2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forum99Forever
(14,524 posts)Extremely Democratic.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)Nor do I care whether you consider him a Democrat. Both are irrelevant.
JRLeft
(7,010 posts)JRLeft
(7,010 posts)Karma13612
(4,552 posts)I usually dislike posts with the "F" word, but my gosh your comment is spot on!!!!!!!!
Let the "F's" fly!
navarth
(5,927 posts)they just come back for more.
Docreed2003
(16,858 posts)But, contrary to others concerns, I love a well placed F-bomb! Excellent post!
INdemo
(6,994 posts)and its your way of trashing Sanders.
And you are wong.
...
TDale313
(7,820 posts)As for the red baiting, puhlease. They've been calling center-right Obama a socialist and a commie for nearly a decade. Time for some new material.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)a nice guy too! but a loser
TryLogic
(1,722 posts)Roy Ellefson
(279 posts)first, war hero American patriot George McGovern was not a loser. Second...using the 1972 election as some "lesson" on the impossibility of American's electing a liberal is a bad "lesson"...in 1972 no one was going to beat Tricky Dick...as much as we hate to admit it Dick was a popular president until Watergate finally brought him down.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Roy Ellefson
(279 posts)the truth is that McGovern was not rejected because of his "leftism" he lost because the sociopath, "Tricky Dick", who I might add was in many ways more liberal than HRC, was a popular sitting president.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)kristopher
(29,798 posts)The facts.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)Thanks for continuing to share your cogent thoughts with us.
randys1
(16,286 posts)rights person?
Wow, news to me.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)CorporatistNation
(2,546 posts)People R FED UP WITH THE STATUS QUO! Bernie will triumph...
Volaris
(10,270 posts)This is the first generation in America born completely AFTER the collapse of the Soviet Union.
Meaning Red-baiting isn't going to work anymore, as these new, younger fish grew up on a very different diet.
bvf
(6,604 posts)by the same GOP?
Quite acceptable to many. Others will force their way out of their deathbeds to vote against her.
It's a win-win for them.
Alert me for saying so. I don't care.
randys1
(16,286 posts)floriduck
(2,262 posts)think like that. The GOP voters will view Bernie in a far better light than you people.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)I want a loyal tried and fight Dem like Hillary: not Sanders who
refused to join the DNC for years.
John Poet
(2,510 posts)is MY KIND OF GUY!
That's a Fucking RECOMMENDATION!!!!
It's a Goddamn ENDORSEMENT!!!
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Bradical79
(4,490 posts)corkhead
(6,119 posts)good job catapulting the propaganda btw.
tularetom
(23,664 posts)Because something like the way he talks your posts read.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)cascadiance
(19,537 posts)You can't give reasoning behind why him being a "socialist" is bad.
Yeah, you follow Rush Limbaugh well with this equivalent calls of trying to call us all things like "liberal", "feminazis", etc. to try and do the same thing as if they were curse words because he's unable to provide any more depth to his comments either.
If this game keeps being played, it is just a matter of time that people learn that most of the Koch funded corporate parties are being funded by money made largely from that COMMIE Stalin. I wonder if Americans would prefer commies to socialists? Might want to ask that question to make sure. Or are you afraid. Or are you also afraid to note that the DLC which was where Third Way people originated from, etc. was also funded by the Kochs.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)cascadiance
(19,537 posts)But you seem incapable of seeing anything more than that or how he's manifested socialist POLICY with his ACTIONS and LEGISLATION that he's been consistently working for the AMERICAN PEOPLE (not corporate people BTW) over that time.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Last edited Thu Dec 31, 2015, 12:18 PM - Edit history (1)
He was always too good for poor De m's: he like is rich socialist
gun toting white state.
Sorry: the socialist name was his pride: not being a Democrat
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)It is other candidates that more represent the wealthy who PAY them to represent them, where he pushes PAC money away.
I guess this is part of the campaign messaging to try to put out disinformation against those in areas you are WEAKEST at.
