"If that is your position then I will talk only to white people" - Hillary Clinton

[Cheese Sandwich]

I'm looking forward to hearing Clinton defenders explain how this comment actually makes sense in context, and in what context this kind of comment makes sense.

Why would she talk only to white people just because one black guy said something she disagreed with?

[Thinkingabout]

1. Better than Sanders did. She did not allow two occasions before meeting with them.

They went away with an understanding. BTW, why did you cut the video, scared of the true results.

[Cheese Sandwich]

2. Thanks for showing up to defend the indefensible

[newfie11]

93. That's telling

I hope it's played everywhere.

[jkbRN]

12. The uncut video is just as bad.

Good on you for defending such a heinous comment.

[senz]

14. Yes, she talks down to them in the full video.

Very "in charge," poking her hand at them with her index finger folded so it doesn't look too much like pointing.

[Thinkingabout]

41. Still better than Sanders reactions.

[BeanMusical]

46. Nice try.

"I will talk only to white people"

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

101. How can anyone defend that shit?

[Fearless]

113. You're making things up.

[AlbertCat]

128. Still better than Sanders reactions.

You mean to the 2 rude disrupters.... one at a rally about economics and one in the street... both who attacked him (moves which BLM didn't like either) , as opposed to the nice little get together Clinton got?

He reacted appropriately to such behavior. When "official" BLM acted without threats, he responded clearly and honestly.


Is that what you are mischaracterizing here?

The GOP meme started back in June that Sanders doesn't care for blacks has been thoroughly debunked. I can't believe Hillary supporters are so desperate they are still beating that dead horse.

Sanders' record on civil rights is long and consistent... unlike someone else's.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

100. WORSE if you ask me.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[John Poet]

13. Yeah, because she spent the whole time hiding.

[Thinkingabout]

119. Or she could have spent her time backing up.

[sabrina 1]

55. Why did Hillary NOT KNOW there was a movement to stop the killing of Black Americans

when she went to a Black Church directly after the tragic murders in Charleston? Why did she insult AAs at that terrible time by saying 'All Lives Matter', angering AAs across the nation? Have you seen the reaction to her remarks at that Church from AA? Bernie btw, defended her. He knew there was a movement and understood the phrase. But Hillary had no idea why her remark was so offensive.

I have to go back here on DU to find the DEFENSE of Hillary's use of that phrase by some who are not attempting to use the race card in this election.

Airc, I had to EXPLAIN why it was so offensive to some of her 'outraged that anyone was criticizing her' supporters after the backlash she received.

Bernie did not use that phrase, and when he was asked to comment on HER use of it in an interview, he refused to engage in playing the race card against her. Telling the interviewer angrily 'I will not attack Hillary for this' forcing him to drop it.

I hope Bernie has learned that being decent to Hillary as he has been, while her campaign has engaged in nothing but attempted smears and attacks, is no longer necessary.

He is dealing with ruthless, dishonest Corporate funded smear campaigners. He defended her in the debate also, got her off the hook for the email garbage which SHE got HERSELF into.

He needs to take off the gloves, and Bernie can do that better than anyone, and start going after her on all of her 'mistakes' and stop defending her, because she and her supporters have done nothing from the beginning but attack with nasty, vile smears, which have NOT helped her. But that is not the point.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

102. Bernie needs to stop defending Hillary's bad behavior.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[MohRokTah]

3. I love it when Sanders people take shit completely out of context.

It smacks of their absolute desperation.

[MannyGoldstein]

8. Would you like to add some context

from the Hillarysplainin' event?

Feel free.

[thesquanderer]

34. S/he has posted this before

and it was knocked down pretty well last time.

See http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017300425

I say this as a Bernie supporter. There are so many good reasons one might prefer BS to HRC, there's no reason to make stuff up, quote people out of context, etc. Painting Hillary as a racist or insensitive to the AA community does no good for anyone. I think BS would be as good or better, but it's better to talk about Bernie's positives than to create fictional Hillary negatives.

