BREAKING: Connecticut woman says then-Vice President Joe Biden touched her inappropriately

[brooklynite]

Hartford Courant

A Connecticut woman says Joe Biden touched her inappropriately and rubbed noses with her during a 2009 political fundraiser in Greenwich when he was vice president, drawing further scrutiny to the Democrat and his history of unwanted contact with women as he ponders a presidential run

“It wasn’t sexual, but he did grab me by the head," Amy Lappos told The Courant Monday. “He put his hand around my neck and pulled me in to rub noses with me. When he was pulling me in, I thought he was going to kiss me on the mouth.”

Lappos posted about the alleged incident on the Facebook page of Connecticut Women in Politics Sunday in response to a similar account by former Nevada legislator Lucy Flores, which comes as Biden is considering a 2020 run for president. Flores accused Biden of kissing her on the back of her head in 2014, when she was a candidate for lieutenant governor.

Lappos, 43, who is now a freelance worker with nonprofit agencies, said she felt extremely uncomfortable when Biden approached her at the 2009 fundraiser for U.S. Rep. Jim Himes, D-4th, where she was volunteering. At the time, Lappos was a congressional aide to Himes, who she said was not in the room when the incident took place.

[Thekaspervote]

1. They are not going to stop!!

[brooklynite]

3. Who are "they"?

This is a Democratic campaign volunteer.

[IluvPitties]

16. Complaining about Biden touching her head???

I have had complete strangers touch me and hugging me and I am not crying about it.

[brooklynite]

18. Well, why didn't you SAY so?

If we'd know that a certain behavior was acceptable to YOU, we could have discounted how other people feel about it from the outset.

[IluvPitties]

22. I don't know, but I don't wanna live in a nation where a hug is a fucking crime.

[vsrazdem]

68. Did you rub noses together too.

[pnwmom]

48. She said he grabbed her by the neck and pulled her in. That's more than touching her head.

And that she was afraid he was going to kiss her, but he rubbed noses.

Can't you see that having a man you aren't close to put his hand on your neck and pull you nose-to-nose could be unpleasant and unnerving?

[trueblue2007]

163. Made up stories now?

Trump is a sexual predator who was accused of raping a 13 year old girl, We saw him on the Access Hollywood tape saying how he sexually attacks women says they just let you do it (grab women by the P*ssy) .
There are over a dozen women who have come forward to complain of Trumps sexual attacks, So there is no comparison at all to Vice President Joe Biden.

[democratisphere]

6. Probably not.

But we do know what this is all about.

[MFM008]

170. Yup

Pretty plain to see.
The gop is delighted.
The rapist in chief is relieved.
And we know the instigators.

[pnwmom]

33. Why should they? If what she described happened, it wasn't appropriate behavior.

Biden had just met her.

[Botany]

2. Where is Roger Stone?

n/t

[True Blue American]

5. Sad, but not in jail yet.

[Botany]

7. This is what they did to Franken.

Michael Corleone, "Now, we have newspaper people on the payroll."

[IluvPitties]

4. What's next? Biden rubbed his arm against mine?

This is craziness.

[democratisphere]

9. Some people will do anything for 15 minutes of so-called fame or

shame.

[IluvPitties]

13. It's like people saying they need to fly with an emotional support peacock.

It's about distorting a real movement and shamimg an honorable man.

[democratisphere]

17. Remember. There are usually ulterior motives.

[John Fante]

44. She laid out the motives herself.

She wants Biden to step aside and support a female candidate for president.

[democratisphere]

54. And there you go. Voters who want other Democratic candidates

are also likely to support the attacks on Biden.

[MineralMan]

8. Oh, for pete's sake!

They're going to march them out, one-by-one, it looks like. And this report is 10 years old. Yikes!

It worked on Al Franken, so that's the new strategy, apparently. I don't know who's orchestrating this, but I don't like it one bit.

[California_Republic]

35. Yes the Democrats care about this. Republicans can grab pussies

[John Fante]

46. She said herself the contact was not sexual in

nature. Not only is this not in the same ballpark as "grab em by the pussy", it isn't even the same sport.

[California_Republic]

50. That's not what I meant. I'm proud that the Democrats care

That’s not what I meant. I’m proud that the Democrats care

The Republicans don’t.

I had hoped that would be my point

[Demsrule86]

99. Oh please. This short of crap will cost us 20 as we choose an .unelectable candidate

[Demsrule86]

53. Joe didn't grab anyone.

[samnsara]

56. AMEN!

[California_Republic]

62. I did not imply that he did. My point was Democrats car about this Republicans, not so much

[pnwmom]

69. So are you calling the Democratic fundraiser who made the claim a liar?

From the OP:

“It wasn’t sexual, but he did grab me by the head," Amy Lappos told The Courant Monday. “He put his hand around my neck and pulled me in to rub noses with me. When he was pulling me in, I thought he was going to kiss me on the mouth.”

