't mean getting what Americans needed passed, or even winning elections: they gave us Boozman rather than allow Halter to win and DWS openly endorsed hard-right Pubs

the decade of shrieking and finger-wagging that "you can criticize only when we win" and "vote primaries, not third-party" was just a cover

[GoneFishin]

80. Yep. Pelosi, Reid, and BO twisted themselves into knots making excuses as to why single payer

was off the table without having any discussion of it whatsoever.

[in_cog_ni_to]

21. From his mouth to

the Goddess' ears! McConnell told him, flat-out, their job was to stop him. He thought he could play nice with a bunch of clinically insane psychotic Teabaggers. It took him years to see the light.

[AnAzulTexas]

22. keep the truth alive bernie

it only took the president a little over 6 years to get that there were was no negotiating with the vermin who only slammed him in the most disgusting ways since he was candidate obama

[Proud Liberal Dem]

26. So, what is his plan to not be "naive" with Congress?

Obama could *barely* deal with Boehner and McConnell and, assuming that the Republicans hold on to the House AND Senate in 2016, how exactly is Bernie going to deal with Boehner's Tea Party-approved replacement in the House and McConnell (assuming he doesn't get overthrown in the Senate). I mean, it's easy to second-guess President Obama's handling of things with Congress but, despite his overwhelming victory and that of the Democratic Party in general, there were even some Democrats whom weren't particularly helpful to him. I believe that President Obama took his responsibility as POTUS seriously, went to Washington to roll up sleeves and get to work cleaning up the mess that the former occupant left and I think that he expected that the Republicans would want the same things, which might be looked at as somewhat naive I suppose but we were facing a pretty serious situation back in 2009 with the economy in tatters and, despite the fact that Democrats had large majorities, some bipartisanship and compromise was going to be inevitable. Republicans OTOH chose not to behave responsibly and declared all out scorched Earth war against President Obama and they will do that and even worse to President Sanders. Not saying that I wouldn't vote for him if he wins the nomination but I want to see President Sanders elaborate on how he plans to get the Republicans in Congress to behave and do their jobs where President Obama wasn't able to. I know that Hillary will have her hands full with them to as they transition seamlessly from racism to misogyny.

[redstateblues]

34. I want to see a plan to win back the state houses

so we can redraw the lines

[floriduck]

37. The answer to your question is out there.

I refer you to Cheese Sandwich's DU post 8/30/15 entitled "Bernie Sanders Explains How He Would Deal With An Obstructionist Congress". It was from an interview with Jake Rapper. Now do your own research.

[uponit7771]

43. Sanders will be mean and growl and revolt and snort and shit. Nothing, I've been asking for months..

... how Sanders would deal with a twice in US history gerrymandered congress to this level

and I don't a damn thing practical in response.

NOTHIN...

Just Bernie will "lead" or some shit..

The GOP doesn't give a shit about Sanders or 43r2343 trillion people marching or anything else..

it's as if he missed the last 6 years!!!!

[LondonReign2]

139. How will Clinton deal with the gerrymandered Congress?

You don't think Bernie can do it... how will Hillary?

Tell me, on what issues/votes is she going to get Republicans to agree with her?

[JDPriestly]

58. Sanders comes right out and tellls us what his plan is:

to build a movement that gets progressives elected and demands action on Sanders' proposals from Congress.

How does Hillary plan to get anything done with a Republican Congress?

Republicans absolutely detest Hillary. She is their punching bag. How in the world does she plan to get anything done by them?

I think Sanders has a better chance to get something from the Republicans than does Hillary. At least Sanders knows the Republicans by name and can talk to them. Hillary had never wrangled or even talked to most of the Republicans in Congress. Sanders serves with them.

I'll place my bet on Sanders in the contest over who can get more out of Congress, Hillary or Sanders.

[uponit7771]

66. cause GOP cares about "movements" really!? Also, when has Sanders ever done this!? I don't remember

... him leading a 2443r trillion person march down the streets of Washington for single payer.

I heard him bitch a lot about what didn't get done while sitting on his ass from the sidelines and tsking at Obama

"lead a movement"...