[pnwmom]

44. Thanks for the reality check -- and your sense of fairness. nt

[joshcryer]

79. That none of the AA members here...

...had a problem with it indicates yet again Bernie "supporters" being at odds with BLM.

The sad part is these "supporters" still don't get it. I hate this crap.

[Fearless]

117. Do you know who all of Black DU'ers are?

[AlbertCat]

129. the AA members here...

I don't think this demographic represents BLM. Nor do I think all of them are just hunky dory with Hillary.

The sad part is someone would think all AA members here think the same and all Sanders supporters (who are real and don't need quotation marks) are all the same.

The really sad part is that this "Sanders' hates/ does get blacks" was started by the GOP in June or something. I can't believe anyone is still championing this GOP created meme! Unbelievable. Can't Hillary... er.... "supporters"... evolve????

[riversedge]

91. Thank you. I thought this OP sounded familiar. Twisting quotes or out of context is not good

for either side.

[Warren DeMontague]

63. Some people here wrote the book on taking shit completely out of context, I think

but they're not the GDP Sanders folks.

[stonecutter357]

96. +1

[Scootaloo]

4. Sounds like her supporters.

[ALBliberal]

5. But what if Bernie had said that?

[MannyGoldstein]

10. The Hillbullies would be screaming at 140dB

and would each change their support from Bernie to Hillary 20 times.

[ALBliberal]

15. yep....double standard there nt

[Warren DeMontague]

64. HOW DARE YOU CALL KATY PERRY A "SHINY OBJECT"!

I object!

[BeanMusical]

72. Lol!

[Warren DeMontague]

74. If you called her dull they wouldn't like it, either.

Can't win, can ya.

[BeanMusical]

76. Yes, some people can't get no satisfaction.

[Zorra]

106. !

[pa28]

58. Where is all the flaming indignity now?

Posters who would use race in such a cynical way as they did in attacking Sanders clearly weren't being sincere in the first place. The OP did us a service in showing that.

[ALBliberal]

66. yes....quite hypocritical. And they painted us all as racists in the process.

[Marr]

68. Yep-- and every person who tries to excuse that comment only proves it.

But tidal values are the hallmark of 'centrists'. They come and go.

[MisterP]

6. the current claim is that Sanders is a macho with a Devil's Joystick

the "wicked race-ignorer" went out when autumn went in!

[Hydra]

7. She totally fumbled that meeting

And there was no excuse for it. She had time to prep, she made them wait until after her event, and she had her team work hard against Bernie for the entire time before that...and she even got more polite Reps from BLM to come talk with her than the others.

And then she dropped the ball, sounding more tone deaf and out of touch than any of the people who got ambushed.

It was a total fail, and it's left a gaping hole in Team Hillary's play to eliminate economics from the discussion to making it entirely on a social justice platform that not only they cannot deliver on, but are not intending to even try for.

[dreamnightwind]

27. Completely agree with this post

Last edited Mon Oct 26, 2015, 02:32 AM - Edit history (1)

I was amazed how little reaction there was to it.

Goes to show how if the powers that be support your candidacy, you can do whatever, while if they don't, you can have the best positions, policies, and personal history of supporting those positions and policies, and it still isn't "good enough".

Your last line, "not intending to even try for", is so true, it's all about positioning for election, then we have nowhere to go and no power to wield, so thanks for your vote but we couldn't and didn't even try, because Republicans. The old triangulation three-step. Been watching that dance for over 30 years.

[ALBliberal]

67. The double standard is appalling... And it was very difficult seeing it all unfold

[RandySF]

9. .

[MannyGoldstein]

11. Nothing says you have zero way to defend your position

better than idiotic crap like that.

[stonecutter357]

97. Flamebait is all you have...

[betsuni]

16. LOL. How many times do we have to see this bit of Fox News-style creative editing? nt

[Cheese Sandwich]

23. LOL it's really out of context huh? Care to explain in what context that comment isn't racist?

[betsuni]

25. This has been discussed all the times you have posted it before.

[Cheese Sandwich]

26. Come on now this is clearly like the most under-discussed quote of the primary campaign

"If that is your position then I will talk only to white people" - Hillary Clinton

We haven't really talked about it that much.

