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Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:31 AM

 

Bernie Sanders is too extreme for America

178 replies, 15991 views

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Arrow 178 replies Author Time Post
Reply Bernie Sanders is too extreme for America (Original post)
Scuba Dec 2015 OP
99Forever Dec 2015 #1
daleanime Dec 2015 #12
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #38
99Forever Dec 2015 #41
JRLeft Dec 2015 #46
kath Jan 2016 #175
JRLeft Jan 2016 #178
Karma13612 Dec 2015 #71
navarth Dec 2015 #87
Docreed2003 Dec 2015 #105
INdemo Dec 2015 #42
TDale313 Dec 2015 #51
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #55
TryLogic Dec 2015 #56
Roy Ellefson Dec 2015 #60
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #66
Roy Ellefson Dec 2015 #69
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #76
kristopher Dec 2015 #117
ladjf Dec 2015 #127
randys1 Jan 2016 #176
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #136
CorporatistNation Dec 2015 #96
Volaris Dec 2015 #109
bvf Dec 2015 #92
randys1 Jan 2016 #177
floriduck Dec 2015 #95
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #154
John Poet Dec 2015 #100
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #155
Bradical79 Dec 2015 #110
corkhead Dec 2015 #119
tularetom Dec 2015 #151
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #57
cascadiance Dec 2015 #62
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #63
cascadiance Dec 2015 #65
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #68
cascadiance Dec 2015 #97
boobooday Dec 2015 #121
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #135
cascadiance Dec 2015 #149
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #153
cascadiance Jan 2016 #159
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #162
cascadiance Jan 2016 #169
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #77
madokie Dec 2015 #91
redstateblues Dec 2015 #103
madokie Dec 2015 #107
redstateblues Dec 2015 #131
cascadiance Dec 2015 #150
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #138
cascadiance Dec 2015 #148
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #165
99Forever Dec 2015 #72
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #75
99Forever Dec 2015 #80
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #84
99Forever Dec 2015 #86
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #168
c588415 Dec 2015 #74
ChiciB1 Dec 2015 #93
Art_from_Ark Jan 2016 #157
ChiciB1 Jan 2016 #160
Art_from_Ark Jan 2016 #161
ChiciB1 Jan 2016 #170
Art_from_Ark Jan 2016 #174
sammythecat Dec 2015 #94
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #137
sammythecat Dec 2015 #147
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #164
Orsino Jan 2016 #163
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #166
firebrand80 Dec 2015 #2
Dawgs Dec 2015 #3
firebrand80 Dec 2015 #4
Dawgs Dec 2015 #5
firebrand80 Dec 2015 #6
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #14
geardaddy Dec 2015 #16
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #19
geardaddy Dec 2015 #21
ChairmanAgnostic Dec 2015 #35
davidpdx Dec 2015 #104
ChairmanAgnostic Dec 2015 #143
geardaddy Dec 2015 #146
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #39
ybbor Dec 2015 #47
RBInMaine Dec 2015 #48
Eleanors38 Dec 2015 #52
cascadiance Jan 2016 #171
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #134
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #111
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #133
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #139
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #140
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #142
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #144
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #145
tazkcmo Dec 2015 #122
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #132
Art_from_Ark Jan 2016 #158
lewebley3 Jan 2016 #167
Akamai Dec 2015 #54
Fuddnik Dec 2015 #20
TryLogic Dec 2015 #58
litlbilly Dec 2015 #7
Old Codger Dec 2015 #8
KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #10
RBInMaine Dec 2015 #49
Old Codger Dec 2015 #50
LiberalLovinLug Dec 2015 #78
lewebley3 Dec 2015 #40
Roy Ellefson Dec 2015 #61
daleanime Dec 2015 #13
Duval Dec 2015 #36
KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #9
Dawgs Dec 2015 #17
stupidicus Dec 2015 #24
firebrand80 Dec 2015 #26
stupidicus Dec 2015 #28
ish of the hammer Dec 2015 #33
Armstead Dec 2015 #85
Attorney in Texas Dec 2015 #11
demwing Dec 2015 #18
Attorney in Texas Dec 2015 #30
demwing Dec 2015 #32
cascadiance Dec 2015 #64
reACTIONary Dec 2015 #59
LWolf Dec 2015 #15
Maedhros Dec 2015 #53
Enthusiast Dec 2015 #22
Feeling the Bern Dec 2015 #23
TIME TO PANIC Dec 2015 #25
stupidicus Dec 2015 #27
hedda_foil Dec 2015 #112
George II Dec 2015 #29
ish of the hammer Dec 2015 #34
George II Dec 2015 #45
ish of the hammer Dec 2015 #67
redstateblues Dec 2015 #102
ish of the hammer Dec 2015 #141
Scootaloo Dec 2015 #98
George II Dec 2015 #99
Scootaloo Dec 2015 #101
George II Dec 2015 #129
yurbud Jan 2016 #152
PowerToThePeople Dec 2015 #31
wial Dec 2015 #37
A Simple Game Dec 2015 #44
Helen Borg Dec 2015 #43
Doctor_J Dec 2015 #70
bvf Dec 2015 #90
kenfrequed Dec 2015 #130
nilram Dec 2015 #73
deutsey Dec 2015 #79
valerief Dec 2015 #81
orpupilofnature57 Dec 2015 #82
WillyT Dec 2015 #83
polichick Dec 2015 #88
Uncle Joe Dec 2015 #89
davidpdx Dec 2015 #106
Douglas Carpenter Dec 2015 #108
merrily Dec 2015 #113
jamzrockz Dec 2015 #114
newthinking Dec 2015 #118
jamzrockz Dec 2015 #123
DhhD Dec 2015 #125
jamzrockz Dec 2015 #128
cascadiance Jan 2016 #172
SacProgressive Dec 2015 #115
Betty Karlson Dec 2015 #116
raouldukelives Dec 2015 #120
Vinca Dec 2015 #124
ladjf Dec 2015 #126
Hekate Jan 2016 #156
cascadiance Jan 2016 #173

Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:33 AM

1. My kind of extreme.

Extremely Democratic.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:36 PM

12. +1

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 02:33 PM

38. Sanders is not a Dem: He will considered commie by the GOP

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 02:40 PM

41. I don't give a fuck what Teapublicans think or say. period

Nor do I care whether you consider him a Democrat. Both are irrelevant.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #41)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 03:40 PM

46. That poster is suspect, and comes off as a republican.

 

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Response to JRLeft (Reply #46)

Wed Jan 6, 2016, 12:53 PM

175. Quite.

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Response to kath (Reply #175)

Wed Jan 6, 2016, 04:02 PM

178. I'm convinced the poster is a troll.

 

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #41)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:03 PM

71. +1000

I usually dislike posts with the "F" word, but my gosh your comment is spot on!!!!!!!!

Let the "F's" fly!

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #41)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:53 PM

87. guys you shouldn't feed trolls

they just come back for more.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #41)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:27 AM

105. I may be letting my navy vet flag fly....

But, contrary to others concerns, I love a well placed F-bomb! Excellent post!

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 02:57 PM

42. That is your opinion

and its your way of trashing Sanders.
And you are wong.
...

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 04:21 PM

51. We should let them pick our nominee why now?

As for the red baiting, puhlease. They've been calling center-right Obama a socialist and a commie for nearly a decade. Time for some new material.

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Response to TDale313 (Reply #51)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 05:22 PM

55. Picking Sanders is like picking McGvoern: a 49 state loss: McGovern was

 



a nice guy too! but a loser

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #55)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 05:31 PM

56. Different person, different personality, different communicator, different time.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #55)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:03 PM

60. a horrible comparison

 

first, war hero American patriot George McGovern was not a loser. Second...using the 1972 election as some "lesson" on the impossibility of American's electing a liberal is a bad "lesson"...in 1972 no one was going to beat Tricky Dick...as much as we hate to admit it Dick was a popular president until Watergate finally brought him down.

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Response to Roy Ellefson (Reply #60)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:31 PM

66. Just the truth: McGovern was even more accomplished then Sanders

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #66)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:41 PM

69. not even close to the truth

 

the truth is that McGovern was not rejected because of his "leftism" he lost because the sociopath, "Tricky Dick", who I might add was in many ways more liberal than HRC, was a popular sitting president.

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Response to Roy Ellefson (Reply #69)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:36 PM

76. No: he was not right for most American's: like Sander left winger is not right

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #76)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 05:26 AM

117. I think you missed something important.

The facts.

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Response to kristopher (Reply #117)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 09:18 AM

127. You are, and have been for years, one of the best "posters" on the DU.

Thanks for continuing to share your cogent thoughts with us.


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Response to Roy Ellefson (Reply #69)

Wed Jan 6, 2016, 01:00 PM

176. Tricky Dick dedicated his life to help Women? He was a pro Gay rights and pro minority

rights person?

Wow, news to me.

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Response to Roy Ellefson (Reply #60)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:22 AM

136. True comparison: Dems have learned from their mistakes: Hillary is ready

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #55)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 10:37 PM

96. A Different Time Today... Different Result! Watch Iowa And NH... fer Starters...

People R FED UP WITH THE STATUS QUO! Bernie will triumph...

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Response to TDale313 (Reply #51)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 01:13 AM

109. And here's the other thing about that

This is the first generation in America born completely AFTER the collapse of the Soviet Union.
Meaning Red-baiting isn't going to work anymore, as these new, younger fish grew up on a very different diet.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 09:26 PM

92. And how will Clinton be considered

 

by the same GOP?

Quite acceptable to many. Others will force their way out of their deathbeds to vote against her.

It's a win-win for them.

Alert me for saying so. I don't care.

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Response to bvf (Reply #92)

Wed Jan 6, 2016, 01:01 PM

177. So millions of new voters wont show up specifically to elect our first Woman prez?

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 10:10 PM

95. No, only Hill people

 

think like that. The GOP voters will view Bernie in a far better light than you people.

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Response to floriduck (Reply #95)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 01:46 PM

154. Sanders gave no supporting speeches to the Dem party until he want to run for President

 



I want a loyal tried and fight Dem like Hillary: not Sanders who
refused to join the DNC for years.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:08 AM

100. Anyone "considered a commie" by the GOP

 

is MY KIND OF GUY!

That's a Fucking RECOMMENDATION!!!!

It's a Goddamn ENDORSEMENT!!!

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Response to John Poet (Reply #100)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 05:41 PM

155. Its not Americas guy: Amercia's guy is middle of the road

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 01:46 AM

110. uh oh...

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 06:55 AM

119. And should Hillary win, she will be greeted with rose petals and chocolates by the repubs

good job catapulting the propaganda btw.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #38)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:46 PM

151. Are you really Yoda?

Because something like the way he talks your posts read.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 05:33 PM

57. Sanders is not a Dem: He is socialist: Americans reject him

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:18 PM

62. Name calling again without any depth of reasoning beyond that again... Desperation shows!!!

 

You can't give reasoning behind why him being a "socialist" is bad.

Yeah, you follow Rush Limbaugh well with this equivalent calls of trying to call us all things like "liberal", "feminazis", etc. to try and do the same thing as if they were curse words because he's unable to provide any more depth to his comments either.

If this game keeps being played, it is just a matter of time that people learn that most of the Koch funded corporate parties are being funded by money made largely from that COMMIE Stalin. I wonder if Americans would prefer commies to socialists? Might want to ask that question to make sure. Or are you afraid. Or are you also afraid to note that the DLC which was where Third Way people originated from, etc. was also funded by the Kochs.

