The ugly lie about black voters and Pete Buttigieg

[babylonsister]

The ugly lie about black voters and Pete Buttigieg
By Jonathan Capehart
Opinion writer
November 8, 2019 at 6:00 a.m. EST

snip//

But all the armchair pundits — and actual pundits — perpetuating the lie that blacks are more homophobic than anyone else are smearing African Americans as a whole, that blacks as a people don’t support LGBTQ equality. In fact, that’s a lie, too. Or, as Charles Blow writes with his characteristic fire in the New York Times, “It is a disgusting, racist trope, secretly nursed and insidiously whispered by white liberals with contempt for the very black people they court and need.”

snip//

Folks harping on black homophobia conveniently ignore the four straight black men who led on gay rights during the Obama administration — most notably President Barack Obama and then-Attorney General Eric Holder. And folks harping on black homophobia ignore how the Trump administration, since day one, has been laying siege to all the Obama-era LGBTQ equality regulations and protections.

African Americans have evolved on LGBTQ equality just like everyone else. According to the Pew Research Center, only 29 percent of blacks supported same-sex marriage in 2009. Ten years later, a majority (51 percent) now does. Sure, that is lower than other ethnic groups, but not significantly so. Also, citing that gap contributes to the intellectual laziness on this matter especially while ignoring other relevant data points. A recent survey from the Public Religion Research Institute (PRRI) has a raft of data that obliterates the blacks-riven-with-homophobia myth. When looking at the numbers below, keep in mind that 69 percent of all Americans favor laws protecting LGBTQ Americans against discrimination in jobs, public accommodations and housing.

65 percent of all African Americans “favor laws that would protect LGBT people from discrimination in jobs, public accommodations, and housing.”
65 percent of black Protestants “support laws protecting LGBT people from discrimination in housing, public accommodations, and the workplace.”
67 percent of black Protestant Democrats “support nondiscrimination protections for LGBT people.”
68 percent of black Democrats and 65 percent of black independents “support for nondiscrimination protections for LGBT people.”
73 percent of young black Americans “favor LGBT nondiscrimination protections.”
54 percent of senior black Americans (age 65 and older) “favor LGBT nondiscrimination protections.”
60 percent of black men and 69 percent of black women “favor nondiscrimination protections for LGBT people.”

more...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/11/08/ugly-lie-about-black-voters-pete-buttigieg/

[cwydro]

1. Thank you!

X1000!

I see that trope here all the time, usually accompanied by a pious “but I have gay friends or a daughter or a son, etc”

[mountain grammy]

2. Good to see this. Thanks for posting.

[Demsrule86]

6. He has issues that are because of issues having to do with his early day as Mayor.

The polls show he has very little support among AA voters. That means he will not nor should be our nominee. AA voters are an important part of our party. They deserve a voice.

[mountain grammy]

10. Of course, but the issue should not be the fact that he's gay.

and I think that's what this is pointing out so well.

[Demsrule86]

17. My personal experience says otherwise...I work to help Gay kids tossed out of their homes...some

stay with me or others...I have a Gay daughter so this is very important to me. She has had a difficult time here in Ohio especially since Trump was elected. I have seen less acceptance of a Gay child in AA households. This is anecdotal of course. But many I campaign with are big church goers and attend churches in some not all cases that are not welcoming to Gay parishioners.My AA friends do not feel this way so take it for what it is worth... I do think there is less acceptance in general and this hurts Mayor Pete in terms of the AA vote. I also think the situation has improved since Hillary ran which is a good thing. I do not support Mayor Pete because I do not think being a Mayor in Indiana is enough experience to become president. He is very talented but needs additional experience.

[mountain grammy]

18. That is so interesting..

I also worked with a group while my daughter was in high school sheltering gay kids who had been thrown out of their homes. We live in a very small community, but it was a great program, also helping kids who's parents became disfunctional. We got involved when my daughter's friend was thrown out and came to stay with us. Her mom finally came around. I'll never understand parents who do this to their children, in the name of Jesus, for heaven's sake.

I like Mayor Pete. If he's our nominee I will gladly vote for him, which goes for all our candidates.. Having issues with Tulsi though. She says she's changed, but I think her right wing support is a result of her homophobia.

stopping gay power and woman power are the two drivers of the right wing "Christian" agenda.

[Demsrule86]

34. I agree with what you say. We are currently helping a young man (adult this time) who

had his own apartment...28-works at my husband's plant. He had roommates that did something illegal or unethical ...don't know exactly what happened. So he was evicted...his parents let him stay in their house one weekend and then he had to leave. This kid is living in his car (not running and needs repairs) and or homeless shelters and works everyday...walks like four or five miles. We are paying for his car repairs...(car not working) and looking for an apartment or another family to take him near his job. We can't take him in as my husband's job wouldn't like this...conflict of interest although he does not work for my husband. I would never let one of my kids live on the streets...and this is Cleveland ...not safe. The kid is a hard worker and my husband (good judge of character) agrees he is a nice kid. I don't get some parents these days. Everyday he is on the street his life is endangered. He has gone days without eating too...although we managed to fix him up with some food at the job.