[John Fante]

88. So she's bitching because she thought Biden was going to

kiss her... even though he didn't. During an interaction she herself admits wasn't sexual in nature.

A Me Too moment of ever there was one.

I know you're getting off on this, but your preferred candidate is going to get the same treatment too eventually. Don't call for solidarity when that happens, because no one will want to hear it.

[pnwmom]

92. She made it very clear she didn't WANT to be kissed, but she was momentarily afraid that

was what he was trying to do. And that would be a normal reaction, under the circumstances.

Lappos, 43, who is now a freelance worker with nonprofit agencies, said she felt extremely uncomfortable when Biden approached her at the 2009 fundraiser for U.S. Rep. Jim Himes, D-4th, where she was volunteering. At the time, Lappos was a congressional aide to Himes, who she said was not in the room when the incident took place.

"I never filed a complaint, to be honest, because he was the vice president. I was a nobody," Lappos said. "There's absolutely a line of decency. There's a line of respect. Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It's not cultural. It's not affection. It's sexism or misogyny."

SNIP

"Biden did something similar to me at a fundraiser in Greenwich when I was a congressional aide," Lappos wrote in her Facebook post. "I'm really disappointed to see this [Facebook] post ask 'thoughts' as if the grossness of men invading women's boundaries to sniff and touch is debatable. And shame on some of the women here excusing this as boys being boys or it's not as bad as Trump. I can speak from experience when I say it's an incredibly uncomfortable situation and not at all acceptable. We need to hold our men to the same standards we hold all men."

https://www.courant.com/politics/hc-pol-biden-grabbed-aide-20190401-vl7chim3hrdjtcwu2tszrhozzm-story.html

[John Fante]

107. Translation: this wasn't a sexual encounter in any way

but fuck it, let me make it seem like was because it will pave the road for a female president.

If Biden didn't kiss her, or attempt to kiss her, then I couldn't care less that she thought it was his intent. It clearly wasn't.

[pnwmom]

117. She didn't say it was a sexual encounter. It was also not a sexual encounter

when George Bush tried to give Angela Merkel a shoulder rub during a meeting -- but it was unprofessional, invasive, and wrong.

Which Democrats spoke out strongly about at the time.

[John Fante]

139. Please. This story is already far bigger than GWB giving Merkel

a shoulder rub (first time I'm hearing about it actually), and let's not kid ourselves: sexual harassment is at the core of these accusations against Biden. It's the 800lbs gorilla in the room.

They can say (in tiny lettering, way at the bottom) that it wasn't sexual harassment, but if they're using language like, "he touched me", "I thought he was going to kiss me", "it made me uncomfortable", and "he invaded my space" then sexual harassment is what will immediately spring to the minds of most people. At that point, it's just a matter of time before Americans conclude that Biden is the democratic version of Trump.

I think that's exactly what these two women want.

[Demsrule86]

101. I don't think it is true. There is an agenda..that is the dumbest story I ever heard,.

[COLGATE4]

180. +1c- Emphatically.

This crap has got to stop. We can't make it this easy for Stone and/or the Rethugs to mess with the one candidate Trump is deathly afraid of.

[MelissaB]

133. Exactly!

This is some slimy shit. I really hope we find out who is behind this.

[Squinch]

10. Biden does this, kids. Its why he had to drop out of his

last Presidential run.

Its a stupid thing for him to do. And no, they're not going to stop because there are a lot of women out there whose reasonable boundaries he has crossed without their permission.

Is it the end if the world? No. But its really dumb. And shows a ridiculous sense of entitlement. And after all these years, he should know better.

[LexVegas]

14. Yep. nt

[Bleacher Creature]

30. Agree with every word.

I think highly of Biden, and also recognize that some of this may be the result of a coordinated smear campaign, but it doesn't change the fact that this behavior is problematic and dumb and that Biden should have known better.

[highmindedhavi]

34. Well said

[fleur-de-lisa]

38. Exactly. He is and always has been a touchy-feely guy.

I don't believe he ever intended to demean any of the women he has touched, but there it is. Expect many more women to come forward and say the same thing happened to them.

I like him and think he would be a good president, but I don't know if he can survive the onslaught of women who will wome forward with weird 'Uncle Joe' stories. This election is too important to mess around with when there is a traitor in the White House.

[customerserviceguy]

178. Any woman

who felt uncomfortable at the time Uncle Joe was getting touchy-feely knows that right now is the time to get that out, or forever hold her peace, as the saying goes. We may see more come forward.

[Demsrule86]

55. Bull. He was VP.

[Delmette2.0]

59. I agree. How many years ago were women asking for more respect,

from new acquaintances? Just give women some time to get to know a man of any age or status before he invades their personal space.

I think, I maybe wrong, the Biden believes he is giving emotional support exactly when a woman does not need it or want it. They have have their mind focused and he comes along and acts like "this woman needs emotional support from me". Biden assumes he knows what is best for her. That is degrading and minimizing the individual in front of him. Do we have any instances of Biden doing this to men, approaching from behind or rubbing noses?

