Elizabeth Warren circles in Iowa as Joe Biden stumbles

[BeyondGeography]

CLEAR LAKE, Iowa — With fake palm trees and a huge American flag as a backdrop, Senator Elizabeth Warren skipped onstage, microphone in hand, and barreled through her proposal to help rural America. In parting, she flapped her arms in a lightning-quick dance as Dolly Parton’s “Nine to Five” played her off.

“We’ve had enough of an America where government works better and better for a thinner and thinner slice at the top — 2020 is our chance,” Warren said to the crowd with her trademark bouncy energy. Right behind her, former vice president Joe Biden trod to the microphone, note cards in hand, and delivered a somber rejoinder, casting President Trump as an existential threat to a grieving and divided nation.

...Biden has held the lead in polls since he entered the race in April. But interviews with voters turned up doubts about his electability advantage. “I love Joe Biden, but he seemed old and tired during the debates,” said Abdi Ahari, 50, a surgeon from Mason City, Iowa, as he lined up outside the Wing Ding. “Politicians have shelf lives, and he’s expired.”

...Some voters pointed to Warren and Harris as among the candidates who are better equipped to take on Trump, suggesting the pair’s commanding debate performances could be shifting the conventional thinking on electability.If Trump were to debate Warren, said Steve Epperly, 74, “I think he would be wrestling a tiger there. “

“She’s got all her ducks in a row. She knows how to express herself. She doesn’t have to get real wordy about it,” Epperly said, adding that Biden “kind of floats off once in a while.”

...Some voters at the Wing Ding were struck by the contrast between the 70-year-old Warren, with her high-energy policy treatises, and the 76-year-old Biden and his reflective reminder of the election’s stakes. “He’s like, ‘words of wisdom.’ She’s like, ‘words of action,’” said Joyce Glover, 79, who traveled here from Wisconsin. “He’s as old as we are. I know how tired you get at this age,” said her sister, Daisy McKinley, 76. She added Warren had displayed “so much more life and oomph.”

More at https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2019/08/10/warren-circles-iowa-biden-stumbles/aw0wW0PWKco08VDxyAHJiI/story.html

[Thekaspervote]

1. Bostonglobe or no polls don't back this opinion piece up

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=3637

[BeyondGeography]

2. It's not an opinion piece

It’s a report.

Here’s another on-the-ground report from WaPo with quotes from county chairs that says pretty much the same thing:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/democrats-descend-on-iowa--with-renewed-anxiety/2019/08/10/18e02624-baad-11e9-a091-6a96e67d9cce_story.html

In these reports, Iowans sound underwhelmed by Biden. Feel free to post reports that say otherwise. Or polls.

[Thekaspervote]

3. Okay.. the polls still don't support it

The Quinnipiac poll I linked to shows warren with 8% of the AA vote. Can’t win on that

[BlueWI]

9. And the only poll that matters doesn't happen till February 2020.

No candidate has a lead. Everyone is tied at 0 delegates.

And it would be great to hear more discussion of the issues and concerns of African American voters rather than just citing polling numbers. If we had addressed those concerns more genuinely and across a broader spectrum of the country (including the Midwest) we would have won in 2016.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

10. Can't win what?

First, the polls aren't out yet (and won't be for a week or so) to reflect Iowan's views after the State Fair/Wing Ding appearances. The piece is focusing on Iowa. These events are a relatively big deal in Iowa, which loves its quirky role in the process.

Second, in a system that I personally despise, Iowa and New Hampshire go first in this process - and the AA vote is relatively insignificant in those states (which one of many reasons why they should not be going first). If any candidate takes those two, the snowball is generally rolling downhill - other candidates drop out and the media tends to want to crown a frontrunner. So if she took those two, she could go into the next round of states where there is a significant AA voting bloc with momentum on her side.

Third, it's August of 2019. The primaries are in 2020. So she has time (as do all of the candidates) to build and grow their coalitions. We are still 5.5 months from the Iowa Caucus, which is an eternity in American politics.

[Demsrule86]

11. It is not news...not one poll backs it up...it is what some want to happen...I can often even

tell who wrote it...Warren won't be the nominee and shouldn't as she would lose...might even lose the house...she has gone way to far to the left to win a general and has little to no support in the AA community.

[BeyondGeography]

17. The polls say she has surged most everywhere while Biden's numbers have been mostly static

She also beats Trump in head-to-head polls, not by as much as Biden but outside the MOE.

That said, it’s WAY early to put too much stock in polls. Iowa isn’t for another 5 1/2 months. At this point, momentum means a lot and Warren has it by any measurement.

[LakeArenal]

44. Static? I frame it "Consistently" in the lead.

You say potato, I say... Joe leads everywhere.

[TexasTowelie]

79. Not according to this article:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287235195

Thus far, it doesn't look like Warren has gathered much traction in the Midwest or Rust Belt states. No matter who our candidate is they will need to do well there to flip the Electoral College or they will have to win Texas in the general election.