[redqueen]

3. Not sure why pundits would claim the lack of black voter support for Pete is due to homophobia.

It's due to his record. Surely everyone is aware of this by now.

[cwydro]

8. It's not just pundits; people post here all the time about how AA folks are homophobic.

Annoys the crap out of me.

I live in the south and have worked with, played with, slept with, lived with, lived next door to, etc, etc. with black people.

I’ve known far more white homophobes. My ex, who was black, had a mom who wasn’t wild about her daughter being gay, but she had much more of a problem with her daughter’s girlfriend being white. So go figure.

[dlk]

4. Black voters are savvy-they have to be

It’s likely they see Buttigieg’s lack of national political experience as an impediment to being an effective leader on issues of race.

[dalton99a]

5. +1. And they remember his "All Lives Matter" attitude

[redqueen]

9. That statement pales in comparison to his actions.

Or maybe it just sheds light on them.

[RLG]

20. Not to mention his mealy mouth explanation for demoting SB's first African American police chief.

Also, the lack of African Americans in the South Bend PD and how AAs in South Bend felt left behind regarding gentrication.

[Celerity]

22. pure rot, the lot of if, I have debunked your false frames on so many occasions

It is shameful how often you come on so many (most all?) Buttigieg threads for months and repeat the same bullshit. You had far less than 100 posts in 17 years until you cranked up the slag-Pete machine back around April or so.

Why don't you go post some positive things about a candidate that you support and stop shitting on Buttigieg with slanted smear tactics and disinformation.

[dsc]

24. it is almost like that poster had no problems with any candidate until a gay man ran

I am sure that is a coincidence.

[RLG]

25. Insulting me isn't going to change my mind.

So saying that I haven't posted in 17 years makes me a bad person, it makes you a small one.

As for "shitting on Buttigieg", get used to it if he's going to be the nominee.

[Celerity]

27. I am simply exposing your modus operandi, not insulting you at all.

So saying that I haven't posted in 17 years makes me a bad person

I never said you did not post for 17 years, nor did I once say you are a 'bad person'. The simple fact is you did post an extraordinarily small amount for that time until you started up with the 'bash Pete on so many threads' manoeuvring back in the spring. You continually post the same spun-up, false-framed tosh over and over, and sometimes in conjunction with that other account, just like the last interaction we had where I called you out for the same rot.

You should go boost your candidate(s) of choice and stop the bullshit Buttigieg slamming. It is fucking offensive and it is disinformation.

[RLG]

28. So expressing an opinion is "Pete bashing"?

I don't have a candidate, but the "disinformation" you claim is out in the mainstream and it's one of the reasons his poll numbers amongst African Americans are low.

And what "other account" am I involved with?

[cwydro]

30. Thank you.

You’re not the only one who has noticed this.

[Celerity]

21. for months you come on most (if not all) Buttigieg threads and push the same false frame bullshit

The all lives matter stuff was back in March 2015, and he used it once during the 2015 Sate of the City speech, and did not use it in the same context that other people were, people who misusing it to try and push back against the Black Lives matter movement. Pete was told about those people and said he would never use it again.

He had already said he would never use it again when Hilary Clinton herself said 'all lives matter' months after Pete did.

Back then (we are talking 4 or even 5 years ago now) there were two types of people who said, "All lives matter"

The first was the person who couldn't stand the thought of us PoC getting any attention to help solve endemic racism -- especially the kind of racism that led to dead black people at the hands of cops. That type kept saying All Lives Matter even when the problems are explained.

The second were well-intentioned people like Pete and Sec. Clinton who were trying to communicate that our black lives should be treated with the same respect as white lives because all lives should matter the same. This type person of person stopped saying all lives matter after learning the problematic nature of the phrase, which is exactly what Pete and Sec. Clinton did.


You are a broken record. Same for your little tag-team partner who (it's magic!) showed up and chirped up with another false frame slag-off that they have repeated dozens of times now on dozens of Buttigieg threads ( the 2002 account below who, until they started slagging Pete like clockwork back starting in April, had far less than 100 posts in 17 years). You two are like synchronised swimmers lately.

[ms liberty]

29. You've only been here since 2018 yourself, so

Perhaps you should peruse the rules of behavior. Your posts in this subthread are personal attacks on another member. Once upon a time, you would have been served a pizza for it. It is to our detriment that this is barely a blip on the radar in our current incarnation.
I personally find your display here to be so very ugly and so disappointing because I have often been in agreement with your comments.
Oh and I've been here since 2003, and I don't post much either. You wanna rag me about it? There's a shit ton of people who have been here less time than me who are complete assholes. I ignore them 99% of the time, because they're assholes. You would do well to do the same.