What made FDR a popular Democrat was his strong socialist philosophy policies that got him reelected four times. I think Sanders stands strongest in reflecting FDR's policies than any other pol running. if you think differently, I challenge you on specific policies you think Clinton does better a which stand up for the working class of Americans. I think that has Sanders representing the best Democratic Party policies of any candidate whether or not he's a Democratic Party member or not.
For voters it is what politicians DO and not what they label themselves which is more important to them.
boobooday
(7,869 posts)He is a DEMOCRATIC SOCIALIST which means that government works for the people, in a way VOTED UPON by the people, just like we are going to vote him into the presidency.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)It was Sanders choice: He honeymooned in Russia: he
believes in socialism.
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)Just the label association that the right wing tries to make it with a dictatorial system in the Soviet Union, which is NOT what is being practiced in places like Sweden now, which is socialism that the people vote to put in place to work for them and not rich bastards. Apparently you don't seem to care that we put in a system that works more for people.
The Koch brothers who helped start the DLC/Third Way movement have MORE in common with communist dictators like Stalin than Bernie did when their financial empire was largely built on Stalin's money through Fred Koch's business dealings with him earlier. Bernie believes in a government system not run by the empires of 1%ers like the Kochs or Stalin. Apparently corporate Dems don't seem to care about that much, which likely would have been to FDR's chagrin if he were alive today who didn't like economic royalists such as these.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)cascadiance
(19,537 posts)WHY is it bad for America. And not the BS that you seem to want to echo from the Republican Party that FALSELY claims it to be like the dictatorial system that the Soviet Union had a while back, which I'll say again, has more in common with the source of the funding that Republicans and corporatist candidates get from the Koch family than what Bernie believes should be put in place to rescue this country in much the same way that FDR and others in the past did when they had traditional Democratic Party views that reflected the views and interests far more of the American people than the economic royalists they worked against then and who have bought control of our government and media today.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Last edited Tue Jan 5, 2016, 03:17 PM - Edit history (1)
You want a pass on Sanders calling himself a socialist, I
am sorry: Democrat on workers not freeloaders.
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)And your brief sentences don't even make grammatical sense. How old are you? Wonder if you are even voting age?
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)madokie
(51,076 posts)is here on DU and the MSM. No where else does anyone have a problem with his wanting to do what is right for the majority of Americans. Call it socialism or whatever but its what America wants to hear.
Bernie will be our next President, get used to it
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)Would sink him in the GE. Polling shows a majority of Americans would not vote for a Socialist
madokie
(51,076 posts)just go with it. Hillary Clinton will never get elected and you can bet on that so I guess by your estimation we're heading for a 'CON president
fuck that noise
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)Madam President. She will crush Trump
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)So, either more Americans like socialists than either the GOP or Hillary, or your lines of Bernie being defined as a socialist being "baggage" for him "sinking" him is absolute BS (and that BS doesn't stand for Bernie Sanders)...
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)The nomination should go to a loyal Dem: I don't nowhere
you go the idea I follow Rush: I have voting record that
is 30 years long and my congress woman is Jan Jawski
that I knock on doors for. The Dem 's I work for and with
don't want Sanders they want a reliable Dem.
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)... that have been pushed in the past to work more for the people than the economic royalist elite. "Everyone" doesn't share your notion of what it means that you don't want to be more explicit about other than just making it a "name" that you fall into the right wing trap of saying it is more akin to an undemocratic system in the Soviet Union called communism.
Bernie's not advocating communism. Never has and never will in his embrace of DEMOCRATIC socialism.
What makes a "reliable Dem". Would you rather have voted for Strom Thurmond as a "loyal Democrat" when he was one over Bernie? If you say yes, then you expose yourself as being more for a label than on principles. If you say no, then you show a double standard if you won't vote for him as a "loyal democrat" but feel like you can't vote for Bernie who has more democratic principles than many so-called "Democrats" today.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)until he turned 73, he also honeymooned in Russia:
I reject ideologues and so do most Americans
FDR was a tinker: he said would do what works
99Forever
(14,524 posts)And the answer hasn't changed.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)Nor do I care.
