I'm sitting with my black relatives, by the way I'm black and we aren't buying into Hillary's

[JRLeft]

bullshit.

[HereSince1628]

1. Unfortunately that begs the question, whose BS -are- you buying into?

I wish it were otherwise, but it isn't.

[sabrina 1]

9. No it isn't and here's why. One candidate has a long, consistent record that voters can check

and see for themselves.

The other has a terrible record on issues that relate to Civil Rights, the Welfare Reform Bill eg, which Hillary proudly boasts she worked hard using her status a First Lady, to get votes for.

People are not stupid, we are all capable of looking at the facts, as apparently the OP has, and making up our minds who best represents us, as the OP has.

[jberryhill]

2. Well that looks like a strarter to a productive conversation

How long have you all been sitting?

Do you plan to stand up, or walk around, while not buying into Hillary's bullshit? Or does this only happen when you all sit?

[artislife]

92. There you have it.

Small brained response.

[jberryhill]

94. What sort of conversation does the OP invite

As a discussion topic, what sort of discussion is intended to ensue?

[JaneyVee]

3. Ok. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

Not sure what race has to do with it.

[peacebird]

76. Because Hillaryites have been claiming she has the brown & black vote locked up

Part of why they say Bernie cannot win

[JRLeft]

81. She could still win the majority but it not a lock by any stretch of the means.

[artislife]

115. Now your are sensitive to using race in a political OP

When it doesn't show how H is winning all the AA or Latino votes, it is kind of icky to you.

See your double standards.

[JRLeft]

119. What?

[artislife]

122. Reply

was to Janey Vee, who gets to use race to support his/her cause but wonders why anyone would use it.

[m-lekktor]

4. I am gay and I can't stand either Clinton. I believe they are a pox on the party. nt

[JRLeft]

5. There are a lot of black people who know the Clinton's are as corrupt as multinational corporate

CEOS.

[JaneyVee]

6. Corrupt how?

[JRLeft]

8. Corporate owned. Taking money from industries harming the globe is corruption.

She won't stand up to the people she is beholden to.

[sabrina 1]

13. Not to mention the Private Prison Industry. I hear all the excuses as to why she doesn't need

to refuse that money. So far not one of them makes any sense considering she NOW says, she opposes them. I remember her support for Tough on Crime legislation which meant 'tough on the poor and minorities' but not so much on her Wealthy Corporate funders.

They would like people to develop a huge amount of amnesia right now. But fortunately that isn't possible when you are trying elect the person best suited to represent ALL the people, not just the wealthy.

[upaloopa]

14. Can you post one link to a legitimate news story about

Hillary taking corporate money?
We don't know who gives to super PACs. Individuals can only give $2,700. Who a donor works for is not who donated the money.
I think you are making shit up

[sabrina 1]

45. You supprt CU then?? You see nothing wrong with taking unlimited amounts of money from people

whose identities are hidden from the public, or how much they are donating to those vile, smear machines?

You just answered your own question. Those Super Pacs themselves are as corrupt an entity as could possibly be allowed into our Electoral system.

And here I thought Hillary opposed Citizens United.

[JaneyVee]

22. Her biggest donors are unions.

[sabrina 1]

46. Who's pouring money into her Super Pacs??

[JRLeft]

18. Keep plugging your ears and denying.

https://www.opensecrets.org/pres16/contrib.php?cycle=All&id=N00000019&type=f

[840high]

95. So naive.

[global1]

34. Then How Do You Explain Why Hillary Is Doing So Well In The AA Community?....

They just showed some poll numbers on MSNBC that says it's the AA Community that's the difference between her and Bernie and that the AA Community is holding her numbers up.

What's the best way for Bernie to get his message out to the AA Community?

[AgingAmerican]

36. Because AA community tends to vote for the Democrat they believe has the best chance of winning

That's why they didn't warm up to Obama til later in the game in 2008.

Bernie needs to keep doing what he is doing.

[JRLeft]

39. If we have a legitimate alternative candidate, a lot of us will switch.

[JI7]

43. her personal approvals are actually high among african americans and other minorities

I know many don't want to face this fact. But it's a fact .

[AgingAmerican]

44. Just like they were in 08

[JI7]

48. in 2008 she kept her non black minority voters. and even black people who voted for Obama

Still liked her.

[AgingAmerican]

58. They eviscerated her once they switched to Obama

There was no love for Hillary from Obama supporters in 08. None whatsoever.