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #62)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:26 PM

63. Its not a name its what he has called himself for 72 years: just a fact

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #63)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:30 PM

65. He's been doing more than just calling himself names for his career...

 

But you seem incapable of seeing anything more than that or how he's manifested socialist POLICY with his ACTIONS and LEGISLATION that he's been consistently working for the AMERICAN PEOPLE (not corporate people BTW) over that time.

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #65)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:34 PM

68. He loved the name: until he decide he wanted to the Dem nominee

 

Last edited Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:18 AM - Edit history (1)


He was always too good for poor De m's: he like is rich socialist
gun toting white state.

Sorry: the socialist name was his pride: not being a Democrat

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #68)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:38 PM

97. Rich socialist term is an oxymoron, which appears to reflect your FLAWED thinking....

 

It is other candidates that more represent the wealthy who PAY them to represent them, where he pushes PAC money away.

I guess this is part of the campaign messaging to try to put out disinformation against those in areas you are WEAKEST at.

What made FDR a popular Democrat was his strong socialist philosophy policies that got him reelected four times. I think Sanders stands strongest in reflecting FDR's policies than any other pol running. if you think differently, I challenge you on specific policies you think Clinton does better a which stand up for the working class of Americans. I think that has Sanders representing the best Democratic Party policies of any candidate whether or not he's a Democratic Party member or not.

For voters it is what politicians DO and not what they label themselves which is more important to them.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #68)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 07:41 AM

121. He has not turned his back on the name, but you're getting it wrong

He is a DEMOCRATIC SOCIALIST which means that government works for the people, in a way VOTED UPON by the people, just like we are going to vote him into the presidency.

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Response to boobooday (Reply #121)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:20 AM

135. Democratic Party means the government works for people: not socialist

 



It was Sanders choice: He honeymooned in Russia: he
believes in socialism.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #135)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:10 PM

149. You just showed that you really don't understand the real meaning of socialism...

 

Just the label association that the right wing tries to make it with a dictatorial system in the Soviet Union, which is NOT what is being practiced in places like Sweden now, which is socialism that the people vote to put in place to work for them and not rich bastards. Apparently you don't seem to care that we put in a system that works more for people.

The Koch brothers who helped start the DLC/Third Way movement have MORE in common with communist dictators like Stalin than Bernie did when their financial empire was largely built on Stalin's money through Fred Koch's business dealings with him earlier. Bernie believes in a government system not run by the empires of 1%ers like the Kochs or Stalin. Apparently corporate Dems don't seem to care about that much, which likely would have been to FDR's chagrin if he were alive today who didn't like economic royalists such as these.

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #149)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 01:44 PM

153. Yes, I do, and so do most American know the meaning of socialism

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #153)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 06:56 PM

159. If they do, then what is about it that they will vote against in your opinion...

 

WHY is it bad for America. And not the BS that you seem to want to echo from the Republican Party that FALSELY claims it to be like the dictatorial system that the Soviet Union had a while back, which I'll say again, has more in common with the source of the funding that Republicans and corporatist candidates get from the Koch family than what Bernie believes should be put in place to rescue this country in much the same way that FDR and others in the past did when they had traditional Democratic Party views that reflected the views and interests far more of the American people than the economic royalists they worked against then and who have bought control of our government and media today.

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #159)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 01:33 PM

162. I guess all American's are dumb or elites that reject Sanders

 

Last edited Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:17 PM - Edit history (1)



You want a pass on Sanders calling himself a socialist, I
am sorry: Democrat on workers not freeloaders.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #162)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:13 PM

169. You still seem incapable of explaining WHY being a socialist is bad...

 

And your brief sentences don't even make grammatical sense. How old are you? Wonder if you are even voting age?

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #65)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:39 PM

77. The rest of time he was just a big talker: Let other people carry water

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #63)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 09:05 PM

91. The only place I've heard anyone mention Socialist

is here on DU and the MSM. No where else does anyone have a problem with his wanting to do what is right for the majority of Americans. Call it socialism or whatever but its what America wants to hear.

Bernie will be our next President, get used to it

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Response to madokie (Reply #91)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:24 AM

103. Bernice's socialist baggage

Would sink him in the GE. Polling shows a majority of Americans would not vote for a Socialist

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #103)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:35 AM

107. What ever you think

just go with it. Hillary Clinton will never get elected and you can bet on that so I guess by your estimation we're heading for a 'CON president

fuck that noise

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Response to madokie (Reply #107)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:59 AM

131. Get used to hearing

Madam President. She will crush Trump

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #103)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:15 PM

150. Desperate BS which is WRONG! Polls show Bernie does better in the General Election...

 

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/10/27/1440343/-The-Electability-Argument-Is-Dead-All-the-Polls-Show-Bernie-Does-Better-Against-GOP-Than-Hillary

So, either more Americans like socialists than either the GOP or Hillary, or your lines of Bernie being defined as a socialist being "baggage" for him "sinking" him is absolute BS (and that BS doesn't stand for Bernie Sanders)...

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #62)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:38 AM

138. Everyone knows what a socialist is: No depth of thinking is required

 


The nomination should go to a loyal Dem: I don't nowhere
you go the idea I follow Rush: I have voting record that
is 30 years long and my congress woman is Jan Jawski
that I knock on doors for. The Dem 's I work for and with
don't want Sanders they want a reliable Dem.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #138)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:04 PM

148. A loyal Dem (a TRADITIONAL values Dem) would embrace many aspects of socialist philosophy...

 

... that have been pushed in the past to work more for the people than the economic royalist elite. "Everyone" doesn't share your notion of what it means that you don't want to be more explicit about other than just making it a "name" that you fall into the right wing trap of saying it is more akin to an undemocratic system in the Soviet Union called communism.

Bernie's not advocating communism. Never has and never will in his embrace of DEMOCRATIC socialism.