[dreamnightwind]

32. 100% agree

In a more just world, it would have completely dominated this board, and Democratic primary discourse in general, for months, especially given their attempts to discredit Bernie on this issue.

Thanks for being willing to get in the mud and dredge this one up. It's not petty, it's very important, and absolutely undercuts the social justice attacks on Sanders.

Also what undercuts them is in the same discussion, they start to talk about what POC need from government, and IIRC it's about policy, policies that Bernie has been behind all along, while the Clinton supporter had been telling us it is not about policy but it is about addressing racism, mostly through optics and speeches rather than policy.

Both are important, but optics and speeches are cheap, getting a genuine candidate who will fight for policy change is the far more important component. Its a tired old game to give the people words and optics while not going to bat for them on policy.

[Cheese Sandwich]

38. Yes exactly.

It should have been a topic of discussion at some point.

The media selects and chooses which stories are repeated. Bernie's BLM encouter? Huge news on a repeat cycle. Hillary's? Nuthin.

[artislife]

29. Discussed, but not defended. nt

[Bonobo]

73. In an environment of "Why did he leave EARLY!?!", this is definitely under-discussed.

I don't know how they do it.

[BeanMusical]

77. +1

[senz]

17. Whoa. Looks like we hit a sore spot!

[Yorktown]

18. HRC is making a rhetorical point, and she guy she's talking to understood it as such

Not much to see here.

[Cheese Sandwich]

24. Thanks for defending it. You don't see a problem with it. OK

[mhatrw]

110. It was a threat. If not, could you explain to us the "rhetorical point"

Clinton was making?

[Yorktown]

125. Yes, I can

What she was saying in essence was:
"If you adopt positions that are too rigid, you make it difficult to find a common solution".

But sentences can be interpreted according to one's outlook on the speaker:
people who read this sentence as offensive probably already have an anti HRC bias.

And, frankly, seeing the dismal Republican line-up, the only way to lose this election is by having Democrats taking potshots at HRC before the election.

Because Biden could have been the candidate, but -for better of for worse- Bernie just won't happen.

[mhatrw]

126. If we are worried only about beating Republicans, Clinton would sadly

gain more racist crossover appeal by keeping her promise to talk only to white people.

Personally, I am more worried about achieving social and economic justice than I am about appealing to the Faux News brainwashed.

[Yorktown]

127. HRC did not 'promise' to talk only to white people

As I said, it was -in my view- a rhetorical device.

And I repeat, the best judge of that was the black guy she was talking to.

From his reaction, it seems obvious he read her sentence the way I did.

[Chitown Kev]

19. FTR, I do think that Hillary was throwing a bit of shade in this specific instance. BUT...

white people do tend to not be as dismissive of other white people when said white person talks about racism.

White people tend to be dismissive of POC that talk about racism. They tend to view white people as being more "objective."

I pointed to another example where Hillary actually did an exemplary job of explaining racism to white people.

[mhatrw]

115. If Hillary were a Sanders supporter who said those exact same words in DU's AA forum,

in the exact same context, what do you think the reaction would have been?

[mythology]

20. Because having your previous post on this exact same subject locked wasn't enough?

I'm not sure what I would find more sad. If you actually aren't capable of realizing that the quote you're using was in response to the claim that black people have no agency in preventing violence against blacks, or if you think this clumsy attempt to stir up shit will help whoever your preferred candidate is.

But hey at least you learned from your first locked post on this subject to drop the direct accusations that Hillary Clinton said the most racist, white supremacist thing ever said by a Democratic primary candidate. I would point out that George Wallace an overt racist has run for the nomination in the past. I don't point this out for your sake, but for the sake of other people who might read your post and want to have some legitimate context for how silly your claim is.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251725946

[Cheese Sandwich]

30. Thank you

I forgot about that Wallace dude. A bit before my time, but I did hear about it in school.

Thanks for defending the comment. I appreciate your efforts. It's nice you had to go all the way back to 1972 to find a more racist comment from a Democratic primary candidate.

