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cthulu2016

(10,960 posts)
31. Yes, the pressure from the artificial floor should decrease somewhat as you go up, but
Fri Apr 4, 2014, 03:20 PM
Apr 2014

not as much as it might seem it would.

Now, wages were flatter back when the minimum wage was stronger, but I think that was more about the very top. CEOs used to make 10 times what a workman on the line made, versus 1,000 times. (Rather than the effect being due to burger flippers and carpenters converging)

I think that if Job X paid twice the minimum wage (and nothing changed except the minimum wage) there will remain an attractor for it to pay twice the minimum wage... it got there the first time, after all.

The job is worth twice the value of a generic employee.

Bill James used to focus on "replacement level" in talking about baseball player salaries. There is a constant pool of decent fielding second basemen who would hit .180 in the majors, and can be had all day for the league minimum salary. A decent fielding second basemen who hits .280 is a very valuable player. So his huge salary is being paid only for 100 points of batting average. No matter what, there will be somebody out at second who can field the position okay... so the replacement level is subtracted from all players.

Every job above minimum wage has *something* about it that is beyond the "replacement level employee," and that gap (which remains just as wide) should have a real value.

(If one assumes markets don't work then non of that would apply, but they do. There is some reason beyond charity that carpenters make more than fry-cooks.)

Unions are, unfortunately, not the factor they were in the 1960s (when minimum wage kept pace pretty well), but you can bet that in a union negotiation in 1967, if bus drivers had been making 316% of minimum wage in 1965 their 1967 target was no less than that 316%. It is how we measure a wage, relatively.

In the face of these wage declines, why is the primary concern what people think of Obama? cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #1
The OP is about both policy and political reality. DanTex Apr 2014 #2
MUST PROTECT OBAMA Capt. Obvious Apr 2014 #3
That explains much Fumesucker Apr 2014 #5
S'rly Capt. Obvious Apr 2014 #8
it's ODS Skittles Apr 2014 #47
MUST PROTECT FACTS. ProSense Apr 2014 #6
What "wage declines"? ProSense Apr 2014 #4
You are intentionally using figures unadjusted for inflation??? cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #14
"Adjusted for inflation, they were up 1.2% MoM and 2.4% YoY." ProSense Apr 2014 #18
Why do you say that when ProSense provided a chart with both real and nominal figures? stevenleser Apr 2014 #21
Prosense is referring to a trend in the last month/year, which is small in comparison to what is DireStrike Apr 2014 #53
Nonsense. The trend has been upward for the last three years. The chart shows that. n/t ProSense Apr 2014 #56
Yes, if you squint really hard you can see a very minor increase in real wages DireStrike Apr 2014 #58
I think the problem that many have.... NCTraveler Apr 2014 #7
Disagree, and ProSense Apr 2014 #9
I get that you disagree. NCTraveler Apr 2014 #10
Well, ProSense Apr 2014 #11
"...I expected dismissal, and your comment flies in the face of the reality." NCTraveler Apr 2014 #13
I most ProSense Apr 2014 #17
Prosense, you have not come close to making the case that this is fundamental and structural change. NCTraveler Apr 2014 #22
Pure nonsense ProSense Apr 2014 #26
How is it fundamental and structural change to the economy? NCTraveler Apr 2014 #27
What the hell? ProSense Apr 2014 #28
Nonsense. NCTraveler Apr 2014 #30
You really ProSense Apr 2014 #33
You're Just Being Obstinate ProfessorGAC Apr 2014 #40
A couple of things. NCTraveler Apr 2014 #45
It's not ProSense Apr 2014 #49
Where Do I Stand? ProfessorGAC Apr 2014 #60
Well, I'm not sure what you mean by "fundamental and structural change". DanTex Apr 2014 #36
"it seems more like vague generalities rather than specific policy objections" NCTraveler Apr 2014 #38
I agree with a lot of what you say. DanTex Apr 2014 #50
The baseline needs to be the crash of 2008. CJCRANE Apr 2014 #12
Raising the minimum wage won't have any effect on the median income, will it? Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #15
Not really. Increasing the minimum wage improves the safety net, but doesn't help most of us. reformist2 Apr 2014 #19
see my post right below cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #24
Good point. But I don't think 50% of workers are making $10 or less. Maybe 25-30% of workers. reformist2 Apr 2014 #25
Yes, the pressure from the artificial floor should decrease somewhat as you go up, but cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #31
Surely it would shift the median line to the right? CJCRANE Apr 2014 #20
I don't believe so. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #32
I'm not a statistician but that doesn't make sense to me. CJCRANE Apr 2014 #34
The median is the income of the middle person. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #35
I think it's the middle value, not the middle person. CJCRANE Apr 2014 #37
The middle value is the value of the middle person. N.T. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #41
If you have 300 million people then the middle person is #150 million. CJCRANE Apr 2014 #43
And the median income is that person's income. Donald Ian Rankin Apr 2014 #46
OK, as per my edit above I think you are right on that point CJCRANE Apr 2014 #48
It will affect more than 50% of wages, surely. Arguably 100%. cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #23
As cthulu pointed out, it would likely have indirect impact on wages beyond just DanTex Apr 2014 #57
Proud to be the first to rec this. Obama has fought HARD for the minimum wage Cali_Democrat Apr 2014 #16
Even with median income going up, everything you listed should happen. randome Apr 2014 #29
And here I thought this was going to be a thread about issues Marrah_G Apr 2014 #39
Short Fuse? ProfessorGAC Apr 2014 #42
Not just this one Marrah_G Apr 2014 #44
they're getting worse, aren't they? Skittles Apr 2014 #51
Yes Marrah_G Apr 2014 #52
It's unfortunate that you are going to ignore me instead of engaging. DanTex Apr 2014 #55
she, as am I, is simply fed up with it Skittles Apr 2014 #59
k&r n/t RainDog Apr 2014 #54
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