[JI7]

72. nope. you still refuse to acknowledge that they were voting FOR Obama

And not against Hillary. Many wanted both on the ticket.

[JRLeft]

73. Wrong most of us wanted her no where near the white house.

[JI7]

74. that's not true which is why she leads right now among all minority groups

[JRLeft]

75. No it's very much true, but keep believing that.

[JI7]

78. i look at the facts

When i supported Obama in 2008 most other south asians (all Asians actually)were supporting Clinton.

I support sanders right now but I'm not going to deny the facts.

[JRLeft]

80. I'm taking about black people.

[JI7]

82. the same is true for all minority groups right now

If you really want sanders to win it won't happen by denying reality

[JRLeft]

86. What I said was factual the Clinton's pissed off most black community with their dog whistle

politics.

[1StrongBlackMan]

62. IOWs, the Black vote FOR Candidate Obama ...

was NOT a vote against HRC.

On a related note ... Anecdotally, I am sensing in a lot of Black spaces I frequent, a vote for HRC is also a vote AGAINST Bernie.

[Hortensis]

68. Is that absolutism coming from HRCers or/and Berniers?

BTW, regarding these sorts of responses, skin color is irrelevant to those personality traits I keep mentioning. All are seen in all populations, in only slightly different proportions*, one of the most illuminating things about the personality thing to me.

* Geographic areas that are more challenging to life and require people to be more protective, like hot climates over more temperate, tend to run more conservative.

[1StrongBlackMan]

69. Sorry ... I'm not understanding the question. n/t

[Hortensis]

70. "Anecdotally, I am sensing

in a lot of Black spaces I frequent, a vote for HRC is also a vote AGAINST Bernie." You know what? I just re-read it and noted the "also," so I think I understand. Do you think Bernie will do better with those people as his campaign broadens out of Iowa and NH?

[1StrongBlackMan]

90. While it is possible ...

Last edited Fri Oct 16, 2015, 08:12 PM - Edit history (1)

he will have to:

1) limit the number of unforced errors ... i.e., give time to racial justice in a way that does not make it seem that it is an "Oh, yeah ..." after-thought. Possible doing an (a series of) event(s) where he speaks exclusively to racial justice (but I honestly think that is counter to his nature ... See: Bernie's "frustration" with SNCC);

2) Increase his exposure in Black spaces; and,

3) In those racial justice (exclusively) events, speak directly to his more "enthusiastic" supporters.

Failing that ... No, I do not suspect he will do better.

But the above poses a real risk that he will alienate a segment of his supporters ... particularly, those of his more "enthusiastic" supporters.

[Hortensis]

91. Thanks for the thoughtful answer, 1Strong.

I'm always an optimist, but it does seem to me it would be not just a good tradeoff but one that may be inevitable as he campaigns in far more diverse states. Bernie also would have to upset some of his more "enthusiastic" supporters as he speaks to the center and independents anyway. I'm guessing most would stick, though, occasionally upset or no. Partially dependent on the appeal of whoever the GOP nominates, maybe?

You make it clear that he will have to go to work, though. Very interesting election season. I usually don't pay so much attention this early, but I'm hooked.

[1StrongBlackMan]

93. I have slight edited my previous response to make a proximate point ...

Last edited Sat Oct 17, 2015, 10:33 AM - Edit history (1)

I'm always an optimist, but it does seem to me it would be not just a good tradeoff but one that may be inevitable as he campaigns in far more diverse states.

Perhaps ... But it's going to be a tough row to hoe, as (the) Black folks (that I encounter in Black spaces) remember/will remember Liberty University ... to a person, there was a collective WTF! The message would have been different had it not been known that he has/had a "Black problem."

Bernie also would have to upset some of his more "enthusiastic" supporters as he speaks to the center and independents anyway.

What makes you think he is going to speak a different message to the center and independents from that he repeats to Black folks ... despite our frustration?

[Hortensis]

118. Well, if he can't win without a substantial portion of the Black vote,

Last edited Sat Oct 17, 2015, 11:10 AM - Edit history (1)

obviously he's got to stop assuming they should choose him automatically.

Apparently up there in "white-flight"* Vermont it never occurred to him he'd have a genuine black problem, which is a joke on him; but by now, after so many clueless stumbles, he's probably paying good attention, especially to Black advisers. He also has to know by now that Black voting rates have been topping White.