Ta ta.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)You don't communicate very well. Perhaps English isn't your primary language. I really don't know or care. Whatever the reason, I have no desire to speak with you further.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Response to lewebley3 (Reply #57)
c588415 This message was self-deleted by its author.
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)He's MUCH more of the kind of Democrat I've always supported. He's the kind of Democrat who represented the Democratic Party when I joined it many years ago! It seems that you joined the "new" kind of Democratic Party. Kind of DLC/Third Way one, which was formed around the time Bill Clinton got elected. There's A LOT of information about how it was formed back then if your interested in reading about it.
Not gonna fight with you about it, I'm sure I can't change your mind. Still I know the Democratic Party I joined thinks like Bernie and it's the reason I'm ecstatic he's running!
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)and that's one reason I will enthusiastically cast my vote for him.
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)And I agreer with you. I cannot tell you how very devastated I was after he was shot. Yes, JFK's was terribly horrible, but it was Bobby's death that affected me in so many ways. I still remember him and remember a very broken heart!
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)Heck, I still can't listen to "Abraham, Martin and John" without breaking down by the time the song gets to "Has anybody here seen my friend Bobby..."
ChiciB1
(15,435 posts)back about those times, I DID feel "we the people" felt we could actually have our voices heard by TPTB! Today, it's so out of control and when I look around I see so much lethargy! The CORPORATE media ONLY reports what they feel we should hear AND most of it depends on WHO you are!
I try so hard to make my fellow citizens aware of what has happened, but so much of the time the answer I get is "I don't talk about politics or religion!" Pretty sick AND IMO one of the main reason the SAME people keep getting re-elected over and over an!d over! I'm a Democrat, but when I see how Bernie is being victimized by THIS system it not only depresses me it makes my blood boil!
What the DNC is doing now is really unacceptable to me because anyone who's followed politics for as long as I have can clearly see they've "decided" that Hillary will be the nominee. Yes, she's quite capable and well informed, but for me she represents what we have now which is "more of the same" and I don't have much faith that much will change. I KNOW I'll have to vote for her because of the Supreme Court situation, but unfortunately that's the only plus she offers me.
I so WISH I felt differently, but having been part of the REVOLUTION of "my generation" it's hard for me to accept what I can only call the "dumbing down" of this country. I honestly know people who DON'T know that we have 3 branches of government or that journalists were once known as The Fourth Estate!
Oh, I need to stop. I get carried away. Yes, the past was chaotic and there was much upheaval, but at least I felt I was part of helping to fix it.
PERHAPS we've come to a cross road at this point in time and people are waking up. WE MUST stop this GREED!
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)sammythecat
(3,568 posts)I don't buy into "My country, right or wrong" bullshit. Call him anything you want. I'm voting for him.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)sound small
sammythecat
(3,568 posts)I'd hoped my vulgarity would convince you to switch allegiance.
By the way, Bernie Sanders is running for President as a Democrat. In fact, he embodies and espouses the ideals of the Democratic Party far more than any other candidate in our lifetime. Far more, but carry on with your attempt to portray Bernie Sanders as some sort of phony impostor even though it's lame and sounds desperate.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Orsino
(37,428 posts)Just look at those Americans rejecting him: https://www.google.com/search?q=sanders+rally
They are literally trying to crowd him out of every venue he tries to speak in.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)firebrand80
(2,760 posts)We've known for years that an overwhelming number of Americans support liberal policies when you ask them about them in the abstract.
However, we also know that Presidential candidates that deviate too far from the political "center" don't do well.
Dawgs
(14,755 posts)We haven't had one since the 40's and he was only elected four times.
firebrand80
(2,760 posts)Far left candidates don't usually win the nomination, and when they have, they get plastered in the GE.
That's why we haven't had one in decades.
Dawgs
(14,755 posts)And FYI, things change over time. They don't always stay the same.
Kind of like a black guy with a Muslim sounding name becoming President. Remember him?
firebrand80
(2,760 posts)Candidates like Kucinich have barely gotten off the ground since then.