[BeyondGeography]

81. Places where she hasn't campaigned

As if this needs to be said. Think Beto would like to trade places with Warren right now?

[TexasTowelie]

82. Considering that Warren will need to win in those states in order to win the election

it certainly seems like it is past the time to start campaigning.

My comment was about Warren (since it is the topic of the OP), so why did you feel the need to take a dig at Beto? At least Beto has a good chance at flipping a state that would win the general election as long as the other states that voted Democratic in 2016 stay on board.

[BeyondGeography]

84. She's got the sequencing right, everyone is circling the same targets right now

I brought up Beto because you don’t seem to have a grasp on how solid her position is right now relative to others.

[TexasTowelie]

87. So, IOW, you are calling me stupid.

I fully comprehend where Warren's grasp is relative to everyone else in the field. It's been decades since a northeast liberal has won a presidential contest.

And you brought up Beto because you couldn't let an opportunity to bash him get away from you.

[BeyondGeography]

89. Warren is a MA liberal by way of Oklahoma

which is part of her appeal. Maybe watch a town hall or two, see how she connects and you won’t say things that are utterly off the mark like Warren is just another northeast liberal.

[TexasTowelie]

97. I have watched her town halls.

She does come off as a northeast liberal regardless of being from Oklahoma (and Texas too--yes I knew that). Being viewed as a northeast liberal comes with the territory since she is a Harvard Law School professor.

The problem that Warren faces is a primary schedule that isn't particularly favorable for her in the early states. She will most likely split votes with Bernie in the New Hampshire primary; however, I doubt that either of them will drop out of the race that early since they have the money to continue. On Super Tuesday, Warren has good chances in Oklahoma and Massachusetts (although the polling which is out-of-date indicates otherwise) while she probably won't gain any delegates in Vermont. Warren won't be in any favorable states afterwards until April. I suspect that we will already have a frontrunner by April, but I doubt Warren will be in the lead.

[BeyondGeography]

105. Just for the record

This has never been said about any northeast liberal in the history of the United States:

After these pronouncements, LeAnn Blankenship, 38, who is a supervisor and coach, says she may swing from her Trump vote in 2016 to Warren in 2020. Blankenship says of Warren:

“She’s a good ol’ country girl like anyone else. She’s earned where she is, it wasn’t given to her. I respect that.”

https://hillreporter.com/elizabeth-warren-gets-applause-from-trump-supporters-in-west-virginia-35289

That was after a town hall in Kermit, WV.

So we disagree on her appeal. That’s what elections are for.

No way I would predict this race, it’s wide open. But I do believe two things: you beat Trump with someone who’s more populist than moderate and the nominee will be someone other than Joe Biden.

[TexasTowelie]

106. At this point we are in disagreement.

I don't see Warren flipping enough Electoral College votes to win an election. It's my opinion which I'm entitled to have, just like you are entitled to have your opinion.

Maybe Warren will come up with a surprise that will prove me incorrect and she will perform more strongly in the Rust Belt, Midwest, or Texas. However, I haven't read any articles to that effect and I'm reading articles from all across the country as I post them on DU. At this point, I don't even know if Warren will win any of the New England states.

[Cha]

100. Thanks for your input,

TexasT!

[Demsrule86]

111. What polls has she surged in? Last I saw she was still down even in New Hampshire...

I have seen no such reliable polls.

[BeyondGeography]

114. Her support in Iowa has nearly tripled since April

Per Monmouth:

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/456904-biden-faces-challenge-from-warren-in-iowa

That’s a surge. There were multiple threads here about it. Do try to keep up.

[emmaverybo]

83. I am not concerned about the ideological label for her multiple plans (although Republicans will

revel in using the L- word) but I find them excessive, impractical, undoable, and potentially at risk of taking dollars and focus away from existing social programs currently de-funded, broken, underfunded, and/or endangered.

In addition to the many social services systems in need of investment yesterday, continuously under threat such as Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid, additional, and extensive federal investment must be made to fix, rebuild, and restore our infrastructure, our inner cities, our public education and community college systems, SNAP, while in many states enough resources are not available for adequate, much less improved, EMS, firefighting, and law enforcement services.

I hope Warren will modify her call for total amnesty or total subsidy in some plans, prioritize our overall pressing needs, restrict some programs to serve low income and vulnerable populations first, and wait, in other cases, until she has secured office to announce any more ambitious and sweeping plans as other than aspirational.

These many plans demand not only a steep economic investment, but tremendous political capital as well. Obamacare, an already tested and fairly conservative program, took immense effort to
implement and called for a substantial investment of political capital to defend it against political detractors and a wary public, won over only by time and the proven advantages it offered. Just a start, but wow, what it alone cost...

Promise to address an array of problems, but stop assigning dollar figures to solutions before
reaching a legislative stage. 200 billion to deal with the opiate crisis? Opiates are not our number one drug problem, alcohol still is. The only available and effective opioid addiction treatment is suboxone with talk therapy. Medicare and Medicaid cover this treatment. Surely, it won’t take 200 billion dollars to cover the rest of the people who can not afford treatment.