I didn't realize until you said JUST how badly Liberty came across to Black observers. It was a surprise to me, really weird timing, going so early to a place like that. I assumed this "socialist Jew" must have picked them as representative of his polar opposites, reaching out to the children of America's premier troublemakers, and thought no more about it. You make clear that some feel his priorities were way out of order -- at best.

"What makes you think he is going to speak a different message to the center and independents from that he repeats to Black folks ... despite our frustration?" I don't. I have no idea what the messages will be, although, of course, some Blacks will also be centrists by nature. What I meant was just that like any politician he'll have to tailor his message to different groups in order to establish connections with them and that inevitably not all he says will please some of his early "enthusiasts."

Speaking of the South, when I first moved to Georgia and started meeting people, joining a garden club, etc., once in benign chat about current events some women commented that they'd never actually met a Jew, sort of in wondering acknowledgement of their insularity more than anything else, and a couple different times people mentioned to me that they'd never actually personally met a liberal. My husband's Jewish and we're both liberal, but I kind of doubt we were actually the first, just the first to say so. We moved here to be near our son and daughter-in-law, a Georgia girl, but we find ourselves living in one of the most conservative counties in the country. Nobody ever bothers to campaign here, and the only political ads I see are on cable talk shows.

* Referring to a commonly held image, not to any specific Vermonters.

[1StrongBlackMan]

123. Last night, I was at an event last night ...

Last edited Sat Oct 17, 2015, 12:18 PM - Edit history (1)

It was a political/social event, attended (largely) by a politically/socially active, economically diverse, African-American crowd (and of course a smattering of non-Black politicians and corporate types ... you know, doing the "minority outreach" thing).

I recounted this exchange and someone (a Black undecided voter) added: If the Liberty event had been proceeded by a couple racial justice only events, the "going into the Lion's Den" move would have been seen as a ballsy move ... expanding his message and out reach to non-tradition spaces; but, given the lack of traction among, and sustained out-reach to, the Black electorate, the message heard was, "We will expand our base among non-traditional spaces, TO MAKE UP FOR our lack of traction in the Black electorate."

While, I do not believe/hope like hell that was (oops, ETA: NOT) the calculus, I was surprised to hear it ... as I had typed that very concern(?) ... shortly after the Liberty event.

Apparently up there in white-flight Vermont it never occurred to him he'd have a genuine black problem, which is a joke on him; but by now, after so many clueless stumbles, he's probably paying good attention, especially to Black advisers. He also has to know by now that Black voting rates have been topping White.

LOL ... Watch yourself! That "white flight Vermont" comment was the met with much derision and more than a few alerts! LOL.

Speaking of Black advisors ... where IS Cornell West these post-"South Carolina Meet Bernie" days? Again, absence noticed and optics not good.

some Blacks will also be centrists by nature.

I would argue that MOST Blacks are ... {speaking in a hushed tone} ... "centrists". And that, outside the walls of DU, is not a slur (not saying you are using the word that way ... but if you haven't seen, DU:Search the word "centrist" and weep).

[Hortensis]

124. Whoa, thanks for the warnings. I am frequently clueless.

FWIW, I think centrist is a perfectly fine thing to be. Before the center and right took a massive shift farther right, I was one myself on some issues, though usually moderate-to-strong liberal on social. That shift, of course, left me a crazy-radical-commie-liberal in comparison.

Regarding Bernie's priorities, I personally do not find in the least credible any notion that he would discard Black justice issues and their votes in favor of chasing after the white right, Christian or otherwise. Only think of him in competition with Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio speaking of how "blessed" he was to be among them.

There is one conservative "populist" subgroup he apparently has been talking to all along, some of whom I suspect are represented here at DU -- lower-income, socially conservative but economically liberal, angry people who feel victimized by "the establishment" -- but his standard economic wrongs message is picking them up anyway.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

77. No group is a monolith...

I have told this story here a million times. My mom was Jewish. My dad was Italian and Catholic. On my mom's side my entire extended family was Democratic and liberal. I never met a Jewish Republican until I got to college. I still don't meet many conservative Jews but I know they are out there.

That's why I prefer to look at empirical data and not anecdotal data.

[1StrongBlackMan]

60. But Candidate Obama's approval numbers among the Black electorate ...

was never below 30%. This is a different contest, a different day, and more importantly, a different candidate.