The most people in the world ever marched and moved against the Iraq war..

10s of millions of people...

and that did what!?

The GOP doesn't care about "movements" they need to be put out of office... literally, lock their offices up so they can't go back into them or some shit

[JDPriestly]

75. I agree that the Republicans need to be put out of office, and that is why I support Sanders

.I think that if we give voters a reason to differentiate Republicans from Democrats by strongly supporting policies that the American people need and want, the policies that Sanders is proposing, then we will get a larger Democratic turnout and be able to "retire" some Republicans who should not be in Congress.

that actually happened to some extent in 2008. It was at least better than in 2014. But we had too many moderate Democrats in Congress like Bauchus who really messed things up for Democrats.

We Democrats need to have a bold platform, run bold campaigns and govern boldly. Obama has not done that.

I don't think Hillary will either.

Bernie will. He has been an independent rather than play the middle-of-the-road, moderate game. I think he will excite voters and get Democrats out. We shall see.

[Duval]

170. The debates will help clarify their differences.

I only wish we were having more of them. I am not an Obama basher and I voted for him twice. I believe him to be an honest and honorable person. He had to put up with a lot of crap in Congress. Bernie will continue to excite voters. I have concerns about our MSM, as I've said countless times.

[AgingAmerican]

101. It's very simple

Don't punt on first down. Don't give away stuff before negotiations even begin. Don't let them fool you into a sequester containing things they had sought for decades, but couldn't get because it would be political suicide. The list goes on and on.

[gvstn]

33. Obama was 2008's Jimmy Carter.

Naive but so much better than the alternative.

I knew he wasn't ready for the hardball of Washington politics but better him than someone else. (Hillary would of been Ok too).

He has been a disappointment in that after the first 100 days where every President gets whatever he wants and he did not, he didn't fight back harder. I can't forgive him for that. You are either a leader or you are not. He is not.

[Hydra]

89. He was too interested in his "Legacy" of being the person who united the Partisans

Nice idea, bad approach- he assumed as a New Democrat/DLC that everyone wants to be a Republican. We're finding out just how wrong that is this cycle...the establishment is pretty much not supported now.

[Live and Learn]

113. I support Bernie but I thnk Obama will go down in history as a great President

despite not accomplishing everything I think he possibly could have. The ACA was a fantastic accomplishment (one Hillary couldn't pull off) and he has had many others. What we need now is someone that can stand against wall street and I think Bernie is the only one that can.

[gvstn]

117. I agree.

I just wish he had fought harder in those first 100 days. Those are when you get to get things done that no one else wants done. I have no disrespect of President Obama. He has been the most disrespected President I have ever seen. From day one he has been hated. That is no way to treat a President. I've hated the way he has been treated by both the media and the masses from day one. It has been disgusting and the media should be ashamed of itself.

[uponit7771]

38. The main question Sanders and his supporters REFUSE to address ....

... How will Sanders get a republican congress, that answers to a very few people, to put AmericaS first?

The responses so far have been Hallmark Card responses of revolution or he's worked with republicans before in ... VERMONT (were people officially have more brain cells) ... or he'll use the "bully pulpit" or Sanders will lead a march of 2ewr8en trillion people through Washington or...

nothing that will practically do any good with today's GOP...

Which is what Obama has to work with, which ... Sanders knows this

I'm starting to think Sanders either doesn't understand the effect of 2010s only 2 times in US history gerrymandering of the US congress or he's being obtuse or ... just... just selling some bullllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllshit.

You're not going to be "mean" to people who aren't intimidated by you or 94n2 billion people
you're not going to "scare" people who you have no control of and don't need you...
you're not going to move people who don't give a shit about what you or yours does..

... and that's today's GOP,

Today's GOP are OPENLY (in front with NOTHING to HIDE) trying to make it so LESS AMERICANS CAN LEGALLY VOTE!!!

The president isn't a dictator, acting as if Obama had FDRs 83% PROGRESSIVE (not just democratic) TOTAL congress is

naive

[yourout]

42. How will any Dem President get anything done right now with....

Congress the way it it?

It's simple.....they won't.