[vsrazdem]

78. I agree, that is why I said in another post, if you wouldn't do it with a man,

Don't do it with a woman. To me that is the standard to go by.

[Squinch]

91. I like the guy but I wouldnt vote for him in the primary because I

know if he was the candidate, too much of our damn time would be wasted on the fruits of his legendary handsiness.

We have real work to do. We don't have time for this shit.

[Demsrule86]

102. Wrong this an issue only in the primary. Mark my words, we will lose 20 if this continues.

[Squinch]

106. I have no idea what this means.

[Demsrule86]

122. Trump can not use this against Biden. I don't think we have another candidate who can be Trump.

[Squinch]

134. Joe's presidential bids always bring up the old dirt. There was also a plagiarism

issue that made him drop out in 1988. It would certainly resurface if he were the candidate.

Love the guy, but he's never been good at running for President. And he's tried a lot.

We have better candidates.

[Demsrule86]

137. I am not worried about 31 years ago. I believe we are going to lose 20.

Last edited Mon Apr 1, 2019, 04:46 PM - Edit history (1)

Who else can win a general?

[Squinch]

143. I think if given enough time in front of the American people, Harris, Inslee or Klobichar could beat

Individual 1.

And I'm not worried about things he did in the past either - though I think decades of being told to keep his hands to himself SHOULD have made him consider stopping his entitled behavior - I am just saying how his Presidential campaigns always end up.

Joe always commits the unforced error that takes him out of the game. And, with respect to his handsines, he keeps committing it. That's stupid.

[Demsrule86]

156. I don't think any of them not even Klobuchar who has the best chance will win

The rustbelt states we need. Biden will win Wi,MI and PA.

[Squinch]

159. Has he ever before as a Presidential candidate?

[Demsrule86]

162. He can win the bluevwall...MI,WI,andPA.

[Squinch]

164. Has he ever before as a Presidential candidate?

[Demsrule86]

191. He won all those states as VP and Biden campaigned there extensively.

No one else except maybe Amy can do this. And I don't think a woman can win much as I hate to say it.

[jberryhill]

155. Actually....

He dropped out in 1988 because of brain surgery for a developing aneurysm.

He was going out the Neil Kinnock thing, which was more funny than anything else.

https://www.nytimes.com/1988/05/04/us/biden-resting-after-surgery-for-second-brain-aneurysm.html

Biden Resting After Surgery For Second Brain Aneurysm

MAY 4, 1988

[Squinch]

161. He dropped out in September of 87. The aneurysms occurred February of 88.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Biden_1988_presidential_campaign

[jberryhill]

165. Yah, you're right

Good point. Yeah, the aneurysm thing was later. Being a Delaware native, I still caucused for him anyway.

[Squinch]

167. I wish someone would kick him in the ass. I would love to be able to vote for him, but

he just always shoots himself in the foot.

[Desert grandma]

149. I agree with you.

Biden is the only candidate right now that can beat Trump IMO. People QUIT CRITICIZING THE DEM CANDIDATES!!! There will be enough of that later. Biden can win and bring honor back to the world stage for the US. Right now, I can see where his experience and friendship with our allies will restore a lot of trust that has been lost in this age of the Orange Buffoon. I can also see where the other side is going to have a field day with throwing barbs at our candidate, whomever it is. We are already giving them lots of ammunition. I am keeping an open mind as we all should. It bugs me to see Democrats giving the GOP their talking points with our candidates. Stop. Just Stop.

[Demsrule86]

153. I think so too. He can win key states. I wonder how important

A fuckng eskimo kiss and a touch on the neck will seem if Trump wins in 20.

[vsrazdem]

123. Agreed. I really like Joe as a person. I am sure nothing he has done has any

sexual connotations. But he is old school, and times have changed. What was once acceptable no longer is normal. I dare say if you had a boss in this day and age that wanted to rub noses with you, smell your hair, kiss your head, you would be looking for a new job. I am sure it is just that he is very demonstrable in his associations with people, but like I said, things have changed, for the better I hope, to the point where women can be respected as well as their boundaries.

[Kentonio]

108. Very well put.

[karynnj]

116. His last run was 2008 - and he dropped out when he got very little support in Iowa and NH

IF the reason would have been inappropriate behavior, do you really think that he would have been put on the ticket? No one in their right mind puts anyone on as VP who has problems. The only time I can think of either party doing so is Sarah Palin and I suspect that McCain had no idea how extreme she was. (I remember the first stuff put out on her where she was positioned as a reformer! )

[Squinch]

129. Google "Biden handsiness." He's done this forever. There was also a plagiarism problem that

surfaced in his 88 run and will certainly resurface again.