Things certainly do change over time, and where the political "center" lies is a moving target. Bernie is actually good evidence of that, he's not really different from Kucinich, yet he's doing far better.
hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)Mondale was a former VP running against the popular incumbent Reagan. Dukakis was portrayed as a technocrat. The GHWB campaign smeared him with Willy Horton, but mostly, he was a lackluster candidate .... even more so than Bush.
geardaddy
(24,926 posts)hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)geardaddy
(24,926 posts)For a minute I had to check my memory.
ChairmanAgnostic
(28,017 posts)tossed out of the GOP.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)ChairmanAgnostic
(28,017 posts)Ike actually was a decent administrator, and was aware of the fragile peace around the world.
Teddy? we were lucky to have him as president.
geardaddy
(24,926 posts)Totally agree.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)ybbor
(1,554 posts)He won with only 43% in 1992, and 49% in 1996. Neither victory was a majority victory. Mind you I voted for him both times but Perot took more votes from Bush Sr. And Dole, than from Clinton.
RBInMaine
(13,570 posts)Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)cascadiance
(19,537 posts)They could have gone to Bush or stayed home too.
Many in this election who have that sentiment might vote Republican if anti-TPP and anti H-1B candidate gets nominated by the Republicans such as Trump. Hillary might have a shot at those voters if GOP nominates Rubio, but even Cruz is lining up against H-1B and potentially against free trade agreements too. They won't be able to use these issues against Bernie to get votes like they can against the Clinton family who has been pro-free trade and pro indentured servant program "guest worker" programs too.
The Eighteen percent that went to Perot is no small group of voters, and that group would largely favor Bernie today over Clinton.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)The R vote was repressed due to GHWB going back on his no new taxes pledge along with a recession. Perot took more votes from Bush than from Clinton. Bill won but didn't come near a major of the popular vote. Dole was a terrible candidate in '96. He showed less fire than Dukakis and Bill was a good campaigner and fundrai$er.
Hilary lost her nomination in '08, despite entering the race as the odds on favorite.
They don't have such a superlative win/loss record.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)lewebley3
(3,412 posts)fail to face.
hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)You're repeating highly superficial analysis from 20+ years ago. Broad brushed at the time, nonsensical today. Simply repeating them has nothing to do with reality then or now. It's no more than yelling neener, neener, neener while sticking fingers in ears.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Left wing of Dem's always put nice guy losers
hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)tazkcmo
(7,300 posts)And you don't get to count the reserved Senate seat of NY. Even if you do count it, it's only 2.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)and in a heavily Democratic state at that.
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Akamai
(1,779 posts)as Sen. Kerry said leading up to the 2004 elections, "These guys will tell any lies to win." Unfortunately, that was largely off-camera any never seem to repeated in public. Bernie has no problems exposing the harm done to people for being mistreated by her right-wingers, by the rich, by the unethical, etc. He clearly does have in enormous fire in his belly to do the right things.
It certainly reminds me of Sen. Paul Wellstone's saying, "If I am on fire, it's because I have icebergs of indifference to melt."
If people are pissed off, taking names and kicking but, they should get off the political platform.
Go Bernie!
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)TryLogic
(1,722 posts)litlbilly
(2,227 posts)Old Codger
(4,205 posts)Is so far right she would have been called a republican not that long ago... The left has come so far right that IKE would now be a Dem.
KingCharlemagne
(7,908 posts)would have chuckled. Oh, wait, Marshall Zhukov remained close friends with Ike after he was eleced POTUS. Maybe Ike really was a closet Commie?
RBInMaine
(13,570 posts)Old Codger
(4,205 posts)In your world
LiberalLovinLug
(14,173 posts)For about 2 decades.
Ike who warned about the growing MIC would be destroyed on Fox News, Rush, and the GOP.