What makes a "reliable Dem". Would you rather have voted for Strom Thurmond as a "loyal Democrat" when he was one over Bernie? If you say yes, then you expose yourself as being more for a label than on principles. If you say no, then you show a double standard if you won't vote for him as a "loyal democrat" but feel like you can't vote for Bernie who has more democratic principles than many so-called "Democrats" today.

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Response to cascadiance (Reply #62)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:00 PM

165. Its is not name calling: and the Depth has been Sanders career

 



until he turned 73, he also honeymooned in Russia:
I reject ideologues and so do most Americans

FDR was a tinker: he said would do what works

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:19 PM

72. Asked and answered.

And the answer hasn't changed.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #72)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:35 PM

75. Sanders own unforce er

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #75)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:45 PM

80. I have no idea what you are trying to say.

Nor do I care.

Ta ta.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #80)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:12 PM

84. Yes you do

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #84)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:27 PM

86. No sir, I actually don't.

You don't communicate very well. Perhaps English isn't your primary language. I really don't know or care. Whatever the reason, I have no desire to speak with you further.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #72)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:04 PM

168. Your rhetoric hasn't changed

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)


Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 09:48 PM

93. Ho Hum...

He's MUCH more of the kind of Democrat I've always supported. He's the kind of Democrat who represented the Democratic Party when I joined it many years ago! It seems that you joined the "new" kind of Democratic Party. Kind of DLC/Third Way one, which was formed around the time Bill Clinton got elected. There's A LOT of information about how it was formed back then if your interested in reading about it.

Not gonna fight with you about it, I'm sure I can't change your mind. Still I know the Democratic Party I joined thinks like Bernie and it's the reason I'm ecstatic he's running!

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Response to ChiciB1 (Reply #93)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 06:21 PM

157. Bernie reminds me a lot of Bobby Kennedy

and that's one reason I will enthusiastically cast my vote for him.

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Response to Art_from_Ark (Reply #157)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 08:46 PM

160. Oh, Bobby Kennedy... Memories Of My Broken Heart!

And I agreer with you. I cannot tell you how very devastated I was after he was shot. Yes, JFK's was terribly horrible, but it was Bobby's death that affected me in so many ways. I still remember him and remember a very broken heart!

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Response to ChiciB1 (Reply #160)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 09:35 PM

161. I do, too

Heck, I still can't listen to "Abraham, Martin and John" without breaking down by the time the song gets to "Has anybody here seen my friend Bobby..."

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Response to Art_from_Ark (Reply #161)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:14 PM

170. Oh, The Memories! What's Even Worse When Thinking

back about those times, I DID feel "we the people" felt we could actually have our voices heard by TPTB! Today, it's so out of control and when I look around I see so much lethargy! The CORPORATE media ONLY reports what they feel we should hear AND most of it depends on WHO you are!

I try so hard to make my fellow citizens aware of what has happened, but so much of the time the answer I get is "I don't talk about politics or religion!" Pretty sick AND IMO one of the main reason the SAME people keep getting re-elected over and over an!d over! I'm a Democrat, but when I see how Bernie is being victimized by THIS system it not only depresses me it makes my blood boil!

What the DNC is doing now is really unacceptable to me because anyone who's followed politics for as long as I have can clearly see they've "decided" that Hillary will be the nominee. Yes, she's quite capable and well informed, but for me she represents what we have now which is "more of the same" and I don't have much faith that much will change. I KNOW I'll have to vote for her because of the Supreme Court situation, but unfortunately that's the only plus she offers me.

I so WISH I felt differently, but having been part of the REVOLUTION of "my generation" it's hard for me to accept what I can only call the "dumbing down" of this country. I honestly know people who DON'T know that we have 3 branches of government or that journalists were once known as The Fourth Estate!

Oh, I need to stop. I get carried away. Yes, the past was chaotic and there was much upheaval, but at least I felt I was part of helping to fix it.

PERHAPS we've come to a cross road at this point in time and people are waking up. WE MUST stop this GREED!

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Response to ChiciB1 (Reply #170)

Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:58 AM

174. Great post!

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 09:52 PM

94. I don't give a fuck

I don't buy into "My country, right or wrong" bullshit. Call him anything you want. I'm voting for him.

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Response to sammythecat (Reply #94)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:33 AM

137. Vulgarism makes you look like a limited thinker: You statment looks

 



sound small

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #137)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 06:54 PM

147. Oh. I'm disappointed.

I'd hoped my vulgarity would convince you to switch allegiance.

By the way, Bernie Sanders is running for President as a Democrat. In fact, he embodies and espouses the ideals of the Democratic Party far more than any other candidate in our lifetime. Far more, but carry on with your attempt to portray Bernie Sanders as some sort of phony impostor even though it's lame and sounds desperate.

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Response to sammythecat (Reply #94)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 01:57 PM

164. Neither do most American's: That is why most Americans a Dem

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 01:52 PM

163. Holy shit; you're right!

Just look at those Americans rejecting him: https://www.google.com/search?q=sanders+rally

They are literally trying to crowd him out of every venue he tries to speak in.

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Response to Orsino (Reply #163)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:01 PM

166. Same as Trump

 

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:35 AM

2. This is nothing new

We've known for years that an overwhelming number of Americans support liberal policies when you ask them about them in the abstract.

However, we also know that Presidential candidates that deviate too far from the political "center" don't do well.

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:39 AM

3. Wrong. We have no idea how a far left liberal will do if elected President.

 

We haven't had one since the 40's and he was only elected four times.

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Response to Dawgs (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:42 AM

4. That's kinda my point

Far left candidates don't usually win the nomination, and when they have, they get plastered in the GE.

That's why we haven't had one in decades.

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:44 AM

5. When was the last time a far left candidate got plastered in the GE?

 

And FYI, things change over time. They don't always stay the same.

Kind of like a black guy with a Muslim sounding name becoming President. Remember him?