[karynnj]

144. That is not what you posted. He never gained any traction in 2008 - so it did not come up

As to it being "forever", I do not recall it being an issue when he was picked by Obama. That does not mean that his behavior changed after that. It might be that what is acceptable did.

One observation I have is that in both 2000 and 2004, Gore and Kerry were criticized for not being the Bill Clinton like very forward, back slapping, hugging politician. In fact, both did hug people when circumstances warranted and the other person non verbally agreed.

Here, I do not know if this will hurt in the primaries -- if not answered well, it might, but his thoughtful answer may be enough. IF he becomes the nominee - I doubt this will be an issue. There has never been a serious accusation that rose to the level of sexual harassment, much less sexual assault - not so for Trump.

[Dr Hobbitstein]

171. Well stated. nt

[Quixote1818]

181. I have seen several videos and he does do this a lot. I don't think he meant any harm but

it was risky and stupid on his part for simply not keeping his distance and playing it safe.

[Squinch]

182. It's also pretty obnoxious, and he's been told that often. Every once in a while, the last

time being around 2015, there are a spate of articles about Joe's "hands" problem with women, always accompanied by photos of women trying to escape his grip.

[Quixote1818]

184. Yes, there are a few I saw where his hands are all over kids and the parents even make comments

that they seem bugged by it. If some man was doing that to my child I would be like "Get your fricking hands off her!" Even though I think he just comes from a different time period when it was okay to be affectionate toward kids. I think he is very comfortable touching anyone but he should know it looks creepy and could hurt his campaign.

It all sucks because I really like him! He is one hell of a debater and sharp as a tack but this is going to be a problem and a distraction we don't need.

[Pope George Ringo II]

11. I'm curious how much of this is "baked into the cake" for Biden supporters

I'm not sure this is really going to hurt him much because it's really not as surprising as it would be with another candidate. Even for me, it's a reason he wasn't my first choice, but he hasn't actually dropped on my candidate list with these accusations.

I guess I'll find out how much it matters, but I'm not expecting it to be much.

[Demsrule86]

57. It doesn't change my views. These folks have an agenda.

Let me say. I believe Biden is the only candidate who can beat Trump.

[Pope George Ringo II]

75. Pretty much what I figured.

It's not like you just found out he's a Martian plant or something. He's handsy, or something less charitable, and has been for years and years. We know this, we've talked about this, we've reached our conclusions with it already a factor. It bothers me more than it bothers you, but we'd both vote for him in November 2020 with smiles on our faces and songs in our hearts.

[Demsrule86]

109. Biden is our best chance to take Wi, MI and PA...

If we lose because of misguided political correctness...it will be truly stupid. Now touching is wrong. What next looking at someone in a way they dont like? Republicans are laughing their ass off. Ginsberg won't make it thru another Trump termn in all likelyhood. We better damn well consider who can win and stop.

[Pope George Ringo II]

127. I don't fault your logic. At worst, it's a reasonable prediction.

Obviously I disagree with your conclusions on which candidate should be our first choice, but I'd still be fine with Biden coming out of the primary process as the winner. And I don't think either of us is really going to have our opinions of Biden hurt by stories like this.

[rusty fender]

190. Bullshit!

Any number of our candidates can beat Trumpass, or Pence in 2020

[marylandblue]

89. Hardcore supporters will stick with him, but

weaker ones may back off either for fear this will be used against in the general or they themselves wouldn't like this type of behavior. I do know some women who would be upset if an older man touched them inappropriately in public. One in particular has a pretty low threshold, so she is very sensitive to someone invading her space.

[Pope George Ringo II]

100. I can see that.

I just think Biden supporters generally have already made their peace with his, ah, excessive nature. Even as somebody who doesn't even have Biden in my top tier--partially for this reason--there's nothing new here. I've already factored it into preferring other candidates, and I prefer Biden to some despite it.

I just can't imagine people are unaware of his history here. Then again, how many people had their opinion of Hillary go down when she was no longer a former Secretary/FLOTUS/Senator viewed through rose-colored glasses but an actual candidate under the microscope again? I don't understand the thinking behind that savage swing, but I do believe it matters more in a general election than a primary, where the voters seem more motivated to keep up with these things.

[Kahuna7]

93. Biden is an affectionate old man. I'm not going to hate on him

for being a people lover.

[Thekaspervote]

12. There's some kind of pay off... money promises... something

[brooklynite]

21. You have evidence, right?

[Thekaspervote]

25. IMO

[CentralMass]

32. I like the guy but google it.

[WeekiWater]

15. There is already a ton of this out there.

It's nothing new for Biden. It's also not all that egregious.

The timing is suspect and won't help the actual issue.

[IluvPitties]

19. Biden's a hugger. Big fucking deal.

The right wants our side to look like a bunch of crazies, and we are helping them.

[WeekiWater]

39. This dismissal is unnecessary.

The patriarchal aspects of society are not crazy. They are as real as could be. It's not a campaign ender. It's not sexual. It's not harassment. Sorry an open conversation can't be held about what it actually is.