[JRLeft]

51. She's not as popular as you think she. She has name recognition.

[sabrina 1]

50. She will lose a lot of that support, and actually we have no clue what the support is since so many

minorities are not even registered to vote, they have given up on the system. Did you follow Ferguson at all by any chance where all this was thoroughly discussed? Why AAs are dropping out of the system?

So those polls are reflective ONLY of people who are registerd. Bernie's campaign is registering voters who have not registered for a long time, believing the system doesn't work for them. I have done so myself and those new voters are not being polled yet.

Not to mention only one third of AAs know who he is, so far.

But as they learn about him, as we see daily, many are switching to Bernie, with AAs now having groups for Bernie throughout the country.

The OP's opinion of Hillary is not at all uncommon among minorities, not sure why people think all AAs think alike, or SHOULD support one party or another. Lots of AAs are Republicans also.

[MADem]

101. Haven't you heard?

Last edited Fri Oct 16, 2015, 10:45 PM - Edit history (1)

According to one DU "pundit," the community is suffering from "Stockholm Syndrome."

And no--the post was not hidden.

smh.


And, on edit, if you keep reading this train wreck of a thread, you'll see a DUer claim that another DUer said that Clinton "owned" black people--a deliberate misstatement to create agita. Then he tried to claim that he meant to say she "owned" gay people....but the actual quote was that she "owned" a portion of the LBGT "base."

And we wonder why discourse sucks here, sometimes? That kind of thing is outrageous. And I see it here every damn day.

[Scootaloo]

102. And according to another, black people are "owned" by Clinton.

A post which not only wasn't hidden, but that you recommended.

[MADem]

103. You're going to show me a link, of course, so I can verify this "slave" reference to which you

coyly allude.

[Scootaloo]

104. Sure. here you go.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251603541

And when we click on the "recs" box, not only are you on the 19-person list, but you're also first to have recced it.

And sorry, it's gay people that are "owned." But evidently black people can be taken completely for granted as well, according to that post.

[MADem]

105. Here's the post I rec'd in its entirety. Not sure where you're getting your slavery allusions.

Reposted from the link, above:

All Your Base Are Belong to Clinton



The Democratic Party umbrella is huge. The party welcomes people whom the GOP and the MSM dismiss as "fringe" ---even though taken altogether the "fringes" make up a larger part of the democracy than the so called "norms"--you know the white , male, heterosexual, not disabled non Muslims. There are many different sections of the Democratic Party base. Some people belong to more than one. Here is a summary of some of the most important (in terms of numbers and votes).

1. Unions. This should be numbers 1 through 3, but I will just limit it to one. So far, All Your Union Base Are Belong to Clinton. Except for National Nurses United, which has given its support to Sanders. In 2000, NNU supporter Nader over Gore. All the other unions that have declared so far ( including teachers, machinists, plumbers) have declared for Clinton. I am going to go out on a very short, very sturdy limb at this point and predict that if Sanders does not get some more union support, his chances of being the party nominee are close to zero. So, his number one job is win over the unions.

2. Women. Women vote for both parties. But women lean heavily Democratic while men are more evenly split. Making women an important part of the Democratic Base. All Your Female Base Are Belong to Clinton (and Will Always Belong to Clinton). Period. That is not to say that some women will not vote for Sanders. Some women will also vote for the GOP nominee. Some would vote for David Dukes if given the option. But if given a chance to vote for another woman, turnout of women will be higher and GOP women will cross over. Here lies the mathematical key to Clinton's victory. No man will be able to separate her from her base. No voter suppression will be able to suppress the enhanced turnout of giddy women who are finally ready to have their day in the sun.

3. Blacks. As Toni Morrison said, Bill Clinton was the first Black president--until Obama was the first Black president. Hillary is married to one of these man, and she was Secretary of State for the other. In addition, she is Obama's anointed successor, and in 2008 she very graciously buried the hatchet at the Convention and campaigned for her primary opponent in a way that other Democratic nomination losers (see Ted Kennedy 1980) did not. Can Sanders peel away Clinton's Black support? Maybe. But people who live in fear of being shot by the police for no reason at all take politics pretty seriously. They are not likely to give up a "sure thing" in order to take a chance with something new.

4. LGBT. Last I heard, Hillary owned this portion of the base. LGBT believe that she is a member of this portion of the base. All Your LGBT Base Are Belong to Clinton, and Sanders would be advised to not even waste his time on this one.