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Response to Dawgs (Reply #5)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:53 AM

6. Mondale, then Dukakis

Candidates like Kucinich have barely gotten off the ground since then.

Things certainly do change over time, and where the political "center" lies is a moving target. Bernie is actually good evidence of that, he's not really different from Kucinich, yet he's doing far better.

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #6)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:40 PM

14. Neither Mondale nor Dukakis were left liberals. That's a smear with no basis in reality.

Mondale was a former VP running against the popular incumbent Reagan. Dukakis was portrayed as a technocrat. The GHWB campaign smeared him with Willy Horton, but mostly, he was a lackluster candidate .... even more so than Bush.

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #14)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:57 PM

16. Nixon? I think you mean Reagan

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Response to geardaddy (Reply #16)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:02 PM

19. Thanks. You're right of course. Correcting it now.

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #19)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:04 PM

21. You're welcome

For a minute I had to check my memory.

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Response to geardaddy (Reply #21)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:44 PM

35. BY today's standards, Nixon would be a flaming liberal

tossed out of the GOP.

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Response to ChairmanAgnostic (Reply #35)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:25 AM

104. So would Eisenhower and Teddy Roosevelt

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Response to davidpdx (Reply #104)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:21 PM

143. True

Ike actually was a decent administrator, and was aware of the fragile peace around the world.
Teddy? we were lucky to have him as president.

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Response to ChairmanAgnostic (Reply #35)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 03:19 PM

146. Yup.

Totally agree.

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #14)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 02:35 PM

39. Mondale, Dukakis , Nader, and Sanders are same: The Clintons know how to win

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #39)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 03:51 PM

47. Bill Clinton benefitted from Perot in both elections

He won with only 43% in 1992, and 49% in 1996. Neither victory was a majority victory. Mind you I voted for him both times but Perot took more votes from Bush Sr. And Dole, than from Clinton.

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Response to ybbor (Reply #47)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 04:08 PM

48. Bullshit. Clinton would have won if they were two-person races. No question.

 

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Response to RBInMaine (Reply #48)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 04:41 PM

52. This argument has "that giant sucking sound."

 

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Response to RBInMaine (Reply #48)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 03:12 PM

171. Nope! It would have depended on where the anti-NAFTA voters went then...

 

They could have gone to Bush or stayed home too.

Many in this election who have that sentiment might vote Republican if anti-TPP and anti H-1B candidate gets nominated by the Republicans such as Trump. Hillary might have a shot at those voters if GOP nominates Rubio, but even Cruz is lining up against H-1B and potentially against free trade agreements too. They won't be able to use these issues against Bernie to get votes like they can against the Clinton family who has been pro-free trade and pro indentured servant program "guest worker" programs too.

The Eighteen percent that went to Perot is no small group of voters, and that group would largely favor Bernie today over Clinton.

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Response to ybbor (Reply #47)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:17 AM

134. But: Bill won twice: and he benefitted by great team work with DNC

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #39)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 01:47 AM

111. Stuff and nonsense. Bill won in '92 with far less than a majority because Perot siphoned votes ...

The R vote was repressed due to GHWB going back on his no new taxes pledge along with a recession. Perot took more votes from Bush than from Clinton. Bill won but didn't come near a major of the popular vote. Dole was a terrible candidate in '96. He showed less fire than Dukakis and Bill was a good campaigner and fundrai$er.

Hilary lost her nomination in '08, despite entering the race as the odds on favorite.

They don't have such a superlative win/loss record.

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #111)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:16 AM

133. But Bill did win: and he was considered too left wing: too liberal

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #133)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:44 AM

139. No. That was a Gingrich meme. It had nothing to do with Dems and Dem leaners

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #139)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:47 AM

140. Yes, it does: its a reality the Sanders people like the Mcgoven supporters

 



fail to face.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #140)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:54 AM

142. Try looking a little deeper than these superficial memes.

You're repeating highly superficial analysis from 20+ years ago. Broad brushed at the time, nonsensical today. Simply repeating them has nothing to do with reality then or now. It's no more than yelling neener, neener, neener while sticking fingers in ears.

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #142)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 01:02 PM

144. No superficiallly at all: its History: The Clintons learned and Dems won

 



Left wing of Dem's always put nice guy losers

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #144)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 02:33 PM

145. The polite term for the type of behavior in which you are indulging is propaganda.

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #39)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 07:59 AM

122. How many elections has HRC won?

And you don't get to count the reserved Senate seat of NY. Even if you do count it, it's only 2.

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Response to tazkcmo (Reply #122)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:15 AM

132. Hillary has never been beat by the GOP

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #132)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 06:24 PM

158. She's only run for office against Republicans twice

and in a heavily Democratic state at that.

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Response to Art_from_Ark (Reply #158)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 02:04 PM

167. The Clintons won in red state: As Dem's

 

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Response to hedda_foil (Reply #14)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 05:18 PM

54. I like Dukakis, but he had little "fire in the belly"--certainly Bernie has a lot of that fire!

 

as Sen. Kerry said leading up to the 2004 elections, "These guys will tell any lies to win." Unfortunately, that was largely off-camera any never seem to repeated in public. Bernie has no problems exposing the harm done to people for being mistreated by her right-wingers, by the rich, by the unethical, etc. He clearly does have in enormous fire in his belly to do the right things.

It certainly reminds me of Sen. Paul Wellstone's saying, "If I am on fire, it's because I have icebergs of indifference to melt."

If people are pissed off, taking names and kicking but, they should get off the political platform.

Go Bernie!

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #6)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:04 PM

20. And the media so ignored Kucinich, most Americans have STILL never heard of him.

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Response to Fuddnik (Reply #20)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 05:35 PM

58. The media !!

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Response to Dawgs (Reply #5)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 11:56 AM

7. Bernie's policies are actually down the middle. Only Bill Oreily calls it far left

 

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Response to litlbilly (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:02 PM

8. And Hillary

 

Is so far right she would have been called a republican not that long ago... The left has come so far right that IKE would now be a Dem.