[IluvPitties]

51. There are women who are huggers and touchy feely as well!

Big deal. Let them be. If you don't like it, just let the perspn know, without forgetting that many people communicate and experience the world through touch. They don't want to hurt you, it's just the way they are wired.

We can't regulate everything.

[WeekiWater]

71. I didn't call for regulation.

Your dismissal with the term "huggers" and equating to the actions of women is an issue. There is zero reason to dismiss the issue. I do understand why some feel it must be done. This is a coordinated attack on Biden. A completely unfair one.

[John Fante]

63. If it wasn't sexual harassment (as both women themselves have stated)

what is the purpose of the conversation? To make it seem like it is sexual harassment? Because that's how the media will portray it.

[WeekiWater]

77. The current purpose of the conversation is to end Biden's chance at winning the primary.

While I wouldn't vote for Biden in the primary(it has nothing to do with this), there is a ton I love about the guy and he is a great Democrat.

The current purpose of the conversation is to end Biden's chance at winning the primary.

There is no other purpose to conversing about a real problem at this time because of how the attacks are being overblown and what the means of the attacks are.

[pnwmom]

103. It was disrespectful and inappropriate in a public setting, with someone he didn't know.

And, as she said: "I never filed a complaint, to be honest, because he was the vice president. I was a nobody," Lappos said. "There's absolutely a line of decency. There's a line of respect. Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It's not cultural. It's not affection. It's sexism or misogyny."

[Demsrule86]

192. I don't agree. I am now done with me too which can only harm men and women,

It has been weaponized by unscrupulous people.

[MoonRiver]

80. This is not just about hugging!

It's about kissing, sniffing, taking hold of women, pulling them toward him, and violating their personal space.

[Demsrule86]

61. From the right wing and Bernie supporters. This is how the GOP WILL BEAT US.

[WeekiWater]

65. It has no impact on me.

Sad that it does on others.

[Demsrule86]

125. Me either. You would think after 16, people would not fall for such shit.

[WeekiWater]

130. It is a complete abuse of the Metoo movement for political and personal gain.

It stands in opposition to education and the betterment of society with respect to the things women face daily.

[Demsrule86]

138. It is disgusting.

[vsrazdem]

132. Sorry, I may be a Bernie supporter, but I am speaking as a women. I feel it is inappropriate and

disrespectful to women. Like I said, he is old school, but things have changed. He needs to respect boundaries. Hugging is one thing, but this behavior went beyond that. I am not saying it eliminates him as a candidate, I just think he needs to learn from this and move on.

[Demsrule86]

136. Sure ...I think the Sexual harrassment in 16 should be examined but not

Last edited Mon Apr 1, 2019, 07:54 PM - Edit history (1)

Because i am a Biden supporter.

[Thekaspervote]

146. +1000 but only if we let it

[jcgoldie]

20. What I find very hard to take...

...is that the press can report on this "old man was too handsy in a non-sexual way and made someone uncomfortable" stuff with a straight face while president pussy-grabber" is in the oval office and nobody bats an eye...

[Thekaspervote]

23. +1000

[IluvPitties]

26. They want Trump to win.

He gives them daily material.

[brooklynite]

29. Except that the Press reported on the Trump video endlessly...

...why is it inappropriate to report on Biden?

[John Fante]

70. Because the two women have aleady fucking admitted

that Biden's behavior wasn't sexual in nature.

[brooklynite]

85. So, women can only complain if the unwanted behavior is sexual?

[John Fante]

104. These women can complain about whatever they want. Problem is

their complaints (whatever they may be) are now being drowned out by charges that Joe is a serial groper, and Lucy Flores, this woman from Connecticut, and posters here seem totally OK with that.

[pnwmom]

37. If Biden runs, he'll be running against other Democrats to start with, not Trump. n/t

[Hassin Bin Sober]

24. Uh oh! This is not good.

[watoos]

27. So far I have seen nothing that should prevent Biden from running.

[C_U_L8R]

28. This reads like an April Fools

Rubbing noses? Really?

[vlyons]

31. a "mere" 9 years ago

Big deal. So what? Somebody(s) must be really afraid of Joe.

[brooklynite]

36. Christine Blasey Ford waited nearly 20 years to accuse Brett Kavanaugh...

...so we should discount her as well?

[Demsrule86]

140. That was rape. This is what a fucking eskimo kiss. I don't believe it first of

all but this will kill me too...it is disgraceful.

[Thekaspervote]

172. +1000

[Demsrule86]

177. Thanks posted wrong...not thanking myself.

[Demsrule86]

176. Thanks

[quickesst]

40. Do you think....

.... this will hurt Biden enough to be of any benefit to Hickenlooper? Also....

“It wasn’t sexual, but he did grab me by the head," Amy Lappos told The Courant Monday.

"Crossing that line is not grandfatherly. It’s not cultural. It’s not affection. It’s sexism or misogyny."