From his 1956 platform:
"We are proud of and shall continue our far-reaching and sound advances in matters of basic human needsexpansion of social securitybroadened coverage in unemployment insurance improved housingand better health protection for all our people. We are determined that our government remain warmly responsive to the urgent social and economic problems of our people."
read it all:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/10/14/1336619/-Eisenhower-a-Liberal
And Hillary, who is beholden to the top financial institutions including the ones that abused the system and nearly destroyed the economy. And who is a war hawk who criticized Obama for not invading Syria years ago and voted for the Iraq war. She is a Thatcher doppleganger in every way. She would have in fact been too radical a right winger for many, including Ike, back in the day.
THIS is reality. What world are you living in?
lewebley3
(3,412 posts)Roy Ellefson
(279 posts)Sanders is not even close to far left...on economic issues he is a 1950's, 60's style Democrat.
daleanime
(17,796 posts)Duval
(4,280 posts)I do believe he can win.
KingCharlemagne
(7,908 posts)liberal' is something of a contradiction in terms. If Eugene Debs was far left, then FDR was left-leaning.
Dawgs
(14,755 posts)stupidicus
(2,570 posts)just peddle the 3rdway BS like the polls showing Bernie prevailing over your rightwing cousins either don't exist or are clearly erroneous -- which you can't make a case for either
firebrand80
(2,760 posts)stupidicus
(2,570 posts)then you'll have to find help elsewhere
I'm not gonna provide it
ish of the hammer
(444 posts)so thanks for that picture to help remind us of that inconvenient truth.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)The DLC/Third Way crowd does not consider liberal policies the "center." Their center is to enable corporations and billionaires to keep their stranglehold on the economy and government. Anything to the left of that is "fringe."
Attorney in Texas
(3,373 posts)we lose.
Look at the right-track/wrong-track polling:
Clinton is the "establishment" candidate. Of all the candidates in both parties, she is the one who represents the continue-down-this-same-track status quo.
If we nominate Clinton, we lose.
demwing
(16,916 posts)they didn't earn it, and don't deserve it
Attorney in Texas
(3,373 posts)populism.
demwing
(16,916 posts)and Bernie is a solid bet
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)... when he was criticizing Cruz for switching gears and now joining forces with others in congress to work AGAINST H-1B when he was against it before. Cruz is seeing Trump's stance against H-1B and is trying to get on that more Republican populist bandwagon, and Rubio felt threatened by that effort and called out Cruz on his hypocrisy there. Trump has his skeletons in trying to be a "populist" too, with his comments on the minimum wage that Bernie has taken him to task on.
The door is wide open on areas such as Free Trade, H-1B , and others that are part of fixing inequality, that he'll be the only pure candidate working for the people's interests, and by the positioning shown above, pressure is on the Republicans now to take populist positions too. Bernie will clearly have an advantage for the non-xenophobe Republican populists over all of the Republicans where Hillary is likely to lose to them on those issues.
Right wing press sites like Breitbart in some ways are even more vocal than progressive sites now on the effect on American jobs that guest worker programs and free trade agreements have on middle class Americans. It will be these areas that will be critical to win the election in 2016.
reACTIONary
(5,770 posts).... Sanders is struggling to break 30 % in his own (adopted) party. If he is such an attractive candidate for the GE, you would think he would be doing a lot better in the primaries.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)will vote for people who stand for them and what they want, instead of allowing themselves to be herded into line through fear and hate, we can achieve it all.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Bernie isn't the extremist.
The extremists are the ones that want to preserve the status quo.
The status quo that has wrecked our democracy.
Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)as Republican Lite and getting tepid centrists to run. . .we might have a super majority in both houses.
TIME TO PANIC
(1,894 posts)stupidicus
(2,570 posts)is just one of many zombie lies those kissing cousins use to decieve, kinda like the "liberal" media myth who actually assist them in their deceptions when possible.
hedda_foil
(16,373 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)...(I say "similar" because these questions obviously have been subjectively posed to those asked) about Clinton?
And are these the ONLY questions posed, or were there a lot more that aren't included on that chart?
ish of the hammer
(444 posts)Making sure women get a bigger piece of the middle-class pie that her neoliberal, DLC, pro-Wall Street, pro-Pentagon, pro-TPP, Republican-lite economic policies are designed to shrink. - expatjouro
George II
(67,782 posts)ish of the hammer
(444 posts)I was actually commenting on your brush-off vid that H. Clinton is doing, at what I guess must be the Benghazi committee hearing.