FDR himself would get nothing passed with the current batch of crazys in charge.

Job#1....take back Gov seats before 2020 so we can at least get the maps back to a point we have a chance to take the House.

Till then I don't care what Dem is in the White House as long as it is a Dem. Nothing will get passed but I am ok with that as the first thing you do with a trauma patient is to stabilize them. Then you work on healing the patient.

[Phlem]

44. crickets.

[uponit7771]

48. Crickets is what I hear from Sanders supporters on how in the hell is he going to do anything

... with a GOP congress who doesn't have to answer to him or anyone else!?!?!?!

We can't take back seats that are digitally gerrymandered to the degree the GOP seats are...

What's Sanders going to do, convince stupid ass's who hate Muslims to vote dem cause he wears glasses or some shit!?

[Phlem]

52. Whatever chief.

I know congress is fucked up and I know it's going to take some time. At least the direction he's going doesn't support the status quo cause I'm sick to fuck of Third Way Bullshit.

"What's Sanders going to do, convince stupid ass's who hate Muslims to vote dem cause he wears glasses or some shit!?"

Uh you guys tried that shit last midterm and lost big.

I'm not even concerned about the Republicans, it's the corporate Democrats that are going to fuck him.

Bullshit Bullshit Bullshit.

[uponit7771]

56. I don't here from Sanders what you know, he's either not aware of how congress works or...

... just being an asshole.

"you guys" don't get simple ass'd questions answered either...

This is typical response, Sanders could have all dems in tow 100% of the time and still not get damn thing done...

How in the world is Sanders going to get the GOP to put Americans first?!

Fuck all the dumb shit, get that question answered and folk who know NH and IA aren't the only two states in the union might take a chance on him.

[Phlem]

63. Wow!

Uh huh, you're not taking anything personally.

"you guys" don't get simple ass'd questions answered either... "

Well more debate's shouldn't be a problem then, right or are you going to pawn it off on DWS.


"How in the world is Sanders going to get the GOP to put Americans first?!"

How's Hillary going to do it?

I haz da quest-unz too!

You have a great night now, I can tell when someone get's unhinged. Get some rest.

[uponit7771]

68. Who is DWS? ... and Hillary isn't promising pink unicorns

[Live and Learn]

106. Pink unicorrns? Who asked for that?

And according to Hillary supporters she is promising not only racial social justice and equality and pay equity for women too. How the heck is that going to happen even with a Democratic Congress? Does she have a magic wand that automatically erases prejudices?

[uponit7771]

120. the people who say single payer was possible...

[Live and Learn]

144. So other countries have pink unicorns then? nt

[Live and Learn]

114. Who is DWS? Wow, you are either really naive, or not being sincere. nt

[uponit7771]

121. More overt condescension, typical Sander supporter retort

[bvf]

116. The Dallas Wind Symphony.

Do try to keep up.

[uponit7771]

122. or I'll try not to live on DU with overtly condescending Bern victims who know what esoteric ...

... fuck, aint worth it

[bvf]

123. It would be way too easy to respond in kind

by suggesting that Sanders's supporters are perhaps just more aware than Clinton's of what's been going on in Democratic Party politics in the past few months, but that hardly seems sporting.

Actually, DWS stands for Dancing With the Stars.

[dreamnightwind]

172. or Debates Were Silenced

[LondonReign2]

140. Crickets is what we get because you won't answer what Hillary will accomplish

that Sanders wouldn't.

Let's try again: on what issues/votes will Republicans side with Hillary Clinton?

[uponit7771]

47. +1, I would love to take back those seats but don't see how it can happen with such a gerrymandered

... districts.

It's digitized today, it's almost to the nth vote...

I would love Sanders to talk about the effects of the only twice in US history gerrymandered congress to on party and what it'll have generational.

Saying Obama was being too nice to republicans is a half truth

[HooptieWagon]

85. So a republican Congress will cooperate with Hillary?

Good stuff, bro...don't bogart it.

[EEO]

45. Good. Obama let the Republicans punch him in the face for months over healthcare legislation.

[Truprogressive85]

63. hmm

-President Obama biggest mistakes was actually thinking republicans would work with him.