Was it not sexual, or was it sexism or misogyny, which by the way, you can't have one without the other since one is a synonym for the other. She sounds a little confused as to how she wants to frame this.

[JI7]

43. Hickenlooper has no chance of being the nominee regardless

of anything that happens with Biden

[quickesst]

98. I know....

[dsc]

49. Lots of things can be sexist without being sexual

Telling a woman to be quiet and make you a sandwich is clearly sexist, it most assuredly isn't sexual.

[quickesst]

105. Joe didn't tell her to make him a sandwich....

According to her account there was physical, intimate contact.

[dsc]

124. I get that

but the person he touched said she didn't perceive it to be sexual but did perceive it to be sexist. I was responding to someone who thought such things didn't exist.

[Pope George Ringo II]

52. Sexual and sexist aren't synonyms.

"Little girl, let me do this for you because women can't" is sexist as hell, but doesn't involve sexuality.

[quickesst]

112. According to her account....

.... there was physical, intimate contact. Sexist can absolutely mean sexual. As far as this occurrence, you guys are using examples that are all non-physical, which is illogical given the circumstances.

[Pope George Ringo II]

121. The circumstances were that you mis-defined the words as synonyms.

Correction was only logical, which is why you got so much of it. But if you want to skip over that part, we can talk about physical distinctions.

Ruffling hair can be sexist without being sexual. Pinching cheeks can be sexist without being sexual. Hands on shoulders, arms, or lots of places which aren't generally considered to be erogenous zones all could qualify. Biden has a long history of inappropriate touching, and relatively little of it suggests he wants to get into somebody's pants.

[quickesst]

147. All of those things you mentioned....

.... are not necessarily sexist. Every one of those actions can be performed on a male counterpart such as a good friend, a brother, a dad Etc. Exactly how can that be interpreted as being sexist, rather than being simply affectionate to another human being. That's Joe Biden being Joe Biden. All of these accusations suddenly popping up are no more than feeble attempts to bring Joe Biden's polling numbers down in order to supposedly benefit other candidates. That's the bottom line.

[samnsara]

41. oh for fucks sake!

....we women are not so fragile that we can't take a hug once in awhile. but apparently SOME are...so someone got the back of their head kissed. OMG call out the riot police...

[Demsrule86]

42. That is the most ridiculous story I have heard.

[CentralMass]

47. How so ?

[Demsrule86]

72. As a survivor this person can go to hell I do not believe one word,

She has an agenda and if we fall for its we are stupid, Joe forced me to give him and eskimo kiss!. Why I thought he would kiss me on the lips...such big fat lies. So dumb! They can't say he harassed anyone so they steal the right wing meme...disgusting.

[CentralMass]

97. That is harsh. He has a history of "nuzzling".

Google it. If i came up to to someone I worked with and put my hands on them and nuzzled them or stuck ny nose in their hair I'd likely get slapped and fired.

[Demsrule86]

113. This is total crap.

[CentralMass]

118. I modified this reply. I don't want to pile on Joe Biden

But I believe these women should not be discredited.

[Demsrule86]

120. Why would I do that? I don't care about this bull...you know what. I consider it right wing crap now

Used to d is credit our people.

[CentralMass]

126. Why would you claim the women is making it up ?

[Demsrule86]

128. Seriously rubbed noses...give me a break...nonsensical.

[CentralMass]

142. Yes, it is odd when it is a pattern.

[W_HAMILTON]

45. I thought this was an Onion article...

Rubbed noses?

THE HORROR.

[Demsrule86]

79. Me. too. Completely nonsensical.

[pnwmom]

58. I wish people would think about how they'd react if George W. Bush had been accused

of grabbing some woman by the neck and pulling her in, so she thought he was going to kiss her, but he rubbed noses instead.

Forget Trump, for the moment. I know that Dems wouldn't have been excusing this behavior from George W. Bush. I saw how everyone, including me, reacted when he tried to give Angela Merkel that shoulder rub. We knew it was inappropriate, even though Bush probably thought he was just being nice.

We shouldn't be hypocrites about this. If the behavior would be wrong when done by George W., then it would be wrong done by a Democrat.

We are not in the General election yet. We are vetting the various Democrats against each other. So obviously Trump is light years worse than Biden in this area. But that's not the issue.

[brooklynite]

66. Case in point: Angela Merkel

Why doesn't she understand that Bush is just exhibiting good 'ol boy Texas behavior?

[pnwmom]

82. I love her for that.

Some people have blamed the women here for not responding in the same way, but they're not accounting for the difference in power. Merkel was confident in her equal status with George W., unlike the American women who were "hugged" by the V.P.

[Vinnie From Indy]

60. And she felt it was vital to reveal this information now because.......

why?