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Response to Old Codger (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:05 PM

10. Bernie's best laugh line was calling Ike a 'Socialist'. I'm sure even Ike

 

would have chuckled. Oh, wait, Marshall Zhukov remained close friends with Ike after he was eleced POTUS. Maybe Ike really was a closet Commie?

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Response to Old Codger (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 04:09 PM

49. Total and complete BULLSHIT. This is mega-left non-reality.

 

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Response to RBInMaine (Reply #49)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 04:15 PM

50. Maybe

 

In your world

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Response to RBInMaine (Reply #49)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:40 PM

78. wow, you are sure living in a bubble

For about 2 decades.

Ike who warned about the growing MIC would be destroyed on Fox News, Rush, and the GOP.

From his 1956 platform:
"We are proud of and shall continue our far-reaching and sound advances in matters of basic human needs—expansion of social security—broadened coverage in unemployment insurance —improved housing—and better health protection for all our people. We are determined that our government remain warmly responsive to the urgent social and economic problems of our people."

read it all:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/10/14/1336619/-Eisenhower-a-Liberal


And Hillary, who is beholden to the top financial institutions including the ones that abused the system and nearly destroyed the economy. And who is a war hawk who criticized Obama for not invading Syria years ago and voted for the Iraq war. She is a Thatcher doppleganger in every way. She would have in fact been too radical a right winger for many, including Ike, back in the day.

THIS is reality. What world are you living in?

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Response to litlbilly (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 02:35 PM

40. No I am Dem: I call Sanders far left and many Dem's do

 

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Response to lewebley3 (Reply #40)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:06 PM

61. huh?

 

Sanders is not even close to far left...on economic issues he is a 1950's, 60's style Democrat.

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:40 PM

13. Which "Far left candiates" were "plastered in the GE"?

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:53 PM

36. We never had an African American elected either! And we need a Progressive like Sanders.

 

I do believe he can win.

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Response to Dawgs (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:03 PM

9. FDR was NOT a 'far-left liberal'. In 1932, he ran as a moderate. Actually, 'far-left

 

liberal' is something of a contradiction in terms. If Eugene Debs was far left, then FDR was left-leaning.

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Response to KingCharlemagne (Reply #9)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:58 PM

17. Uh, okay. n/t

 

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:06 PM

24. in other words, you can't really dispute the facts in the matter

 

just peddle the 3rdway BS like the polls showing Bernie prevailing over your rightwing cousins either don't exist or are clearly erroneous -- which you can't make a case for either

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Response to stupidicus (Reply #24)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:11 PM

26. I did what now? nt

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #26)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:15 PM

28. if plain and simple english is inadequate

 

then you'll have to find help elsewhere

I'm not gonna provide it

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:37 PM

33. the DLC was partially funded by the Koch brothers

so thanks for that picture to help remind us of that inconvenient truth.

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Response to firebrand80 (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:16 PM

85. The "center" is what the OP was all abiout

 

The DLC/Third Way crowd does not consider liberal policies the "center." Their center is to enable corporations and billionaires to keep their stranglehold on the economy and government. Anything to the left of that is "fringe."

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:17 PM

11. People want change. If the Republican nominee promises change and our nominee promises status quo,

we lose.

Look at the right-track/wrong-track polling:



Clinton is the "establishment" candidate. Of all the candidates in both parties, she is the one who represents the continue-down-this-same-track status quo.

If we nominate Clinton, we lose.

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Response to Attorney in Texas (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:01 PM

18. Yep, and I'm over and done with letting the Rightwingers own Populism

 

they didn't earn it, and don't deserve it

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Response to demwing (Reply #18)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:24 PM

30. Exactly! Rightwing populism beats centrist establishment corporatism but loses to real progressive

populism.

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Response to Attorney in Texas (Reply #30)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:33 PM

32. precisely, and this is why Hillary is a risky candidate

 

and Bernie is a solid bet

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Response to Attorney in Texas (Reply #30)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:29 PM

64. This was obvious at work with Rubio's comments on H-1B in the Republican debate...

 

... when he was criticizing Cruz for switching gears and now joining forces with others in congress to work AGAINST H-1B when he was against it before. Cruz is seeing Trump's stance against H-1B and is trying to get on that more Republican populist bandwagon, and Rubio felt threatened by that effort and called out Cruz on his hypocrisy there. Trump has his skeletons in trying to be a "populist" too, with his comments on the minimum wage that Bernie has taken him to task on.

The door is wide open on areas such as Free Trade, H-1B , and others that are part of fixing inequality, that he'll be the only pure candidate working for the people's interests, and by the positioning shown above, pressure is on the Republicans now to take populist positions too. Bernie will clearly have an advantage for the non-xenophobe Republican populists over all of the Republicans where Hillary is likely to lose to them on those issues.

Right wing press sites like Breitbart in some ways are even more vocal than progressive sites now on the effect on American jobs that guest worker programs and free trade agreements have on middle class Americans. It will be these areas that will be critical to win the election in 2016.

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Response to Attorney in Texas (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 05:49 PM

59. And yet...

.... Sanders is struggling to break 30 % in his own (adopted) party. If he is such an attractive candidate for the GE, you would think he would be doing a lot better in the primaries.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 12:42 PM

15. If the nation of voters

will vote for people who stand for them and what they want, instead of allowing themselves to be herded into line through fear and hate, we can achieve it all.

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Response to LWolf (Reply #15)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 04:47 PM

53. That was exceptionally well said. [n/t]

 

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:05 PM

22. Kicked and recommended to the Max!

Bernie isn't the extremist.

The extremists are the ones that want to preserve the status quo.