[oasis]

99. Only in your extremely biased opinion is it racist.

That's why the months old incident was allowed to shrivel on the vine. No amount of watering by fake outrage will be sufficient to revive it.

[Agschmid]

31. Not locked... hidden 6-1.

This is just another flamebait OP.

[mhatrw]

118. Yes, Hillary > George Wallace

for sure

[shenmue]

21. Hello, Flamebait: Primaries!

[John Poet]

22. It makes sense in the context of her 2008 arguments about

the importance of the white vote to a Democratic presidential candidate:

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/05/08/clinton-touts-white-support/?_r=1

Clinton Touts White Support

As if the divisions between race and gender in the Democratic Party hadn’t been further exposed through Tuesday night’s exit polls — and by a very heated exchange on CNN between Donna Brazile and Paul Begala — Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton’s interview with USA Today on Wednesday is further mining those tense depths.


“I have a much broader base to build a winning coalition on,” she said in the interview, citing an article by The Associated Press.

It “found how Senator Obama’s support among working, hard-working Americans, white Americans, is weakening again, and how whites in both states who had not completed college were supporting me.”

“There’s a pattern emerging here,” she said.

While she said her remarks weren’t meant to be divisive, they’re already whipping around the Internet. “These are the people you have to win if you’re a Democrat in sufficient numbers to actually win the election. Everybody knows that,” she said in the interview. (Hint, hint, message to the superdelegates still undeclared.)

In Indiana alone, six in 10 white voters went for Mrs. Clinton, where she narrowly won the primary.

Bill Burton, a spokesman for the Obama campaign, told the newspaper that Mr. Obama had made inroads in Tuesday’s contests. And he added that her comments “are not true and frankly disappointing.”

On Tuesday night, we mentioned the dustup between two Democratic pundits, Ms. Brazile and Mr. Begala, who engaged in a prime-time debate about the coalitions being built by Mr. Obama or Mrs. Clinton. Mr. Begala, a Clinton supporter, said the party could not win in November with just “eggheads and African-Americans,” that the party could not ignore white middle-class voters. Ms. Brazile, who said she was not “undecided but undeclared” when it came to her choice for a candidate, shot back that Mr. Begala’s notions were dividing the party. (And that she’d chugged down many a beer with Joe and Jane “six-pack” in an effort to woo white voters.)

We’re revisiting their spirited exchange to demonstrate how divided party loyalists are right now.

[thesquanderer]

28. If your genuinely want to understand how this makes sense in context

just read the replies to the last time you posted this, at
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017300425

i.e. #s 32, 33, 35.

[Agschmid]

33. Actually the last time it was posted was this one...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251725946

[thesquanderer]

35. Oh, right, and that one.

I guess s/he figures the third time's the charm...

Fourth (at least) if you count posting the same video in the thread at http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251725457

[Agschmid]

36. The more a meme is duplicated the more it becomes "believed"...

If it's repeated over and over again, eventually people take it for "truth".

Luckily I don't believe everything I read on the internet.

[Fumesucker]

70. Indeed, I have heard that Bernie is a racist and a sexist many many times by now

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026737025

[sheshe2]

59. WTF!

This place has lost it's collective mind.

[Cheese Sandwich]

37. Thanks for your effort but I'm not buying it.

I think she meant it the way I understood it.

[brush]

45. You're full of it with this post. Just read post 35 from the last time you posted this dishonest . .

bit of editing. Here's the url of the last time you posted this.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017300425#post33

Read #35 if you want real context.

But you already know this don't you?

You're not helping Bernie with this deception.

[Agschmid]

48. He's not helping himself either.

[JustAnotherGen]

94. Good job with this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017300425#post33

[ucrdem]

39. It doesn't mean anything and I was on the jury that hid it an hour ago.

You're not winning any points with this thing. First off it's clear from the title image that she's flustered and apparently she phrased something badly. It happens. I'd self delete because this looks like bad-faith RW spam.