[Autumn]

67. Because she's secretly working for Bernie and wants to take Biden out?

[Demsrule86]

83. No she doesn't want Biden to run. She wants a woman...so some here say.

[Autumn]

96. Well at least she's not connected to our revolution or Bernie.

But she looks a little too happy.

"

[Hassin Bin Sober]

135. I'm sure the doxing is ongoing

[Kahuna7]

95. Because she supports someone else. nt

[Firestorm49]

64. It sounds like their strategy is to attack a front runner early on.

If only their idiot leader could have been so passive in his approach.

[David__77]

73. OK, he's touchy.

I don't see this as disqualifying to Biden's candidacy.

[defacto7]

74. The propaganda bull shit machine never ends.

[matt819]

76. It is a shame

IMHO, Lappos and Flores are discrediting the #metoo movement and embarrassing themselves in the process.

Granted, I'm a middle aged white guy, but there is a difference between abusive behavior and the behavior described by these two women. And while I hope, of course, that a Democrat will be in the White House beginning in 2021, if that's not the case I will place part of the blame squarely on these two women and other publicity hounds that may surface in the coming 18 months, regardless of whether Joe Biden runs (which I don't think he should, but not because of these two incidents).

While it is true that campaign events are widely covered, I think we're at the point that politicians - all politicians - need to wear body cameras.

[pnwmom]

90. Here is a woman describing being grabbed by the neck and pulled in for what she thought

was going to be a kiss, which turned into a nose rub -- and being disturbed by the whole thing.

YUCK. Most women I know would not want a man they're NOT interested in to do that.

A kiss on the mouth from a man you don't know? A nose rub?! EW.

[Kentonio]

119. Would you think it acceptable if a larger man you didn't know grabbed your head

And pulled you in as if he was going to kiss you, and then rubbed noses with you instead?

[Demsrule86]

179. Doesn't know? Baloney. She worked for Heims.

[stonecutter357]

81. lol fail !

[book_worm]

84. Joe, don't run

why put yourself through all of this?

[Demsrule86]

87. Do run so Trump loses and the country is saved. A few more judges and they may jail LGBTQ.

[watoos]

86. Unbelievable, this is gettinng more news,

than the Mueller report cover up.

This nonsense is hurting both Sanders and Biden.

She has absolutely no responsibility to do this, but Gillibrand could come out in defense of Biden. It may help heal old wounds.

[Farmer-Rick]

110. I know. This is not worthy of so much angst.

Let the parties involved work it out. Trump and his Russian pals are cheering it all on while stirring the pot.

Trump grabs women by the pussy and everyone is fine with voting for the criminal. This guy gives an awkward hug and suddenly it's a major news story.

When the RepubliCONS hold their serial sexual abusers, pussy grabbers and Supreme Court Rapist and molesters accountable, then I'll worry about these issues of awkward touching on the head. Until then, this all comes off as Russian Troll wars.

[elleng]

94. a freelance worker with nonprofit agencies, who trump's happy to fund.

This won't stop.

[peggysue2]

111. It wasn't sexual

I'm beginning to see a pattern here. It wasn't sexual but the behavior invaded my personal space; he touched me inappropriately. He grabbed her head and rubbed noses.

Whatever.

The cockroaches are skittering out of the woodwork.

Why would that be?????

The timeline is going backwards. We're now in 2009.

My prediction: this will not prevent Joe Biden from entering the race.

But it does vaguely remind me of another scurrilous attack. The man's name was Al Franken.

Won't Work! Fooled us once. Not again.

[Demsrule86]

115. Exactly right.

[Otto Lidenbrock]

114. A couple of months ago Trump was accused of kissing an ex staffer on the lips

And that got buried in 24 hours.

Jesus wept.

[MelissaB]

131. This is Al Franken all over again.

Was this sexual? No.

Fuck it all...

[Squinch]

141. No, Franken had no history of anything like this whatsoever. Joe has been famously "handsy"

for decades.

[Socal31]

145. I believe the victims.

[Thekaspervote]

169. They are NOT victims!!

[Dr Hobbitstein]

173. Yes, they are. nt

[d_b]

148. Lol

[still_one]

150. I am no longer undecided. Biden is my preference, and as soon as he announces he will be getting my

donation


This isn't a 'Me To" movement thing

This is an Al Franken burning your own thing

In the end it comes down to this, if you don't like Biden's approach then don't vote for him.

Biden is a touchy feely guy, but I do not believe for a moment that he intended to offend or "creep" anyone out anyone, though I have no doubt some were.

In my view his politics are in the right place 90% of the time, and at this point in time he has the best chance to defeat Trump in the GE.

If this touchy feely issue is a show-stopper for someone, then then vote for someone else.

President Obama all the time could be seen hugging people during his campaign of both

genders. There was no sexual context, but it could be uncomfortable for some I am sure

During the hurricane disaster in NJ he was hugging a lot of folks, and it wasn't to teach them Constitutional Law. It was his way of showing support.