Which reminds me-
What's the first thing you learn in Law School (even Liberty U.)?
never ask a question you don't already know the answer to.
so an entire committee full of lawyers and staff with assistant lawyers with months to prepare
9 hrs worth of questions and they ALL forgot the first thing taught in law school?
I don't know what's worse - to BELIEVE that it actually happened, or that it REALLY did happen!
either way, it says a lot about the level of governance in this good ole usa.
methinks you"re easily impressed- judging by your vid
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)What about the third wayers,oligarchs, RINOs, corporatists. So many straw men so little time. It's good to play the victim
ish of the hammer
(444 posts)the victim is democracy.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)But you're right, the questions aren't about "candidates", but most certainly candidate:
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)I dunno why that notion confuses you so badly.
George II
(67,782 posts)....what you say it does.
Care to directly address my original comment?
yurbud
(39,405 posts)PowerToThePeople
(9,610 posts)is he too extreme.
wial
(437 posts)out on youtube the other day, spouting lies about Sanders. If they're deploying forces like that, it means they're desperate. Sanders really does represent the mainstream. It's not a silent majority in America, it's a *silenced* majority, but Bernie gives us voice at long last!
A Simple Game
(9,214 posts)Helen Borg
(3,963 posts)Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)I think this picture shows exactly why if Hillary becomes president, nothing of import will change, and the people at large will remain impoverished and very unhappy.
bvf
(6,604 posts)including a lot of self-identified, capital-D democrats.
I have had an increasingly difficult time understanding many of those in my party over the last few years. A lot are too young to see how rightward the drift has taken us.
To them, it's a quadrennial wrestling match, the outcome of which is little more than that of a bar bet.
kenfrequed
(7,865 posts)Isn't that a third level sorceror spell?
No, seriously I think these kinds of vague descriptors used by the media and pundits to tout their preferred candidates are about the worst thing.
nilram
(2,886 posts)Wanting stuff that most people want? Pfft, maybe if we ignore him he'll go away.
deutsey
(20,166 posts)valerief
(53,235 posts)orpupilofnature57
(15,472 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)polichick
(37,152 posts)Uncle Joe
(58,354 posts)Thanks for the thread, Scuba.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)Thank you for posting it. I was the 200th record!
Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)jamzrockz
(1,333 posts)are the same ones who told us that 90%+ of Americans support increased gun control after Sandy hook.
Also about the free public college ambition, I wonder why citizens who do not go to college themselves should be made to subsidize college education? I know the argument is that it benefits society but the same goes for just about everything most adults college grad and non college grad do for a living. So its either we subsidize everybody seeing as college students are not anymore special than people who go into trade
newthinking
(3,982 posts)throughout the nation.
State Universities were almost completely subsidized and most states' Jr. College were tuition free or nominal.
jamzrockz
(1,333 posts)America doesn't have the advantage it used to have then. Europe have completely recovered from the damages of WWII and Asia has emerged as a serious competitor. The only way we can dream of having free colleges again is with a massive increase in taxes which I can tell you nobody wants to do just for college students.
Even in the bad economy we have and massively inflated tuition costs, if you plan your college life well and study a degree with good job prospects you are not going to have problems paying back your student loans. Students just have to be starter and plan well before jumping into college.
DhhD
(4,695 posts)by Democrats and Republicans but not the Third Way-Hillary Clinton.
jamzrockz,
I do not understand how the information about how easy it would be to make free tuition available again, has escaped so many Democrats. Even Republicans agree on reestablishing this sales tax that ended in 1966. Bernie Sanders is for reestablishing the tax. Clinton has a third way plan that lets Americans stay down when it is not necessary.