Is student debt the only debt weighing huge numbers of people down? What about mass foreclosures across America that push POC, elderly, and all folks hit by hardship out of their communities, sometimes on to the streets.

Cancel student debt on an income driven basis when there is no possibility for potential wage earning to pay it, freeze interest during hardship or a return to school, bring down interest rates, revive the federal loan forgiveness program currently not functioning, cap the amount of loans
a student can take out to pay for-profit colleges, in sum, make changes that make a difference without betting the house.

Savings from modifying just some plans can go into paying down our debt, ensuring benefits and safety nets for 11 million undocumented immigrants working in America, and welcoming fleeing asylum seekers and refugees we must accommodate now and into the future. We should invest in job training, particularly youth and over-fifty, crime prevention, the VAWA, more drug-deterrent courts, yes, universal childcare for those who need it, and yes, affordable housing, but build more later and make habitable the low income housing we now ignore,

Republican talking points? Realistic points I say. I have not begun to mention a variety of social
needs that are urgent now, and will arise in the future as we become a more just and equal nation.

I am impressed with Warren’s vision for a more compassionate, healthy, and fair nation. How to expend economic and political capital, what can be achieved in two terms, where to invest and building consensus for investment concern me. If those, and not purely partisan concerns happen to match with any questions sensible independents or conservatives have, so be it.

I may not meet the definition of a progressive today, but I am a liberal who has much more in common with progressive candidates than anyone who votes Republican.

Don’t listen to Republicans, Liz. Listen to the widest electorate in your own party. There is time in your campaign to refine and tweak your plans, choose the top ones to promote, and bring
promises into line with reality.

[ucrdem]

96. Word.

I think Warren is terrific but I have to wonder at her commitment to some of the positions she ardently espouses. Surely she's smarter than that? Which to me has always clouded her credibility. Does she say this stuff to win votes or because she believes it? And if her thing is markets, why would she believe it?

[NNadir]

47. We've come to an age where polls are more important than campaigns, have we?

I am certainly disenfranchised in the selection of the nominee, since I am in a state where the nominee will have been decided before my primary.

Is this emphasis on polls before even a single primary is held an argument that we should simply declare a winner with no votes cast, based on some telephone polls?

Please let me know if you agree with this proposal, and I'll just not bother discussing politics with anyone. I'll just wait for the media to announce the winner and live with it.

[True Dough]

77. +1

There are a handful of Biden supporters here who would prefer that this race be called right here, right now. It's just not how things work. And history has shown us some very dramatic moves made over several months of primaries. There's a lot of runway left, a whole lot.

[George II]

4. Warren is only six years younger than him. Carter has been sharp as a tack into his 90s.

[KPN]

34. That"s Carter, not Joe. And Warren appears like she's 15 or 20 years younger in my view.

[monmouth4]

5. Biden is no longer the sharp guy he may have been, is not laser focused like Warren or Harris and I

honestly do not think his poll numbers will last. I'm surprised to tell the truth how those numbers became so high. I guess many like to fall back on name recognition and his VP performance with President Obama. Those days are over, time for us to move on.

[Demsrule86]

13. That is what people have been saying since the start...I think the numbers will hold

and hope they do or we lose a general. Warren will not win the states we need...sure I would vote for her but you need more than Democratic voters to win a general these days, and my big fear is we send Trump back with the house if Warren runs as our nominee.

[emmaverybo]

101. You must not have read Biden's Op-Ed on Central America published recently, heard his speech on

foreign policy and relations, or tuned in to his interview with Anderson, his highly lauded address to the nation this past week. They all demonstrate intellect, firm grasp of issues, understanding of “the moment we are in,” and perhaps more striking, character depth, gravitas, emotional reach.

Biden polls high because he has job-specific qualifications, knowledge, experience, and stature on the world stage. It is not merely his name that is recognized and respected, but also his accomplishments, decency, leadership abilities. He is the most prepared, nationally and globally,
to take the helm day one.

Icing on the cake is that he has been one of our better liked politicians for decades.

And yes, having been such an active and trusted VP to Obama is a BFD.

[monmouth4]

104. I agree with all of your points, I just think Elizabeth is a lot sharper. However, and I am not

alone, if Joe is the nominee then he's my man..

[emmaverybo]

108. Very sharp on her own plans and about income inequality in America. More cerebral in style than

Biden. For all I know, she has a higher IQ. I think even Biden himself would agree that he was not
a top-rate scholar, more middling, and not an academic as is Warren.

She could speak without a glitch for hours on her economic policies, I have no doubt, and does so in that topic range with admirable energy and enthusiasm.

Unfortunately, she is not nearly as up to speed on global foreign affairs and policy as Biden. I say
unfortunate because this is such a crucial area and it could be, given early times, that Warren
surpasses Biden in the primary ranking and gains such support among African Americans and in
the rust belt that she takes the presidency!