I do not believe that Biden had any devious intentions, nor do I believe Al Franken did either

My view is that someone should vote for whoever they believe can win the general election, and that means someone who can win some red and purple states

[Pope George Ringo II]

151. You could do worse.

Obviously, I'm at a different place, but I do find it interesting that "Biden gonna Biden" isn't the problem (at least one of) his opponents think it is.

[still_one]

157. That is the bottom line. Biden is going to be Biden, and if that is a show stopper for some, then

they should vote for another candidate.

[Pope George Ringo II]

160. It's part of why he's not my first tier of candidates

Along with age, the non-handsy gaffes, and the fact that I'm not sure an old white guy is our best shot, but I'd be quite happy voting for the guy in November 2020. He's got not one, but two German Shepherds. How do you not love a guy with two German Shepherds? I still miss my last one so much it hurts, and it's been six years.

[still_one]

185. Sorry for your loss, I know how you feel. I lost a pug in 2913, and you never really get over it.

Of course that also applies to a lot of other losses throughout life also.

[Pope George Ringo II]

186. I've buried both parents, and I've seen people bury children.

Biden can tell us all about burying children. It's harder, and I don't know how anybody does it, so he has my respect on that score. Plus, I'm German Shepherd people, and so is Biden. I'm not going to pick on the guy. And if I have to switch to Biden to keep Sanders out of the nomination, I'll do it without a second thought.

[still_one]

187. We are on the same page. Harris is my Senator, and when we get to Super Tuesday, depending

how I see things going, I may very well end up voting for Harris in the primaries.

Thanks

[GETTINGTIRED]

154. No Fucks Left to Give

the person that can take trump down has my vote, I have no fucks left to give on whatever folks dig up.

[Pachamama]

158. They really are afraid of Biden

Sorry - but I’m not buying all this. I say this as a) a woman who supports the Me Too movement.

I am a survivor of sexual assault and a feminist. I am a Kamala Harris fan and I like Joe Biden. I know Joe Biden and have met him multiple times because I was friends with his son Beau who went to Penn and was friends in the group of friends of mine there in the Castle Fraternity. Joe Biden has spoken at Penn many times and at graduations and at fundraisers and he is currently a visiting professor at Penn associated with the Biden Center. I have interacted with him and gotten what I would call “fatherly pats” and hugs and never anything inappropriate. I travel frequently abroad to Germany and Denmark and Spain where I have family and people great eachother, even upon first meeting with far more than Joe Biden does. (In Europe, kisses on cheeks etc).

This is getting ridiculous and Joe Biden is not done creeot guy who is doing something inappropriate.

This is a political smear effort and it shouldn’t even have legs or be assisted by Dems. People are afraid of Biden running - will stop at nothing. Don’t help this along.

[helpisontheway]

166. They are so scared for Biden. Pathetic! I might want a younger candidate but

I would not tear down a good man to achieve that. All I can say is what goes around comes around. They will get it all back...

[herding cats]

168. She wants all the male Democrats to drop out of the race?

From the linked article:

"If Biden truly supports women and gender equality he would step aside and support one of the many talented and qualified women running," she said. "The same goes for the other men who have thrown their hat in the ring. Women are 52 percent of the population. We are not a minority, we are the majority. It is time we are represented as such. After 45 male presidents it is time we elect a woman."

Ok, no matter how one feels about her claims here, that statement is excessive and divisive. She's not helping the brilliant Democratic women running for President with a statement like that. To the contrary, she's just stirring the pot of discontent and weakening our chances while increasing Trumps.

[George II]

175. "I thought he was going to kiss me on the mouth...."

BUT HE DIDN'T!!!!!! What you THINK was going to happen and what did happen are two completely different things.

When does this stop?

[BlueFlorida]

183. Meh

Probably another Bernie supporter and/or David Sirota's friend.

[Quixote1818]

188. I saw the videos of Biden touching kids a few years ago and knew this would be a big issue

sooner or later. If anyone thinks this second accusal is the last I would suggest you watch some of the videos out there that compile his hands all over women and kids in ways the parents look extremely uncomfortable.

I love Biden and he probably would have been my first choice but I saw this as an issue long before any of this broke. I had an exchange with another DUer about this awhile back. I don't think he ever meant to be a sexual predator or anything, he seems like a very kind affectionate guy who is comfortable touching people. But he should be able to read people's body language as some of the kids and women look extremely uncomfortable. In this day and age all people need to learn to not touch people at all unless you really know them. If for instance my boss or a fellow employee touched and stroked a kids hair the way he does they would not be able to get away with it. Imagine your co-workers stroking a kids hair and putting their hands around the kids waist and kissing their head and it being a kid they just met. Everyone would be freaking out.

[left-of-center2012]

189. Rubbing noses disqualifies you from being President?

Or is the goal to stop Biden at all costs ?

[UniteFightBack]

193. Well ain't this a surprise. Women coming out of the woodwork to say Joe did this or that. BAKED IN