A discussion about the b-word

[cinnabonbon]

Because after the clusterfuck that happened in GD, I think I need some help here. I think we all agree that it's a slur that is harmful. My predicament lies in the explanations I have to give to people. How do you refer to the slurs in question without asterisking them out? (Like this: b*tch) Is there a way that is more acceptable? I admit that it surprised me just a little, because the places I frequent simply asterix it out if they need to use it, and they consider that an acceptable compromise (although you're supposed to use it as little as possible, obviously.)

But is there a better way to refer to it? Do we just call it the b-word?

[Warpy]

1. I have proudly worn what the prissy people call "the b word" for years

because when any joker tries to patronize or dismiss me, I am one. On wheels.

While I can see it being hurtful to be called such in a political discussion (along with any other pejorative, no matter how sex neutral), I would prefer describing certain residents of the right wing kennel as what they are.

I've seen more than one discussion site ruined by word jumpers. I hope it doesn't happen to DU, but it looks like it's going to.

[cinnabonbon]

2. I gotta say

I think there's a world of difference between women who reclaim it and guys who simply want to use the word because they like it. The second is something I have a problem with, -not you. I just don't see why it's necessary to use people's gender as an insult, but that's just me. There are so many other juicy insults out there just dying to be used when it's time to find a suitable curseword for this week's Republican Screwup.

The word jumpers, as you call them, is part of the 4th wave. There might come more of them as this generation becomes more mature. We'll see.

[redqueen]

3. The prissy people, huh? Is that also the term for those who think words like 'gay' and 'retarded'

are unacceptable?

[seaglass]

7. There really was no need for you to describe people who object to the word as "prissy", your point

was made without it. I could just as easily describe someone who uses the word as classless, ill-bred, vulgar etc...how far does that get us?

Look, there are words that personally don't bother me that I know other DUers find offensive, so I don't use them. I don't think it's that hard nor do I think it's too much to ask. Unless your purpose is to offend.

[redqueen]

4. I don't have a preference. B-word, single quotes, asterisks...

We all know what we're referring to.

My problem is when it's used as an insult by anyone, or used at all, in any way, by men.

It's ... odd ... how most people can manage to comprehend that 'gay', 'sissy', 'panty waist', etc. are unacceptable... but much uglier words for women are A-OK.

(Not really. It's not odd at all. That's just where we are still stuck as a (misogynist, patriarchal) society, sadly.)

[wryter2000]

8. What bothers me much more

Is referring to a man as a woman as an insult.

[redqueen]

14. And that starts in childhood.

You should have seen the pile on in GD when I objected to insults such as 'you throw like a girl'.

Then again, we who objected to bullying used to get piled on by those who found it no big deal / acceptable / unavoidable / beneficial, and that isn't the norm anymore.

Progress is possible, but on issues related to misogyny OH MY FUCKING GODDESS but it is painfully slow.

[cinnabonbon]

11. I think they're just so used to

using insults that describe anything female as worse than masculine, that they don't see it. Seeing it would mean that they realize that they've have male privilege.

In my dreams I hope that we'll eventually be able to have discussions without words like "harpy, banshee hysterical," etc pop up, because they're also mostly used against women who speak their minds.

[redqueen]

15. I know we will get there, someday. It will take a long time,

and radical feminists will lead the way.

[cinnabonbon]

18. ...

[ismnotwasm]

5. I don't like it

There's the Intellectual reason-- it animinalizes and objectifies women, and then there's the old school reason. Call me a Bitch in any way shape or form and I WILL do something about it-- this from the days of my youth

Funny, I cuss a lot, but I tend away from ones referencing women's body parts except for one or two people find FAR more offensive than bitch. Bitch is a useless, stupid word, internalized by society to alter it's meaning so it's just a bit less homophobic, just a bit less sexist to make it part of a grand joke, without changing one whit the core of its historical and misoginist dysfunction. A silly meme these days often.

I don't use it. I'm gonna cuss, I'm gonna do it for reals. And it wouldn't fly here.

So, while I don't like it, I have no intentions of cleaning up my own language either, so there you go. But if I'm going to use the word bitch in any context, I'm going to spell it out. Askerisks and the 'b-word' is silly to me, and is a disingenuous attempt to make it less offensive to those it offends.

I'm the last person who should be the language police, but I appreciate good discussions on the historical value of words, how they did or did not change, and what it means for women today. Unfortunately, DU is not the place for such discussions, given the knee jerk defensiveness seen all to often.

Let me paraphrase my daughter when she got out of the military; "don't call me a bitch---I'm not a dog-- you call me a c***, ( have to use asterisks with this one) I won't like it, I might tell you off, but it's a body part I'm proud of, and you can't take that pride away from me--and trying to make it an insult is just going to convience me you're an useless asshole quicker than calling me a bitch would".

[redqueen]

6. I cuss like a sailor,

but I don't use bigoted slurs.

It bugs me when people assume the problem with bigoted slurs is about 'dirty' words, and stupidly call you a hypocrite for saying 'fuck' while objecting to oppressive insults.

[ismnotwasm]

9. Something like that

Pretending words are harmless is just a fucking weird way to think.

[Lunacee_2013]

19. Re: the c-word.

I never understood why the woman-haters think that particular word hurts us. To be completely honest, I've always thought it said way more about the dumb-ass saying it, then it did about me.

In fact, I see it as a compliment now. It means "I'm a sexist jag-off and you've pissed me off so much that I've lost the ability to say big words".

[Sheldon Cooper]

10. Well, you can add

"twat" to the list of perfectly acceptable gender slurs to be used here. I alerted on a post calling J. Bieber a twat, fully expecting it to be allowed to stay, and sure enough a jury voted 5-1 to leave it alone. So, for those keeping score: calling people c*nt, b*tch, and twat are all A-OK here on Democratic (sic) Underground. Quite a big steaming pile, isn't it?

[cinnabonbon]

12. That is all sorts of awful.

[redqueen]

13. Butbutbut 'gender' is in the TOS...

isn't that enough?

[boston bean]

16. it's like discrimination based on SEX does not exist.

Just gender.... WTF!

[redqueen]

17. Oh no, Democrats know it exists. The issue is whether it matters.

You know, just the 'little things'. Just a 'little bit' of sexism is ok.

Just like the 'little' forms of racism, homophobia, etc. I mean who doesn't enjoy mocking the silly concerns of those who object to racist and homophobic jokes, racist and homophobic insults, the media's complicity in promoting racist and homophobic tropes, etc.



Oh, wait.