http://www.thenation.com/article/bernie-sanders-has-plan-tax-wall-street-and-make-college-free/
http://www.salon.com/2013/10/18/the_tax_that_could_save_america_from_wall_street_partner/
snip
Once upon a time, we had a financial transaction tax in America, and it served us well from 1914 to 1966. Wall Street leaders at the time complained bitterly that the tax would be ruinous, but if you stop and think about those years, you notice that the American economy was actually much healthier than it is today. Income inequality was much lower, and jobs were more secure. After the Wall Street crash of 1987, major politicians, including Senate Majority leader Bob Dole and President H.W. Bush, called for a return of the FTT. Since the Wall Street-driven crash of 2008, renewed support for the tax has surged from every direction except, of course, from Wall Street and the politicians who rely on their donations.
more at link
http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/22/a-sales-tax-on-wall-street-transactions/?_r=0
jamzrockz
(1,333 posts)tax on high speed trading. My objection is using said money to fund free college tuition. I would prefer using any extra funds to shore up programs we already have now that people like, programs like SS and medicare so that they are still robust by the time I am old and ready to collect.
Actually, I really do not believe college education should be free. Its a program I would only support after all the debts have been paid off, SS and medicare are on solid foundation, the veterans are taken care off, maternity leave programs are funded, etc etc. Essentially, free college tuition is at the very bottom of my priority list if its there at all and I am not saying this because I had to pay for my college education myself.
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)The kids these days are having to deal with becoming indentured servants on a scale that many of them that graduated 10 years ago or earlier haven't had to deal with before. These kids deserve a break. I know that recently our state legislators here in Oregon have pushed through a program to make community college free for kids here starting in 2016. I've been very active in saying not only should future students get a break (since what they are doing is great for them!), but they also need to find a way to help even the playing field and help the younger generation that have already been put in huge debt through recent attendance of college relieve their huge lingering debts too. Especially I note since those who have been in the system the last four years are going to be newer voters in the coming 2016 election.
Why shouldn't those taxes be used to fund college tuition? Social Security and medicare (and I will be in those programs shortly now too) affect at the moment mainly older people. We should help them too, but that can be solved by removing the cap on payroll tax. College tuition and debt forgiveness could be fueled by speculative trading taxation. Wall Street trading should be rewarding companies that are good *investments* and not those that are the best fuel for casino gambling. It is the former kind of company that ultimately will hire these kids and turn them in to great parts of our economy instead of those in debt when they can't get jobs without education, and with the outsourcing of our jobs to other countries, or to "guest worker" programs like H-1B that basically fuel the economies of other countries when the money earned by those that get hired as cheaper labor instead send that money to other economies around the world instead of having that money spent here and fueling our economy here.
And the argument that those who aren't able to go to college funding this program they cannot participate in is also not inherently valid either, as that money could also go towards trade school education funding as well, for those that don't qualify for collegiate degrees. I believe Bernie has said as much at times when he's been asked about this.
SacProgressive
(12 posts)Look how that turned out...
#FeelTheBern!
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)raouldukelives
(5,178 posts)There are those who wish us all to live in reality and deal with our issues honestly and there are those who contribute to filling the coffers of those assuring nothing is changed and that no reality other than their own narratives is allowed.
Some take democracy, and the sacrifices of those who died face down in the mud for it, seriously. For everyone else, they take joy in dismantling those sacrifices one investment dollar at a time
Vinca
(50,269 posts)they either hate gay marriage, hate gays in general, hate black people, hate equality for women, hate Muslims/Buddhists/Jews/Sikhs/Wiccans/Etc. and love to practice gynecology as a hobby. They agree with what Bernie is offering, but only if all those other people don't get it.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)Hekate
(90,656 posts)...the infrastructure.
cascadiance
(19,537 posts)... that we have in place now where corporate and 1% money "buys the field" of the two parties that are the only valid choices to vote for in a general election if you don't want the "worst" of the top two parties to win. With instant runoff voting we wouldn't have to worry about that, and corporate money would have to worry about outside candidates coming in that have the right message about working for the people coming in to a race that they can't buy off.
Until we have that system (that is now in place in places like Australia), what Bernie is doing makes sense to avoid a Republican winning, NOT because he "needs the Democratic Party infrastructure" that you FALSELY infer!