cognitive dissonance.

[seabeyond]

i have been thinking. we start with our boys very young telling them they are men, with certain behaviors they do. reinforcing that behavior is what makes them men.

my son got in an accident Friday night. both sets of parents went to site of accident. when i was being told how the accident happened, and i turn and give son the eye, the father of the other boy tells me. hey. just boys. this is what boys do. and he literally said. boys will be boys.

now, it was my son at fault, and i am being all nice to not have this put on sons insurance. but that one got at least a snort from me.

you know. boys drive recklessly. just innate in them.

later talking to son, and continually knocking on wood, i told son. i would take either of the two men on (one old man as witness was saying the same) with driving fast and kick their ass. the difference being is when i drive fast... (just the one law i cannot stay true to), (knock on wood) i do it with expertise, safety, cautioun, experience. i do not get in accidents. (knocking on more wood).

by teens, we are continually defining the male role for our boys thru each other, society, media and entertainment. in all kinds of ways. they start hearing that innately, their dick is to lead them in life and it is all about getting some any way. the definition of a man.

clear up to now, i am continually hearing men boast and brag about being a man. high fiving their manliness and masculinity. a constant chatter in their life defining and cheering their testosterone.

so, i was thinking the other day. we do not start telling our baby girls they are women. we do not hold womanhood up continually to them, unless it is defining their worth to male masculinity. we do not call them women as teenagers. we do not say girls being girls. we do not spend the rest of our life time continually talking about our estrogen. how often do you hear anyway say, ... well you know, that estrogen.

anyway.

the more we learn we are the same. the more i see men so dogmatic in trying to separate a difference that simply is not there.

[mercuryblues]

1. I love

the shock when people learn I drive fast and love muscle/sports cars. I mean because I am a woman, I am not supposed to like that stuff. I can see the gears grinding in their heads as they try to rationalize it. Usually I get the a reply alluding to I am not within their idea of a "normal" female.

The other day my hubby and I were ordering a new kitchen table. The owner of the store came over, looked right past me and asked my hubby if that was his car out in the parking lot.

I looked up at him and said "no, that would be mine" I mean can't a woman decorate a home and drive a sports car?

[seabeyond]

2. Exactly... You are so right on. I am totally a non risk person in almost all ways. But driving,

We have all decided I should have been a race car driver. I am just one.... Lol, with the motion.

It us funny. I have so many examples just like your story.

[mercuryblues]

5. yup

my family jokes I should be an ambulance driver.

I have gotten better as I get older. Someone once asked me how I knew when I became a grownup.

When I could afford the increases in my insurance, but realized that money could be better spent elsewhere.

I pick and choose when I floor it now.

All I know is that my life would be pretty boring if I lived by the stereotypical rules. As a kid, I played with barbies and matchbox cars. I was great with a slingshot and could braid hair.

Life shouldn't be an either/or proposition. I hope I handed that freedom from stereotypes down to my kids and they theirs someday.

[MuseRider]

3. The extreme discomfort presented by

cognitive dissonance causes some people to double down. I know that is most likely the first response for all of us if our challenged belief is a strong one. Those who are able to use that discomfort to learn and properly place the new information are able to change.

This is important sea. Holding my place as an equal is very important to me and requires work, always has. For my husband (I use him as an example especially because he is on the long track of learning and unlearning behaviors he learned from his exceedingly misogynist father) it is very difficult because his very basic knowledge of himself as a man is just that, boys will be boys so they are not really accountable and men are on top no matter what. For them it is simply truth, there is no belief it just is.

This is not meant to give them a break. You know as well as I do that if they even try to be thoughtful about it they begin to understand, they are not stupid. To me it is just the quality of the person, in this case a male person, who can allow that maybe just maybe they need to challenge what they "know" about themselves and where all of that "knowledge" came from and the extreme damage it does to others INCLUDING other men.

Your sons are lucky that you treat them as real people not as "boys will be boys". That is not being real at all and at some point they all learn that it is not a constant they can survive on.

[seabeyond]

4. thinking further. my son is not that good of a driver. two men reinforced this reckless driving

for my son. that was a totally wrong message to give a boy, defining that this is innately his right, that could cause his death or others if he does not wake up to that fact, that he does not have it in him to take these risks.

i just thought of that one. i knew it within and that is why i addressed it when we got home. but what these men did, trying to create their idea of manhood, and give it to my son, was a lesson that could put him and others at risk

shame on them and their stupidity.

that their need to reinforce masculinity takes precedent over my sons safety and the men not reinforcing that lesson.

wowser wowser. to say this out loud.

they are not really accountable and men are on top no matter what. For them it is simply truth

and this is what we all know is true. yet... we pretend it is not. how dishonest we live.

thanks for your post

[MuseRider]

6. You just put it right out there.

It is difficult to talk about this. I too have 2 sons and I love them dearly and like you I worked really hard to raise them without all the crap. Society hands it to them. As a parent you have to see it, process it in a way that you can talk about it, and then take that time.

It is impossible almost to break through it. Who among us would ever want to give up the upper hand when everything is set up so that you never even have to worry about losing it? I don't think I could live that way but then we, as women, have been taught by everyone that we can't have that. It is reinforced to us every bit as much as it is to them.

I like what you have said. It is important. I am afraid that in most jobs this is almost demanded in their behavior to act this way. It gets reinforced so much. My boys both do music, it is not there so much, at least with the kind they do and the atmosphere they live and function in. Most men do not have that.

Here is a question for us to think about. Other than raising young men, why is this our responsibility? I do not see a lot of work in this direction by men. Sure there is some and there are some very good male supporters out there but it seems to fall always back on our shoulders. AFAIK we have enough to deal with and there is NOBODY out there saying to us, "Oh girls will be girls" unless they are talking about shopping.

[ismnotwasm]

7. I'm reading "Angry White Men" by Michael Kemmil

Recommended to me by a DUer. It's NOT a slam about being white, or being a man, but an analysis of white male privilege and the cult of masculinity as well as the perceived "threats" to it that creates this anger. while the book hasn't mentioned cognitive dissonance in particular, it seems to me that is really much of what is happening with phenomena such as MRA's and the Rush Limbaugh fans and minute men militia (for example). The world is changing; privilege is shifting. And those who grew up with certain expectations are angry and confused and place the blame on the most convenient "other"

[nomorenomore08]

8. I've always said that the problem with "angry white men" is they're angry at the wrong people.

Whereas they should be pissed off at the political and financial elite who've screwed us all over, they choose to scapegoat women and racial/sexual minorities.