[Celerity]

31. Huge difference between your thousands of posts and

then someone with close to none over a 17 year period but now almost single-mindedly comes on most all, or at least a very large majority of Buttigieg threads and repeats the same spun-up, false-framed claptrap over and over and over, with that being the vast vast majority of their activity, almost to the point of single purposeness.

I should not have to keep writing (as I have done so often in the past) dozens upon dozens of systematically detailed, documented, hyperlinked debunking posts in order to counter this continued barrage of drive-by hit comments. It is the same shite every time, served on the same platter by the same, very small in number (thankfully) hands.

The ugly is not coming from me. I am sorry if you found my comments troubling.

[cwydro]

33. This.

I’ve noticed the exact same thing again and again.

It’s pretty obvious.

[Demsrule86]

7. I think that is true too.

[ismnotwasm]

11. Black people aren't feeling mayor Pete

And the release of that focus group has pissed off a number of Black people.

[loyalsister]

44. I think it has more to do with his approach to urban renewal

It's one thing to have made that mistake in the 60s, another to adopt the approach that aggravated racial disparities after the results were known.

[crazytown]

12. Approve marriage equality: Dems+Lean Dem 75%, AA 51%.

https://www.pewforum.org/fact-sheet/changing-attitudes-on-gay-marriage/

[redqueen]

13. 11 point difference

Not too extreme really

[crazytown]

14. ?

75 - 51 = 24. Am I missing something here?

[redqueen]

15. I looked at the last chart, about same sex marriage

62% vs 51%

[crazytown]

16. OK

Since we are looking at the primaries first, I quoted Dem+Lean Sen 75%

44% of GOP+Lean GOP approve of marriage equality.

African American attitudes to marriage equality have evolved from less than 25% approval in 2004 to 51% today.

[Demsrule86]

36. Don't use Dem lean and see what the numbers are...this Dem lean is not useful in a primary IMHO.

[peggysue2]

19. Looks like age has more to do with the issue than race

Older voters in particular and I would bet this spreads across racial lines, black or white.

Each generation has a wider, more accepting opinion on many of our social issues. The younger generations are born into a more accepting society, that acceptance fought for by their elders, btw. The real question is how hard we fight to maintain those values of acceptance and equality under the law while pushing for greater fairness into the future.

Trump and his enablers would erase all progress. Just another reason underscoring the importance of the 2020 election.

[Lexblues]

23. There's a difference between urban blacks and rural/southern blacks

I live in the south in a small city and I'm black. The homophobia is real here and I don't need anyone to tell me any differently. Sure, black people in Chicago, NYC, SF, LA, DC, etc. are totally open regarding homosexuality and it's no problem. But anyone that lives in the south where most blacks go to Baptist churches, know that homophobia is rampant here.

[cwydro]

32. I live in the south in a small city, and I'm white and I'm gay.

I’ve not encountered this with any of my black neighbors, friends, or co-workers.

[Lexblues]

37. With all due respect, you're not at the kitchen table in the homes

hearing the stuff that is said. Sure, outwardly black people are very hospitable and kind by nature. So I wouldn't expect you would be treated any differently. However, homophobia is real behind closed doors.

[cwydro]

43. Seriously? You are assuming I've never been at any of my neighbors' kitchen tables?

Shared Christmas dinner? Thanksgiving? Even a Saturday breakfast?

You know NOTHING about me or my neighbors, and that is one of the most condescending remarks I’ve seen on this board.

“Outwardly black people are very hospitable.” Good lord, go ahead and say two-faced, why don’t you?

Guess what. It’s not just “outwardly.”

[UniteFightBack]

35. I had a large group of black friends right here in NYC and they were very homophobic

and so were the papi's...this is just what I saw and heard.

Now..... have things gotten better? Absolutely, but my running around days weren't that long ago so I do believe there is still a lot of work to do.

[blm]

26. So true. In 2012 I worked Dem HQ in Charlotte where the convention was held.

The entire election cycle I fielded only 2 phone calls from 2 Dem voters who were angry about Obama’s support for gay marriage. 2.... out of thousands.

[Beringia]

38. Then what were the complaints mainly?

[blm]

39. The two calls were angry about gay marriage and that they

would not vote for Obama again because he supported gay marriage.

[Beringia]

40. I mean of the thousands, what were the majority of complaints about

[blm]

41. Most needed voting information.

Very few complaints, but, usually about not being able to get tickets to events or not getting through to national party and “...could you pass on a message?”

Some complaints were about gun issue.

Most calls were definitely about voting information.

[Beringia]

42. Thanks