5. Irish-Americans. Forgot about this one, didn't you? Irish-Americans are an important part of the base. Hillary brought peace to Northern Ireland. Hillary won New Hampshire in 2008 because of the tradition of strong female leaders among the Irish-American Matriarchy. Sanders chance of peeling off the Irish vote? See number 4. All Your Irish-American Base Are Belong to Clinton.

6. Latinos. With Julian Castro rumored to be on board, All Your Latino Base Are Belong to Clinton. Sanders had better pick himself a Latino running mate pronto if he plans to compete for this demographic. Or better yet, suddenly discover that one of his parents is Hispanic.

7. Young people. Not a chance anyone young and hip will be caught campaigning for an old woman who wears pant suits. This portion of the base belongs to Sanders---unless someone younger and hipper shows up. All Your Youth Base Are Belong to Sanders (let's just hope they can be reminded to get out there and vote).

8. Jewish Democrats Hard to say. I am pretty sure that Jewish Democrats would like a Jewish president to make up for all those years of discrimination. On the other hand, Hillary Clinton has shown a willingness to commit US ground troops in order to combat genocide. Bill was the one who vetoed sending troops to Rwanda, if it was up to Hillary we would have been there in Africa saving lives. And even if she did not actually dodge bullets in the Balkans stopping a genocide, she and her daughter were there on the ground showing their support for a mission that the GOP hated because it was not intended to prop up the price of oil, it was supposed to save lives. Sanders, on the other hand, is running as the No War, Not Ever candidate. Never, Bernie? Not even to stop another Hitler? Proof that you have to be careful when creating your brand image. I am pretty sure that Sanders would have voted "Let's go kick Hilter's butt!" But he is already being labeled the "Peace Candidate" .....with no qualifiers.

If I left out any portion of the base I am sorry! It is late. For Sanders to have a chance, he needs to get the majority--not just an even split of the Unions----and he needs to snag the Latinos. Can he do it?

Are you so young that you do not understand the "All your base" meme?

Not sure where you are getting any of that "slavery" shit you tried to insinuate. Didn't see any owning of blacks word in that post, either. I see you're now retracting--after making that ugly fucking accusation--and now trying to pretend that I'm homophobic based on the phrase in the post that says Hillary OWNS a portion of the LGBT base.

You should be ashamed of yourself. That's probably some of the ugliest posting I have seen here in a long ass time--and you're the author. Pat yourself on the back.


Edited to add your post:

Scootaloo (20,574 posts)
104. Sure. here you go.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251603541

And when we click on the "recs" box, not only are you on the 19-person list, but you're also first to have recced it.

And sorry, it's gay people that are "owned." But evidently black people can be taken completely for granted as well, according to that post.

[Scootaloo]

109. Where did I say anything about slavery, MADem? Or call you a homophobe?

I understand the meme just fine, thanks, but it's the content of the post that's the issue. And the content of the post is problematic as it rattles off assorted ethnic and social groups, declaring how Clinton can just take them for granted (except for young people, who are insulted and dismissed, as clinton supporters do). You were first in line to rec this shit.

And now you're misquoting it. After posting it in full. While putting words I never said into my mouth.

[MADem]

110. When you talk about black people being "owned"--as you did upthread, you are talking about slavery.

Cut the crap.

You have been caught stirring the pot.

You should be ashamed, and apologize, but instead you double down.

It's clear to anyone reading this subthread what kind of game you are playing.

And I'm cutting and pasting your words, so you can't change them or delete them.

If your take away from that post is that "Clinton takes them for granted" then you are a poor student of the political process. But you're now trying to pivot from that "black owning" language you were playing with earlier, that anyone can look upthread and see.

109. Where did I say anything about slavery, MADem? Or call you a homophobe?
View profile
I understand the meme just fine, thanks, but it's the content of the post that's the issue. And the content of the post is problematic as it rattles off assorted ethnic and social groups, declaring how Clinton can just take them for granted (except for young people, who are insulted and dismissed, as clinton supporters do). You were first in line to rec this shit.

And now you're misquoting it. After posting it in full. While putting words I never said into my mouth.

[Scootaloo]

111. Copy and paste all you like. Just besure to actually read what you're C/P'ing

'Cause you're saying I'm calling you a homphobe, and talking about slavery, neither of which is true. As anyone reading can see.

I'm accusing you of reccing a shitty, bigoted post. Being first in line to do so, even. Since you're all about safeguards, here's a screenshot:

[MADem]

112. What was bigoted about that post? Answer--NOTHING. It was a political analysis of

interest groups, and you tried to make something UGLY out of it.