True, Obama had no foreign policy experience and little knowledge. Hence, he chose Joe Biden to be on the ticket.

[redstateblues]

102. I like Warren. I don't think she gets the rust belt back

With Warren there is a greater chance of an Electoral College win for Trump. I wish I had more confidence in her in the General.

[BlueMTexpat]

6. I am not sure why it is

that when a positive piece is posted about Elizabeth, the immediate reaction to it by some is that the polls still do not support what the piece says.

The fact is that she IS rising - steadily - in the polls. We are still in very early days yet. What she says is clearly resonating with voters.

[Merlot]

12. Biden Bros?

[BlueMTexpat]

57. That I really would hate

to see!

[Cha]

74. Yeah, it's such a "lovely" insult.. Thanks

for that.

[emmaverybo]

109. "Lovingly" they don't stop at railing against Biden, but insult we who support him too. You made

me laugh again, Cha, with your “lovely.” Hey, ya can slap some hearts down, but we know an
insult when we see one.

[Cha]

110. lol! "Bidenbros?"

Yeah we do.. the worst!

Mahalo, emmaverybo!

[emmaverybo]

119. Got to hand it to whomever thought up "Bidenbros." Well, we "bros" got each other. .

Ya know our guy is doing a hell of a job when Biden envy is in bloom. To Cha:

[Demsrule86]

14. We will see...right now I see little to no evidence of this.

A sitting senator in a state with a GOP governor should not have run anyway...we need the senate.

[Bradshaw3]

53. This "point" has been disproven on here many times

A special election will soon be held after she is elected, and the Dems will hold the seat. Your premise means that no senator from a state with a repub governor should ever run for the Democratic presidential nomination, which is ridiculous.

[Demsrule86]

117. It doesn't have to work that way...I well remember when Kennedy died...so I maintain she should not

have run. You are dealing with a Republican governor.

[Thekaspervote]

16. I certainly did not say anything negative....just facts. I would luv to see a Fe prez

I supported Hillary over Obama in 08, and worked just as hard for her in 2016.

The polls don’t lie, if she can overtake Biden, win the nomination... great. It just doesn’t seem like that is what’s going to happen... JUST IMHO

[BlueMTexpat]

55. OK, thanks!

For the moment, you are absolutely correct.

[Drunken Irishman]

37. If this was just about Warren, you'd be right...

But, uh, did you read the article or even the headline? It's an anti-Biden article masking as a pro-Warren one and you're confused as to why some Biden supporters are upset?

Where is the proof Biden has stumbled? Because they potentially cherry-picked some quotes from random people in a state Biden consistently leads in during a far where their straw poll had him the overwhelming top candidate? Sure seems like that's agenda-driven.

[BlueMTexpat]

58. I did read the article.

This is the Boston Globe, not generally a place to pit Dems against each other, and hardly a hit piece.

I think that you need to chill a bit, DI. Just sayin'!

[Drunken Irishman]

60. Na'. I'm good. Thanks for your concern.

You seemed confused as to why Biden supporters would be in this thread putting out facts - I explained why. It really isn't that difficult to grasp. This article is every bit about Warren as it is about Biden. I mean, you read it. You saw the headline. It specifically mentions Biden stumbling. And you're confused as to why Biden supporters would jump on that? C'mon, cut the games. You know exactly why they did. So, don't act shocked that Biden supporters would be posting in a thread that is also about Biden.

There. Hope that answers the initial question you posed (you did want a response, right - or why else pose the 'I'm not sure why...' question?).

[BlueMTexpat]

86. I did have a concern that

the first response would be immediately to discount Elizabeth Warren because she is still behind Biden in the polls. It seemed to me that the focus was on the polls rather than on the facts.

But that responder and I have amicably agreed to disagree and see what transpires in future.

Unfortunately, you have jumped in with some unwarranted snark and talking down, whether you meant to or not. Neither is helping your case with me.

So, please just leave it at that.

[Drunken Irishman]

88. No. The first response is to discount this silly notion Biden is stumbling.

That is literally the first response to your thread.

[BlueMTexpat]

90. This is the first response to this thread.

Bostonglobe or no polls don't back this opinion piece up

and then a link.

Did you see another one? I must have missed it.

And it wasn't an opinion piece.

[Drunken Irishman]

91. That's the one! The polls don't back up the claim Biden has stumbled.

Here's the most recent polls:

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/ia/iowa_democratic_presidential_caucus-6731.html

Biden's average lead is 9%.

'Stumbles' heh

[BlueMTexpat]

93. Sheesh!

I basically have cut you slack because of your name. I am proud to be Irish - among other things.

"Drunken" - maybe not so much.

But the slack has now officially been cut. Please don't bother to respond to me again.

[Drunken Irishman]

94. Or what?

You asked a question. I replied. You obviously are a bit sensitive on this subject. It's just baffling to me that you can't see why Biden supporters would get a little bit upset over a headline that literally states their candidate is stumbling - and yet, the article provides no proof of this assertion beyond some quotes.