- Bipartisanship is a nice word that's about it

- Dems like to stick the head in the sand when Republicans attack instead of fighting (I blame DWS)

-Here is sad piece of truth ! even if Dems get back the senate the House to regain will be challenge for some time

[1StrongBlackMan]

82. Does anyone really believe President Obama was naive in dealing with republicans? n/t

[jeff47]

136. Would you prefer to believe he likes chained CPI for Social Security? (nt)

[1StrongBlackMan]

145. Why do "Democrats" pretend that was not a strategic move ...

Everyone, including the republicans, knew that the CCPI was going no where. Even though the republicans asked for/demanded President Obama offer movement on "entitlements" ... and he did, with a lot of conditions, everyone knew that it was a deal the republicans could not take.

But the move did exactly what it was intended to do ... broadcast to the American public that the republicans were full of stuff when it came to governing/compromise. Check the polling data ... before the offer, the American public saw Democrats/President Obama roughly equally responsible for congressional gridlock; after the offer, a majority of independent and a strong plurality of republican voters blamed the republican party.

[jeff47]

146. It was a strategic move to compromise with Republicans. Who were not willing to compromise.

Hence 'naive'.

[1StrongBlackMan]

153. Did you read what I wrote? ...

Yes ... It was a strategic move to compromise with Republicans TO SHOW THAT IT IS/WAS THE REPUBLICANS. Who were not willing to compromise.

And, it worked, Hence NOT 'naive'.

[jeff47]

154. Yes. You're doing an excellent job rewriting history

1) It wasn't just one time to make a point. It was offered many times over many different "compromise" bills.

2) Republicans did not reject it because it was extreme. They rejected it because it was not extreme enough - they wanted more than chained CPI and publically said so.

3) It was an attempt to undo the sequester, which was already a failed attempt at compromising with Republicans. The defense cuts already showed Republicans were extremists not willing to compromise.

Obama believed that under all the rhetoric, Republicans actually wanted to do what's best for the country. Unfortunately, he was wrong.

[1StrongBlackMan]

156. Re-write history? ...

1) It wasn't just one time to make a point. It was offered many times over many different "compromise" bills.

Yes. It was offered twice, in 2012 and again in 2014. Both times before an election and both times moved the public to poll as seeing the gop as the party of obstruction.

2) Republicans did not reject it because it was extreme. They rejected it because it was not extreme enough - they wanted more than chained CPI and publically said so.

In what world, could seating republican legislators accept any cut to SS? It's amazing how some believe the gop spin ... it's almost like they've never encountered anyone that has cried sour grapes.

3) It was an attempt to undo the sequester, which was already a failed attempt at compromising with Republicans. The defense cuts already showed Republicans were extremists not willing to compromise.

The defense cuts showed people that follow politics closely that the republicans were extremist; but, the defense cuts did not move the public.

Obama believed that under all the rhetoric, Republicans actually wanted to do what's best for the country. Unfortunately, he was wrong.

Okay.

[Thinkingabout]

83. Naive? Is this why Bernie has gotten so many bills passed in Congress?

[Autumn]

84. Well this will get interesting.

[NCTraveler]

87. Very early on I had similar thoughts about Obama.

Then after a while I became amazingly impressed with his handling of republicans. Shit, their number one guy gave in to the point he had to go. I got a clue for how much of a fighter he is during the passage of the ACA. Many other instances as well. Sanders calling Obama this? Lol

[BeyondGeography]

88. All Presidents learn the hard way about limits

Bernie's statement lacks humility. Unattractive.

[SunSeeker]

97. Keep talking, Sanders. Bashing Obama is a great way to get black voters.

[AtomicKitten]

98. Hillary blamed Obama for the rise of ISIS. That can't be good for her.

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/08/hillary-clinton-failure-to-help-syrian-rebels-led-to-the-rise-of-isis/375832/

[SunSeeker]

99. Your concern is duly noted. nt

[Live and Learn]

103. And yours is duly noted as hypocrisy. nt

[SunSeeker]

109. I have expressed no concern about Sanders bashing Obama.

Why would I?