The status quo that has wrecked our democracy.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:06 PM

23. Imagine if the Democrats actually supported policies like this instead of branding itself

 

as Republican Lite and getting tepid centrists to run. . .we might have a super majority in both houses.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:10 PM

25. K & R !

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:12 PM

27. well, that rightwing/thirdwayer "this is a center/right country!" myth

 

is just one of many zombie lies those kissing cousins use to decieve, kinda like the "liberal" media myth who actually assist them in their deceptions when possible.

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Response to stupidicus (Reply #27)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 01:54 AM

112. The only kiss those cousins can give is the kiss of death.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:21 PM

29. Did "Progressive Change Institute" ask the same likely 2016 voters the same or similar questions...

...(I say "similar" because these questions obviously have been subjectively posed to those asked) about Clinton?

And are these the ONLY questions posed, or were there a lot more that aren't included on that chart?

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Response to George II (Reply #29)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:39 PM

34. Hillary:


Making sure women get a bigger piece of the middle-class pie that her neoliberal, DLC, pro-Wall Street, pro-Pentagon, pro-TPP, Republican-lite economic policies are designed to shrink. - expatjouro

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Response to ish of the hammer (Reply #34)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 03:31 PM

45. What does that have to do with my post? Did your stuff answer my questions?

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Response to George II (Reply #45)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:32 PM

67. I'm sorry I didn't make my post clearer-

I was actually commenting on your brush-off vid that H. Clinton is doing, at what I guess must be the Benghazi committee hearing.
Which reminds me-
What's the first thing you learn in Law School (even Liberty U.)?
never ask a question you don't already know the answer to.
so an entire committee full of lawyers and staff with assistant lawyers with months to prepare
9 hrs worth of questions and they ALL forgot the first thing taught in law school?
I don't know what's worse - to BELIEVE that it actually happened, or that it REALLY did happen!
either way, it says a lot about the level of governance in this good ole usa.
methinks you"re easily impressed- judging by your vid

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Response to ish of the hammer (Reply #34)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:21 AM

102. You left out several straw men

What about the third wayers,oligarchs, RINOs, corporatists. So many straw men so little time. It's good to play the victim

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #102)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 11:51 AM

141. the DLC was partially funded by the Koch Brothers -

the victim is democracy.

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Response to George II (Reply #29)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:00 AM

98. It appears the questions are about policy, not candidates.

 

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #98)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:06 AM

99. Here's the graphic again...look it over..

But you're right, the questions aren't about "candidates", but most certainly candidate:

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Response to George II (Reply #99)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:10 AM

101. "Do you support policy X" is not a question involving candidates.

 

I dunno why that notion confuses you so badly.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #101)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:00 AM

129. Confused? Me? Not a chance. But that chart doesn't say or ask....

....what you say it does.

Care to directly address my original comment?

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Response to George II (Reply #99)

Fri Jan 1, 2016, 02:13 PM

152. I'm linking to that graphic

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:25 PM

31. Only in the minds of right wingers

 

is he too extreme.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 02:22 PM

37. I was happy to see a right wing troll with bad grammar

out on youtube the other day, spouting lies about Sanders. If they're deploying forces like that, it means they're desperate. Sanders really does represent the mainstream. It's not a silent majority in America, it's a *silenced* majority, but Bernie gives us voice at long last!

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Response to wial (Reply #37)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 03:08 PM

44. There are a couple (at least) like that on DU, I wouldn't hide them if you paid me. n/t

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 03:00 PM

43. The extreme meme!

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 06:55 PM

70. Yes, but Hillary has an "Aura of competence"

 

I think this picture shows exactly why if Hillary becomes president, nothing of import will change, and the people at large will remain impoverished and very unhappy.

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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #70)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 09:00 PM

90. And a lot of people would settle for that,

 

including a lot of self-identified, capital-D democrats.

I have had an increasingly difficult time understanding many of those in my party over the last few years. A lot are too young to see how rightward the drift has taken us.

To them, it's a quadrennial wrestling match, the outcome of which is little more than that of a bar bet.

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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #70)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 10:12 AM

130. Huh...

Isn't that a third level sorceror spell?


No, seriously I think these kinds of vague descriptors used by the media and pundits to tout their preferred candidates are about the worst thing.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:29 PM

73. yah, boy, he's some kinda wakko.

Wanting stuff that most people want? Pfft, maybe if we ignore him he'll go away.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:43 PM

79. He's "too extreme" for the elites who believe they own America

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:51 PM

81. Looks like America is too extreme for TPTB. nt

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:52 PM

82. Too extreme for the same old same old, not for saving our Democracy from the 1% .

 

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 07:53 PM

83. HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!!

 


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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:58 PM

88. He's so extreme, there's a media black-out re Bernie so nobody will be hurt by him...

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:59 PM

89. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Scuba.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:27 AM

106. I'm stealing this to put on my Facebook page

Thank you for posting it. I was the 200th record!

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:56 AM

108. knr

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 02:02 AM

113. Despite the bs, America is a liberal nation. Let's talk polls:

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 02:03 AM

114. Iwon der if the people conducting these polls

 

are the same ones who told us that 90%+ of Americans support increased gun control after Sandy hook.

Also about the free public college ambition, I wonder why citizens who do not go to college themselves should be made to subsidize college education? I know the argument is that it benefits society but the same goes for just about everything most adults college grad and non college grad do for a living. So its either we subsidize everybody seeing as college students are not anymore special than people who go into trade

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Response to jamzrockz (Reply #114)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 06:23 AM

118. You obviously are not old enough to remember that we used to have a program of "almost free" college

throughout the nation.

State Universities were almost completely subsidized and most states' Jr. College were tuition free or nominal.