Forget that the polls show Biden leading in Iowa by a pretty strong margin.

Forget that, at the same event, the straw poll done on the candidates put Biden well out front of his rivals.

He's somehow stumbling. Okay. Cool.

By mid-afternoon Thursday, more than 2,000 Iowans had voted in the State Fair’s “Cast Your Kernel” survey by dropping corn kernels into glass jars labeled with the names of candidates.

When the poll closed for the day at 9 p.m., Democrats and Republicans were tied 50% to 50%. Among Democrats, Biden was the front-runner with 33% of the vote, followed by South Bend Mayor Pete Buttigieg with 14% and Senator Elizabeth Warren at 12%. Trump held a hefty lead over opponent Bill Weld, the former governor of Massachusetts, with 97% of the Republican vote.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-08-09/the-corn-kernels-say-it-ll-be-biden-vs-trump-campaign-update

[Thekaspervote]

85. Agree! If it were an honest on the ground report of all or many, it would have had good & bad for

Biden and warren

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

61. Nice to see!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

[Cha]

76. I have never said anything negative about

Elizabeth Warren and Biden supporters are kind and brilliant.

They sure as hell don't need to be speculated as "Biden bros?"

[still_one]

78. It isn't the positive piece or poll from any candidate it is the urge by some to go out of their way

to subtly or not so subtly to “put down” another candidate at the polls expense, and I am not just talking about a candidates poll numbers going up and down relative to previous polls, but an intentional effort by some to take it much further negative beyond simple speculation

The candidate that appears to be most susceptible to this currently appears to be Bide, which I suspect because some view home as the leading candidate in these early polls

[Drunken Irishman]

95. I mean, the article puts down Biden in its headline...It's not just a positive Warren piece.

It's a negative Biden one - and one that isn't really rooted in fact.

If this was just about Warren surging in Iowa, and didn't mention 'Biden stumbling' with an actual poll, I think you'd have a point. But when it's an article solely built around the idea Biden is stumbling, and it's because some perceive him to be too old (with quotes from random people, which is not scientific in any possible way), why shouldn't Biden supporters be a bit defensive?

[still_one]

99. I agree, and my statement was meant to apply to both because they do, I should have

made that clear

Just my observation, but I think after the second debate some in the media seemed to realize they were more important interested in trying to promote divisionary, sometimes petty issues among the candidates to attack each other, rather than exploit where the candidates differ with each other

With the hyperbole being generated by some because Biden identified himself as VP when talking to Parkland in 2018, indicates this tactic isn’t going away soon, and in fact they had no qualms distorting the actual story

My view is that a good number of a candidate’s advisors are more there for money than ideology, and the moment they are no longer affiliated with the campaign, they are only too willing to bad mouth that person for their opportunity at the talk show or book circuit

[Green Line]

7. I have a subscription to the Globe

They have been shilling for Warren and knocking Biden for weeks now, it's getting old. I love how they talk about Joe's age and never mention Warren's, she 70, just 6 years younger than Joe.

[BeyondGeography]

8. WaPo wrote basically the same report

Are they shills, too?

You know, you could always find and post an article with glowing quotes from Iowans about Biden’s performance this week. No law against that.

[Demsrule86]

15. Biden does not get that kind of coverage...the media saves it for Warren and Harris...

[highplainsdem]

20. There are a number of reporters who obviously can't stand Biden being the front-runner

and are slanting their coverage to favor his rivals, particularly their own favorites.

[bluewater]

27. unskewing the news?

Not a good look.

[emulatorloo]

51. Unscew this one from CNN then

It is a positive article from CNN about Biden connecting with voters. It includes a discussion of “gaffes”. The voters don’t care about “gaffes”

Joe Biden hears your taunts about his age, but he's busy running for president
CNN Digital Rebranding 2014
Maeve Reston
By Maeve Reston, CNN
Updated 11:19 AM ET, Sun August 11, 2019

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/11/politics/joe-biden-iowa-state-fair-2020-election/index.html

[bluewater]

54. The news is what the news is

Attempts to unskew the news are just silly



"Joe Biden Gaffes His Way Through Iowa

It’s been a big weekend in Iowa, where 22 Democratic candidates assembled at the “Wing Ding” dinner in Clear Lake to demand bipartisan gun control before driving down to the Iowa State Fair for retail politics and the eating of stick food. For the front-runner, the four-day swing through the first state to vote also represented a major uptick in the intensity of his ground campaign: In the next month, Joe Biden will boost his travel schedule considerably, visiting the three other early-voting states before the next debate.

Despite his strong polling lead in Iowa and on the national level, some local party figures expressed concern this weekend about Biden’s onstage performance and the notion of his electability. (As the candidate characterized himself in December: “I am a gaffe machine.”) “He isn’t as compelling verbally,” the Madison County party chairman told the Washington Post. “There is starting to be a real fear that he cannot hold his own in the debate against Donald Trump.” The party chair from Grundy County wished “he’d get his mojo back,” and reminisced over the Biden of 2012, when he debated vice-presidential hopeful Paul Ryan.