[Cheese Sandwich]

42. At least you're not defending Mrs. Clinton's vile comment. Thank you for that.

[ALBliberal]

47. but when Bernie was surprise confronted and probably flustered he was criticized for standing

quietly by and yielding the mic. I just don't get how Hillary's response is not only a nonissue but it also is closed for discussion.

[BeanMusical]

81. +1

[blm]

103. From the posting record I'd say there's no good faith involved here, at all.

.

[Cheese Sandwich]

43. You can't say that.

[BeanMusical]

51. Yikes! I'm speechless.

[delrem]

49. This is controversial only because "Bernie Supporters (tm)" have been called out on race.

And have been continuously called out on race, with an accelerant put on that fire in the past few days.
In this circumstance, Cheese Sandwich's OP is just a rhetorical interjection.

A "wtf? *you* are accusing *us*?"{

[jfern]

50. And she said "All Lives Matter" in a black church

[bravenak]

54. Yes

[BeanMusical]

56. Nice personal attack.

Why don't you use the same words than you did at that toxic site? Remember what you said about "BernieBaggers" being as dumb as a brick and twice as thick?

[NanceGreggs]

57. Yes, I certainly said that.

And I certainly remember it.

And this OP is exactly the kind of thing that prompted the statement.

[BeanMusical]

61. So you admit that your reply to the OP was a personal attack then.

Thank you for your honesty.

[BeanMusical]

65. "And this OP is exactly the kind of thing that prompted the statement."

Bernie-baggers, that's so sweet. And now you called me an imbecile too, you really can't help yourself now can you?

[lovemydog]

82. Well, I'm not calling you or anyone an imbecile, BeanMusical.

But I think it's imbecilic to take an abbreviated clip out of context and then keep running with it despite having the longer clip available. Reminds me of that O'Keefe guy the right uses to 'punk' planned parenthood or acorn.

[betsuni]

60. Another yes.

[Ino]

53. It was sarcastic & mocking...

After interrupting him, she says, "Respectfully..." in a sarcastic tone, mocking the man's words. The pointing. The petulance.

And this is after she KNEW she'd be meeting with them at some point. This was no combative, confrontative ambush.

The queen was not amused nonetheless.

Really, this makes me ill.

[lovemydog]

69. So far, you've gotten a number of explanations.

You've responded to each with something along the lines of 'thank you for defending the indefensible.'

I think the best explanations so far are that 1) it's taken wildly out of context, 2) if you look at the longer clip she's making a rhetorical point, 3) it's not her best moment, 4) the person she was talking with, if you look at the whole clip, did not appear offended because he understood she was making a rhetorical point, 5) your question has been asked and answered on other threads, links provided in other posts here which you ignore.

These are not defenses, to me. They are explanations. It's pretty silly to use such a small clip and take it out of context.

I'm leaning toward Sanders. You're not doing him or yourself any favors by ignoring or insulting those who are trying to give you explanations.

[betsuni]

83. It's a game, though.

Post something you know is wrong, get a lot of comments from people who don't bother to check (or don't care it's wrong), cheering you on, and people who do check and will correct you. Lots of attention. Just say anything to the correctors, doesn't matter, but pretend you don't understand and try to make them angry so they'll post more. Then complain in another post about how mean and horrible the other side is. Repeat.

[lovemydog]

84. Yes, I agree betsuni.

That's the only rational explanation when some keep repeating stuff long after people have given reasonable explanations. I've also seen this with the 'President Obama said he's a moderate republican' nonsense. I've seen that entire clip. He was answering a question that was criticizing him for being too liberal and he was saying that what he was proposing was something that republicans a few years ago would have endorsed. But that now they've gone more right wing just to thwart his proposals. A nuanced and intelligent response to try and push his policy. Not a gotcha moment of 'Hey, I'm a republican!' that many who repeat that keep implying.

[betsuni]

85. I'm beginning to wonder if some of it is the way people's brains work.

I can hear/read Hillary's words or, in the example you gave, Obama's words, and easily understand the forest. But I've known a few people whose thinking is extremely literal and rigid and it's difficult for them to see the forest for the trees. To understand nuance and meaning beyond the literal words themselves. I do wonder.