Again, what was bigoted about that post--be specific. And if you try to claim that the sentence that references Clinton owning a portion of the LGBT base as being bigoted, you've LOST the argument.

I was proud to rec that post--it was, for a change, a good analysis of the ground game, as opposed to the usual shitflinging I see here from people who Make Shit Up and play games to try to goad and bait people.

[Scootaloo]

113. Re-read the post. Think about it. And for fuck's sake, pay attention to the LGBT part

You keep misquoting it.

[MADem]

114. Thought so. You got nuthin.

Not that hard to find the "offending" sentence and cut and paste it. Gee, that way there will be none of this mysterious "misquoting" you're whining about.

Come on--don't be shy. Let the whole WORLD know exactly what part of that post is "bigoted."

Tick tock!

Scootaloo
113. Re-read the post. Think about it. And for fuck's sake, pay attention to the LGBT part
View profile
You keep misquoting it.

[MADem]

106. Since this accusation you made has been shown to be a complete falsehood, I'm retaining this

post of yours--ugly, and untrue, in all its glory--so everyone can see how you play it.

Scootaloo (20,573 posts)
102. And according to another, black people are "owned" by Clinton.

A post which not only wasn't hidden, but that you recommended.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

35. Hear that all the time! Nothin new.

[Nedsdag]

7. As an AA woman, I have a long memory.

I still remember Bill losing it when Obama won in SC. I still remember Hillary's "hard working white people" remark and how she wants to be ready if "something happened" a la 1968. I certainly haven't forgotten their egregious behavior during the campaign.

Hillary's supporters expect many AAs to hold their noses and vote for her because she's "the best candidate." I haven't made up my mind who to support during the primaries, but she'll have to do more than meet with #BlackLivesMatter before I come around to her side.

[JRLeft]

10. Her racist bullshit was garbage, but her donor base is dangerous.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

12. So, from your perspective, Nedsdag, may I ask what is the feeling you get from the AA community as

to whom they are generally supporting? Thank you.

[JRLeft]

15. My father hates the Clinton's because of the way they treated Obama.

[Nedsdag]

16. The more Bernie talks, the more I like him.

I hope he does well because I feel his platform is more palatable than Hillary's.

As for other AAs I know, they're older and are more prone to vote for her. They also wish that Biden would run as well. But younger AAs are willing to give Bernie a chance.

[upaloopa]

17. Hillary supporters don't expect you to do a damned

thing but to vote for your favorite candidate in the primary and vote for the nominee in the general if you are voting as a Democrat. Personally I don't care what you other than what I just posted.

[Nedsdag]

20. Keep it up and I will vote for Bernie.

Hillary supporters are so arrogant that they assume that all AAs will automatically vote for her.

I'm glad you are able to forgive what she said in 2008. I haven't.

Have a good day!

[JaneyVee]

24. No. No one assumes that. She earns her votes.

It's Bernie's supporters who have taken to the internet to lecture African Americans.

[Nedsdag]

26. And Bernie hasn't "earned their votes"?

Is it because he's from Vermont?

Give me a break!

[JaneyVee]

29. According to polling, no.

It's up to him to bridge that divide. But he voted for the 1994 crime bill and lax gun laws. 2 things that have hurt minority communities. Not Hillary. She opened her offices in Harlem, fights for global human rights, and helps fighr AIDS in Africa.

[Dawgs]

31. You seriously write, 'opened offices in Harlem, fights for global human rights, and helps Africa'

As reasons that she supports the African American community? You sure you want to go with that?

[Bluenorthwest]

52. Problem with your logic here is that the Crime Bill is owned by Bill Clinton and not by Hillary but

the offices in Harlem and the African AIDS efforts are Bill's more than Hillary's. They opened offices in Harlem, not she. So it's not fair to say 'she's clear on the crime bill but gets credit for Bill's good stuff'.

Cake and eat it too. Play fair.

[Truprogressive85]

61. What ? lol

Whats office does she have in Harlem ?

I am Black Bernie Sanders supporter, and I am proud to support Sen. Sanders run for the White House


whats has HRC done for me and my community ?

[JaneyVee]

63. She's been sticking it to the NYPD for racial killings since Amadou Diallo.

And hasn't stopped since.

[Truprogressive85]

64. What office does she have in Harlem ? as you stated in previous

There was police brutality before Amadou Diallo and still there is police brutality - what did she do to fix as a senator ?