The former veep didn’t exactly quell those fears in his trip through Iowa. It began with a remark at a town hall hosted by the Asian & Latino Coalition in Des Moines, where Biden wanted to dispel the “notion that somehow if you’re poor, you cannot do it. Poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids.” He corrected himself immediately, but the gaffe was out. Thursday wasn’t over: On a soapbox at the state fair, he issued the accidentally Orwellian line: “We choose truth over facts.” And for the second time this summer, he caught himself as he referred to former prime minister Theresa May as Margaret Thatcher, who passed six years ago."

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/08/joe-biden-gaffes-his-way-through-iowa.html

[emulatorloo]

64. Did I "unscew" the news? No, I posted a positive article.

No one is “unscewing” the news in the thread.

[bluewater]

69. 'No one is "unscewing" the news in the thread.' You missed a post then? Read this...

"There are a number of reporters who obviously can't stand Biden being the front-runner and are slanting their coverage to favor his rivals, particularly their own favorites."

THAT is a definite attempt to unskew the news.

[emulatorloo]

71. Pointing out bias isn't "unscewing". Did you forget "But her emails!" In the NYT

Or the normalization of Trump by some news outlets?

You are an intelligent person, so I assume you remember both.

[bluewater]

73. Claiming the Boston Globe and the Wahington Post are "biased" against Biden?

Both are respected left leaning major news sources.

Being critical of Biden's recent performance is not proof of either being "biased" as the poster claimed.

"There are a number of reporters who obviously can't stand Biden being the front-runner and are slanting their coverage to favor his rivals, particularly their own favorites."

THAT is a definite attempt to unskew the news.

[Green Line]

43. It isn't about this one article, it's about the Globe

I read the Boston Globe every day, they bash Joe all the time. I get that Warren is a local for the Globe and wouldn't mind if they went after the other candidates like they go after Joe, but they don't.

[Demsrule86]

113. Yes they are...did you see who the authors are and the other stuff they wrote?

[cwydro]

18. She is a very young 70; no one can deny that.

Not to mention that at that age 6 years is a big difference.

She’s full of energy, and she’s got some great plans. I think she can appeal to rust belt voters too.

[highplainsdem]

19. Biden's a very young 76. I don't recall seeing any coverage of Warren jogging along a parade

route, as Biden's done.

And FWIW, at that age 6 years is NOT a huge difference.

Healthy senior citizens tend to stay healthy senior citizens for a very long time, if they take care of themselves.

And in case you're considering mentioning risk of Alzheimer's, as others here bringing up Biden's age have done -- it's roughly double for women compared to men at Warren's current age and the age she'll be between 2020 and 2028, so her risk for that is comparable to any risk for Biden and Sanders.

And for all three of them, it's minimal.

[BeyondGeography]

21. As of a month ago she had done 105 town halls

answered 500 questions and taken 35,000 selfies.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jul/08/elizabeth-warren-2020-campaign-selfies-town-halls

The day Joe jogged at a parade he finished up with an appearance at Marshalltown where people could barely hear him reading a teleprompter.

She’s outworking him, which she of course needs to do. But Biden’s schedule has been comparatively light and his public appearances have been uneven. So it’s no surprise that reporters have a lot less trouble finding voters or even county chairs who bring up Biden’s age than Warren’s.

[highplainsdem]

23. You're completely misrepresenting Biden's Marshalltown speech, which was on C-SPAN and was

posted about here, WITH the video.

I suggest that anyone who wonders how well Biden handled that campaign appearance check out this thread for the video and the comments:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287189468


That also shows all the time he spent after the speech talking with people in the audience.


And a thread about him jogging along a parade route earlier in the day:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287189398

[BeyondGeography]

25. I guess this summary is all part of the anti-Biden media conspiracy

Some of that torch-bearing air of vitality had gone out of Biden’s performance by the time he got to Marshalltown later in the afternoon. The morning of bobbing and weaving in the parade seemed to have left him tuckered out. And not even the spirited audience warm-up by his wife could provide much of an adrenaline boost.

Standing at the rostrum at a Best Western inn on South Center Street, he read his speech, rather flatly, off a teleprompter again. It was a medium-size meeting room of a modest hotel just off U.S. Route 30, where the capacity crowd of heartland folk waited to be propelled out of their seats by invigorating rhetoric — or at the very least, by a dose of magnetic, plain-spoken Uncle Joe. Instead, it got a lot of canned campaign-speak from Politician Joe...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arts-entertainment/2019/07/25/posts-theater-critic-is-reviewing-performances-democratic-candidates-this-installment-joe-biden-is-back-an-encore/

[Autumn]

26. The WP never loved Joe

[highplainsdem]

28. Why don't you look at the video for yourself? And yes, that reviewer shows anti-Biden bias.

[BeyondGeography]

29. There's a clip in the article which I saw

It’s bad. I’m sure there were better moments but like I said above Biden has been uneven. Warren has not and it’s starting to sink in with voters in Iowa, hence the OP.