[lovemydog]

89. Interesting. You may be on to something there.

Also I think some people have others on ignore. So they may not read nuanced responses. In some instances I think there is trolling intended to divide leftists and democrats from one another.

[olddots]

75. I guess I don't see things the way Hillary does

or a republican does .

[joshcryer]

78. This thread has some fascinating hides.

[SunSeeker]

80. She's not saying what you're implying she's saying.

As a fellow Bernie supporter in the prior time you posted this explained to you:

Your comment ignores even the additional context we can actually see in the video (putting aside that we don't even have the context for the clip as a whole). But even just within the clip, we can tell that she's not saying what you're implying she's saying.

The person says: "This is, and has always been, a white problem of violence. There's not much that we can do to stop the violence against us." (Inferring a larger greater context, this probably equates to something like "You're suggesting the black community do something here, but it's out of our control, it's the white community that must change its behavior.&quot

Her answer: "If that is your position, than I will talk only to white people about how we are going to deal with the very real problems..." (Which I would similarly restate as, "If you're telling me that there's no point in my talking to the black community about this, and you don't want to listen to me, then I guess I'll only talk to the white people about it.&quot

The first person understands the rhetoric she is using, that she is suggesting that this is HIS idea, i.e. that such a move (only talking to white people about it) would logically follow from his premise, and he comes back with "That's not what I mean." He is participating in the conversation and has the full context, and he gets it.

I guess I'd also suggest that "that's not what I mean" is not a reasonable comeback to a racist comment. But it's a reasonable comeback to what she said.

I (and obviously many others here) see your post as an unfair hit job. There are many things about HRC that I think one can legitimately take issue with. This isn't one of them.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017300425

African Americans overwhelmingly support Hillary, despite bullshit like this OP being thrown around about Hillary.

[MrWendel]

86. WOW...

This OP stinks of desperation. Its sad really.

[SunSeeker]

87. Yep. nt

[BeanMusical]

88. Welcome back!

[MrWendel]

104. Funny, I got "Welcome back Carter" theme stuck in my head. But thanks.

[BeanMusical]

122. Never heard of a show called "Welcome back Carter".

[MrWendel]

124. My parents show. "Kotter" my bad. Im sure there is a straight to dvd show/movie

for a dollar, that would prove me right.

[workinclasszero]

116. Pathetic

But I guess thats all Bernie's got.

The magic internets polls aren't working out very well

[mhatrw]

120. So she purposefully misunderstood what the black man was saying

and threatened to speak only to white people about racial issues from now on in order to "make a point"?

What again was the exact point she was trying to make?

I don't get it.

[SunSeeker]

121. No, it is the OP that is purposely misunderstanding. nt

[Lil Missy]

90. You didn't provide enough of the conversation to determine "the context" in which it was spoken.

Makes it look like you have something to hide. Worthy of Fox News.

[riversedge]

92. I found post #34 from a Sanders supporter to be helpful in breading down this smear from the OP

[NaturalHigh]

95. Meh. If this is the best you can do to attack Clinton...

I'm going back to the kitten posts.

[sufrommich]

98. It's funny that only white Sanders supporters take that

quote out of context.

[Orrex]

105. BOOM.

[Agschmid]

112. Yup.

[Historic NY]

107. Did I header BS mention BLM the other night in Iowa?

[stillwaiting]

108. I don't understand why this didn't become a huge problem for Hillary.

I really don't.

It's shocking and unbelievable to me.

[George II]

109. Well, even you admit that the 27 second clip was taken out of context. Thank you.

[NCTraveler]

111. Not your first go around.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017300425

Even many Sanders supporters don't appreciate what you are doing here. When that happens on either side, you know it is really a fucked up thought process you are promoting.

[Agschmid]

114. If at first you don't succeed...

[randome]

123. How else would one speak to someone with Stockholm Syndrome?

Sheesh.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]"The whole world is a circus if you know how to look at it."
Tony Randall, 7 Faces of Dr. Lao (1964)[/center][/font][hr]

[Cheese Sandwich]

130. Is this still active?