[Live and Learn]

110. I see you proudly claim the dark-side. As so, it is no surprise you

deny what you pretty explicitly just posted.

[Live and Learn]

105. Keep pretending that was a bash.

I too wish Obama would have done more with the chance he had. I am not sure why he thought he could reason with the unreasonable.

That said, I still think he will go down in history as a great President.

And, that said, I am not sure why I am trying to reason with you. Chalk me and Obama up with making similar mistakes.

[SunSeeker]

108. Obama had 24 working days of a filibuster proof majority in the Senate.

Sanders was there. He knows that. He knows Obama had to barter and compromise with the GOP and blue dogs to get anything done. And yet Sanders slams this effort, which resulted in amazing successes, as stupidly "naive."

Yep. Sanders should keeps talking about how "naive" Obama is. Really.

[Live and Learn]

111. Obama had the people on his side and he din't use it.

That is not an Obama slam just a fact. Bernie is saying he would use it instead of caving in like we all know Hillary would do and which you seem to think is fine.

[leftofcool]

127. Unfortunately, "the people" don't control Congress

You think that Republicans care if bernie gets 25k or so people to march on Washington? It would be a laughingstock. This is bernie's problem. He thinks that he can wave some type of magic wand and Republicans will just fall at his feet. He doesn't believe in compromise and compromise is not "caving in."

[gwheezie]

104. Obama did a better job than I expected

I think he's gotten quite a bit if progressive laws done inspite of the obstruction from the GOP and the bluedogs. I was surprised he was able to out manuever them so many times. I don't see Bernie being capable to manage that kind of obstruction. He's been in Congress a long time, his record is not that impressive.

[Live and Learn]

112. Sure, go with Hillary then, WalMart board members are notorious for getting things done.

ETA: Might I add, I had even more hope for Obama but will still rate him as one of the best. Pity you thought so little of him.

[leftofcool]

128. We will and she will get thing done.

[LondonReign2]

141. What things will she get done? Do tell, because it seems no Hillary supporter

can answer...what things will she get done? On what issues/votes will she get Republicans to side with her?

[gwheezie]

143. Oh my did I compare Bernie to Hillary?

I thought I compared him to Obama, are you projecting much ? I have said publically in these forums that I don't think ANY of the dem candidates running for 16 are going to be as effective as Obama.
I see very little evidence in Bernie's long career in both the house and senate that he has any more ability than Obama to get things done with a GOP Congress
I think Obama has handled the GOP with skill and pragmatism. I never thought he was naive. For Bernie to claim he could do a better job with the GOP and blue dogs because he's not as naive as Obama is not backed up by anything but rhetoric. So what did Bernie mean when he said Obama was naive?
I didn't vote for Obama in my primary but my confidence in him grew when I saw him in action. I think the right democrat won in 08.

[eridani]

115. Don't think that Obama has been naive--he's just really, really interested in finding--

--common ground. This is cool with respect to the Iran and Cuba deals and not so cool trying to deal with Republicans.

[moobu2]

131. A Bernie presidency would be a total failure and guarantee

a republican dominated government and supreme court for decades. But feel the bern!!.

[redstateblues]

142. But but but bully pulpit

Love that as an answer to "get things done". Talk about naive

[1StrongBlackMan]

155. You forgot the part about ...

the clicking of heels that will have MILLIONS marching on D.C.!

[Eleanors38]

152. Very good observation by Sanders. nt

[zappaman]

157. "Naive Obama"

[Vinca]

160. Couldn't agree more.

It took the POTUS 6 years to figure out the GOP had no intention of working with him.

[Blasphemer]

166. Sanders is right

He approached the GOP as if he was misinformed about their history. We're talking about evil - from the bowels of hell type of evil. I'm not sure that any modern day Dem would have been successful (where is LBJ when you need him?) but you can't can't begin with giving opponents such as these respect. If they can't even respect the Constitution, they are certainly not going to show any Dem president any.

[Maineman]

167. I agree.

[DAngelo136]

168. The late Bartcop said it all those years ago:

He called it "Bart's Law #17"

"You don't negotiate with barking dogs". RIP Bartcop.