[highplainsdem]

40. You should look at the entire speech. And btw, as far as that critic's bias

against Joe, and the silliness of it -- in the YouTube video he did for his review, he even snipes at Biden's smile:

"Oh, wow, those teeth! He sometimes looks like a smile that just happens to be attached to a man."

Nope. No bias there...



He snipes at Biden showing "enduring fitness."

He criticizes him for using a teleprompter.

At one point he says that watching Biden, "You can feel you're watching a film star playing a preidential candidate."

And Marks says that in a critical tone, as if he disapproves of Biden looking fit, looking like a possible president.

So, because I wondered what a theater critic who sniped at Biden for his smile and his "enduring fitness" might look like:

Peter Marks' Twitter account with what I assume is a fairly current photo:

https://twitter.com/petermarksdrama



Another photo of Marks from 6 years ago:





I don't know how old Peter Marks is. I'm guessing he's at least slightly younger than Joe Biden.

And IMO he sounds envious that a politician older than he is has a dazzling smile, enduring fitness, and even seems like a film star playing a presidential candidate.

[Cha]

72. Poor thing.. he sounds Jealous.. Biden Derangement

Syndrome.

Thanks for your research, highplains!

[highplainsdem]

98. You're welcome, Cha! Yes, that critic does sound jealous.

And after reading that journalists are having a hard time keeping up with Biden as he campaigns in Iowa

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287235498

I'm wondering if some of the sniping at him from other journalists is also due to jealousy.

[bluewater]

31. The video shows a very tired looking, flat sounding Joe.

[highplainsdem]

41. The C-SPAN video of the speech doesn't.

[bluewater]

45. He looks very very tired in that CSPAN video.

[zackymilly]

92. He needs a couple Red Bulls and some 5-Hour Energy before he speaks. n/t

[emulatorloo]

52. I understand it doesn't fit your narrative, but here's an interesting article from CNN

It is a positive article from CNN about Biden connecting with voters in Iowa. It includes a discussion of “gaffes”. The voters don’t care about “gaffes”

Joe Biden hears your taunts about his age, but he's busy running for president
CNN Digital Rebranding 2014
Maeve Reston
By Maeve Reston, CNN
Updated 11:19 AM ET, Sun August 11, 2019

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/11/politics/joe-biden-iowa-state-fair-2020-election/index.html

——-

Biden and Warren are my top two candidates. I find them both highly capable.

[BeyondGeography]

56. My narrative?

This is what’s being reported, even in your link.

Joe’s a good soul. But as that article acknowledges he has lost a step and his staff is taking measures to minimize the harm to his brand by using the prompter and notes in settings where other candidates, including Warren, do without.

[emulatorloo]

67. Nonetheless the article is a positive one about Biden's connection w Iowa voters

which contradicts your narrative that Biden’s practically senile and hated by Iowa voters.

As I mentioned before, DU’s told us Biden’s a ‘pedophile’ and a ‘serial molester’. Neither were true, and neither piece of spaghetti stuck to the wall.

If Warren wins, she will win fair and square. She won’t be attacking Biden’s character or his mental capacity.

[BeyondGeography]

68. Lol, point to where anyone said that

[emulatorloo]

70. Insinuations. Don't piss on my shoes and tell me it's raining.

[TexasTowelie]

107. I recall the days when Republicans used to make fun of President Obama

for using a teleprompter. Have we come full circle?

[Demsrule86]

115. Now that is an opinion post and shouldn't even be posted but...yeah this pretty much shows that

the media wants Warren...and since she will not win a general although she has my vote-won't win the rust belt and has gone to far left to win in center left America...do they want Trump again...confusing.

[BeyondGeography]

116. Thanks for the multiple kicks

[Thekaspervote]

35. Thx for the links!! Mr. Biden is doing a great job. More let's pile on the leader

[cwydro]

22. I didn't say anything about Alzheimer's, did I?

I like Biden, and I said nothing to disparage him.

Calm down.

[highplainsdem]

24. As I said in my message, others here promoting Warren instead of Biden have brought up

risk of Alzheimer's. I didn't say you had. But I did think you might have been considering it because you mentioned the difference 6 years can make.

IMO, Biden, Warren and Sanders are all in very good shape for their age. They all seem to be taking very good care of themselves.

[bluewater]

39. Why the AGEIST comment? "are all in very good shape for their age"

I thought age was just a number ?!?

Is the implication that somehow the average 70-77 year old is lacking physically or mentally to be President?

[highplainsdem]

42. Please try reading more carefully -- it was cwydro who brought up age.

[bluewater]

46. "are all in very good shape for their age."

That's what you said, not cwydro.

That sounds like a very AGEIST comment.