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Response to newthinking (Reply #118)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 08:11 AM

123. I am sure the situation is different now

 

America doesn't have the advantage it used to have then. Europe have completely recovered from the damages of WWII and Asia has emerged as a serious competitor. The only way we can dream of having free colleges again is with a massive increase in taxes which I can tell you nobody wants to do just for college students.

Even in the bad economy we have and massively inflated tuition costs, if you plan your college life well and study a degree with good job prospects you are not going to have problems paying back your student loans. Students just have to be starter and plan well before jumping into college.

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Response to jamzrockz (Reply #123)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 09:00 AM

125. The sales tax on Wall Street transactions that are sometime thousands per second are supported

by Democrats and Republicans but not the Third Way-Hillary Clinton.

jamzrockz,
I do not understand how the information about how easy it would be to make free tuition available again, has escaped so many Democrats. Even Republicans agree on reestablishing this sales tax that ended in 1966. Bernie Sanders is for reestablishing the tax. Clinton has a third way plan that lets Americans stay down when it is not necessary.
http://www.thenation.com/article/bernie-sanders-has-plan-tax-wall-street-and-make-college-free/


http://www.salon.com/2013/10/18/the_tax_that_could_save_america_from_wall_street_partner/
snip
Once upon a time, we had a financial transaction tax in America, and it served us well from 1914 to 1966. Wall Street leaders at the time complained bitterly that the tax would be ruinous, but if you stop and think about those years, you notice that the American economy was actually much healthier than it is today. Income inequality was much lower, and jobs were more secure. After the Wall Street crash of 1987, major politicians, including Senate Majority leader Bob Dole and President H.W. Bush, called for a return of the FTT. Since the Wall Street-driven crash of 2008, renewed support for the tax has surged from every direction — except, of course, from Wall Street and the politicians who rely on their donations.
more at link


http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/22/a-sales-tax-on-wall-street-transactions/?_r=0

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Response to DhhD (Reply #125)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 09:37 AM

128. I am not saying we shouldn't implement the

 

tax on high speed trading. My objection is using said money to fund free college tuition. I would prefer using any extra funds to shore up programs we already have now that people like, programs like SS and medicare so that they are still robust by the time I am old and ready to collect.

Actually, I really do not believe college education should be free. Its a program I would only support after all the debts have been paid off, SS and medicare are on solid foundation, the veterans are taken care off, maternity leave programs are funded, etc etc. Essentially, free college tuition is at the very bottom of my priority list if its there at all and I am not saying this because I had to pay for my college education myself.

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Response to jamzrockz (Reply #128)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 03:32 PM

172. You do know that the collective college debt recently became larger than collective credit card debt

 

The kids these days are having to deal with becoming indentured servants on a scale that many of them that graduated 10 years ago or earlier haven't had to deal with before. These kids deserve a break. I know that recently our state legislators here in Oregon have pushed through a program to make community college free for kids here starting in 2016. I've been very active in saying not only should future students get a break (since what they are doing is great for them!), but they also need to find a way to help even the playing field and help the younger generation that have already been put in huge debt through recent attendance of college relieve their huge lingering debts too. Especially I note since those who have been in the system the last four years are going to be newer voters in the coming 2016 election.

Why shouldn't those taxes be used to fund college tuition? Social Security and medicare (and I will be in those programs shortly now too) affect at the moment mainly older people. We should help them too, but that can be solved by removing the cap on payroll tax. College tuition and debt forgiveness could be fueled by speculative trading taxation. Wall Street trading should be rewarding companies that are good *investments* and not those that are the best fuel for casino gambling. It is the former kind of company that ultimately will hire these kids and turn them in to great parts of our economy instead of those in debt when they can't get jobs without education, and with the outsourcing of our jobs to other countries, or to "guest worker" programs like H-1B that basically fuel the economies of other countries when the money earned by those that get hired as cheaper labor instead send that money to other economies around the world instead of having that money spent here and fueling our economy here.

And the argument that those who aren't able to go to college funding this program they cannot participate in is also not inherently valid either, as that money could also go towards trade school education funding as well, for those that don't qualify for collegiate degrees. I believe Bernie has said as much at times when he's been asked about this.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 02:25 AM

115. They said the same about FDR and his policies

 

Look how that turned out...
#FeelTheBern!

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 03:45 AM

116. K&R for truth.

 

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 07:07 AM

120. K&R We live in the most reality Wall St shareholders will allow.

There are those who wish us all to live in reality and deal with our issues honestly and there are those who contribute to filling the coffers of those assuring nothing is changed and that no reality other than their own narratives is allowed.

Some take democracy, and the sacrifices of those who died face down in the mud for it, seriously. For everyone else, they take joy in dismantling those sacrifices one investment dollar at a time

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 08:31 AM

124. Unfortunately for us, some on the green side will vote Republican because

they either hate gay marriage, hate gays in general, hate black people, hate equality for women, hate Muslims/Buddhists/Jews/Sikhs/Wiccans/Etc. and love to practice gynecology as a hobby. They agree with what Bernie is offering, but only if all those other people don't get it.

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Thu Dec 31, 2015, 09:13 AM

126. Good post. nt

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Response to Scuba (Original post)

Mon Jan 4, 2016, 06:19 PM

156. No, he's not too extreme for America. He's just not a Democrat and is only one now that he needs...

...the infrastructure.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #156)

Tue Jan 5, 2016, 03:36 PM

173. Correction. He's one now because we don't have instant runoff voting to avoid the RIGGED system...

 

... that we have in place now where corporate and 1% money "buys the field" of the two parties that are the only valid choices to vote for in a general election if you don't want the "worst" of the top two parties to win. With instant runoff voting we wouldn't have to worry about that, and corporate money would have to worry about outside candidates coming in that have the right message about working for the people coming in to a race that they can't buy off.

Until we have that system (that is now in place in places like Australia), what Bernie is doing makes sense to avoid a Republican winning, NOT because he "needs the Democratic Party infrastructure" that you FALSELY infer!

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