She been pro " tough on crime" and accused then Sen. Obama of being weak on that issue during the 08' campaign

What has she done for me and my community ?

[JRLeft]

65. The poster has no idea WTF he/she is talking about.

[Truprogressive85]

66. I'm seeing that now

offices in harlem lol

Bill Clinton had an office in Harlem but he moved down to the financial district (I wonder why ) lol

[JRLeft]

67. Wall Street LMFAO!

[upaloopa]

25. I don't remember anything about 2008 except

that I supported Obama and how nasty this board was.

[AgingAmerican]

47. The whole internet was an anti-Hillary mosh pit

Obama supporters were teaming up with Republicans on Yahoo chat bashing Hillary. Air America hosts were self immolating over her. Randy Rhodes wrecked her career over Hillary.

It was a mess.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

37. Welcome aboard the Bernie Express! Enjoy the ride!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[JRLeft]

79. Yes they do, I remember Rahm Emmanuel saying where else are they going to go.

[StevieM]

21. Supporting Hillary Clinton's 2008 campaign for president was the proudest experience of my life.

I reject every charge you have leveled at her.

Hillary never said she wanted to be ready in case something bad happened to then Senator Obama. She wasn't even answering a question about whether she could win. She was discussing whether it was unreasonable for the election to go into June, and she reminded people of other elections where that happened. She mentioned the RFK race, and also gave her husband's race as an example.

It would have made no sense for Hillary to given that answer to a question about winning the nomination, because her entire position--whether you agreed with it or not--was that it was inaccurate to say that the winner of the pledged delegate count was the automatic winner of the nomination. Her supporters often talked about other standards, like who won the majority of congressional districts, or who won what you might call the electoral college map (looking at the primary race through the prism of the electoral college). They rejected that the race was over and decided, given that Senator Obama finished hundreds of pledged delegates shy of what was needed to guarantee the nomination, and historically, races that close went to the Convention.

Hillary did not say "hard working white people." A newspaper headline referred to hard working voters, white voters. The comma is pivotal. And the wording of the headline was theirs. Hillary was talking about groups Obama was struggling with later in the campaign and she referenced blue-collar voters and white voters. Even if it was a mistake to say that, it isn't the same as saying "hard-working white people" which implies that white voters are the hard-working Americans, as opposed to minorities.

[Nedsdag]

23. She used code words.

Her husband told Ted Kennedy that Obama was the type of guy who would get him coffee and carry his bags.

If Hillary is the nominee, she'll will be the lesser of what is out there. I plan to vote November 2016 for my congressman. I haven't decided to vote for her, but then again I live in a blue state so it doesn't matter.

I'm glad you supported her, but I haven't forgotten.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

38. Who can forget that one? Shameful!

[Fawke Em]

107. Me, either, Nedsdag.

While I am a white woman, I live in a very blended community, therefore, I work and play with a lot of people of various color. I'm also a Southerner (I live in a blue city - our mayor is a Democrat and a Latina). When she put on that Southern drawl in an attempt to sound, I don't know, "black" or "Southern," to pander to the crowd, she lost any good will I ever had toward her.

Of course, her ties with corporate America and her itchy trigger finger that could conceivably send my son into war don't help, but that "be all to everyone" stunt really showed me her true colors.

[demwing]

30. I've heard the quote

it's not two items in a list, it's one item and a qualifier.

[artislife]

117. Well read this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/118729338

This OP is how I remember her.

[LondonReign2]

55. Nedsdag, do you have any theory on why more people in the AA community don't think this way?

I'm not a poll denier, I believe the polls when it shows Clinton has very strong support with AA's. What I can't figure out is, WHY? Why isn't her racist dog whistle campaign in 2008 causing her any backlash?

[Number23]

96. This is a great post.

And I agree. But what I can't understand is people who think that the tone deaf stuff that Bernie is saying and doing TODAY is somehow so much less odious than the tone deaf crap Clinton said 8 years ago.

[Todays_Illusion]

11. I think the story line that African Americans don't like Bernie is pure propaganda and serves more

than one purpose. Creating division between Democratic voters and presenting Bernie as lukewarm on civil rights when it is clearly a lie.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

41. A damn lie! Started by whose campaign I wonder?

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[Todays_Illusion]

53. I think you are reacting according to how the conservative propoaganda wants you to.

The Republican party, their darlings are exploding, they keep trying to stir up a storm among the
Democratic, they have been running stories about Democratic infighting for the last two years, about the Democratic Congress who have held together quite well all things considered and most of all they want the Democratic to attack each other.