Is the implication that somehow the average 70-77 year is lacking physically or mentally to be President?

[cwydro]

49. Lol!

Not even a good try!

And you even threw in Alzheimer’s for good measure. Smh.

[highplainsdem]

50. Okay. The article in the OP brought up age. Your reply 18 also brought up age and I responded to

that.

I'm tired of the ageist attacks on our top candidates, and the ones that try to argue that Biden's old while Warren isn't look particularly silly.

[cwydro]

59. I never said Biden is old, and Warren isn't. Just stop.

You seem very defensive.

If you’re looking for an argument, look elsewhere.

Time will tell.

[Princetonian]

30. RW media have double-downed on the ageist meme that originated from Trump's "full deck" tweet.

Joe, Elizabeth and Bernie are all septuagenarians. It is only a matter of time and opportunity when they go after Elizabeth as they have Joe and to a lesser extent, Bernie. The main thing holding them back from talking snidely about Elizabeth's age is they do not want to face cries of sexism. Joe is rolling with the punches as usual.

'The Trump campaign had seized on Biden’s mix-up of two words during the previous night’s speech — and that fit neatly into Trump’s narrative that the 76-year-old former vice president isn’t equipped for the mental rigors of the presidency because he’s not “playing with a full deck.”... it’s not yet clear how effective Trump will be in softening Biden’s support with his attempts to describe him as “Sleepy Joe” or lacking “a full deck.”

<snip>

A little ways down the rope line, a reporter shouted a question about Thursday night’s word mix-up — in which Biden misspoke by saying “poor kids are just as bright and talented as white kids” before immediately correcting himself. President Donald Trump’s daughter-in-law used the mix-up to question his mental acuity, the reporter noted.

“Tell them it’s the second anniversary of Charlottesville coming up, so they need to divert to something,” Biden replied, referring to the fatal street violence that occurred at the 2017 Unite the Right rally in Virginia. Biden often rebukes the President’s handling of the incident — Trump’s perceived encouragement of white supremacists with his response that there were “very fine people on both sides” — while campaigning.

<snip>

"He’s a human being like the rest of us, instead of just a Democrat,” Craven said when asked why he isn’t seriously considering any of the other Democratic candidates. “I’ve read his book. I’ve listened to him speak going as back as far as the Obama campaign. I worked 40 years as an electric utility lineman, a foreman, and I understand that experience counts. And some of these people, I don’t believe have reached the level of experience to where they can handle the job that Trump is going to leave us.”

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287235329

[KPN]

32. "I love Joe Biden, but ... Politicians have shelf lives, and he's expired."

Frankly, I'm with Abdi Ahari on that. He strikes me as way too old these days.

Having said that, I'll fight for and support him 100% of the way, every day leading up to and through the GE if Joe does win the nomination.

[Demsrule86]

118. Well if Biden isn't the nominee then Trump wins IMHO...no one else will beat him.

I would vote for anyone but it won't matter because we need moderates and even some conservatives to vote with us to get Trump out. I also fear we will lose the house if Trump wins.

[theophilus]

33. I am so impressed by her wit, her intelligence, her heart, and her

energy. She has all the right "stuff".

[katmondoo]

36. i am sick of reading the "Joe Biden stumbles " How about the Trump stumbles and lies.

He doesn't lose his honor and compassion if he happens to "stumble" He just goes on being Joe Biden a compassionate and honorable man.

[stonecutter357]

38. let's go Joe !

[nolabear]

48. He is every bit as capable as she is. Plus he has far more experience.

I like her a lot. But a snappy delivery doesn’t equal health. People’s abilities vary widely and not only according to age.

[ucrdem]

63. Exactly.

In a couple of months Joe will be an old hand but meanwhile he's got a new campaign team to put together and break in.

[ucrdem]

62. Keep in mind that Warren also "stumbled" at the start of her campaign

and was written off by the punditry. Now she's picked up some steam and it's Joe's turn to play Casey at the bat. It's an old narrative and very convenient but I'm guessing Joe will soon pick up steam too. It's not just innate talent, there's also a small city of new volunteers and campaign workers who have to be hired, trained, and find their own sea legs. So I expect to hear this familiar tale for another couple of months or until other stories crop up, like campaign suspensions

[highplainsdem]

65. Actually, if you google any candidate's name followed by the word "stumbles" you're likely to

find articles about how they've made mistakes, and will this hurt their campaign, etc. Games the media love to play.

[ucrdem]

66. LOL. Yep. Stories that never grow old.

[Grasswire2]

80. somebody is determined to take out the one polling most likely to beat Trump. nt

[emmaverybo]

103. Yes. Makes one wonder...certainly does not help ensure we see the back of Trump.

[Demsrule86]

112. The poll they site...she is losing by nine points...and that is Iowa only...she is losing in

other states as well...I see no surge myself. Perhaps among Sanders voters or Harris voters...not seeing it...and good. She won't win a general...although she would have of course have my vote.