But of course that is only my own opinion.

[JRLeft]

49. Most never heard or they have but vaguely remember him.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

97. She's terrified that she is going to lose the African American vote

[Todays_Illusion]

100. Translation, conservative groups can run divisive storylines pitting Democratic against each other

Blame Bernie's team for some, Blame Hillary's team others. It seems to be working fine.

[angel123]

19. So, you are black.

OK, so whose bs are you buy into, and what does color have to do with it. It just seems to me, that some so called "democrats" want us to fight among ourselves. We do have an edge over republicans disarray and you want us to do the same dumb stuff. Why are we so gullible?

[JRLeft]

56. I do not want bought and paid for candidates. Hillary is owned by Wall Street.

If Hillary wins expect the middle class and the poor to continue being decimated.

[artislife]

116. You haven't been here long enough to know

That race, especially AAs and Latinos , is used to bash Bernie over the head. Apparently, there are very few of us (Latina) who like Sanders. The outliers must state their race to prove she doesn't have each and every one of us.

[workinclasszero]

27. Well hey with a well reasoned

cognitive, persuasive argument like that, you are sure to win many people over to Bernie's side.

Keep up the good work!

[Dawgs]

32. Did they say anything about Bernie?

[JRLeft]

40. Most of my family friends have no idea who he is.

[Dem2]

28. I would suggest you vote for Bernie in the primary then n/t

[Walk away]

33. Hey! There are Black and Gay republicans too!

Not many but they exist.

[uponit7771]

42. So?!?! tia

[arely staircase]

54. All of my AA inlaws are for HRC

They think wasting a vote on a socialist is a great example of white privilege. For them who appoints the next AG will make a real life or death difference for young Black men. Nominating a socialist and throwing the election to the GOP doesnt sit well with them.

[JRLeft]

59. I would say wasting a vote on Hillary is white privilege, because that's who wins under Third Way

Democrats, like gentrification in Oakland, San Francisco, Berkeley, and Richmond, CA.

[Art_from_Ark]

121. So how have the current AG and her predecessor worked out for them?

[Faux pas]

57. Oh Yeah!

[JRLeft]

71. I'm very aware of her true constituency.

Last edited Fri Oct 16, 2015, 06:59 PM - Edit history (1)

[angryvet]

83. and you all will be real

happy when the Republican president gets to appoint 3 right wingers to the supreme court. GET A GRIP

[Kalidurga]

84. I feel support growing in the AA community

I am not in the community so much as I just live near a diverse area. Six months ago it was rare for me to run into anyone in the AA community that heard of Bernie much less supported him. Now, it happens now and again. For example, I made a drink stop at a gas station and the attendant was watching the pre debate coverage. I said I hope Bernie wins the election. He grinned big and said he does too. It turns out he was homeless at one point and got arrested four times for things that are in effect laws against being homeless. He believes and I believe that if Bernie wins then it will be much more rare for people to be homeless and if they do become homeless anyway they will have an easier path to finding a home.

[JRLeft]

88. Bernie has helped the poor for years he's the only candidate speaking up for the poor.

[Bread and Circus]

85. Thank you. Bullshit is a perfect word for it too.

[NCTraveler]

87. If they are all buying into Sanders...

They made a damn fine choice.

[JRLeft]

89. They like what they've heard so far but haven't made a decision yet.

[jfern]

98. Hopefully they continue to like what they see

One thing I think is holding a lot of people of all races back from supporting him is that they don't think he's as electable as Hillary. But general election polls show they are somewhat similar, and Bernie has more room to grow because of his better net favorables. So once people realize that I think they'll be more likely to support him.

[JRLeft]

99. As much as they despise Hillary they don't want a Republican in the White House.

[WillyT]

108. :fistbump:

I was asking a legit question... I thought...

The outrage was over the top.

Thank you.

[DCBob]

120. I think blacks are not buying into anything..

I am white but from my wide ranging life experiences and living in the south for many years, I think its simply a matter of feeling comfortable with Hillary whom they have known for decades. As opposed to Sanders who popped onto the national stage just recently for whom they know very little about... and what little they do know doesnt sound all that appealing.. an old white jewish guy from a small northern state... what could he possible know about the plight of regular black folks??